The Whiteboard

1:36 AM

Also see the programmers.SE version programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/103807/… — Pacerier 5 secs ago

4:18 AM

This question should be asked on Programmers Stack Exchange as it is not directly code related. You will find better answers there. — phpPhil 19 secs ago

As this already has an answer, if you intend to have it be on Programmers.SE, please flag it for migration rather than reposting. That said, it would likely be closed as a duplicate of one of the many questions on multi tenancy (for example 500 databases or 1 database with 500 tables or just 1 table with all the records? or Supporting multitenancy). — MichaelT 10 secs ago

first please post some code and a question - second it seems you are asking for opinions which is not what you want to do here (there is a code-review and a programmers site where this belongs IMO) — Carsten König 23 secs ago

user55340

4:40 AM

I did some significant retcon of the question (removed a bunch of links) and made it into a CW answer... which I'm not overly happy with, itself being a link-farm only answer.

user55340

8

Q: Multi-tenancy - single database vs multiple database

We have a number of clients, whose systems share some functionality, but also have quite a degree of diversity. The number of clients is growing - always a healthy thing! - and the diversity between their businesses is also increasing. At present there is a single ASP.Net (Web Forms) Web Site (a...

user55340

If anyone would like to review that and make sure this wasn't a middle of the night delusion on my part.

ratchet freak

8:00 AM

full stack developer alert:

-1

Q: I work as a full stack web developer and my boss wants me to learn photoshop. Is it a right step for me?

I work as a full stack developer at small IT company. I have just 7 months of experience but my boss wants me to learn photoshop too so I can share the workload of the designer. Is it fair?

office

rwong

10:01 AM

@ratchetfreak You mean designer alert?

rolfl

10:27 AM

0

Q: Designing exception classes

I'm coding a small library and I'm having some trouble with designing the exception handling. I must say that I am (still) confused by this feature of the C++ language and I tried to read as much as possible on the subject to come to an understanding of what would I have to do to properly work wi...

c++ error-handling library

Candidate for migration? ^^^^

Duga

10:52 AM

I'm voting to close this question as off-topic because it belongs on another site, probably programmers.stackexchange.com. — harald 1 min ago

Mike Nakis

11:26 AM

Help! I need second, third, Nth opinions on this: programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/29433/…

Telastyn

11:40 AM

Seems like the commenter is a little tightly wound, though the comment does make light of something most people don't agree with.

user15026

11:58 AM

@MikeNakis As an English major, with a shiny degree and all, I do find it kinda dismissive. Not the end of the world, but it's a little unnecessarily rude, and doesn't read well as humor.

Mike Nakis

Okay @Telastyn and @AshleyNunn, thank you!

Oh, @Telastyn and @AshleyNunn do you think there may be a way to reword it so as to keep the distinction between engineering and essay writing while making it non-dismissive for English majors? C-:=

Thomas Owens

@MikeNakis I'd just remove that last sentence. It doesn't help make any points not well made in the rest of the paragraph.

As someone who studied (and occasionally does) technical writing, one of the principles is to write concisely. If the statement doesn't add anything new, why include it?

user15026

@ThomasOwens that's really good advice. :)

Mike Nakis

12:18 PM

Okay, I shall heed your advice!

user55340

1:07 PM

You know you've nailed the delivery when...

user55340

@MichaelT can we assign a bounty to a comment? — Lohoris 2 mins ago

durron597

1:33 PM

@ThomasOwens this question isn't appropriate for stackoverflow but it should be migrated, either to SuperUser or UX&LX

-4

Q: Is it possible to install llvmlite Python package on Cygwin?

When I try installing llvmlite Python package on cygwin, I get the following errors. GINMF in this case. $ pip install llvmlite Downloading/unpacking llvmlite Downloading llvmlite-0.4.0.tar.gz (69kB): 69kB downloaded Running setup.py (path:/cygdrive/c/Users/ADMINI~1/AppData/Local/Temp/pip_bu...

python windows-7 llvm gnu

Thomas Owens

Why not SO?

LLVM is a development tool.

Unless I'm missing something, LLVM is a development tool, Python is a programming language, and lots of developers use Cygwin on Windows. It's off-topic for Programmers, but I'm thinking SO.

user55340

If we can send it to a site better than SO we should. Just because SO is on topic and a default doesn't make it the only option.

durron597

@ThomasOwens It's "how do I install this software?"

user55340

It's on topic on SO, but SU would likely be a better place for it.

Thomas Owens

OK. SU it is.

But yes, it is on-topic on SO, I think.

durron597

1:38 PM

meh.

Ha!

212

Q: How do I install Eclipse Marketplace in Eclipse Classic?

I'm running Eclipse 3.6.1 Classic, which does not come with the Eclipse Marketplace plugin by default. I've looked around the Eclipse website, but I don't see an available plugin for installing Eclipse Marketplace. Am I just not seeing it?

eclipse eclipse-plugin eclipse-marketplace

enderland

ugh people in technical fields blatantly not caring about HCI/UX >.>

durron597

Okay, I suppose you're right.

Telastyn

I care about UX, but I also am skeptical that UX experts are better than chance at actually making good UX.

enderland

@Telastyn heh....

durron597

Wait a minute... Why does SuperUser have the new profiles but we don't and SO doesn't?

user55340

1:42 PM

There is overlap in scope for installs. I believe SU to be more receptive to those questions and likely to give a better answer now.

durron597

@MichaelT Related

10

A: Why am I getting different versions of my profile page on different sites?

The new profile page is being previewed on Meta Stack Exchange, before being rolled out to the rest of the network. The rollout will not be to all sites initially. Only sites that have been converted to a new .less structure will get the new profile page, which, over time will be all of them. Cu...

Telastyn

2:06 PM

20 minutes of coding, now hours of waiting for code review.

/me shakes a fist at inane process.

ratchet freak

@Telastyn do some other coding?

Telastyn

I would, if I weren't already waiting days for business to decide what the hell they want for the other story I'm assigned.

we're not very good at managing the dev pipeline here.

user55340

@Telastyn go on a rabid refactoring rampage!

ratchet freak

@Telastyn start reenacting xkcd.com/303 and reply waiting in QA

user55340

By the way, three Shog posts on meta.sf that are good reads.

user55340

2:11 PM

Well, two new, one update.

user55340

The two new ones are the ones to look at. They also address some pain points that we feel on P.SE from time to time.

Thomas Owens

I receive a String from JMS that is an XML message. It is one of three distinct types. I can use JAXBElement<?> elem = (JAXBElement<?>) unmarshal.unmarshal(new StringReader(xmlString)); to get a JAXBElement object out of it. If I call elem.getValue().getClass(), I can get the specific instance. Now, I'm using the event-driven MessageListener to handle incoming messages.

Do you think that I should have three methods that accept Strings and invoke the right one as a callback, should I get the class and then get the right element and invoke the right method in the onMessage handler, or something else?

I personally think that I should put the logic for converting the String into the right object in the onMessage class, but that could be overloading it too much.

That would let the client just see a thing that can get me an object of the right type.

user55340

What does the method do? Did you use 'and' in that description? If so, break it up.

Thomas Owens

The onMessage method is part of the MessageListener interface. It is invoked whenever a new message is picked up on the queue or topic that the subscriber is connected to.

It's public void onMessage(Message message). So I'm going to use it to do some kind of callback. But I don't know if I should hand off the text and make the client deal with a String or hand off a usable object to the client.

Telastyn

@MichaelT - tempting!

Thomas Owens

2:18 PM

Returning a string seems pretty silly. I'm just thinking about other options. What if I'm not reading from JMS, but a database. Or a flat file. I think regardless of what I read from, I should return the object that is useful to the client, not a String or a Row or a File reference.

They would all parse the data in a different way, but want to return the same object. It makes sense that performing the transformation is part of the responsibility of the thing reading the data.

I guess the way I envision that is that I could have all kinds of readers (two right now - file and JMS). JMS is a continuous data stream, file is either a single file or a directory. Regardless of the method, I hand the reader the same object and say "go". For a continuous reader (JMS or some other stream), it makes the right callback based on the message after determining what the message is. For a single hit reader, it just makes one callback and ends.

maple_shaft

0

Q: Inline WSDL generator from WSDL with many imports

Background I am a software engineer working with an outside development group. This group enforces SOA at the bank and works on our ESB layer/service provider. We are a Java development team working with more modern frameworks like Spring 4/Spring WS for consumption of web services. Our build...

linux windows-7 software-development xml

shameless self bump

durron597

> I've watched one moderator after another tire and burn out here, but somehow the reason behind it never came into focus for me until this weekend: there is very, very little community moderation here.

Thomas Owens

@MichaelT Link to Shog posts?

durron597

I guess that is another main difference between SF and Progs, as far as the culture goes.

@ThomasOwens First Second Third (this is an edit to a previous post)

Thomas Owens

@durron597 Thanks!

user55340

2:30 PM

5

Q: How to get more people doing reviews?

We're nowhere near the point of Stack Overflow with (at the time of this writing) 65.9k questions in the close queue. I've noticed an uptick in the queue of people flagging questions. In a batch of 20, I often see a question that is not an audit that has no votes on it - this is from a flag. T...

discussion review

user55340

I'm very pleased to see other names in review recently.

user55340

And I'm seeing more names on close votes too - even if not in review.

durron597

@MichaelT I've capped my CV review almost every day since i got 3k

You know, something I've been kicking around for a long time (that's come into sharp relief by reading this, though it applies to all sites) is, how do we get the really smart people to ask GOOD QUESTIONS

user55340

Yep. And I see @Snowman in there too. Amon and ratchet aren't infrequent. Ixrec too. And TZHX from time to time.

durron597

@ThomasOwens (this is not personal, you're just a good example) comes in here almost every day with design questions. GOOD design questions. But why here, why not on the main site? I've spent quite a bit of time chatting in here with my design questions.

user55340

2:35 PM

I'm also seeing lots of active front page people, even if not in review with votes.

durron597

@MichaelT You have ZERO questions. Why?

Have you learned every single thing there is to learn about programming?

If you were to write a question, I know it would be a good one. Even if you self answered it.

Thomas Owens

@durron597 I should ask them. And probably self answer. But when I initially have them, they are way too vague to be on the site.

durron597

@ThomasOwens This is less about any of us individually and more about "smart, high rep users collectively"

user55340

Stack exchange is the last resort for my questions. I either find them from coworkers or other questions first.

Thomas Owens

But admittedly, yes, I should ask and self-answer more than I do. I think a lot of people should.

durron597

2:37 PM

@MichaelT Do you deny that any question you would write here would be good and on-topic?

Thomas Owens

During the course of our day, we ask ourselves and answer a lot of questions. It may take refinement to get them so they are good for the site, but it usually happens.

durron597

We complain about crap questions but, honestly, we should be writing them ourselves if we complain about it.

user55340

One aspect of voting on almost everything is I've read a fair chunk of the site.

durron597

And this is not a Programmers specific issue.

user55340

At that point, if there is a question I've read it or can reapply a question to its tangent problem that I have.

durron597

2:39 PM

Jon Skeet has 34 questions to go with his 31,500 answers. Martijn has 13 questions to go with his 13,000 answers.

Telastyn

I don't ask questions, because my interesting questions would be closed.

2

durron597

@MichaelT Are you saying Programmers is saturated? No wonder there's so much noise for all the signal.

Gordon linoff has 0 questions, 18,500 answers. dasblinkenlight has 9 questions, 10,000 answers.

enderland

Most of this room uses this chat for their questions, not the main site

user55340

I'm saying for the questions that I have are either specific to my projects, things I need to find out for myself, discoverable with research or too localized to be useful for a wider audience.

enderland

I love it when people answer questions I have a good answer on with a crap answer, so it bumps it and gives me free rep..

user55340

2:42 PM

Asking "how do I get my coworkers to use maven" is a bad fit for the main site.

durron597

@MichaelT If it's discoverable with research, if that research doesn't turn up an answer on this site, then it's a good candidate for a self answer.

And maybe someone will have an even better answer, and you learn something.

But this is more about site design and incentive structure.

Thomas Owens

Interesting. Wikipedia does not have an article on "full-stack developer". Is the terminology standard or common enough that I should reopen the question? It's simple, but it's not well-defined on a site I would consider to be permanent.

Telastyn

it is standard and common these days, though I thought it was a dupe.

user55340

It's a job title / resume self description.

Thomas Owens

That would mean it's off-topic for us and localized to companies, so not appropriate for The Workplace.

user55340

2:47 PM

I call myself one in that I can and have done all parts, but others would argue that my client side isn't there. That argue makes it into an opinion / discussion.

user55340

Some put seo in there too. I don't.

Telastyn

SEO isn't full stack since most stacks don't care about seo.

Duga

I'm voting to close this question as off-topic because it's not about a specific programming question, perhaps programmers.stackexchange.com is a better fit. — ircmaxell 18 secs ago

user55340

There is a difference between full stack in enterprise intranet vs external skills. The later is often contractors with one off gigs who can provide a complete solution... Vs the I work with web sphere, oracle plsql, down to jsps. That's full stack for me.

enderland

wow that duga message got dogpiled with "no don't post on p.se"

user55340

2:54 PM

Others claim "set up php, MySQL, $cms, and some JavaScript" as full stack.

Robert Harvey

I'm with @Telastyn. The questions I would want to ask on Programmers are typically too broad.

Though sometimes I can make them interesting enough to be spared the close hammer.

Thomas Owens

@RobertHarvey At the outset, yeah. But I do think that if you work your way to an answer, there may be a good PSE question in there. If you take the effort to formulate it right.

Telastyn

yeah, either too broad or too opinion oriented

Thomas Owens

Taking the time is another hard thing.

user41796

@RobertHarvey A couple of rounds of retaliatory suspensions on SO ought to solve that problem.

Telastyn

3:00 PM

sigh...

"'Associates.Business.Mobile.Helpers.Campaign.CampaignServiceContext' does not contain a constructor that takes 26 arguments."

user55340

For full stack being code and libs within a language? Nope. Not in my opinion. Being a general contractor of a project? Nope.

Telastyn

rabid refactoring rampage is so tempting.

user55340

@Telastyn I recently introduced Builder to my co workers in one class (with four 20+ arg constructors).

Telastyn

the worse thing is that we have a unit test to make sure that all 26 throw ArgumentNull if null is passed in.

user41796

@Telastyn You know you wanna

Telastyn

3:02 PM

well, 26 unit tests

builder just hides the problem

user55340

If a class needs 20+ fields, it needs them.

Robert Harvey

@RobertHarvey How do I use it?...Just a simple code will do for my project. — programmer_360 2 mins ago

ffs

Telastyn

if a class has 20+ dependencies, you're doing things wrong.

user55340

Offender has list of offenses, supervisory agent, name, list of aliases, etc...

ratchet freak

@Telastyn doesn't need to be dependencies

user41796

3:05 PM

@RobertHarvey Retaliate. :-) Seriously though, this SO question of theirs should be closed.

Telastyn

no, but dependencies is easier to argue.

Robert Harvey

I think you linked the wrong one, but yeah.

@ThomasOwens The C Neural Network guy is question-blocked on Stack Overflow.

user41796

Confession: When I see really atrocious comments from users, I sometimes click through their profile looking for stuff to VTC and VTD. I kinda figure that if they made that stupid of a comment then their other posts are likely garbage too.

Thomas Owens

@RobertHarvey What C neural network guy?

Robert Harvey

-5

Q: Neural network C or C++ program

I wanted to know where I could get a c or c++ implementation of a backpropagation neural network so I could use it for my project.

c++ neural-networks

Thomas Owens

3:09 PM

He's been dealt with quite harshly, I believe.

Robert Harvey

Aww, c'mon. I was nice.

user55340

The question was very poor. No research and completely off topic. The closing was merited. The question was not something that could be salvaged and deleting to show the inappropriate nature of it and prevent further hemorrhaging is likely a good thing.

Telastyn

really? I have more answers than votes?

Robert Harvey

Delete the zero-voted answers. Problem solved.

Telastyn

oh, that's not right. votes on workplace

I don't have that many answers there.

durron597

3:14 PM

Comments and votes please:

0

A: Should we add more badges for asking questions?

I don't agree with the status-declined decision on this question. Every big site complains about not having enough good questions: Meta Stack Exchange Why aren't people voting for questions? Can we prevent some of the low-quality questions from entering our system? StackOverflow Why the bac...

Neat, I can finally see MSE vote counts.

Telastyn

quantity of questions is not something to incentive-ize I think.

durron597

@Telastyn I agree that nakedly doing so is not a good idea.

Robert Harvey

The problem with badges like this is that they only incentivize the people who already understand question quality. The people who ask crap questions, for the most part, don't care about rep, don't care about badges and don't care about question quality; they just want their crappy question answered. Really, they just want someone to hold their hand.

durron597

That's why it should be paired with upvoted answers and/or requiring the questions themselves get some (or even a lot) of upvotes.

Jimmy Hoffa

-3

Q: What is Open Stack?

I visited Open Stack's website recently. I did not understand what it is. So if anybody could give me an explanation about what Open Stack is, which language is it written with and if anybody could contribute to it. Thank you!

programming-languages open-source

^-- When the door to closed stack is ajar

Robert Harvey

3:22 PM

[sigh]

durron597

@RobertHarvey I'm not trying to get new users to ask better questions, I'm trying to get experienced users to write questions at all

@RobertHarvey Don't you think any question asked by any regular in this room would be light years better than most questions that get asked every day?

Robert Harvey

Of course. But the experienced users have to drop their questions into a sea of chaff, and hope other experienced users see them.

Jimmy Hoffa

@durron597 not really a great idea, the questions we tend to have oft go unanswered or are not relevant to a general audience - the general/common stuff experienced folk mostly have figured or can easily get their heads on.

Telastyn

badges aren't going to make me ask more questions.

MetaFight

free cake might.

Robert Harvey

3:24 PM

Googling question titles like yours often yields a detailed examination and analysis of the problem on GeeksForGeeks: Kth smallest element in a row-wise and column-wise sorted 2D array — Robert Harvey 9 mins ago

Jimmy Hoffa

@durron597 look through the Qs we have asked

MetaFight

or pie, if you swing that way.

Telastyn

alas, not even free food will get me to ask questions that will be insta-closed.

MetaFight

@Telastyn D:

durron597

23

Q: Is functional programming a superset of object oriented?

The more functional programming I do, the more I feel like it adds an extra layer of abstraction that seems like how an onion's layer is- all encompassing of the previous layers. I don't know if this is true so going off the OOP principles I've worked with for years, can anyone explain how funct...

object-oriented functional-programming

Jimmy Hoffa

3:27 PM

note it had to be protected; believe it was closed, and frankly I second guess it's quality as well, it's very specific and more opinion than anything, also the answers aren't particularly good. They just reiterate things I said in the Q because nobody could really speak to the details of the Q (this is how you do inheritance in FP, or you can't and heres the proof)

I'm rather more proud of this Q

25

Q: Performance of single-assignment ADT oriented code on modern CPUs

Working in immutable data with single assignments has the obvious effect of requiring more memory, one would presume, because you're constantly creating new values (though compilers under the covers do pointer tricks to make this less of an issue). But I've heard a few times now that the losses ...

functional-programming hardware memory cpu algebraic-data-type

user41796

@JimmyHoffa Doesn't appear to have ever been closed according to the revision history

Jimmy Hoffa

@GlenH7 not sure why it was protected then

meh

Telastyn

my highest voted question would likely be voted as too broad if made by a lower rep user.

durron597

@JimmyHoffa Any deleted answer?

Stack Exchange

Blog - Stack Exchange: Two new user pages. One new stat. This one’s <em>big.</em>

Jay Hanlon on April 15, 2015

In the time since we started working on the profile, generations of dinosaurs were born, fell in love, had families, and were killed by a comet. Or climate change, or maybe texting and driving or some nonsense like that. Anyway, as of today, it’s live on SO and about half the network, and we’ll be rolling out to the rest over the next few weeks. And it was worth the wait:

Unfortunately, the designers said I could have… like two, maybe? At most. So, we went with that:

The Profile Page lets you show others a summary of what you’re all about. Share your interests, favorite c …

user41796

3:30 PM

@JimmyHoffa Likely because of Johnny come lately. 10k link

Telastyn

the other problem with my questions is that I hate all of the answers.

and feel as though I need to select one of the highest rated ones, even though it's garbage.

durron597

I pasted the answer in Tavern on the Meta too. They point out that we already have Curious / Inquisitive / Socratic.

So maybe I'm wrong.

Duga

I don't think code review would be the right place for this either, it's more of a coding theory question. programmers.stackexchange.com may be a good place, make sure you read through the tour and help topics to make sure your question is on topic before posting there. — Kevin B 48 secs ago

Robert Harvey

1

Q: Onebox in chat is exposing HTML tags in the title of the onebox

In this example, the <em> tag is not rendering properly:

bug onebox

durron597

@RobertHarvey Heh speaking of Socratic that's your next gold badge. Only need two more days

user55340

3:44 PM

@GlenH7 MIT allows re licenseing. If it is all under MIT, anyone can take it closed source.

user55340

If it's not under MIT, well, it is because that is the premise of the question.

user55340

I can form a MIT project and make it closed without anyone else's buyoff.

user41796

@MichaelT Good catch

user55340

s/form/fork/

user55340

That permissive nature is part of what is key to BSD and MIT licenses. They can very easily go closed by anyone.

ratchet freak

3:56 PM

and why GPL came to be by people who didn't like that "their child" could go closed source

user55340

Yep. Great fun reading that conflict in the emacs mailing lists.

user55340

RMS vs. Eric Raymond in one bit.

user55340

(About if clang support should be added to emacs)

user55340

phoronix.com/…

user41796

I've updated my answer and I think I beat the issue to death

user55340

3:59 PM

And phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=RMS-Emacs-Gud-LLVM

user55340

Permission notices in the source there is no requirement to share it.

user41796

@MichaelT Suggesting I add that to my answer? Not quite certain what you mean with "there is no requirement to share it"

user55340

Just note that MIT is not a copy left license and that close sourcing it is quite possible.

user41796

dun

user55340

The author likely is taking issue with it going closed source.

user41796

4:09 PM

"my precious!"

user55340

"They took it closed and want something for what I had for free earlier"

ratchet freak

Then it's his own fault for choosing MIT

durron597

Wow, this primary has a lot of people clustered around 10/11/12th place

disorient.ddns.net/SOVoteMonitor

user41796

"MY PRECIOUS!!!"

user55340

Btw, b switch statement is neat. It has ranges v

user55340

4:14 PM

thinkage.ca/english/gcos/expl/b/manu/manu.html#Section5_8

user55340

Look at the example and its use of fall through.

ratchet freak

@MichaelT so does D's

though with case 1..10: notation

Thomas Owens

@durron597 I can't use dynamic DNS at work. Can you post updated results heere?

durron597

1	Martijn Pieters	9378
2	meagar	6251
3	Jon Clements	5103
4	Matt	4612
5	Second Rikudo	4459
6	deceze	3482
7	Raghav Sood	2697
8	Paresh Mayani	2612
9	Jeremy Banks	2441
10	Undo	2180
11	Jason C	2164
12	Ed Cottrell	2131
13	slugster	2012
14	Qantas 94 Heavy	1497
15	Andy	1201
16	Sergey K.	1136
17	vcsjones	958
18	rekire	720
19	Thomas Owens	683
20	Moshe	611
21	Michael Irigoyen	575
22	codeMagic	468
23	hichris123	382
24	AstroCB	300
25	Mooseman	294
26	Idan Adar	290
27	Unihedro	183
28	Shree	154
29	Hemang	146
30	Amit Joki	46

Thomas Owens

Boo. I slipped from 18th o 19th.

But of the top 10, I'd vote or 6 or 7 of them to be SO mods.

durron597

4:19 PM

@ThomasOwens I really didn't like deceze's "answers to your questions"

ratchet freak

no shame in losing against someone good

durron597

I would be totally fine with the top three winning there.

enderland

@durron597 that's neat!

Ampt

how neat is that!?

durron597

@Ampt Neater than an OCD person's packed luggage.

user55340

4:25 PM

There is quite a bit that could be done to reduce load on that page.

enderland

I am really surprised how few people have signifiacnt meta posts

user55340

Store state in cookie... Variable update times.

user55340

MSO is a scary place for many.

ratchet freak

@MichaelT scarier than the SO review queue?

user55340

Down voted fly fast and arguments in comments are not uncommon.

Jimmy Hoffa

4:36 PM

gra I don't know if coming in was wise. Feck a cold. Feck this cold. Feck colds. Piffle.

Ampt

@JimmyHoffa this is what you get for actually going in to work

I'm happy here on my couch

Jimmy Hoffa

You don't tell me what to do! You're not the boss of me!

durron597

@MichaelT I think JasonC is looking for feedback in the SO election discussion

Ampt

@JimmyHoffa no, your cold is!

Robert Harvey

Umm...

user15026

4:47 PM

@RobertHarvey what part is the ummm? The name?

Robert Harvey

Clever reference or abysmal marketing? You decide.

user15026

I have never understood products like that but I like making food too much.

user15026

@RobertHarvey I think they explained it as a clever reference (as in they knew what they were doing)

Robert Harvey

Naming your product after a movie about recycling dead bodies. That sounds like a good plan?

user15026

Scrolling down, they have a section asking what it is made of, and they go "it's not people" so they know what they are doing. Whether it works or not is another thing.

user55340

4:49 PM

Is it green?

user15026

It apparently tastes pretty gross, but they have said they've improved it. Pretty expensive, though.

Robert Harvey

Maybe you need that as part of your master plan for being a "full stack developer." Same meal every day, same T-shirt..

user15026

Yeah, it's probably in the requirements someplace

korima

Hello everyone! I left here a question for if someone could answer... Pass a service locator as dependency is allways a code smell? To me yes, because you hide the class dependencies but I was watching this slide and says that not: slideshare.net/kindblad/application-architecture-32607528 (Page 32)

Robert Harvey

@korima You're using a lot of words here that it sounds like you don't actually know what they mean. Can you state your problem in plain English, without the jargon? If you can, then it might be an answerable question.

korima

4:58 PM

What words for example? I think I did well the question...

Robert Harvey

Service Locator, Dependency, Code Smell

What makes you think that a service locator hides class dependencies?

korima

The fact of you have to ask him the class you want

Robert Harvey

You still have to say which class gets instantiated somewhere.

korima

For example, Service Locator has a lot xxxManager. Then your class where you inject Service Locator, you ask with: serviceLocator->UserManager

Robert Harvey

OK.

And?

korima

5:02 PM

I read in many sites that using this is bad practice because if someone see your class, viewing the construct he can't see the real dependencies of the class

So, they say is better inject on the constructor UserManager instead of ServiceLocator

Robert Harvey

Because it's named something that you can recognize? "UserManager?"

korima

But I don't know if it really has limit because the slideshare I post before, says that it's ok inject ServiceLocator, for example to design a facade class

Telastyn

You totally can see the real dependencies, since you're explicitly asking the service locator for them. It is better to just pass them into the constructor, but that is occasionally impractical due to business requirements.

korima

So, the "rule" of inject the real dependencies instead of the service locator, it isn't a rule allways aplicable, no?

Robert Harvey

@korima I doubt that it is always applicable. There is no such thing as "always."

@Telastyn Is the reason you do all this so that you have a way to configure and assemble the components of your application through a configuration file?

Instead of modifying the actual code?

Telastyn

5:07 PM

Some people consider the service locator itself to be an anti-pattern. Some people consider passing in the SL an anti-pattern. I personally think it's something to avoid, but not forbidden.

Robert Harvey

But what is the motivation? Reconfiguration without recompilation?

korima

@Telastyn That is I refer. Some websites / blogs points this like an evil and many times I'm doubt what is true / false.

Telastyn

@RobertHarvey - hopefully not. When I had to do this, it was because I was working with products that had like 20,000 SKUs with all the combinations of parts we offered. Each part provided different capabilities.

Thomas Owens

Is it weird that I have interfaces that extend other interfaces just for convenience as arguments into methods?

Telastyn

Capabilities that sadly depended on other (possibly non-existent) capabilities.

@korima - judge for yourself. Do the arguments about why it is evil seem reasonable?

Brb, driving.

user41796

5:11 PM

@ThomasOwens VTC as primarily opinion based.

Robert Harvey

@Telastyn That seems reasonable.

korima

@Telastyn It doesn't really seems to me an evil. Maybe you need to read whole class code to see the dependencies but the arguments of the constructor is less. In addition you can create mocks for unit tests so there aren't problems with it. Like I said before, my doubts came because of blogs/posts say not to use

Robert Harvey

You have the right to decide "that blog post makes no sense." Make up your own mind.

korima

@RobertHarvey I know... but as I'm a newbie student I don't know what is correct.

Robert Harvey

@korima The way you find that out is to study and understand the software pattern, understand what the software pattern is intended to accomplish, use the software pattern in a piece of real software solving real problems, and then decide for yourself if the benefit the software pattern provides outweighs the additional complexity it adds.

Software patterns are tools. You use them only when you need them, not "just because they're there."

korima

5:21 PM

Ok, I will follow your sugest but phewww, it is difficult... I need a long path to walk xD

Many thanks all to help me one more time :)

And sorry my bad english.

Robert Harvey

@korima blog.ploeh.dk/2010/02/03/ServiceLocatorisanAnti-Pattern

Of course, you're going to need more fundamental experience in software design and coding before you can fully understand that article.

Telastyn

@korima - the arguments I've heard is that the Service Locator has too wide an interface. I can literally handle any interface you ask for and provides little guarantees. It very easily slips into being a God object.

and all of those things are true.

but rarely, that's what you need.

my 20k SKU example, for example

before I got there, the service locator was instead just one huge (30k loc) class at the base of a 8 deep inheritance hierarchy

Even my service locator was a God object, but it was at least a testable, modular, decoupled God object.

Telastyn

5:54 PM

there. It's not programmers, but a question nonetheless

0

Q: How to help women feel welcome on a male dominated team?

The flip side of this question. I work as a software engineer, often as a team leader. Software development is a male dominated field, and has been for my entire career. When I have had women (and foreigners, and LGBT people) on my team, I took the tact of ignoring these differences. They were a...

software-industry gender

still kinda likely to be closed shortly.

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