The Whiteboard

Hosch250

12:06 AM

Anyone around?

Telastyn

noooope

Hosch250

OK, see you later.

On a serious note, I have a question, and I'd like to ask if it is on topic here.

Telastyn

mhmm

user41796

@Hosch250 ignore the rabble. Go ahead and ask in here

Hosch250

Would it be on topic to ask whether it is better practice to use the provided end-of-line character that many languages have or if it is better to just append "\n" to the end of the string?

Telastyn

12:09 AM

don't we already have that question?

user20683

@Hosch250 yes

Hosch250

It doesn't apply to all languages, because some have stuff like Console.Write() and Console.WriteLine().

user20683

though I suspect it'd be a dupe

Hosch250

OK, I'll do so, if there isn't a dupe.

user20683

if it's not, go ahead and ask

Hosch250

12:09 AM

See you!

Telastyn

7

Q: Using a stream manipulator (endl) or a newline escape character (\n)?

I don't have a specific context in which I'm asking the question, but while I was reading a beginner book on C++ I noticed the use of both an endl stream manipulator and a newline escape character when dealing with a stream object. The exmaple is as follows: cout << "Hello World" << endl; cout <<...

Hosch250

OK, well, great!

Thanks.

user20683

@Hosch250 you're welcome. Also this is the recent why I don't have much SO rep ;)

Telastyn

at first glance, it doesn't look like we have the non-C++ equivalents.

Hosch250

Yeah, I switched to CR.

I suppose there isn't a generic answer for this?

Telastyn

12:13 AM

the generic answer is that it is best practice to use the language newline, since it will be smart enough to use the right newline depending on your platform

Hosch250

OK.

Well, thanks again.

Telastyn

\r\n on windows, \n on unix, etc.

Ixrec

@Telastyn which, oddly enough, is not true in C++

Hosch250

I am on Windows, and I just use \n

Telastyn

unless you don't want newline, and need an explicit unix newline.

Hosch250

12:14 AM

Maybe VS interprets it for me.

Telastyn

@Ixrec - ? thought it did.

Ixrec

nope, std::endl is always \n

Telastyn

@Hosch250 - naw, windows is better about handling stuff these days

unix too to be fair.

Hosch250

Everything, probably.

Ixrec

Everything other than Notepad is pretty good at handling newlines

user20683

12:14 AM

@Hosch250 unless you're working in the embedded space or mainframes

Hosch250

They have time to make minor changes like this now the main platform is done, maybe.

No, just the console.

user41796

C# has Environment.NewLine

user41796

But I think most people write to a StringBuffer and let the system deal with the formatting behind the scenes.

Hosch250

Does it?

I just use Console.WriteLine and Console.Write.

With the occasional \n if I only want to use one .WriteLine and write two lines.

user41796

Which is what pretty much everyone else uses too

Telastyn

12:17 AM

yeh

user114359

1:44 AM

@MichaelT Yep, I be lazy in the past but trying to be a team player lately.

user114359

And while I was in a location where I could not chat it up in here earlier today, I did read about how experienced users do not ask many questions. I think that is partly because we have fewer questions, the ones we do have are not good for the Q&A format, but I agree with @ThomasOwens that more self-answer questions will bring value to the site.

user55340

@Snowman It really does help, both in making sure that things that aren't on the front page still get their attention and making it so that it doesn't appear like there's a cabal in a secret chat room running it all (I'm really happy to see Doc and Doval show up in close votes)

user114359

Personally, I am gearing up to start an open source project in the next week or two. While I feel at this point in my career I have most of the answers, nobody, myself included, knows everything. I just might ask some "design review" questions here, or self-answer some interesting issues I come across.

user114359

@MichaelT With only 25 votes per day it is difficult both to burninate and to help with the queue but I am sure I can find a balance.

user114359

Also, NBA basketball is so distracting this time of year. I do believe it is the perfect pro sport.

user55340

1:49 AM

@Snowman Both are important, and both help. If you have the choice, front page is probably more important in that its what is there now while burination can be something where "I'm going to have an hour where I can help community moderation - just work on the queue rather than going and hunting"

user114359

I've been trying to work the queue for 10-15, burn 5-10 old questions with bad tags, keep a few aces up my sleeves for up-to-the-minute moderation during the day, then burn the last few on review > burninate right before 8 PM

user114359

Days like today where my wife says "let's go to the bar after work, drink beer, and watch basketball..." twist my arm, please?

user114359

ooooops, didn't vote much today

Jimmy Hoffa

@WorldEngineer angular does a ton; it's loaded full of modules and components that all depend on eachother so you can't use one without all the others; it's the single largest client side web application framework I've seen...

user114359

Can't beat jQuery: 4 LOC, 100kb.

Jimmy Hoffa

1:56 AM

@Ixrec You find that odd? Sounds right in C++s wheelhouse to me

@Snowman even when I believe I know what I'm doing and have confidence in my designs; I find reviews absolutely invaluable. They're like tests, you may be completely certain your code is perfect, but when the tests come back successful you feel even more sure.

we all have blind spots, reviews help you know none are glaring right now.

user114359

@JimmyHoffa at my last job I was the very senior developer reviewing code from fresh college graduates. I made it clear that reviews are peer to peer, not me to you. They found bugs in my code, and I laid my pride on the table for them. Nobody is immune.

user114359

Granted my code was overall better than theirs, but not perfect. I never claimed that.

Jimmy Hoffa

maybe not immune, but vaccinated by years... :)

user114359

I prefer "battle-scarred"

Jimmy Hoffa

I prefer "fluffy bunnies"

user114359

2:01 AM

And if they complain about that, I tell them about my six years in the military

user114359

I can code, shoot guns with pinpoint accuracy, and you can get off my lawn!

user55340

2:18 AM

@Snowman btw, you do know about the 10k close vote sniper page?

user114359

@MichaelT no, I am not part of the cool kids' club but should be soon

user55340

Snowman, Ohio

9.6k 2 26 42

java object-oriented object-oriented-design design algorithms c++ architecture

user55340

Ahh, 400 more.

user55340

Soon.

user114359

9,607

user114359

2:26 AM

I have had accounts on SE for a long time, but I have not been actively engaged until about a year ago. I was mostly lurking.

user55340

Ever look at your all site network profile? Here's mine: stackexchange.com/users/109017/michaelt?tab=reputation

user114359

Yep, that is how I know I was mostly lurking until a year ago :-)

Bobson

3:59 AM

So, would Programmers.SE be the place to ask an "Identify this esoteric language from a vague description" question? :/

Because I have one...

ratchet freak

8:21 AM

@Bobson no it isn't, programmers chat however is much more flexible in that regard

IdislikeCalot

9:03 AM

hello

So I'm currently waiting for the sites cache to refresh so I can get into the C++ chat room. Anyone willing to help me debug some homework? ideone.com/WrwRBc

ratchet freak

core culprit is the SIZE definition

think of #define as a global search-replace of each "SIZE" to "5"

This transforms void bubblesortname(char *fullname[], int *age, SIZE size); to void bubblesortname(char *fullname[], int *age, 5 size);

IdislikeCalot

But #define isnt a global variable right?

And I was trying to use it to set the length of the arrays... Maybe I have it listed incorrectly in the functions?

ratchet freak

it's worse; it's a source level transform of tokens

it works on type variables and keywords indiscriminately

IdislikeCalot

So I used it incorrectly.

ratchet freak

indeed

IdislikeCalot

9:15 AM

Ok thank you.

Well any chance I can bribe you to debug my program? :)

deostroll

hey .net TPL is touted to make max utilization of processor cores...but it is also said that it uses ThreadPool underneath...so does this mean that the ThreadPool is actually enhanced since .net 4.0? I am just wondering if the ThreadPool is "enhanced"...how so?

ratchet freak

@deostroll threadpool just keeps some threads alive for tasks to run

TPL is what must create the tasks so that they are fine grained enough to use multiple thread effectively

deostroll

9:30 AM

TPL is good at managing async tasks, but they are run of the threadpool internally...

ratchet freak

The only bottleneck in a threadpool is the task submission queue

or how tasks get from the submitting thread to the worker threads

That is at its core a producer/consumer problem which is well studied

overexchange

How do I differentiate CSS class used for styling from java/C++/javascript class? I know that java class is a type abstraction

deostroll

My assertion is that since TPL is believed to make max utilization of processor cores, and, considering the fact that it uses ThreadPool underneath, it eventually means that stuff that you put on ThreadPool must also make efficient use of processor cores...right?

ratchet freak

@overexchange CSS class just groups several tags that have a common attribute

@deostroll well a thread pool would have at least as many threads as there are CPUs right?

that means that as long as there are enough tasks being submitted that all cores will be busy

overexchange

as many LWP's as there are CPU cores

deostroll

9:38 AM

Usually its not done that way...by default its 25 or so...that is available...

IdislikeCalot

Pentium 5 or bust

overexchange

so for an activity of grouping some properties we use the keyword class in CSS?

ratchet freak

@overexchange wait CSS as in cascading stylesheet or something else?

overexchange

yes css that works with html for example: .large { font-size: 300%;}

deostroll

@ratchetfreak I don't follow how you equate the two - CPUs = # of threads?

ratchet freak

9:42 AM

@deostroll A thread pool has a Thread-Safe task queue and a set of threads which run the code while(alive)queue.Pop().run();

overexchange

@ratchetfreak Is this query1 query2 relevant to your discussion on threads?

ratchet freak

well it's a bit more complicated so it can die after a timeout and catch+handle the exception that run() may throw

meh I'm asssuming that kernel to userspace threads is 1-1

and the OS is smart in spreading them over the cores

MetaFight

10:32 AM

I'm documenting some work I've done for the boss. My project is essentially a queryable database of versioned documents. By default queries return the latest version of all the documents, but users can also specify a snapshot date in their queries in which case only documents effective at that time will be returned.

My doc sections so far a things like: Document model, Versioning model, Effectivity model, Querying model.

I'm wondering if I'm using the term 'model' in a standard way.

**Document model** describes the document schema. Where the metadata is held, and where the payload is held.
**Versioning model** describes how versioning works. Both how the version data is stored and the logic involved in creating new versions.
**Effectivity model** describes how documents are assigned effectivity date ranges. How only the start date is explicitly stored and how the end date is inferred from the subsequent document version's effectivity start date.

Querying model describes the logic involved in the querying service to pull out snapshots of the database and how document relationships are resolved on the fly to create document aliases (kind of like symlinks)

Should I be using a word other than "model" here?

MetaFight

11:40 AM

for those without enough rep to see: Those 3 deleted messages were me practising new swear words.

ratchet freak

has nothing to do with rep only room owners (italic name) and mods (blue name) can see deleted chat messages

MetaFight

:)

Telastyn

1:15 PM

@overexchange - you mean, besides CSS classes are in CSS and non-CSS classes are in not-CSS?