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12:01 AM
@hyper-neutrino I was just about to edit in wezl and you ninjad my efforts
Very sad
well I was just about to explain my downvote on the "get rep quick" proposal but you ninjad my efforts by deleting the post so guess we're even :P
Fair enough
it's kind of annoying because when you delete your post the field becomes inaccessible
so i can't post the comment or even copy the contents
even though i can post comments on deleted posts normally
12:16 AM
@RedwolfPrograms I would like the suggestions post to settle a bit first, and for a conclusive opinion between one/many meta posts before we do the first post
> The question you're asking appears subjective and is likely to be closed
I got this when I copy-pasted the Flow Free question
@Bubbler Link?
No link, it's the message I got when I clicked "Review your question" button on the Ask page
@Bubbler Just an FYI, SE currently has no way to "unsynonimize" tags, so is always going to be a synonym of . I think that by merging the two, it'll remove both [optimized-output] and the synonym association, but I'm not entirely sure and that would involved "remaking" [optimized-output] if we wanted it
I know far too much about SE's tagging system :/
12:27 AM
@user I think it's reproducible if you copy-paste the entire title/body(markdown)/tags into the Ask Question page
Q: Can we clean up the [optimization] tag and its tag wiki?

BubblerThe tag wiki for optimization currently reads like the following: Challenges tagged optimization should tend to focus on three areas: There is exactly one observable parameter ("score") which measures the performance of attempting a puzzle in a particular approach. As examples, this could be a ...

@cairdcoinheringaahing I'm 195% of the way to Generalist, not including the limitation of the top 40 tags having over 200 questions each
The problem is that our site is very unbalanced in terms of tag usage
12:48 AM
also, am I imagining it, or does TNB seem to have become very chatty recently?
Q: Golf your finger-strokes in Flow Free: Warps

BubblerBackground Flow Free is a series of puzzle games whose objective is to connect all the same-colored pairs of dots on the grid. Flow Free: Warps introduces the "warping" mechanic: a line connecting two dots can go through the border of the grid, which makes it re-enter through the opposite side of...

@Neil it's become very active lately
@Bubbler Honestly, we could probably just retire and say "If it doesn't have a winning criteria tag, it's a code golf challenge", and that's balance the tags out :P
@OldSandboxPosts thanks. As a normal user doing the work of a feed, you should be paid for this
I just had a compiler error, spent a few minutes of research, fixed it, then forgot and did a few more minutes of research. I blame it on PPCG
1:18 AM
Q: Fastest unique finder

l4m2Given 4096 16-bit integers, only four of which are unique and others appeared twice (so 2050 different integers exist). Find the four uniques. To time precisely and limit RAM usage, your program will be run on a 12MHz 8051(with 128B RAM). I'll test with a random case generated by some code to tes...

1:47 AM
New bounty for an interesting new language just went up. If you're interested, check out Barrel!
Q: Fibonacci function or sequence

Chris Jester-YoungThe Fibonacci sequence is a sequence of numbers, where every number in the sequence is the sum of the two numbers preceding it. The first two numbers in the sequence are both 1. Here are the first few terms 1 1 2 3 5 8 13 21 34 55 89 ... Write the shortest code that either: Generates the...

2:15 AM
you can get mortarboard on meta???
first of all why, second of all how did i get it
All of the upvotes on the voting post I guess
right, but all of the answers are CW, and i got it today not yesterday
Oh that's weird
oh i guess i earned it 2 hours ago which would be the end of yesterday so i guess that makes sense?
Maybe the suggestions for the blog combined with the voting question?
2:17 AM
but still, I CW'd all of them.
@RedwolfPrograms that's possible
Q: Negative Space Graphs

Wheat WizardTask You will be given a positive integer and you must output a "self-complementary graph" with that many nodes. If you don't know what a self-complementary graph is the wikipedia article wont help you much so below are two explanations, a technical and a non-technical one. Non-Technical A gr...

3 hours later…
5:03 AM
fun fact: when trying to graduate out of beta, a site is considered healthy if it gets 10+ questions a day. at time of graduation, CGCC had 10.6, but in the past month (from 3/10 to 4/10), we've only averaged a bit under 3 per day, lol
of course, this metric doesn't translate as well to CGCC as Q+A sites because our questions don't just get a "right answer" and get accepted and move on
ᵈᵒⁿ'ᵗ ˢᵉⁿᵈ ᵘˢ ᵇᵃᶜᵏ ᵗᵒ ᵇᵉᵗᵃ
also fun fact, the #1 most common site that people who committed to the PPCG area 51 proposal also committed to was, well. Code Review lol
@RedwolfPrograms *ungraduates your site*
PPCG ungraduation userscript
so it uh reverts back to beta colours
And deletes useful features like code formatting
5:07 AM
wait does that means it brings back dennis and everyone else?
but there's only CJam and Golfscript to use
Vyxal doesn't exist
@RedwolfPrograms how to make userscript?
@Lyxal if dennis comes back then we wouldn't exist on the site right
Go to the tampermonkey menu and click new userscript
@Razetime oh yeah right
5:09 AM
Then write teh codez
just teleport bread for 3 days
Hello everyone! Yesterday I gave a CMQ and then vanished
Is there any specific userscript which only adds leaderboards to questions
Not sure, but I'm going to make one tomorrow
Is your GCCaPl ready? When you are releasing it
It turns out it's almost impossible to have loops since websites can't intercept Ctrl + (Shift +) N or Ctrl + (Shift +) W
So I'll need to rethink the program format
5:16 AM
How about writing the keyboard shortcuts as Unicode characters?
Like a Unicode character in program will point to a specific shortcut
But the problem is that, in order to terminate the program, you close the window. But there's no way to prevent that if your program includes it, so looping is impossible.
Ooh, idea
A popup window rather than new tab
So Ctrl + Shift + W would close that instead of the "main" window
A lot of windows will likely confuse
Are you using selenium?
No, just manually entering the commands
You launch a chrome window and user has to hit those keys?
You could probably emulate it though
5:22 AM
Ah then the interpreter program will be so short
okay how to share userscript?
Copy and paste it into a gist and end the name in .user.js
Is there .user part necessary?
No, but it makes it automatically install (so basically yes)
I present to you: LFAPOU
The name is an acronym for Lyxal's first and probably only userscript
5:25 AM
What does this do?
mostly nothing
Yesterday I wrote a userscript and the result went very bad
like actually it mostly does nothing
how much of the giant mess of strings and lists is actually meaningful to the code
all of it
5:26 AM
i hate you /s
I ran it through an obfusicator
this only works sometimes
Recursive acronym: LLFAPOU is Lyxal's first and probably only userscript
@hyper-neutrino exactly
oh. that's intentional? i thought it was just my tampermonkey being weird or another userscript breaking it or smth
5:27 AM
plus it only works on the homepage
@hyper-neutrino you either get lucky or you don't
@Lyxal i'd say it's win-win; either i get to listen to wonderful music, or i get to browse CGCC
@hyper-neutrino I'm keeping it on btw
actually it's arguably any of the four combinations of win/lose - win/lose depending on how i'm feeling
Just thought of something...you could make a userscript to seriously mess stuff up by doing document.write("") on every page
Actually you can still disable it from the extension popup
@hyper-neutrino how would you rate what will most likely be the only userscript I ever write?
5:30 AM
@Lyxal 69/420
I have an idea of a bot/userscript which does the monotonous Thanksgiving or welcoming task in comments of Stack exchange
@hyper-neutrino excellent
then it shall forever remain at version
i didn't actually notice that yet am of course not at all surprised
@RedwolfPrograms have you checked out LFAPOU?
No, I can assume what it does :p
5:36 AM
CMQ: Which part of code golf do you prefer more? (e.g answering, asking, golfing language creation etc)
I'm talking about the actual act of golfing
Not the site but the things we actually are here to do
asking and making golflangs
@Lyxal answering!!!
But currently I am asking a lot
i feel like hypothetically i might find making languages more fun than golfing in them if i was actually sane
I'd like answering more if JS didn't have so many people better than me :p
How many people use JS in PPCG?
5:40 AM
I'm very lucky that there are only 3 active Powershell users in PPCG
@RedwolfPrograms use japt
Isn't it just shortened js?
Or Ash in a week or two, hopefully :D
I will like to learn Pyth
5:42 AM
@RedwolfPrograms well maybe if you hurry up a little bit I could be golfing in ash too :p
Well done mobile chat for sending my edit as a new message
I've got some really annoying bugs with array composition though :/
Is there many ArnoldC user?
anyone know how to make it not flash between page load and loading in the new stylesheet?
also i just steal conlang.SE's css lmao
It's complicated
You can use @runpat document-start
But the DOM's not loaded yet
5:48 AM
that seems to just make it not work at all, since i replace elements in the document
You'll need to wait for DOMContentReady I think, which I'm pretty sure is before first paint
oh okay, i'll try that
also i have no clue why on earth i did this but this does bring back a bit of nostalgia :P
fixed; still flashes a bit but it's better
@Razetime ^ made a very primitive verison which just changes the CSS to a beta stylesheet and removes the site logo and replaces it with text
doesn't like delete code formatting or anything like that
Does anyone know if there's been a challenge which asks for a day of the week and returns how many days away that day is?
E.g. Given the day "Thursday", it would return 1
Because Thursday is one day away
(today it would return 1)
Given "Monday" it would return 5 today, because Monday is 5 days away
Does such a challenge exist?
Because if not I want to sandbox it
I couldn't understand "away"?
how many days from now until the specified day of the week
6:01 AM
I think such challenge exists
I was looking under and scrolled so far I found a redwolf question
I am going to give a new challenge in main
this is close but works with exact dates
The challenge I'm thinking of is relative to program running time
Last feedback for this should I disallow Whitespace here?
for sake of fun yes
6:13 AM
@Wasif Explicitly disallowing arbitrary languages is not recommended, so no
oh he mean Whitespace not whitespace
It's pretty much impossible in a bunch of languages, and it would be nigh impossible if whitespace chars are disallowed :P
@hyper-neutrino If the userscript is aimed self used, a rule for Redirector add-on would work for you. You may also insert the styles at very beginning and add !important here and there...
Ok I won't then Whitespace and deadfish~ is gonna win
@Bubbler I meant Whitespace language :P
Restricted Source Theorem: For any source restriction that is in the form of "you cannot use XYZ characters/bytes" so that some non-empty program is allowed, there exists at least one language on esolangs.org that can completely bypass it.
6:21 AM
O is available
Restricted Source Conjecture: There are at least 10 different languages that satisfy the above
Incident is made for challenges like these
i have not the slightest clue how to handwrite it though
Yeah, incident is proven to be Turing-complete with any two distinct chars
@Wasif don't think so?
> The only characters left to use are 12345QWERTASDFG<>ZXCqwertasdfgzxc!@#$% and also Tab, Space, and Newline.
Q: R.E.P.A.I.R. T.H.E. K.E.Y.B.O.A.R.D

WasifSequel of this AWESOME challenge You, a genius tech prodigy detective, have successfully disarmed the bomb and want to break into the computer. The policemen found the password 67890-=yuiop[]hjkl;'\vbnm^&*()_+:"| on a piece of paper, but much of the keyboard is broken and there are no other ways ...

6:24 AM
@hyper-neutrino sorry sorry I was saying from the password
So a problem happened
Does this qualify as non-zero score?
This is a good news that another language is kicked out :-)
@Bubbler you need to write a program which will output only one character
So it is invalid submission for the challenge
Then Deadfish is totally out
Deadfish~ still lives, because it has a character output command c
and then you can ask the fairy for i, and voila
This was done in the Disarm bomb challenge
Deadfish~ can have a decent score but can't make its way to 35
@Wasif To clarify the question: Should an answer print the first n chars of the password, or any n distinct chars of the password in any order?
6:35 AM
An answer can print only one character, and the writing order of programs can be anything, like you might make program to write 9 before o or y after 7
> Write a separate program/function for each password character.
If you choose unary
Oh didn't notice that until now
it use only one char which you can select
The fairy character can be used any number of times in any number of programs, right?
6:40 AM
I am going to do it
okay i meta-golfed deadfish so this should be unbeatable (in deadfish)
unless i am stupid
@hyper-neutrino didn't expect this silly idea to actually happen
@Razetime me neither, but i realized i could probably just replace the CSS with a beta site's current style page and so it wouldn't take too much effort
if it took time or effort i wouldn't have had the motivation to do it :P
can i slowly updates answer?
so long as your original answer is correct and solves the problem
6:55 AM
tempted to put the meta-golfer and explanation first because the actual deadfish code itself is pretty boring but i'm slightly more proud of the meta-golfer
What i gonna do is painful
do keep in mind that editing a post bumps the thread to the top of the main page, which isn't too big of a deal since it's one post and new answers will bump it too, but just keep that in mind in case you didn't realize
I will try to update it in one go
7:14 AM
i just reduced my code from 1e+26 to 1e+16 lol
@okie probably the biggest golf in history of PPCG lol
there have been several considerably longer ones
@Wasif If you think so, you definitely haven't seen this yet
@Bubbler I am having goosebumps after seeing this...
where's the one that was golfed from not fitting inside the observable universe
down to 2488
7:20 AM
Will unary make way to 35 score?
Definitely will, because it is not affected by source restriction at all (it uses single char 0 for all its programs, and we assume it's given by the fairy)
I can't seem to find a good BF text generator
7:51 AM
My work has completed
I happily abandoned art class and over 15% of my laptop power to fulfill my need for unary
8:13 AM
@hyper-neutrino Yeah, if you get enough upvotes on meta that would be equivalent to getting 200 rep (if upvotes gave rep) you get Mortarboard
Can't get Epic or Legendary tho
huh. didn't realize that and mildly surprised i hadn't gotten that before lol
It's surprisingly hard to get 20 upvotes in a day on meta nowadays :P
true :P must've just been from spamming your "what should we put on our blog" post lol
if i didn't CW my election thread i would've nearly gotten it from just one, and there were three with almost that many votes
@hyper-neutrino Which is why I woke up 2 hours ago with 15 notifications from the SE app :P
8:16 AM
Combine that with getting a notification everytime someone edits the Vim LotM post and it was ridiculous :P
A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

LyxalHow Long Until The Next Date? code-golfdate Sometimes, I will think it is one day of the week (e.g Friday) when in reality, it's earlier in the week (e.g Tuesday). Your challenge is to display the number of days my estimates are off by. Challenge Given a day of the week I think it is, and the day...

@Bubbler Yeah, that doesn't surprise me :P Jelly has to have as it's "fairy" character otherwise it's not outputting anything as a character, and "ASCII-only" Jelly is not very golfy
1 hour later…
9:27 AM
Q: Calculate Home Primes

caird coinheringaahingThe Home Prime of an integer \$n\$ is the value obtained by repeatedly factoring and concatenating \$n\$'s prime factors (in ascending order, including repeats) until reaching a fixed point (a prime). For example, the Home Prime (\$\text{HP}(n)\$) of \$10\$ is \$773\$ as: $$\begin{align} 10 & = 2...

9:55 AM
@cairdcoinheringaahing is my solution the same one you had or did you arrive at a distinct 6-byter?
@hyper-neutrino Yeah, mine was the same
okay. i suspect there isn't really a way this can be golfed, rip
Just ÐL and Æf being irritatingly long :/
yep, and the necessary $, which means we can't beat 05AB1E even with one-byte builtins :c
10:23 AM
Q: Basic Typescript Types

EtheryteTypescript is a typed superset of Javascript. For this challenge, we'll consider the following classic basic types: string number boolean undefined null And two "meta" types: any never The type any annotates that any type is valid: const a: any = "foo"; const b: any = 42; const c: any = true;...

Q: The longest consecutive traversal possible (number of edges)

PluviophileA truck fleet dispatcher is trying to determine which routes are still accessible after heavy rains flood certain highways. During their trips, trucks must follow linear, ordered paths between 26 waypoints labeled A through Z; in other words, they must traverse waypoints in either standard or rev...

1 hour later…
11:26 AM
@hyper-neutrino stack based languages ftw
@Lyxal FTFY: languages with 1 byte factorisation and fixed point builtins ftw :P
Also @hyper-neutrino I keep confusing you with stewie griffin
@cairdcoinheringaahing you're just jelly that jelly doesn't have atom overloads :p
@Lyxal Nah, I'm jelly about the one byte commands in other languages :P
Personally, I'm not a fan of overloading, cause you have to remember that 4 different things a builtin does
But OTOH it does allow you to cram more functionality in
And it makes things more efficient too - you aren't wasting potential functionality when the types required for an operator are not what is usually expected
I can get overloading strings vs numbers, but I'll always prefer vectorisation over array overloading
11:32 AM
Vectorising always comes before overloading
Unless there's a very exceptional case where it's desired for a command to not vectorise, vectorisation should be the default option
For arrays that is
11:46 AM
Interesting fact for Rot-13: I just realize that Space isn't counted as printable ascii.
12:08 PM
@okie Spaces are generally considered printable, but because it's ambiguous you should generally specify
12:27 PM
@hyper-neutrino since when did you remove the sign in option from your xyz site?
Now I can't sign into my hyperaccount™
This is sad
Alexa, play despacito
removed it when i redid the whole thing
first version was half just testing and there's no reason for me to have a signin :P
@Lyxal I disagree. Only like three operators in Ash vectorize, because having more array operators is always preferable to saving a byte here and there, because more array operators saves a byte here and there and there and there and there and there and there and so on
The point of overloading is that, yeah, you might wanna cast a string to a number and then take absolute value, but having it, say, convert to upper case saves a byte in a lot more situations. Similarly, you may want to upper case a list of strings, but it'd be useful in quite a bit more situations if it, say, sorted the array max -> min.
There are some operators, like +, that I agree should probably be vectorized. Most of them are not those.
12:42 PM
If you treat strings as arrays of characters, then you vectorise all commands and overload them for numbers/characters
Quite a few string operators would break
If you just vectorize over the characters and do stuff to each one individually, you can't have certain parts of the string be affected and the rest not.
Can't think of an example because I'm not really awake yet
Stuff like splitting on spaces?
@RedwolfPrograms yes you can
you just need a general way to apply a function to a specific part
12:46 PM
@cairdcoinheringaahing Yeah. Stuff like that, trim whitespace, etc.
there's no reason you can't have that in a language that treats strings as arrays of chars
@RedwolfPrograms The way you deal with that is by having some "array-based" commands, and some "non-array based" commands
If Jelly had string overloading, I'd point to that as an example
If you have say ['a', 'b', ' ', 1, 6.5, 'd', ' ', 1j+4] in Jelly and split on spaces, you get [['a', 'b'], [1, 6.5, 'd'], [1j+4]], which is how it should work
Quite a few of Ash's operators are already almost identical with strings and arrays
Use auto-casting to promote integers and characters to arrays when necessary
But overloading arrays as separate from strings gives you the flexibility to make sensible changes when that wouldn't make sense.
You can have it vectorize 99% of the time, but anything that doesn't waste one operator is an operator gained
Gotta go to school now, but that's my main argument for overloading (not necessarily against vectorization, just against vectorization by default)
12:56 PM
The real answer to the question here will come from when ash is actually released and makes its way onto the Elo post
And that's gonna take a while because new languages take forever to show up on the Elo list
1:08 PM
@RedwolfPrograms IIRC one of Dennis' rationales for not overloading commands in Jelly is so that the language "made more sense"
Because as soon as you can increment characters, Jelly becomes complete nonsense, and never before then :P
Btw I missed last night's conversation but here's a userscript that does basically everything the PPCG graduation script does, but without the extra CSS stuff.
is there no way of knowing why you were awarded a random bounty?
1:25 PM
Husk officially beats Jelly now?!
I guess that makes it slightly more feasible for Ash to beat Jelly so I have permanent bragging rights :p
1:50 PM
Three dots cost me ten minutes of debugging time :|
I guess that's better than when I first learned HTML/JS and didn't know it was innerHTML not innerHtml, and couldn't figure it out for three weeks
@Lyxal does using the chat count? Also, good morning
@Lyxal Answering, hands down. Also getting rep
well those too

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