The Whiteboard

1:25 AM

@WorldEngineer Hm, it's not missing anything, its the title that's wrong. That's (a version of) the EU, not Europe (the continent). Europe is larger than Australia.

Jimmy Hoffa

1:44 AM

@MichaelT wife and I watched the night and day of the doctor the other night, both just ended up confused. Need to get my hands on the xmas special now..

I like the idea it's driving at though; that they're going to spend the next season tying the doctor to his pre-2005 roots, not knowing any of those but that there's a treasure trove of sci-fi for them to work with in that pantheon it should be fun

(also that paul mcgann strikes me as somebody who I would be happy to see as the next doctor, if only..)

Yannis Rizos

@JimmyHoffa Want hats?

Jimmy Hoffa

@YannisRizos Please! Just no togas..

Yannis Rizos

@JimmyHoffa Ok then, I'll let SE know we want hats. If people hate them, I'm blaming you.

Jimmy Hoffa

@YannisRizos Magnificent! I like being blamed for things, it's the second best thing to getting credit, but costs wayy less effort to get!

0

Q: What makes google faster

I've been using search engine since long time (so does any programmer). I'm just wondering what makes Google search faster. Hoping someone would light me up on this :) Is it the algorithm or the hardware?

> Hoping someone would light me up on this :)

Yep, they did at that.

user20683

@JimmyHoffa Torch

Matt D

1:59 AM

well theres certain things they do do, which are public

such as, they basically precompute searches ahead of time, and just query the results.

which is a fantastically high level simplificiation

but google basically "work" on that they can solve problems purely by sheer brute force and scale. which is a unique advantage.

user20683

@MattD That's about as optimized as you can be. Van Emde Boas Trees and their ilk can function like that.

Matt D

something like google maps, is a beautiful example of sheer scale being used to overcome problems

im personally waiting for google million monkeys at typewriters

I did have an idea. that. say you could somehow resolve really complicated problems into small "packets". and then have a way to represent that packet, perhaps a "which image looks like the other image" or something else which humans excell at but computers dont. and turn it into an iphone game or web game. and have millions of humans solve all the small parts of problems computers suck at in some kind of meta distributed thing.

user20683

@MattD Amazon's Mechanical Turk

user20683

mturk.com/mturk/welcome

Matt D

kind of, but more dedicated to solving actual problems. like say, protein folding. which computers find hard.

or like breaking captcha via pure distributed human input

Jimmy Hoffa

2:06 AM

@MattD the protiene folding games out there are exactly what come to mind as this (I assume you're familiar with these)

Matt D

so using the captcha example. you'd give a million people one letter from a captcha at the same time

you'd eventually brute force it purely by using millions of humans to solve individual parts of a problem

(that computers are natively shitty at solving)

the trick would be a) obfuscating the problem in such a way that the humans arent aware of what they're actually solving b) working out how to break problems down so you can apply a) to it

user55340

@JimmyHoffa What part was confusing? You've got the 8th doctor - the one you likely weren't expecting.

Matt D

that would make a fun story to write. a worldwide AI which runs everything which actually makes decisions using input from humans playing a candy crush like game. and a small group realise whats going on and try and influence decision making by gaming the game

makes a note

user55340

The Sister's of Karn were an old Doctor (4th - the one with the scarf) who were studying life and regeneration.

Matt D

only to realize that they're not the only ones doing this, and more interestingly, there's an actual AI also doing this. bwhaha. ok. time for lunch

as for dr who. they'll just [plot device] retconn the whole thing.

Jimmy Hoffa

2:11 AM

@MattD I've heard (not certain this is true?) Captcha is a bunch of scanned bits of books where they know one of the words and not another, and they were making money by using the human translations (20 people say this block is word X so we accept that) as crowd-OCR to accurately digitize libraries

Matt D

i thought the whole "regenerations" thing there was only to build some kind of tension that the dr might actually be in danger of actually getting himself killed.

user55340

You've got the time war - both the Time Lords and the Daleks were wrecking the universe with the war - the other races were collateral damage.

Matt D

@JimmyHoffa that is, as far as I can tell, correct. and also people use captcha farms to brute force captcha with low paid chinese workers

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT I recognized sisters of karn from last season when Smith went to his own grave site

(that's where that was, right?)

user55340

@JimmyHoffa Nope...

Jimmy Hoffa

2:12 AM

Oh, I thought the sisters of karn were there on that planet where his grave site was

user55340

Jimmy Hoffa

my memory is feschnicket

user55340

That's the sisters of Karn.

Matt D

ah tom baker

user55340

Trenzalore is the doctor's tomb.

Jimmy Hoffa

2:13 AM

that's right trenzalore

Matt D

personally, what they'll do is give him a new body and bury the old one, hence the tomb and hey presto more regens

user55340

Karn was a colony of the time lords and the hideout of the Time Lord Morbius (thats the brain in the body). They had the Elixier of Life.

user55340

It could heal serious injuries and was used by time lords having a difficult regeneration.

user55340

So, that's the sisters. They had as they said, perfected their science of regeneration and could influence the next life.

user55340

Thus, the War Doctor.

Matt D

2:16 AM

and the "moment"

user55340

Trying to find that funny video of the old doctors trying to get onto the set of the 50th anniversary special.

user20683

@MichaelT that's the 5(ish) doctors. It's on the BBC website

user55340

That would be the one then.

user20683

bbc.co.uk/programmes/p01m3kfy

psr

2:37 AM

4

A: Avoid too complex method - Cyclomatic Complexity

Software Engineering Answer: This is just one of the many cases where simply counting beans that are simple to count will make you do the wrong thing. Its not a complex function, don't change it. Cyclomatic Complexity is merely a guide to complexity, and you are using it poorly if you change th...

Nice job putting "monadic parser" in scare quotes. There should special unicode monadic parser scare quote characters.

2

Or maybe they are in quotes because they are imaginary.

Jimmy Hoffa

2:53 AM

@psr His retort is kind of bullshit too that the multipliers map might not be enough to encapsulate the logic variance. I would literally shit a brick if the difference between those different converters was anything more than the multiplier.

user55340

World's scariest airport - slate.com/blogs/atlas_obscura/2013/11/25/…

Matt D

3:41 AM

lol

@psr who the hell codes to specific complexity measures?

anyway, as pointed out, all of those function calls are completly irrelevent and could be replaced with some simple maths ffs

Matt D

6:13 AM

hmm

custom membership/role providers are weird if your email/name isnt unique

gnat

11:56 AM

@Undo I am going to be online for 3-4 hours from now, please ping me when to push email through that erway URL

gnat

12:26 PM

wonder if this answer deserves downvote? I put quite some effort into it, which naturally leads to bias, making me bad on judging its quality...

-1

A: Are trivial protected getters blatant overkill?

No matter if you use getters or field access, any experienced reviewer will find out the issue in your design and complain that your objects expose data instead of behavior. Note that appealing to "protected" won't help, because the purpose of inheritance is to allow subclasses adjust / tune beh...

Ampt

2:15 PM

@gnat Not sure why you got that drive-by downvote. Well thought out answer that gets to the root of OPs problem

Undo

2:47 PM

@gnat Goforit.

gnat

@Undo going to shoot right now...

...done - got 404 as expected

Undo

There it is. Awesome. Thanks!

Note to self: Make decent signup system.

Ampt

@Undo RoR with Devise is amazingly simple.

Undo

@Ampt I doth useth PHP... and I'm just too lazy to make a decent system :P

Ampt

@Undo And I'm apparently a software hipster according to @JimmyHoffa. We all have our problems!

Undo

2:59 PM

Lol

@gnat You should be set up. Tell me how it goes.

(note there is a problem where you need to log in, click another tab, then login again)

Ampt

@Undo around my neck of the woods we call that "Desired functionality" or "Working as intended"

Undo

That's not a bug, it's a security feature!

2

Ampt

You know what they say; If you can't fix it...

Feature it!

gnat

@Undo this thing works fine, thanks! (nice heuristics you've got there). Took me a while to figure how to switch to Programmers, then everything was all right. While I have your attention, did you consider an option to let user upload a csv or html with plain list of links to comments? I know SEDE provides similar option

Ampt

Feature requests already! I think he likes it!

gnat

3:15 PM

@Ampt thanks, I feel much better now. By the way, first few hours the answer had "incestual intercourses" instead of "indiscriminate messing" - I softened the wording after I decided that there was too much effort invested to put it at risk with too passionate wording :)

Ampt

3:28 PM

why are Regular Expressions regular?

in no way, shape, or form are they "Regular"

Yannis Rizos

@Ampt They are a regular PITA. Does that count?

3

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT reminds me of the cuzco airport I landed in

user55340

3:45 PM

@Ampt It has to do with the Chomsky hierarchy of languages

user55340

Chomsky hierarchy

Within the field of computer science, specifically in the area of formal languages, the Chomsky hierarchy (occasionally referred to as Chomsky-Schützenberger hierarchy) is a containment hierarchy of classes of formal grammars. This hierarchy of grammars was described by Noam Chomsky in 1956. It is also named after Marcel-Paul Schützenberger, who played a crucial role in the development of the theory of formal languages. The Chomsky Hierarchy, in essence, allows the possibility for the understanding and use of a computer science model which enables a programmer to accomplish meaningful ...

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt Possibly one of the worst accidents of naming... the "regular" isn't supposed to mean implementations are standard, though the naming would give you that inclination combined with the simile of implementations. Unfortunately as you see, the implementations are all totally thoroughly non-regular amongst eachother.

user55340

"'Regular expressions' are only marginally related to real regular expressions. Nevertheless, the term has grown with the capabilities of our pattern matching engines, so I'm not going to try to fight linguistic necessity here. I will, however, generally call them "regexes"" -- Larry Wall

gnat

Ampt

@MichaelT @JimmyHoffa @gnat I think we all know that only @YannisRizos's answer is the correct one.

gnat

3:48 PM

@Ampt sure! Chomsky pales in comparison

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt Give it a few more years in industry, you'll find one-line of griping is hardly enough to vent your angers regarding regexp.

Ampt

thankfully dealing with user input isn't something I do a lot of with snow plows, so I may be off the hook

Jimmy Hoffa

(unless you go perl in which case you don't count because all indicators at that point are that noam chomsky has brainwashed you)

user55340

The thing is, once you get your head around them, they're not that bad... brainwashing aside.

Ampt

@JimmyHoffa If I go perl, I want you to put me down

user55340

3:50 PM

@JimmyHoffa What about if he does something like going Ruby?

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt Unfortunately I'm more likely to do so if you go ruby or php... man you modern folks don't know a damn thing about DBs

Ampt

@JimmyHoffa SQL? Get out of here with that. Theres a Gem for that

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt Thus why you modern folks don't know anything at all about DBs. For crying out loud you think db design is "SQL" :P

not that you could write SQL either

user55340

@Ampt (with a bunch of security holes because it automatically expands the objects from the strings into complex objects with code of their own... just because Ruby can do it)

Ampt

@JimmyHoffa Blah blah blah You old geezers and your databases.

user55340

3:55 PM

@JimmyHoffa yea... we're antiquated now, they renormalize everything and stick it in some nosql database (I am sure that Codd is rolling over in his grave).

Jimmy Hoffa

There is something so pleasant about laying out a nice table structure for a data model that's purpose built for a known set of use cases where you can look at live system statistics to make estimates of growth rates and verify quality of the use cases by sproc execution plans having the whole thing just nice and perfect with a pleasant repository written over it... One of those great things because when you know how to do it, you only have to do it once and you don't even have to look back.

Ampt

It'd be nice if storing your data didn't mean having to come up with arbitrary sized tables and convoluted statements to access said data

and you know, maybe versioning so wiping out an entire database with a bad command wasn't possible

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt If the next generation doesn't think that's possible I'll be employed for a loooong time...

Ampt

If all I have to do to never work with SQL is have one @JimmyHoffa around, I'd just put up with his antics and deal with it

you win, congrats

user55340

@Ampt Oh... you've never had the joys of working on a well setup oracle database.

Ampt

3:59 PM

no, I haven't, because it costs an arm and a leg to do so

(actually quite a few arms and quite a few legs)

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt MSSQL is just as good in all regards (also costs an arm and a leg but you can use SQL Express for free)

user55340

Man... they've got a 'snapshot' based approach that you can just roll back to some point in the past. Even committed transactions.

user55340

But then you also have transactions in the first place, so unless you commit it, you haven't messed anything up. Just do a 'rollback'.

Jimmy Hoffa

You mean like backup points or are you talking about isolation level? MSSQL has snapshot isolation level since I think 2008

user55340

docs.oracle.com/cd/B28359_01/appdev.111/b28424/…

Ampt

4:01 PM

SQL and Regex are right next to eachother under the column of "Shit I apparently have to deal with eventually, but don't have to enjoy"

user55340

You can do queries against the history of the database values.

user55340

INSERT INTO employees
    (SELECT * FROM employees
     AS OF TIMESTAMP (SYSTIMESTAMP - INTERVAL '60' MINUTE)
    )
    MINUS SELECT * FROM employees);

user55340

Replace employees database with what was there 60 minutes ago.

Jimmy Hoffa

> Once snapshot isolation is enabled, updated row versions for each transaction are maintained in tempdb. A unique transaction sequence number identifies each transaction, and these unique numbers are recorded for each row version. The transaction works with the most recent row versions having a sequence number before the sequence number of the transaction. Newer row versions created after the transaction has begun are ignored by the transaction.
>
> The term "snapshot" reflects the fact that all queries in the transaction see the same version, or snapshot, of the database, based on the sta…

user55340

SELECT versions_startscn, versions_starttime,
       versions_endscn, versions_endtime,
       versions_xid, versions_operation,
       name, salary
  FROM employees
  VERSIONS BETWEEN TIMESTAMP
      TO_TIMESTAMP('2003-07-18 14:00:00', 'YYYY-MM-DD HH24:MI:SS')
  AND TO_TIMESTAMP('2003-07-18 17:00:00', 'YYYY-MM-DD HH24:MI:SS')
  WHERE name = 'JOE';

user55340

4:02 PM

Find out what changed for a given user between two time stamps.

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt You should enjoy SQL, regex is a totally different thing

Mike

I can't remember ever enjoying regex

user55340

@Mike I had a very enjoyable theory of computing class back in college where I came to understand what really went on behind a number of things we use at the theoretical level.

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt really; SQL is quite enjoyable, invest some time when you've got a job at a company with some large database just trying to come up with statistical analysis of the data and you can learn a lot and it really is enjoyable figuring out how to structure your queries to get disaparate data together in the right way

user55340

Deterministic Finite State Automata and Non-DFAs where the first area the class covered... and when you grok it at that level, regular expressions are just a representation of them.

Jimmy Hoffa

4:05 PM

It won't feel like a waste either because if you come up with some interesting statistics from the data you've got something to report to people. I don't know how many hypothesis I've proved just by digging around in databases at my jobs so I could report them as facts to my colleagues which helped us make decisions

user55340

Things like the proof that a NDFA can be represented in a DFA, and the process of changing one to the other, the pumping lemma, how to determine if a language is regular or not.

Ampt

SELECT cares FROM cares_to_give WHERE care = TRUE
Showing 0 to 0 of 0 entries

Jimmy Hoffa

I'm giving you crap in good fun @Ampt; nobody knows SQL or DB design before they get into industry, or at least nobody has for probably a decade. Good fun though so do give it a poke when you get a job with some large DBs

(probably longer than a decade)

Ampt

@JimmyHoffa Haha I know. I get the basic premise of it, and it was actually a part of one of my interviews

did well enough to get an offer

they had me do HTML, CSS and SQL. My 3 worst subjects

user55340

While nosql is all hip today, I've never worked somewhere there wasn't an oracle database lurking in the datacenter that you had to work with.

Jimmy Hoffa

4:09 PM

@MichaelT you graduated early 90s right? They still did DB design and basic query stuff back then didn't they? I mean back then the "application in a database" model of sotware was still prominent

user55340

@JimmyHoffa '96.

Ampt

I had a Database class. Got a B somehow

know nothing of SQL from that class

how I passed is beyond my comprehension

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT ah so it was fading by then, did they go over all that stuff with you guys in any more than glossing over normals and transactions?

user55340

I actually dropped my database class, but it wasn't about the practical use of database... its the "what you need to know to be a positive contributor to MySQL or work at Oracle" type thing (not that those were mentioned).

Jimmy Hoffa

@Ampt SQL and DB are really distinct things, one is a structural system, the other is like it's scripting system; it's Excel and VBA; you can learn them independently and people often do.

user55340

4:10 PM

I really regret dropping that class, turns out it was taught by one of the best professors in the area in the country.

Ampt

mine was taught by a dude with a thick accent and not a lot of knowledge to my best understanding

user55340

The professor that taught the class - pages.cs.wisc.edu/~dewitt

Jimmy Hoffa

Yeah... I think when the application-in-a-database software model faded away they really lost all the DB stuff from schools, back when that was a prominent approach they taught DBs like they teach python now (or so is my understanding) largely because back then DB systems were the python of the day through much of the 80s and early 90s

user55340

I actually never touched a database until... '98.

user55340

But when I did, it was a full dunk in the system. "We need to do this" and then you get in and learn how to do it.

Undo

4:16 PM

@gnat Actually, I get the comments from SEDE and put them into a MySQL DB - I certainly take requests for new comment searches, etc. to be thrown in, but as of now it's a rather manual process (direct MySQL import). I'll think about it, though.

gnat

@Undo I see. That's sure not urgent, things work fine without it

user55340

@JimmyHoffa Back then, databases were the thing... everything was CRUD with attached business logic. And I mean everything. CPU time was at a premium and so you did every trick you could to get the report to run faster. It was running reports, printing them out and sending them to some manager.

user55340

Payroll didn't have a web page to hit, they entered data, it got sent on punched cards to the computing center, they ran the data, and spat out another report on a printer. You wanted the program to run fast because everyone else's jobs were waiting too - accounting, etc...

user55340

Btw, got feedback From Tim on the 10k flagging...

user55340

@MichaelT Not an answer seems the best one there, if that were a question, or even lower quality than pictured, then you'd go for very low quality. Whichever is most descriptive, they both ultimately indicate your opinion that the post should be deleted. — Tim Post 5 mins ago

gnat

4:23 PM

first crap-thrower from TWP to us...

to which my comment still applies. It's about certification for software developers, and at Programmers you'll probably find more relevant answers to this specific point. As Justin Cave pointed out in his answer, there's value in virtually anything. — CMW yesterday

Undo

@gnat What in particular were you thinking? I'm planning to add 'please accept' comments in six to eight weeks, and more suggestions are always welcome.

Actually, we have a whole chatroom just for this:

Charcoal HQ

Where smoke is detected, diamonds are made, and we break thing...

16

28

(we being Manish and I)

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT Yeah, I can only presume they did teach that stuff back then because that was the model of the day. Most of those green screen POS systems you see, corporate internal processes, HR software, all of that stuff was done that way back then. Plus I get the inclination it was taught because of how rigidly people from that era understand the normalization "levels" (I can never remember and don't care, proper normalization is about use cases not which level for which purpose)

gnat

@Undo nothing besides html/csv upload. But now that you mention please-accept, I rather wonder why didn't you have it from day one. :) That should be a real hit

Undo

Hope so!

Jimmy Hoffa

Plus that's the generation that created that old and frankly horrible term "object relational impedance mismatch" as if they just didn't have enough trivia to ask in interviews

user55340

4:26 PM

@JimmyHoffa I was in college during the period of transition of "big data, big reports" to "applications are king" (with the pure CS background) but before the "big data, big reports" came back to the forefront it is today.

Jimmy Hoffa

I'm so glad that has faded from our modern lexicon...

@MichaelT Yeah, but the way it's in the forefront now is totally different, I presume they're trying to teach data isolation and concurrency/distributed partitioning more than anything for what's currently a big deal; though I don't think schools have caught up to this "big data" stuff just yet...

user55340

And realize I was taking computer science and it was taught as such (theoretical was its own required class).

gnat

@Undo that's very convenient! I bookmarked the room, will drop in there to talk about charcoal instead of slipping through endless regex / MUMPS debates here

user55340

Digital logic (building adders with AND and OR gates), machine code, compilers, numerical methods, theoretical CS, operating systems (writing the memory management, drive access optimizations), theory of programming languages...

user55340

@gnat You forgot monads.

user41796

4:30 PM

@MichaelT, @gnat, @Undo - do you know what I'm doing wrong? When I log into Charcoal, I get stuck in an endless cycle of the browser having to send information back to the server.

user41796

And I have tried on IE, firefox, and safari at this point. I feel quite lame.

gnat

@GlenH7 login first time, switch to Programmers at top tab, then login second time (and, if memory serves, switch to Programmers again)

firefox did it for me

user41796

@gnat I don't even get to a top tab

gnat

@GlenH7 oh and yes, resend, - click Retry!

login first time, retry, switch to Programmers at top tab, then login second time, retry, (and, if memory serves, switch to Programmers again)

Jimmy Hoffa

4:32 PM

@MichaelT I guess back then the other stuff was the "CIS" eh? That wasn't a half bad degree back then I understand, though nowadays they have these "IT" degrees; what a crock, I understand people basically get trained to work the tech bench at best buy with those degrees if that, poor bastards...

gnat

worked to me in Firefox

user41796

is what I'm seeing in Firefox.

gnat

@GlenH7 right, I hit resend there

and it refreshes the page

Undo

Yeesh, is it this bad? D:

user41796

4:34 PM

@gnat I end up in an endless resend loop then.

gnat

with iirc Physics tab displayed by default (strong influence of Manish I guess:)

user41796

@Undo I'm pretty willing to bet the error exists between the user & the keyboard.

user41796

:-)

Undo

@GlenH7 Have cookies enabled?

Jimmy Hoffa

@GlenH7 I've accidentally made webpages do this before with JQuery, don't remember how or what I had done wrong... :)

user55340

4:34 PM

@CMW I would strongly suggest looking at the microsoft certifications tag on P.SE and consider that these questions are often off topic for the site. Furthermore, P.SE also has an off topic reason of "career advice" for which this would likely be closed as if reposted or migrated. Please spend some time looking over the suggested tag before suggesting reposting to another site, and if it does belong there, flag it for migration instead of suggesting. — MichaelT 21 secs ago

user41796

@Undo yes, but not from 3rd parties

Undo

@GlenH7 That might be it. GoDaddy for some reason puts an ugly iframe over the site.

user55340

That said, there's some stuff in microsoft-certifications that could get... some prompt and clear cut treatment in the close and delete vote way.

Undo

(godaddy shudders)

The whole thing's on GitHub here, if any of you people smarter than I am (all of you) can see what's wrong.

user41796

@Undo Ding! that did it. Evil, bad GoDaddy.....

Undo

4:36 PM

Ugh, evil, bad, malicious, terrible <insert adjectives here> GoDaddy.

Jimmy Hoffa

stupid 2011 question closed as duplicate of 2012 questions which is also closed... both flagged for deletion.

Undo

lol

user41796

@Undo My browser wizardry is not that sophisticated yet, but this may be an excuse for me to start learning.

Undo

@GlenH7 I'd say it's an excuse for me to switch registrars.

user41796

@Undo - how should I use the valid / invalid buttons?

user41796

4:39 PM

And I need to click through on each to flag the comments, right?

Undo

@GlenH7 They're actually primarily for feedback to my algorithm. They both dismiss the 'flag' from the queue for everyone, and it gets marked handled on my DB.

@GlenH7 Yup.

Valid/invalid just set a var on the DB to 1/0.

(and yes, you get marked as having handled the flag. So we can have handling races and stuff.)

user41796

Won't be a race since I was foolish enough to ping @gnat and include him in the fun.

user55340

@JimmyHoffa "bleh blame RH"?

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT I had my fun, I don't intend to genuinely cause the mods headaches, though those two questions really will be deleted no matter what my flag message says.. "How do I get a job at Microsoft?" duped to -> "Is it possible to get a job at Microsoft?" really?? This site needs that content like it needs goatse grafitti..

user41796

@Undo - does charcoal cluster the comments for review? or is it a triage basis? ie. worst flags bubble up to the top first.

Undo

4:43 PM

@GlenH7 In theory, the worst ones should be at the top (sorted primarily by length, as that seems to be a good measure).

Jimmy Hoffa

-1

Q: Does Microsoft MTA certification help you get a job/better position?

I was wondering if Microsoft certification helps you get a job or if people recommend doing it . I'm currently thinking about it but I don't know if it is worth the effort/time Hope this isn't a bad question but I was wondering....

microsoft-certifications

not even closed

If you have a cv left..

Undo

I do not have a CV left :(

user55340

@JimmyHoffa That CV on it is mine (as is one of the down votes, and the favorite to remember to clean up)

Undo

Because I have 101 rep.

user41796

@Undo We routinely burn through close and delete votes here

Jimmy Hoffa

4:44 PM

@Undo Go answer some PHP questions or something

user41796

And thanks for the explanation. I wish there was a way to track additional collateral damage action like voting to delete crap questions.

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT I know mods don't delete until it's closed, but fuck it I CV'd and flagged for deletion anyway. It's garbage, he didn't even invest more than two sentences on a topic which is unacceptable anyway

Undo

I'm actually primarily Meta - with SO next.

Undo, Northwest USA

11.2k 5 31 77

discussion feature-request support review bug status-completed stackoverflow

Jimmy Hoffa

One exception to this rule: The documentation of the class should list its subclasses local to its own library. — Kieveli 4 hours ago

Anybody else think that's just wrong?

user55340

@JimmyHoffa I always flag questions that get a close vote on a migration because otherwise it will become a locked answerless stub that will require another flag to get deleted (because you can't delete vote a locked question).

user55340

4:49 PM

@JimmyHoffa No... not as such.

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT It just seems totally misleading if documentation dictates it's subclasses when it can't possible know them all

user55340

Consider docs.oracle.com/javase/7/docs/api/java/util/List.html : All Known Implementing Classes: AbstractList, AbstractSequentialList, ArrayList, AttributeList, CopyOnWriteArrayList, LinkedList, RoleList, RoleUnresolvedList, Stack, Vector

user41796

@Undo Meta scares me. (and others in this room too)

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT That's generated documentation, totally different situation, MSDN does the same

user55340

@JimmyHoffa local to its own library

Undo

4:50 PM

@GlenH7 It scares me too. But it's kinda fun.

Jimmy Hoffa

I don't disagree documentation generators should parse hierarchies and list all of them it can find; including non-local inheritors

user55340

It can't know about things outside that implement it, but within its library the author has knowledge of all the classes.

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT I know, but my point is that's a subset which makes the documentation inaccurate therefore misleading

user55340

I don't read it as incomplete or missing.. and often find it useful. I want a list, what lists are there... oh, I want a CopyOnWriteArrayList for this implementation...

Jimmy Hoffa

Iduno. Just my thoughts I guess. I'll think about it I guess but it just seems like it could quickly become out of data and altogether wrong and moreover even though it's just documentation and not code, still knowledge of subclasses seems just wrong

gnat

4:53 PM

@MichaelT sometimes it just scares me how we do things the same way

user55340

@gnat I found it a useful approach to take...

Jimmy Hoffa

and another, off topic and only 2 sentences...

9

Q: MCPD Certification(or any certification) vs Degree

What do you find more valued on a Resume? MCPD certification (Or any certification) or a Degree in Comp Sci? And why?