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Anonymous
12:00 AM
It can give incorrect output, it can error out, it can solve a different PPCG problem... It doesn't matter, since it won't be tested.
 
@Mego It looks like it is still really slow even for small inputs
 
Anonymous
How about we meet in the middle: I'll change it so that only the test cases in the question matter.
 
Anonymous
(and I'll create a few more)
 
Anonymous
@quartata The C++ program? Yeah, it's O(2^32).
 
@Mego I just think you could improve the quality of your challenge by e.g. using the lower bound 1, as then you would have clear conditions and you would not just leave it to the participant....
 
Anonymous
12:02 AM
@flawr As Calvin stated, it's unfair to change the range restriction
 
Anonymous
Just like my last challenge, this feedback would've been great while it was in the Sandbox
 
I think I'll just give up on this challenge for now because I don't feel like implementing Simpson's rule or using a super slow super inaccurate approximation
 
how is the gamma function implemented?
 
@quartata I think you could reduce the INT_MAX to something much lower. It won't be as precise but it will be faster.
 
12:04 AM
@quartata not helpful...
 
Damn son, Spounge's approximation FTW
0
A: Gamma Function Golf

Alex A.Julia, 141 bytes z->(z-=1;a=90;c(k)=(k=big(k);(-1)^(k-1)/factorial(k-1)*(a-k)^(k-.5)*exp(a-k));(z+a)^(z+.5)*exp(-z-a)*(√(2π)+sum([c(k)/(z+k)for k=1:a-1]))) This creates an unnamed lambda function that accepts a real number and returns a real number. It uses Spounge's approximation to compute...

 
Hey, we've got a language restriction challenge: codegolf.stackexchange.com/q/63898/45151
> The language must not be bash or a bash scripting language of any type
ban ban ban ban ban ban ban
 
on it :P
 
@AlexA. Wait, what?
Oh I totally forgot about that
 
Alex ninja'd me
 
12:05 AM
>:D
 
by 5 seconds
 
@AlexA. that'll be fun to implement in Rotor D:
 
I just got back from walking my dog my hands are cold that's cheating :P
 
Per our recent meta discussion however challenges like this can be closed on site actually
 
@Doorknob oh my god dog what kind of dog i love dogs ahh (except thedoctor)
 
12:07 AM
-2
Q: Implement Cowsay

minerguy31If you're like me, you love pointless things like cowsay. I mean, sure, it's not useful, but it is fun to play around with. Anyways, onto the challenge. You have to make a program that prints something of this format: ___________ < Text here > ----------- \ ^__^ \ (oo)\___...

 
10
A: Disallowing Explicit Exclusion of Languages

MegoYes, challenges that specifically exclude certain languages or penalize them should be considered off-topic and closed as such The spirit of this site is to write the shortest code per language for a challenge, not just the overall shortest code. We do not forbid users from posting answers which...

 
@quartata Hasn't had enough time to build consensus and we don't yet have a custom close reason for it even if we decided to do it.
 
@AlexA. He's a "doubledoodle," which is a cross between a labradoodle (lab + poodle) and goldendoodle (golden + poodle).
 
How does a doorknob walk a dog?
 
very, very carefully
 
12:07 AM
> walk.... but.... very carefully
 
@Calvin'sHobbies The leash it attached to the knob. The dog can't go very far.
 
Anonymous
I tested this with replacing INT_MAX with 1e8, and all the outputs were accurate. I suggest you do the same, since it will both shave off bytes and drastically decrease the execution time. — Mego 33 secs ago
 
@Doorknob ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
 
Anonymous
The C++ answer is accurate and not horribly slow with 1e8 iterations
 
@AlexA. I gotta go eat but I can give you pictures later if you want ;)
 
12:08 AM
Do want
 
Anonymous
Which means that it's not that bad to use the integral definition and iterate a billion times
 
Have good eat
 
@AlexA. Speak better
 
No
 
Confirmative
 
Digress
 
Is he asking for the input to be outputted like that...?
I'm not even sure what he's asking for.
He seems to just want any text there.
 
Anonymous
Yeah, I VTC'd as unclear
 
can I copy an paste a wikipedia implementation and golf?
 
@quartata He's obviously meaning for there to be some input string that is displayed. The first rule is saying how many underscores/dashes need to be above/below it.
 
12:14 AM
General suggestion: Quite often we find problems with challenges after they have been posted, even if the question has been in the sandbox. I think a lot of them could be avoided if the one providing the challenge would have to provide an implementation himself.
 
@flawr For the record I rarely do this unless I have to or want to.
 
@Calvin'sHobbies Me neither, but I think it would greatly improve the quality of the challenges.
 
Anonymous
@flawr Disagree, the issue is that nobody looks at the sandbox.
 
@Calvin'sHobbies It's so very unclear.
Ah, he's cleared it up now
 
@Mego You think it would not provide better quality?
 
12:17 AM
Oh wait that was you.
 
can I copy an paste a wikipedia implementation and golf?
 
@TanMath Yes
 
@TanMath I do not think this is an issue, it just would be nice to make a reference to the source.
 
Anonymous
@flawr Perhaps, but the root cause of the issue is that, while a challenge is in the sandbox, the author and maybe one or two other people work on it. Then, when it hits main, lots of people see it and see issues that those 2-3 people didn't notice.
 
@flawr obviously
 
12:20 AM
@Mego But I think many of the problems would be noticed if the author would actually try to solve the challenge himself.
I do not say this is the key to solving all problems but I think the site would greatly benefit.
 
Anonymous
The issue is not that the OP doesn't understand the question (which is what you seem to be implying), but rather that there are not enough eyes on the sandboxed question to catch all of the issues.
 
Anonymous
@flawr Are you implying that I didn't try to solve the Gamma challenge myself? Because that is certainly not the case.
 
@Mego No that certainly not what I mean.
What do you mean by OP, the author or the participant?
 
Author (OP = original poster)
 
Then no, I think it should be given that the author understands what he is asking.
I think too that the posts in the sandbox do not get enough attention. But this is partly because it is 'hidden' in meta, but also because it is quite cluttered.
 
12:27 AM
^
@flawr i cannot carrot this enough
@Doorknob is it possible to migrate meta posts to main?
 
-2
Q: Move the sandbox to main

DoorknobA little over a year ago, we had a discussion on meta about whether the sandbox should be migrated to the main site. The answer suggesting to do so was at +8/-4, but there were no counterarguments in the comments or the other answers (other than "there would be too many answers" which, after the ...

 
Working on a TI-Basic gamma
Too bad typing on my calculator is painful
 
Anonymous
@quartata Try replacing the spikes with keys
 
@quartata cool!
 
@Mego but that'll void the warranty!
 
Anonymous
12:34 AM
@flawr I did solve the Gamma question myself. I chose not to include a reference implementation in the question because there are many different ways to approximate Gamma, and I wanted to avoid turning it into "who can golf my code the best".
 
@TheDoctor I'm actually not against moving the sandbox to main. The argument that "it does not fit in the scope of the site" is pretty feeble and an exception can be made for the sandbox
 
i agree...
and given that that question now has a positive score
 
1
Q: Move the sandbox to main

DoorknobA little over a year ago, we had a discussion on meta about whether the sandbox should be migrated to the main site. The answer suggesting to do so was at +8/-4, but there were no counterarguments in the comments or the other answers (other than "there would be too many answers" which, after the ...

Yep
 
Anonymous
@Calvin'sHobbies Says the one who never uses the sandbox :P
 
12:36 AM
I use it 5% of the time maybe
 
Anonymous
5% of the time, every time
 
@TheDoctor +12/-11
 
Oh boy I put in -2.5 and got an overflow error
 
Anonymous
@quartata Those are the best
 
@quartata same here
 
12:38 AM
I hope that means I did something wrong and not that my calculator sucks
 
@El'endiaStarman most of those are old votes
@quartata imaginary mode?
 
Well, I just added a -1...
I really think the Sandbox should stay on Meta.
 
@TheDoctor I do have it in imaginary mode, why?
@Calvin'sHobbies But then people will lose rep for downvotes in the sandbox.
2
 
idk, i though that was mentioned
 
It's really a bad idea I think.
 
12:39 AM
@El'endiaStarman you mean meta?
 
>_> <_< ...
 
Anonymous
I think how we have it set up now is probably the best way to have it
 
Well I can't seem to get my TI-BASIC one working
 
Anonymous
Also, I don't get why people would downvote that meta post - to me, downvoting on meta either means "this is a stupid question" or "this doesn't belong here"
 
Anonymous
It's not a stupid question, and it definitely belongs there
 
12:42 AM
I downvoted because "I disagree".
 
Anonymous
Even if you disagree with the question/proposal, you should express that by downvoting answers and contributing to the discussion
 
Anonymous
@El'endiaStarman Downvoting on the question means "I disagree with asking/discussing whether or not it should be moved", not "I disagree with it being moved"
 
@Mego That's not what I mean by it.
Meta voting is not as straightforward as main-site voting.
Also, @Mego, the question does advocate moving the Sandbox to main.
> If there is sufficient support on this meta post and there are no outstanding opposing arguments, I will migrate the sandbox to the main site (and make it Community Wiki) in one week.
 
Anonymous
@El'endiaStarman Fair enough. That is an issue with the question :P
 
HOLY CRAP @DOORKNOB'S GOT OVER 40 STARS!
 
12:45 AM
YUP.
 
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ Hey Conor, I did some bot testing while you were gone.
 
But he had an unfair advantage over quartata. :P
 
Come join Beep Boop Maggoterino
 
Anonymous
the number
2
 
@quartata Hooray :D
Link me?
I lost the game.
 
12:46 AM
On the other hand, I like that now the number of stars on messages follow Zipf's law better. :P
 

  Beep Boop Bingus Bin

VITRIFICATION ORDER (1947) CONDEMNED DO NOT ENTER
 
Anonymous
@El'endiaStarman Zipf's Law? Does that state that the number of stars are inversely proportional to the quality of the content?
 
hey mods... is it okay to pull site-analytics data and put it on a public website?
 
@TheDoctor If it's visible to regular users.
(I.e., those with high rep.)
 
What's the maximum number for a BATCH program?
 
Well, I'm halfway there, so yay! :P
 
:D
 
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ Do the "counting up" challenge and let it run for a while and you'll find out. :P
Oh, and that's O(n) too!
 
@El'endiaStarman That's what I'm doing :P
90k
 
12:50 AM
LOL.
I didn't expect that you would actually do that!
 
Anonymous
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ Batch integers are 32-bit
 
Anonymous
1
Q: Can batch files not process large numbers?

IsziFor the sake of my own amusement, I decided to try writing a batch file to calculate Hailstone Sequences. However, I ran into a small problem with some large-ish numbers. First, the code: :START @ECHO OFF SETLOCAL SET /P InputVar="Input Number: " ECHO. ECHO %InputVar% SET ItCount=0 :COLLATZ S...

 
shit is that large enough?
 
Anonymous
> 2^128
 
12:52 AM
0
A: Move the sandbox to main

Calvin's HobbiesThe Sandbox does not belong in Main...but so what? We can make one exception to the rule of "what belongs in Main" for the Sandbox (that is a user defined rule, after all). It's not like putting the Sandbox on Main will bring in a slew of other questions that are technically off topic. If the S...

 
Anonymous
In universes where 128 >= 32 is a true statement, no
 
deletes batch post
 
@quartata Not brainfuck, but something :)
 
Anonymous
> I could have used nasm and crinkler, but I hate both of them.
 
Anonymous
Best reasoning
 
@mınxomaτ dayum
 
@TheDoctor yes. Even mortals can migrate meta->main with 5 close votes
@Calvin'sHobbies I asked that question; I already get notifications from answers. :P
 
@Doorknob Do we also get rejection votes if it does get migrated, or is that only a cross-site thing?
 
For the purposes of migration, main and meta are separate
 
I think we should have the sandbox be on its own site, haha.
 
12:58 AM
You know, I'm not sure if this is possible but if we can make some sort of "redirect question" that takes you to the meta question that would be real nice.
Having it on main is really bad though, since then downvotes would matter
 
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ that was rejected IIRC
It's been proposed with lots of support though
 
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ try the bot again
 
@Doorknob Did we get the meta rep reqs reduced? (Happen to have an official message/post link mentioning it?)
 
@Calvin'sHobbies yes we did
Questions and answers
 
@quartata If the Sandbox question is migrated, it would almost certainly be made community wiki.
 
1:00 AM
20
Q: Should we remove the reputation requirement for answering on meta?

DoorknobI've been made aware that it's possible to lower the reputation threshold required to ask or answer questions on a per-site meta. A very common complaint about the sandbox is that new users, who are the ones who typically need it most, don't have access to it, due to the minimum 5 reputation req...

@El'endiaStarman s/almost //
 
@Doorknob erm I was just joking on that XD
 
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ well, it's been a serious proposal
I would link it but search on mobile is painful
 
@Doorknob So I've noticed.
 
Probably this:
15
Q: Sandbox good for its own subdomain?

impinballEdit 2: See Grace Note's answer. Edit: Answers may be allowed, so that question-specific sandboxes would be actually on topic, such as attempted for Stack Exchange Quine. It could also enable people to post more detailed comments to proposed questions and potential answers, helping mitigate more...

 
Anonymous
1:03 AM
So here's the thing about the sandbox
 
Anonymous
The issue isn't just that too many posts get posted right away on main with serious issues that could've been resolved if they were sandboxed first
 
@El'endiaStarman no, that's not it... pretty sure CJY proposed it first
 
What are the arguments of the downvoters? (meta.codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/7478/26997)
 
Anonymous
It's also that posts often come out of the sandbox only having been reviewed by a few people, and so a lot of stuff is missed
 
While I'm at it, let's revisit this issue:
10
Q: Why isn't the Sandbox Community Wiki?

ASCIIThenANSIWe all know and love the Sandbox. It's one of our best features. But in the body of the Sandbox, I noticed this: This is a community-maintained list of the most active Sandbox submissions, sorted by major contest type. Add an entry to the top of this list if you add a new submission or update...

 
1:05 AM
@Calvin'sHobbies Alright, I guess I'll post an answer.
 
I have to go, but I feel like this could use a redux on meta as a new question, addressing all of these issues.
 
Anonymous
@Calvin'sHobbies I just don't see any point in it being CW on meta
 
Anonymous
On Meta, it doesn't make a difference at all
 
@Mego I agree that there's not really a point then. I'm only for CW if it ends up on main.
 
Anonymous
@Calvin'sHobbies Same. I solidly sidevoted your proposal because I don't think it will change much if it's on main.
 
1:08 AM
@Hipe99 I noticed you made a Python version of Rotor
Tell me if you ever get that working, I'd like to use it for the online interpreter
 
@Mego But think. The sandbox will almost always be on top of the active questions page due to constant edits. Therefore loads more people will see it.
 
Anonymous
@Calvin'sHobbies Seeing != using
 
@Mego Well we could never force people to use it. Think of it as advertising. Seeing -> much more likely to use.
 
Anonymous
@Calvin'sHobbies Well @Doorknob does have that trout...
 
Anonymous
(afk)
 
Anonymous
1:13 AM
(brownie points for anyone who tries running chat logs through Seriously to see what happens)
 
@Calvin'sHobbies Calvin, I don't think you're quite getting the problem. Downvotes on answers will affect your rep.
That's really really discouraging for new users
Look at some of the bad challenges in the sandbox.
They usually have -3 downvotes or so
That's not a huge deal to you or I in terms of rep maybe but that's really not a good thing for new users
If there isn't a way to change that, then basically having the Sandbox in main won't work at all.
 
That's why it'd be Community Wiki. As I understand it a CW question has all of it's answers CW as well, and CW posts cannot affect rep.
606
Q: What are "Community Wiki" posts?

Justin StandardSome questions and answers are marked Community Wiki and are owned by a Community Wiki user. Why have Community Wiki posts? How do Community Wiki posts work? How does a post become a Community Wiki post? How can the Community Wiki status be removed from a post? Return to FAQ Index

> Voting on a community wiki post (up or down) does not affect any user's reputation.
> An answer posted to a community wiki question will also be community wiki.
 
@Calvin'sHobbies I see...
 
@quartata So this is a non issue (assuming people accept a CW sandbox)
 
There's still some problems though.
Primarily my concern is how would you migrate the sandbox?
It's a huge post.
 
1:19 AM
scripts?
and the API
 
@TheDoctor Then all the answers would be owned by someone else.
 
@quartata @Doorknob already volunteered to when he posted meta.codegolf.stackexchange.com/q/5496/26997
 
not really, i think mods can migrate
 
> If there is sufficient support on this meta post and there are no outstanding opposing arguments, I will migrate the sandbox to the main site (and make it Community Wiki) in one week.
 
All right.
 
1:21 AM
@quartata I'm not sure how it's done but I'm guessing some mod-tool/script would be doing the heavy liftting
@MartinBüttner @Dennis @AlexA. Other mods want to weigh in on conversation to move Sandbox to main?
@quartata Any other problems you see?
Keeping the Sandbox on Meta for the sole purpose of classification is a petty silly argument in my opinion. Our site will not collapse if we have one anomaly, one impurity, one Main post that is not a challenge. In other words, it's alright to keep a knife in the bread drawer if that makes slicing bread easier. — Calvin's Hobbies 36 secs ago
 
I'm writing up an answer...
 
@Sp3000 @PeterTaylor Any thoughts on this? I'd value any input.
@El'endiaStarman I'm going major lobbyist on this...
 
I can see that. :P
 
@Calvin'sHobbies made my comment without reading yours, and I totally agree
 
1:37 AM
:)
 
I personally wish that we could have addressed the disadvantages I listed, and kept it on meta
but I'm ok for the second best option
 
ohai @NathanMerrill
 
@Calvin'sHobbies Looks like a fair enough argument to me. Personally I'm still a little concerned about solving-challenges-in-the-sandbox problem, but I guess that ain't going away anyway
 
@Sp3000 You mean preemptive solutions and FGITW and all that?
@NathanMerrill I agree that in an ideal PPCG world, the sandbox would be separate from main (i.e. its own site really). But having more visibility for both new users and old users who can help along new questions is well worth the minor "impurity".
 
@TheDoctor hi!
@Calvin'sHobbies right, however, it could be on a different site if we had a big flashing "Oh hi, you're new, we'll help you avoid those downvotes here"
 
Anonymous
1:51 AM
Incoming dupe...
 
Anonymous
(once the bot comes out of hibernation)
 
@Mego Bet you 10 rep it will post within the minute of 1:55 am UTC
 
Anonymous
@Calvin'sHobbies How would that bet even work? Loser upvotes something of the winner's?
 
Fine. I bet 10 pretend rep
 
I initially starred Doorknob's message, but couldn't stand the shame of messing up the perfect 42
 
1:54 AM
0
Q: Convert Brainfuck to another language!

JamieThe Task Write the shortest program, that accepts script in brainfuck from STDIN (or equivalent) and outputs to STDOUT (or equivalent) a program written in the SAME language you're using. For example, if you write in Java, with the input ++++++++++[>+++++++>++++++++++>+++>+<<<<-]>++.>+.+++++++...

 
Anonymous
 
Anonymous
> 19:54
 
1:54:47 - I lose :(
 
Anonymous
Gimme that pretend rep
 
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9...10 there
 
Anonymous
1:57 AM
yay
 
Hey all.. Who knows about Lanzcos approximation?
 
Anonymous
I can now create pretend CW posts and answer pretend protected questions
 
^ popularity of tags over time
 
Who know?
 
It's interesting that (afaik) you can only see the exact time a message was posted by quoting the permalink it and mousing over it.
 
Anonymous
1:59 AM
 
7 secs ago, by Calvin's Hobbies
It's interesting that (afaik) you can only see the exact time a message was posted by quoting the permalink it and mousing over it.
 
@Mego tru
 
0
A: Move the sandbox to main

El'endia StarmanThe Sandbox really does not belong on Main and should stay on Meta Let me review the arguments made for moving the Sandbox to main (from the question): Users with less than 5 reputation can still use the sandbox. (This is the most convincing argument, in my opinion.) The reputation r...

 
@TheDoctor Interesting. What was that kolo bulge?
 

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