The Nineteenth Byte

Geobits

09:00

strawpoll.me/10950974

TùxCräftîñg

it's a tie

ASCII-only

@DJMcMayhem good luck, you'll probably DDoS the strawpoll servers with the number of polls you need

Destructible Watermelon

strawpoll.me/10950978

Geobits

Make sure the docs link to each strawpoll where appropriate, and promise to change/update the language when/if the results change later.

DJMcMayhem

Oh god, please no

Anonymous

09:02

@Geobits And then don't actually follow through on that promise

Destructible Watermelon

Strawpoll whether or not you should retroactively change it

DJMcMayhem

What if the very fundamental design of the language itself changes?

Destructible Watermelon

then wait until it says you don't have to :P

Anonymous

The language can be called "Democracy"

Geobits

Either Strawpoll or Popularity Contest would work as a name for it.

DJMcMayhem

09:02

^^

Okay, time to get serious. strawpoll.me/10950979

TùxCräftîñg

SPL - Strawpoll Programming Language

Anonymous

Democracy: where everything is decided by polls, but promises aren't kept and nothing actually changes

Geobits

Anti-golfing FTW

Destructible Watermelon

Well, I think those answers are a bit constraining

ASCII-only

@DJMcMayhem s/anti-golfing/bowling/

Destructible Watermelon

09:04

something like BF isn't a golfing language, and it certainly isn't normal, but if I picked anti-golfing that might mean something like java

Geobits

@Mego Where the small arrays are slowly losing data to the big ones who run the show.

ASCII-only

but java is normal

Anonymous

Make the language require that source files contain error checking and correcting measures in case of cosmic rays

Anonymous

Basically a language that is forced to be radiation hardened

Destructible Watermelon

java is real verbose

That's the Joke

►

Geobits

09:05

Just keep it in a big lead box.

DJMcMayhem

@DestructibleWatermelon I would consider java to be a "normal language". By "anti-golfing" I meant turing tarpit/unusable mess

ASCII-only

you could just force it to be distributed to make it radiation hardened

DJMcMayhem

Like brainfuck brainflak, snowman, Malbolge

ASCII-only

@DestructibleWatermelon and you're saying Lenguage isn't much more verbose than Java?

Destructible Watermelon

@DJMcMayhem Turing Tarpit is different to just antigolfing

like that intercall language

Geobits

09:06

@ASCII-only They average about the same length in my golfing experience :P

Anonymous

@Geobits That won't help with UHECRs

TùxCräftîñg

@DJMcMayhem and hellambda

Destructible Watermelon

now you need to strawpoll how many dimensions, or how many commands (few or many), whether there are literals or only single char things that just push 1s to stack... etc. Strawpoll what to strawpoll next

Geobits

@Mego Maybe not, but I'm not sure that's required in even military specs for "radiation hardened" :P

Anonymous

@Geobits We have to consider everything :P

Geobits

09:10

Hmm. Even heat death?

ASCII-only

just ensure there are at least 1 million copies at all time, constantly checked for errors

mınxomaτ

A lil experiment (feel free to golf): SASS generated CSS-only countdown.

Geobits

@ASCII-only I think that's vulnerable to a 51% attack.

Destructible Watermelon

strawpoll.me/10951013

TùxCräftîñg

you are evil

Destructible Watermelon

09:12

who is evil?

ASCII-only

@Geobits well, it shouldn't be easy if you keep your computer offline

DJMcMayhem

@DestructibleWatermelon I'm only counting my own polls.

mınxomaτ

Every time I click on a strawpoll link, I think to myself: "Ah damn, never gonna get those seconds of my life back".

5

Destructible Watermelon

@mınxomaτ strawpoll.me/10951019

Geobits

They're just so clickable though.

Destructible Watermelon

09:14

@DJMcMayhem are you making any more polls?

Geobits

@ASCII-only How do you constantly check a million copies for errors if they're all offline?

DJMcMayhem

Alright, anti-golfing won by a landslide. Next, Lets figure out what it will be called: strawpoll.me/10951028

ASCII-only

@Geobits ?

they're all on the same computer

Geobits

Oh, well that's less impressive then.

Destructible Watermelon

@DJMcMayhem Ping me should be the name

ASCII-only

09:15

if you mean online, then that uses public key encryption

DJMcMayhem

I like democracy the best, but I only get one vote.

7

Geobits

I'm not positive any encryption scheme can positively ensure a million distributed copies are unaltered.

ASCII-only

@DJMcMayhem s/1/2/

Geobits

@DJMcMayhem Very nicely played for out-of-context starring. I applaud you.

ASCII-only

fair enough, but it can ensure only the copies that are unaltered can be sent/recieved to/from reliable computers

Geobits

09:19

If you assume the keys stay private and were distributed securely.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

I found a node bug

ASCII-only

@VTCAKAVSMoACE photo?

Geobits

Smash it with a shoe?

VTCAKAVSMoACE

ASCII-only

@Geobits but you're using the public keys to verify

VTCAKAVSMoACE

09:20

Tried that multiple times - node was 100% causing that.

feersum

If you tell it to endlessly allocate memory and it runs out if memory, how is that a bug?

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@feersum Because it's increasing 1 value once per .1 second.

And it took 10 seconds to crash.

DJMcMayhem

I honestly don't understand why that got starred.

Anonymous

@DJMcMayhem It's a pun.

ASCII-only

@VTCAKAVSMoACE yeah, the setTimeouts spawn much faster than once per .1 second

VTCAKAVSMoACE

09:22

@ASCII-only oh

ASCII-only

use setInterval, and once

VTCAKAVSMoACE

But it never output anything. o-o

feersum

@VTCAKAVSMoACE What? It looks to me as if you schedule more and more events as fast as you possibly can.

DJMcMayhem

@Mego oh. I suppose. It was definitely not intentional.

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@ASCII-only Oh, is that synchronous?

ASCII-only

09:23

@VTCAKAVSMoACE no, but you can use it to run a function at a specified interval

like setInterval(thatFunction, 100) to get the behavior you wanted

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@ASCII-only ohhhhh I see

zyabin101

@VTCAKAVSMoACE Maybe censor your name in the username and hostname next time? >>’

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@zyabin101 Don't care enough

ASCII-only

@zyabin101 not too important, I've seen his name on his blog IIRC

TùxCräftîñg

$ ./run.sh examples/fizzbuzz.neo
D:\Neoscript\tmp.0Pqd2h.js:3
for(n of(Array.range('[]',1,100))){var s="";if(((n).op_mod(3)===0)){s=(s).op_add("Fizz");}else{}if(((n).op_mod(5)===0)){s=(s).op_add("Buzz");}else{}if(((s).length===0)){s=n;}else{}((console).log)(s);}
                                                    ^

TypeError: n.op_mod is not a function
    at Object.<anonymous> (D:\Neoscript\tmp.0Pqd2h.js:3:53)
    at Module._compile (module.js:541:32)
    at Object.Module._extensions..js (module.js:550:10)

ಠ_ಠ

wait

i am stupid

ASCII-only

09:24

@VTCAKAVSMoACE btw 10/10 Ubuntu, -9/10 horrible theme + unity bar not hidden

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@ASCII-only It's a VM lol

TùxCräftîñg

-Infinity/10 ubuntu -Infinity/10 unity -Infinity/10 VM

ASCII-only

but that doesn't make it less important to have a UI that doesn't kill your eyes

VTCAKAVSMoACE

@TùxCräftîñg wow 1-

feersum

I wish the chat ignore feature could be more effective; it just makes everything all disjointed.

Feature request: ignoring someone in chat teleports you to an alternate universe where that user doesn't exist.

Sp3000

09:28

Granted! You are now in a universe where nobody exists

Sherlock9

@DJMcMayhem Have you ever watched CGP Grey's voting videos?

TùxCräftîñg

$ ./run.sh examples/fizzbuzz.neo
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
...
84
85
86
87
88
89
90
91
92
93
94
95
96
97
98
99
100

Sherlock9

@mınxomaτ It does not appear to be changing

DJMcMayhem

Alright, so we'll tentatively go with "democracy", although this may change. Up next, language of implementation! strawpoll.me/10951065

TùxCräftîñg

look like my fizzbuzz is borked

DJMcMayhem

09:30

@Sherlock9 no, I haven't

TùxCräftîñg

@DJMcMayhem JavaScript

zyabin101

Today I discovered frinklang.org

DJMcMayhem

@TùxCräftîñg I veto that.

TùxCräftîñg

veto?

zyabin101

@TùxCräftîñg I forbid.

DJMcMayhem

09:32

@TùxCräftîñg en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veto

Sp3000

Veto = a confused vote

Sherlock9

@DJMcMayhem One of the ideas he presents is, essentially: You rank the candidates in order of most to least favorable. If your candidate doesn't make it, your vote goes to the next candidate on your end. At the end, everyone still gets one vote but it isn't "wasted" on a candidate that never had a chance.

DJMcMayhem

@Sherlock9 oh yeah, I've heard about that! Isn't that what SE mod elections use?

zyabin101

@DJMcMayhem These use Meek's method.

Anonymous

@DJMcMayhem Sort of. SE's mod elections use a modified version of STV (single transferrable vote) called Meek STV, which makes votes stop counting after a certain number of transfers. Also, SE mod elections only have you pick your top 3 choices, rather than ranking all of the candidates.

ASCII-only

09:35

@DJMcMayhem yeah

@DJMcMayhem JS

Sherlock9

He's also done videos on how the most common system (First Past the Post voting, whoever gets the majority wins, no matter how slim the majority) is nuts. And also how the US electoral college system is biased towards the smaller states.

Anonymous

Traditional STV requires voters to rank all of the candidates (with no ties), and every vote eventually goes somewhere

DJMcMayhem

@ASCII-only I refuse to write a language in JS

Anonymous

@Sherlock9 Even worse is the issue of swing states in the US. Every election basically comes down to about 10 states.

ASCII-only

@DJMcMayhem why

TùxCräftîñg

09:38

@DJMcMayhem ಠ_ಠ

Sherlock9

I can think of two reasons: 1) DJ doesn't know JS enough to write an entire language in it and 2) DJ doesn't like JS enough to spend what will probably be several months of work deep in JS to build a new language with it

DJMcMayhem

Yes and yes.

Although for some reason I included Perl on the list?

Sherlock9

It's why, if I ever build a language, I'll do it with Python 3. It's what I'm most comfortable with and it's what I know best

TùxCräftîñg

no love for Rust ;_;

ASCII-only

@TùxCräftîñg scripting languages are a lot easier to use in general

TùxCräftîñg

09:41

ik but rust is more easier than C/C++ but C/C++ have more votes

zyabin101

@TùxCräftîñg s/no/some/ :D

TùxCräftîñg

and the package system is neat

Anonymous

I voted for C/C++ because I'm a mean person and I want you to suffer :P

TùxCräftîñg

y u do dis ;_;

ASCII-only

@DJMcMayhem how do you know so many languages

Anonymous

09:44

@ASCII-only Programmers learn languages like old ladies accumulate cats

ASCII-only

@Mego D: that means I'm not a programmer

Zgarb

I'm writing Jellyfish in Python 3, but I'm starting to wish I'd picked Haskell instead... stupid type errors.

DJMcMayhem

@ASCII-only The only languages on that list that I know are C, python and sorta ruby.

I figured if another language won I'd just learn it.

ASCII-only

@Zgarb Don't want type errors? Use JS :P

DJMcMayhem

Although I'm secretly hoping C will win.

Sp3000

09:47

I'm hope you don't actually want it to win :P

ASCII-only

@Mego I just accumulate interpreters to let them collect dust

DJMcMayhem

@Sp3000 Why not? C would be a bit of a pain, but C++ is not too bad.

Sp3000

Well I meant C, rather than C++

Zgarb

@ASCII-only From bad to worse... at least Python usually catches my errors at some point. :P

Even if it's in some seemingly unrelated function.

DJMcMayhem

How do I know when to call it? There are 5 votes so far

ASCII-only

09:50

@DJMcMayhem when there's a 60% majority

Sp3000

I haven't looked at Jellyfish's source yet, but I get the feeling Zgarb probably writes like def f(x:int)->int: return x**2

DJMcMayhem

@ASCII-only that'll probably never happen

TùxCräftîñg

neoscript> 1 `f 2
(f)(1)(2);

\o/

-4

A: What programming languages have been created by PPCG users?

Your Mom Your Mom is a language that I have created after a message of mbomb007 on The Nineteenth Byte: I think someone should create a language called "Your Mom", just so that during an argument over which language is a better one, they can interject that "Your mom is a better language" S...

controversial post

Destructible Watermelon

I voted python because I don't have java installed and I don't feel like installing it :p

TùxCräftîñg

10:14

$ ls
bin/               node_modules/  run.sh*
compiletonode.sh*  package.json   src/
examples/          README.md      tmp.Vi3j5L.js

huh

ASCII-only

10:31

@TùxCräftîñg ?

TùxCräftîñg

> tmp.Vi3j5L.js

ASCII-only

@TùxCräftîñg wat

what is that even for

TùxCräftîñg

run.sh generate a temporary file and launch it

but sometimes the temporary file isnt removed

ASCII-only

@TùxCräftîñg yeah, maybe you should create the temporary file in /tmp

TùxCräftîñg

but the stdlib cant be loaded :/

ASCII-only

10:34

@TùxCräftîñg ?

TùxCräftîñg

Neoscript require a additional library to work

ASCII-only

why can't the stdlib be loaded

TùxCräftîñg

because the stdlib is loaded with require("./bin/stdlib/stdlib.js") by default

ASCII-only

oh

why do you even need a temp file

TùxCräftîñg

because i cant run it directly (for now)

ASCII-only

10:38

you can't use eval or something?

TùxCräftîñg

running directly a script is on my TODO list

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

What did Erik do to be put on the naughty step?

Eʀɪᴋ ᴛʜᴇ Gᴏʟғᴇʀ, Greece

1 4 23

TùxCräftîñg

idk

-22

Q: Reverse a 1-dimensional array

Note: This challenge is not the same. Challenge Believe it or not, we haven't got ONE challenge for reversing one-dimensional arrays (although we've got one for n-dimensional ones)! This should operate only on the 1st dimension, not on all dimensions of an array. Rules Standard loopholes are...

code-golf string array-manipulation

ಠ_ಠ

New Main Posts

-8

Q: le-derme-luxe-review

I suppose you're dead wrong. That is something I was pondering on the way into work this morning. I leave these words with you now. I felt like a kid in a candy store. I presume you enjoy this. You might have at present heard with reference to Le Derme Luxe. Le Derme Luxe earned this unbelievable...

math

TùxCräftîñg

@NewMainPosts 11 this

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

10:48

Haha wow, -22?

I could only dream of those depths

ASCII-only

halp would an image generation ~~popcorn~~ popcon be a good idea?

or are popca just a bad idea in general?

TùxCräftîñg

popcons are good, popcons with images are not

ASCII-only

how, many of the best popcons are image ones

TùxCräftîñg

ah

but i have read somewhere in meta that image popcons are bad

Destructible Watermelon

I have idea for sandboxing

ASCII-only

10:54

@TùxCräftîñg i thought it said popcons in general were bad

TùxCräftîñg

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

Go with an image popcon. Although there are a lot of them, they're definitely the most enjoyable

TùxCräftîñg

unicode have reversed small caps ö

Destructible Watermelon

what is that symbol even for though?

TùxCräftîñg

¯\_(°ᴥ°)_/¯

ASCII-only

10:59

@TùxCräftîñg ?

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

Rollerskating Os

TùxCräftîñg

to create swaggy smileys

ASCII-only

o with umlaut maybe?

TùxCräftîñg

a :O

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

o:O

TùxCräftîñg

11:00

ö

Releasing Helium Nuclei

Ü looks too happy

Destructible Watermelon

<.(ö).>

TùxCräftîñg

new mighty smiley: °ᴥ°

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

(°ō°)

Releasing Helium Nuclei

@TùxCräftîñg polar bear

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

11:01

@TùxCräftîñg Looks like a polar bear on my phone

zyabin101

Please stop with the spam?

TùxCräftîñg

brb editing my XCompose

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

ASCII-only

@βετѧΛєҫαγ how did you get your username

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

@ASCII-only I looked through all of the Unicode characters and picked different ones out

There's a Wikipedia list

TùxCräftîñg

11:03

greek and cyrillic

ASCII-only

Hello @AlphaDecayAndroid

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

brb

TùxCräftîñg

°ᴥ°

Releasing Helium Nuclei

Alpha decay = atoms releasing helium nuclei

TùxCräftîñg

compose key ready to °ᴥ°

Alpha Decay

11:06

Good noon

ASCII-only

wat @βετѧΛєҫαγ has a sock?

TùxCräftîñg

hi Αλπηα Δεψαυ

Alpha Decay

@ASCII-only He has two feet, so yeah

zyabin101

@βετѧΛєҫαγ Choose: F or R?

Alpha Decay

@βετѧΛєҫαγ is dead

TùxCräftîñg

11:07

now just to wait for Gamma Decay

zyabin101

brb changing Server Fault username to Gamma Decay, avatar to Gamma and chat parent user to SF

Alpha Decay

I will bite any imposters

Beta didn't train me to be a pet

zyabin101

@AlphaDecay Choose: F or R?

Releasing Helium Nuclei

oeis.org/A085148 ...wow

Alpha Decay

@zyabin101 R

Destructible Watermelon

11:10

I'm not sure how to not make this challenge into a chameleon challenge '~'

oh wait yeah i do doi

Releasing Helium Nuclei

'~' nice

zyabin101

@AlphaDecay Beta Decay chases you and returns you to the battlefield. "NO YOU MUST STAND AND FIGHT"

ASCII-only

Where's @GammaDecay?

Alpha Decay

@zyabin101 ...wut XD

Releasing Helium Nuclei

is there any keyboard layout that Shift+1 != ! (or "shift+1≠!)

zyabin101

11:13

Well, thanks. :I Frink has five answers and I had no chance to be a pioneer.

TùxCräftîñg

Hello @əℓ¶

Destructible Watermelon

What should the upper limit on integers be in a challenge?

TùxCräftîñg

ﬀiißbb°ɹĸə

Releasing Helium Nuclei

@DestructibleWatermelon 2^31-1 or 2^63-1

ASCII-only

@DestructibleWatermelon 1 << 30 - 1 + 1 << 30

Destructible Watermelon

11:15

>>>"ﬂy"!="fly"
True

New Main Posts

0

Q: Tips for golfing in Common Lisp

What general tips do you have for golfing in Common Lisp? I'm looking for ideas which can be applied to code-golf problems and which are also at least somewhat specific to Common Lisp (e.g. "remove comments" is not an answer). Please post one tip per answer.

tips

Releasing Helium Nuclei

@NewMainPosts remove unnecessary whitespace

ASCII-only

wat beta decay disappears but alpha decay stays

TùxCräftîñg

test

\o/

@ReleasingHeliumNuclei azerty; shift+1 = 1

test

t-clausen.dk

11:31

βετѧ Λєҫαγ are you here ?

zyabin101

@TuxCrafting come back into chat, we're missing you.

Gamma Decay

it's me

Alpha Decay

@t-clausen.dk Alpha's here

t-clausen.dk

ok, improved my answer for your question, it is not the shortest answer

zyabin101

@t-clausen.dk nope

t-clausen.dk

11:32

it is NOW*

Alpha Decay

@t-clausen.dk Alright, I'll edit

Gamma Decay

14

Q: Roll an ASCII die

In this code-golf challenge, you must output an ascii-art of a random die roll. like this: ________ /\ \ / \ 6 \ { 4 }-------} \ / 5 / \/_______/ Please note that: ________ /\ \ / \ 3 \ { 4 }-------} \ / 5 / \/_______/ is invalid output, ...

code-golf ascii-art random

6 answers

t-clausen.dk

would be a miracle if my sql answer will actually be the shortest. Never expected that

for A Fractional Year

Alpha Decay

8

Q: A Fractional Year

My PPCG holiday is over :D Intro Fractional time is the year + (the value (minute of year) / number of minutes in the year). Example calculation You should assume that February always has 28 days and the year is always 365 days long. Let's say we want to convert the time: 17:34 3rd March 201...

code-golf date

t-clausen.dk

also answered that Roll an ASCII die - good assignment

it was a bit longer though

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

11:36

I'm back

Gamma Decay

> The current winner is t-clausen.dk's TSQL answer at 63 bytes

t-clausen.dk

saw the update :)

I don't think sql has ever won on codegolf

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

Haha it'll probably win the bounty too

t-clausen.dk

I imagine Dennis will come by and provide a jelly answer with 13 characters

Gamma Decay

meh i am too bad in SQL to search for winner SQL answers

@t-clausen.dk i think you mean 1.3 bytes

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

11:39

codegolf.stackexchange.com/search?q=sql+isaccepted%3Ayes

t-clausen.dk

I only know sql - so that will always be my answers

Gamma Decay

a lot of challenges dont have accepted answers

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

Yeah, but it's the best we can do

Gamma Decay

@βετѧΛєҫαγ SE data explorer

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

t-clausen.dk

there was a really cool challange that was deleted, it was a ASCII ball of letters

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

11:41

@GammaDecay How would that get the code length?

t-clausen.dk

can provide a link

Gamma Decay

@βετѧΛєҫαγ true

oh

regex

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

@t-clausen.dk How're your regex skills?

t-clausen.dk

regex in sql sucks so bad

so not that skilled. Know some though

Gamma Decay

if you want regex help i am here

t-clausen.dk

11:45

found my sql for the letter ball. But it doesnt work in the fiddle

βετѧ Λєҫαγ

Oh :P

t-clausen.dk

Here is the link, but it doesn't make much sense: data.stackexchange.com/stackoverflow/query/…

it is missing the line feats

zyabin101

Why do you use SEDE for generic SQL queries?

t-clausen.dk

because sql doesn't have stdin or out

assuming SEDE means hardcode

Gamma Decay

wut

t-clausen.dk

11:49

is that from my link ?

El'endia Starman

@GammaDecay Oh no, Frodo didn't throw the ring in! We're all Doomed!

Gamma Decay

:O

zyabin101

@GammaDecay vice-emu.sourceforge.net

t-clausen.dk

got to get back to work, thanks for the chat

zyabin101

@t-clausen.dk You're welcome :D

Goodbye!

Gamma Decay

11:52

ahh

i havent screenshoted it but frodo crashed with Illegal opcode: 42

zyabin101

Link to Frodo?

Gamma Decay

frodo.cebix.net

Transcript for