The Nineteenth Byte

mınxomaτ

00:00

@Qwerp-Derp chat.stackexchange.com/messages/35035195/history

Qwerp-Derp

@mınxomaτ How did you manage to do that?

Pavel

Rly?

mınxomaτ

Copied the wrong thing. Or rather didn't copy the right thing.

Pavel

You felt the need to copy... tips. Four letters.

mınxomaτ

Don't judge me.

I needed to lookup if the tag is "tip" or "tips".

ATaco

00:04

Tacobot can now run Lua.

In a sandbox.

quartata

@Doorknob ahahaha

mınxomaτ

That's hilarious.

Qwerp-Derp

Wait what? Link please @mınxomaτ!

mınxomaτ

0

Q: A boring version of yourself

A boring version of yourself Have you ever dreamed of a boring version of you which types the text you just typed ? No ? Because that's exactly what I'm challenging you to do ! The program needs to check how many time it took for the user to input a text at program launch and then retype the t...

popularity-contest

Riker

@mınxomaτ I understand, I don't it's that funny though

mınxomaτ

00:17

Oh come on, this is meta on so many levels.

Riker

true

mınxomaτ

@Riker Also, I you forgot the word

Riker

true

Qwerp-Derp

lol

ATaco

Yay, I wrote a Tacobot Quine, I guess.

Pavel

00:25

wut

wat

I don't think this is normal

ATaco

Actually, that kinda is.

New Main Posts

0

Q: Tips for golfing in tinylisp

tinylisp is, in its essence, a very stripped-down version of Lisp, as the name suggests. It was made by @DLosc for an "interpret this language" challenge, which can be found here. It features a small amount of builtins, which can be used to create practically anything. There is a repository for ...

code-golf tips

wat

ah yes the old "chrome eats ram like an industrial shredder" cliche

ATaco

@orlp I have one of those robot arms. They're not autonomous, sadly.

CMC: A quine that prints the keystrokes required to produce it.

feersum

00:36

On the quine challenge you can find many quines that don't require a "Shift" or anything.

ATaco

How many of them are valid quines?

Even 1\n1 requires an {enter}

(Vim is cheating)

quartata

@wat How many tabs do you have open??

wat

@quartata at the time, around 40-45

quartata

Well that's why.

Mistah Figgins

All on the same window?

wat

00:40

@MistahFiggins yes

Mistah Figgins

How do you manage to change tabs without closing some

quartata

Each tab is a process. That's what you're seeing.

Pavel

@ATaco How do you represent enter/shift/etc.?

ATaco

For the sake of this, {ENTER} {ENTER D} {ENTER U}

wat

@MistahFiggins I can still see the icons, just not the titles, and I can hover over tabs for icons.

quartata

00:42

Actually, how about a program that actually types itself? Like using xdotool or such.

Riker

hm

wat

@Riker hmm

ATaco

The 7 Quine 23723 works, if you use the raw octet form.

quartata

I mean, I wouldn't actually post that. But it would be funny.

Riker

ye

ATaco

00:50

Lua,

s="s=%qs=s:format(s)t={[string.char(34)]='\\'',['%%']=5,[';']=':',['{']='[',['}'‌]=']',['(']=9,[')']=0}s=s:gsub('.',function(a)if t[a] then return '{SHIFT D}'..t[a]..'{SHIFT U}' end return a end)print(s)"s=s:format(s)t={[string.char(34)]='\'',['%']=5,[';']=':',['{']='[',‌['}']=']',['(']=9,[')']=0}s=s:gsub('.',function(a)if t[a] then return '{SHIFT D}'..t[a]..'{SHIFT U}' end return a end)print(s)

Riker

is that a quine?

ATaco

A Keystroke Quine.

Riker

nice

in python, _='_=%r;print _%%_';print _%_<enter> is one

I think python wins

ATaco

Does that correctly encode the %s?

Riker

?

oh true it doesn't

ATaco

00:56

b="t={[string.char(34)]='\\'',['%']=5,[';']=':',['{']='[',['}']=']',['(']=9,[')'‌]=0}s=s:gsub('.',function(a)if t[a] then return '{SHIFT D}'..t[a]..'{SHIFT U}' end return a end)print(s)"s="b=%qs=%qs=s:format(b,s)load(b)()"s=s:format(b,s)load(b)()

Much better golfed.

wat

why is cities skylines taking like 10 minutes to load my save

Wheat Wizard

@Pavel I think I've done it now codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/108206/56656

feersum

01:16

@ATaco Here's an existing one that requires no extra keystrokes: codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/100426/30688

I was trying to post this earlier but then I ended up spending 20 minutes debugging the clipboard.

It turned out to be locked by a program that had crashed, and was fixed when I closed that program.

Pavel

In order to prevent trivial quines like the one above, there should be a requirement that you also have to represent the keystrokes {CONTROL S} to save your program.

feersum

Auto-saving text editor.

Pavel

Or {f5}/whatever to run the code, or something like that.

feersum

Also you should have to represent the power button on your computer for turning it on.

Pavel

Of course it all breaks once someone tries to push a Jelly answer.

Downgoat

01:21

@wat ok well then something is wrong if it's serving me https

wat

@Downgoat I don't know, everyone here is getting http

although

I'm getting https too now

Downgoat

hm :/ it's just that one link

wat

but then you can replace the https:// with http:// and it should work

Downgoat

weird

mınxomaτ

I fixed the memory bug, I think. When in doubt, pass by reference.

Pavel

01:27

@mınxomaτ ...What are you talking about?

mınxomaτ

2 hours ago, by mınxomaτ

@quartata I use bit locking to shadow the image data over an array of RGB values to prevent memcpy operations. I think Windows gets angry if you don't free the lock in time.

Pavel

Welp, that sounds complicated. I'm out.

4

Pavel

01:55

Announcing: 50 rep bounty to the first quine if Forte!

(May be increased if this turns out to be exceptionally difficult)

Dennis

46

Q: List of bounties with no deadline

This is a list of unofficial, deadline-less (hence not searchable) bounties offered by users on various challenges on the main site. Disclaimer: There is no guarantee that the user will award the bounty for you in case you fulfill its requirement. Especially if the user isn't an active member an...

discussion bounty

Pavel

Didn't no about that, thanks!

ATaco

Working on it now.

Christopher Peart

@Pavel k

Pavel

(tio.run/nexus/forte)

Christopher Peart

02:04

How quine must it be

Pavel

Actual, legit quine.

No empty programs

DJMcMayhem

@Qwerp-Derp I honestly don't understand why everyone hates CAD so much. It's not amazing but I enjoyed reading it

Christopher Peart

Hmm

Having trouble thinking about how to quine at all

ATaco

It may be impossible, due to the fact that strings can't be built up and Print appends a newline.

Pavel

It's been proven that any TC language capable of outputting arbitrary strings has a quine.

Christopher Peart

02:07

@ATaco add a semicolin

ATaco

Arbitrary unformatted strings.

New Bounties With No Deadlines

0

A: List of bounties with no deadline

50 Rep: Quine in Forte Exactly what is says on the tin.

Pavel

@ATaco Yes. stackoverflow.com/questions/2568020/…

Christopher Peart

I a going to die

Pavel

Creating a Forte program that takes input is like making a radiation-hardened program, but even worse.

Christopher Peart

02:12

XD

So no input?

Pavel

If the user inputs a number that is the line number of the input statement plus one, it crashes instantly

Christopher Peart

XD

But still

Pavel

Well, quines don't take input anyway.

Christopher Peart

Double checking

My last google search: how to write a quine

Welp

I have no idea how to quine

Pavel

@ATaco if you end a print statement with a semicolon, it won't append the newline.

ATaco

02:15

I've noticed, thus I have faith again.

Christopher Peart

I don't even know how to quine in a normal lang

ATaco

Is it even possible to print a "..?

Christopher Peart

dk

that is a wall I hit

Pavel

Don't think so

That... might be a problem

Christopher Peart

yeah

XD you just made a impossible challenge. I have checked and found no way to do that

Pavel

02:20

Challenge retracted

Christopher Peart

XD

There goes my chance of 50 rep

1 PRINT "1 PRINT";
3 LET 1

Would that loop forever?

ATaco

A " cannot be printed at all, and a Letter cannot be printed without the use of a ". Nothing can be printed without the usage of a letter, Thus, a quine of any length higher than 0 is impossible.

Also nope.

Christopher Peart

Ok

My idea involved a infinite loop

So you would always run it and the quine would never stop

ATaco

I was just going to encode a double print.

Christopher Peart

then Dennis would track me down for wasting server space

Dennis

02:24

Are you implying I don't know where you are?

Doorknob

@Pavel Can you not just use PUT?

Christopher Peart

OHH GOSH

GUYS

Please save me

Pavel

WELP

wat

from what

Christopher Peart

Uhhh "Are you implying I don't know where you are?"

Dennis

ATaco

02:26

Oh, PUT.

We are back on track.

Christopher Peart

I wasted a lot of server processing actually. I was trying to fix my code

wat

Dennis is definitely a menace

Christopher Peart

(Never fixed it)

@Pavel it may be possible using PUT

Pavel

It is possible with PUT.

Christopher Peart

Yas

Back to pain and anguish

Pavel

02:28

Forte is Turing-Complete, and can output any finite chain of characters. Therefore, a quine exists.

@ais523 you made Forte right? You may be interested in this, there's an indefinite bounty for a quine in it.

Christopher Peart

@ATaco Do not try and loop

ATaco

Make me.

Christopher Peart

I broke it

TIO

100110 LET 110=110+3
109 LET 100110=108
110 PRINT "Looping...": LET 108=108+3

trying that

It timed out

no error or anything in the debugger

Pavel

How, exactly, were you planning to write a quine without loops?

Christopher Peart

It times out

∴the output will never be shown

∴you can't view what will happen and if it works correctly

Unless I have a negative amount of knowledge on quines

ATaco

02:35

You can write finite loops.

Christopher Peart

But a quine would not be finate

would it?

ATaco

A quine is always Finite.

Dennis

All quines are finite, unless you have infinite source code.

Which comes with a few practical issues.

Anonymous

@Dennis "a few" is a bit of an understatement

Christopher Peart

:P I have no idea how to quine. SO little idea that it became negative about 20 min ago

Pavel

02:37

It doesn't have to fit in the observable universe, but it does have to be finite.

ATaco

Well, think a bit more creatively.

Have a script with one half just being an encoded version of the other half. Then, the other half is print the encoded version, then decode and print that.

Pavel

I wonder if a Cat program is possible in Forte

Christopher Peart

huh

cat?

Pavel

Exactly output the entire input

Anonymous

Don't we have an answer to the quine challenge that doesn't fit in the observable universe?

wat

02:38

yep

Dennis

We did. It was golfed.

Pavel

We used to have Brain-flak, but it's been golfed

Ninja'd

Christopher Peart

Dennis please don't hurt me for burning so much Server Power

Pavel

TIO is pretty good with killing anything that tries to break it

Christopher Peart

After 60 sec

Dennis

02:39

Load average of the past 15 minutes were 0.20. You're overestimating the impact of your attempts.

Christopher Peart

Challenge accepted

Anonymous

I'm fairly certain 9.8e580 bytes will fit in the observable universe

Anonymous

@ChristopherPeart Please don't break the nice things

Christopher Peart

Already failed

Pavel

1e100 doesn't fit in the observable universe

That's a Googol

ATaco

02:41

9.8e580 wont fit, Probably.

Lenguage might be the way to go.

Pavel

Maybe

Christopher Peart

How do you print a " symbol in Forte

?

Pavel

PUT34

Anonymous

10**124 bits is approximately the maximum information that can be stored in the observable universe

Pavel

spaces are optional everywhere except the newline at the end of a command btw

Anonymous

02:42

So approximately 10**123 bytes. So I guess that Brain-Flak quine wouldn't fit.

Anonymous

I always thought the Bekenstein limit of the observable universe was higher. Guess not. We need to upgrade our storage.

ATaco

10PRINT"10PRINT";
20PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT59

That, prints the first line.

Christopher Peart

Well I have tried and failed to do this

Pavel

WTF there isn't a quine in BASIC at all.

Christopher Peart

Rly?

10PRINT"10PRINT 20PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34
30LET10=50
40LET20=60
70PUT5920PUT34

That is the closest I got

ATaco

02:45

You really need to learn how to quine.

wat

forte is not in TIO

Christopher Peart

yup referring to ATACO

ATaco

tio.run/nexus/forte

Pavel

@wat Yes it is

Christopher Peart

Yeah it is @wa

wat

02:46

not in Nexus anyway

Pavel

Follow. The. Link.

Christopher Peart

So if I brute force this does it count?

Pavel

Oh wait, there's a qBasic quine

@ChristopherPeart It does.

Christopher Peart

Imagine a evil grin right here

Pavel

I'll see you at the end of the lifespan of the universe.

Christopher Peart

02:50

XD

My closest brute force before I started to scan the room for Dennis

Pavel

Wait, are you brute forcing it with TIO BASH?

Christopher Peart

gnight

Pavel

gnight

ATaco

I'll take my bounty now.

Wheat Wizard

@Pavel I think I've done it this time

ATaco

02:55

I did it first.

I win.

Pavel

@ATaco Post it to "golf you a quine for great good", I'll create the bounty, and if by the end of the week no one has beaten you, you get it.

Work on golfing/explanation for now?

ATaco

This was not competitive :(

wat

hey @Downgoat can you please update your userscript to be compatibl with TIO Nexus?

Pavel

@wat No, because the new TIO back end it weird.

I asked

Downgoat

1 hour ago, by Pavel

Welp, that sounds complicated. I'm out.

I could make an API though

Still trying to figure how to get node to work on api.vihan.org

wat

02:58

your problem is that

you are using node

Downgoat

haha you're so funny

Pavel

@WheatWizard Good job! Have an upvote!

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