Ask Ubuntu General Room - 2019-06-13

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WinEunuuchs2Unix

2:47 AM

@Rinzwind St. Louis player said F word on TV after win...LOL

This time the St. Louis starting line up included the two guys from where I live.

Ubuntu Questions on U&L

3:21 AM

0

Q: Understanding Networking Issue Ubuntu 18.04

I have a server setup where I've bonded 4 interfaces (bond1) and connected this to a physical switch. I have added this bond1 to an OVS switch ovsbr1 with VM's attached to ovsbr. It seems there was a change in how Ubuntu/debian handles dummy interfaces in 18.04. Previously I configured a dummy i...

ubuntu networking

3:43 AM

Is there a reason questions mentioning Ubuntu appear in this chat room from only UnL? Superuser gets some Ubuntu questions as well. Example: superuser.com/questions/1448134/…

4:14 AM

Jun 27 '11 at 14:02, by Marco Ceppi

It's designed to show only questions on Unix&Linux with the Ubuntu tag

I guess that Super User loves version tags very much. Unix & Linux has ubuntu while SU has ubuntu-18.04 (Really???). So, I think it's easy to identify those on U&L or nobody tried writing a bot for SU or feed O_o

Journeyman Geek

4:49 AM

@Kulfy oh

Blame windows 8 and 10

they had RCs so we actually kinda had version tags

In theory you also want a generic ubuntu tag there

2 hours later…

6:47 AM

@Kulfy Thanks for digging that out :)

@WinEunuuchs2Unix Fantastic? >:)

7:39 AM

SU has a watch-dog here O_o

@JourneymanGeek Bindoz is innocent, don't blame her. Why tf it (Win10) has control panel and settings? Bindoz vary very much in their releases.

Journeyman Geek

@Kulfy for version tags

@JourneymanGeek May be you can make them synonym of ubuntu

Journeyman Geek

@Kulfy oh we have it for a reason

you might want to take it up on our meta

@JourneymanGeek Currently I'm not on SU.

Multiple tags makes earning gold badge hard

Journeyman Geek

@Kulfy the association bonus should get you on meta ;)

7:44 AM

Register to participate on meta? Thinking Ok. Just do it ✔

8:06 AM

@JourneymanGeek Done. Please review my very first post on SU Meta ^_^

Journeyman Geek

now lets see what the community has to say ;)

I found 19 tags. I'm not familiar with SU's community as of now.

8:38 AM

@Kulfy they're useless on U&L too. 9 out of 10 questions tagged with ubuntu on U&L shouldn't have the tag.

I sometimes feel the only useful thing about the bot that posts those questions here is that it helps me find and retag them :(

It's an old problem:

Jul 16 '14 at 17:26, by terdon

DAMMIT! Will you people stop tagging questions with ubuntu on U&L unless it's really specific to Ubuntu! Grrr...

:)

@terdon :D :D :D

Unintentional side-effect!

9:04 AM

@terdon People are too specific with their posts.

Here on AU, I find people use version tags which may end in even closure of their question.

Example: askubuntu.com/questions/1147483

9:34 AM

Don't get me started on version tags... :)

Ok. Does it mean that you hate version tags like anything?

@Kulfy I find them largely pointless.

@terdon But I think here on AU they may have point if the post is version specific. Isn't it?

The idea of tags is to help direct experts to posts they can answer. Nobody is an expert on 16.04 and not on 18.04 or whatever.

@Kulfy Yes, in principle, but in practice i) extremely few posts are actually version specific and ii) very, very few people use them that way.

@terdon Ah.. In that way. I agree.

9:43 AM

So they just end up taking a useful tag space that could have been used for a tag that was actually informative.

May I know your opinion regarding this answer?

0

A: Do we really need multiple [ubuntu]s?

I would argue that the version is actually often important - there have been significant changes through the versions and I certainly would not expect any but the most generic (as in, "would apply to any Linux distro") answers for a ten year old version to work perfectly on a recent release. Jus...

On the other hand, the tags can be useful in the first few weeks after a new release when all sorts of issues are coming up.

But of course, since we have that strange rule about "no bugs", most of those will be closed anyway.

But still legacy is going on from long ago. I guess.

Also, note that this is just my opinion. There are valid arguments in favor of version tags as well. The community (and mod team) are split down the middle on this.

@terdon Indeed.

9:50 AM

0

A: Do we really need multiple [ubuntu]s?

I would say that we absolutely don't need so many version tags. I would argue that all we need is ubuntu and then the version can be mentioned in the body of the question. Yes, there are difference between Ubuntu versions but they tend to not be very important. Also, most of them are down to the ...

Ubuntu Questions on U&L

10:04 AM

0

Q: Proper permissions for Laravel project in /var/www/html

I want to create a Laravel project in /var/www/html using composer. Since composer won't allow you to run as root, I can make a directory and give it all the permissions 777 but I don't think that's a good idea. So I was wondering what permissions shall I give to my new project folder so I can w...

ubuntu permissions

What should be done about askubuntu.com/questions/1150689/…? OP also asked at superuser and answered the question there.

10:51 AM

@DKBose On SU OP mentioned a question on AU which helped. So, the question on AU is a dupe of that. I think closing as a dupe is a better option.

@Kulfy voted to close as a duplicate of the AU post.

11:04 AM

@DKBose terdon closed the question

Thanks!

11:29 AM

('Personal and subjective opinion, please feel free to disrespect any of my opinions at all times)

0:-)

:50665340 that isn't a very nice thing to say. Nor is talking about someone behind their back like this in another public room. He looks like a person with problems navigating human social interactions. A troll is someone who intentionally acts in an unpleasant way.

@terdon Thank you for removing that.

Next time, think first, yeah?

Didn't look it at that way,

@terdon Next time: just keep my big mouth shut.

@terdon please remove my comment as well! Thanks.

11:32 AM

(which I have to tell myself too often, I stould stop saying it and start doing it)

join the club...

I'm not a naturally pleasantly communicative person neither, hence the avatar: I do feel like an alien that doesn't get these human's interactions sometimes...

I try to always be pleasant, but sometimes fail...

You're actually good at this!

(or at a minimum: much better than me!)

>:-) ;-)

Ubuntu Questions on U&L

12:04 PM

0

Q: How to set the right folder permission to make a program accessible to all users?

I have a program X which I want all users of my computer to be able to access. So I can't put it in my home folder. So I hear that \usr\local is the right place and tried that. But the folder permissions for folders in \usr\local\bin\ are drwxr-xr-x, which I find out is 755. So I create a fold...

ubuntu software-installation

5 hours later…

4:40 PM

can I get keys on a keyboard to function when xev does not report a keycode?

I have a set of keys marked P1 through P6 :P

> If you press a key and nothing appears in the terminal, it means that either the key does not have a scancode, the scancode is not mapped to a keycode, or some other process is capturing the keypress. If you suspect that a process listening to X server is capturing the keypress, you can try running xev from a clean X session:

$ xinit /usr/bin/xterm -- :1

wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/…

hmm

nothing from that either :(

5:07 PM

@Rinzwind maybe there's some special key to enable them? Fn or something?

all the Fn keys I can identify There is an extra key next to printscreen with the hp omen logo on it. also does nothing >:) in windows that one is connected to some hp software

the answer is probably no :P

I'm voting to close this question as because it was cross posted and subsequently answered on Ask Ubuntu. — Mokubai ♦ 6 hours ago

@DKBose ^^^

5:28 PM

@Rinzwind I have the same issue, but I found that these keys generate mouse events (Button 3-9)

So try that before giving up...

5:39 PM

that could be it. the software video on it matches them with a mouse :P

quick convention poll: in code comments(any programming language), text content (tex, markdown), or in any language where you break lines at a certain character count
pastebin.com/raw/mUHWHqfU do you prefer style 1 or style 2?

@Lacey Style 1. Style 2 only if each sentence is making a very different point and you want them to be read as a list.

Personally, I always go for style 1 'cause I feel it makes my code look less messy.

I've also learned that if your code needs comments that are that long, you are almost certainly doing something wrong.

I used to comment my code religiously so I could understand it when I looked at it again months or years down the line. These days, I write my code so that it is clear and I can understand it without needing comments. Turns out that's a much better approach!

5

@terdon ~500 characters is not very long. it is like a 10 second read

you just wrote that much, i wouldn't call your comments 'that long'

@terdon points for writing readable code. I generally follow the rule that a 4 year old should be able to read python and tell you basically what it does. It's why I avoid random things like lambda functions and custom magic. Another rule of thumb I use is if your function comment is basically the function name/signature, you're probably doing it right.

5:55 PM

I look back at the code I used to write and I want to cry...

@Lacey Um...

That's what I thought too until I started working with people with loads more experience and going through code reviews.

If you need 500(!) characters in a comment, you should really think about simplifying your code. At the very least try using descriptive variable and function names etc

6:08 PM

Describing what a class does or the purpose of a data structure often requires that many characters. It is less than 1/4th of a book page. It is a single paragraph.

@terdon 2 lines of 78 chars is enough.

otherwise you need to find a better job >:-D

@Lacey The point is that if your class requires 500 characters of explanation, then it is almost certainly not written clearly enough. Of course there will be exceptions, but that's a useful rule of thumb.

And then, of course, you will change the behavior of the class and forget to update the comment, and someone else will modify it, and also forget and a few months or years down the line the comment is no longer relevant and your class is still unclear.

6:32 PM

https://askubuntu.com/questions/1150863/how-to-forcely-hang-ubuntu
who wants to post the obvious 1onliner?

If you are fine with assuming things without evidence, then just assume I am actually committing printed out images instead of code. I haven't had issues with maintaining ~8 sentences. That character length is not long enough to talk about all the variables or even functions. 8 sentences is just enough to explain the basic purpose of a thing and what it does.

it may also very well be that your class is in fact multiple classes combined and can be split to make the whole code simpler

I don't find it an easier read when a codebase consists of smaller files I have to keep jumping around

@Lacey in 25 years of coding I never needed more then 2x78 chars. Then again I see lots of undocumented code from old employees where I instantly know who wrote it. Just a couple of lines often is enough for me. And every old employee had his

@Rinzwind Really, never?

6:38 PM

quirks. Often I already knew what they did wrong before seeing the whole class.

@Lacey yes sir. Never ever.

Then I assume you never ever used a docblock or a meta comment either? You would have more than that length after just 2 parameters and a return value

@Lacey I am not assuming anything at all. I'm talking about my code and how it has changed over the years. I've found that the clearer my code is, the fewer comments I need. So these days, if I find myself writing comments that explain the code, I rewrite the code instead.

that is something else. we are talking about a description of a class

I'll use comments to explain why this code is necessary, for example, but not what it does.

@terdon so true. what also is important; at my workplace we have templates. Each different language has pre-defined ways to code it. UNLESS you want to maintain the software yourself you have to abide by those rules.

6:43 PM

@Rinzwind actually this whole conversation is something else, the topic was where should the lines wrap

@Lacey at char 78 :=)

oops sorry. new keyboard >:)

just keep the mistakes in :p

Where I work with javascript the description is not allowed to be more than 1 line. And it all has to be in English too :-)

@Lacey my grandparents got murdered by them so lay off.

I am out @terdon

@Rinzwind sorry about the joke, then

Please don't throw around "Nazi" casually. It carries some pretty strong emotional weight for many of us, especially those of us in Europe.

6:53 PM

got it, my bad

no worries

simpledeveloper.com/should-you-have-comments-in-code

blog.codinghorror.com/coding-without-comments

I am aware of the idea. I think people take it as gospel and run with it

I used to think so as well before moving from academia to the private sector and professional coding.

I still don't consider myself a programmer, as such, so I don't tend to have any religious convictions about code, but I have seen that as the quality of the code I produce improves, the amount of commenting I do decreases.

Your mileage may vary, of course.

@terdon that wasn't the discussion though, the discussion was whether 500 characters is excessive or not

I think we've made our position on that quite clear by now :)

6:59 PM

@terdon yeah and it wasn't even the question anyway, so this whole thing is weird :p lets just go away :p

Hey, I answered the actual question first before getting on my high horse!

Ubuntu Questions on U&L

0

Q: Making my remote SSH more secure

Novice getting into Linux here. I recently set up SSH access to a small Ubuntu box which I currently log into both from my local network and from offsite. Currently I just have 2 users that are remoting in, but checking my /var/logs/auth.log I see TONS of random username/port combination attem...

linux ubuntu ssh iptables

1 hour later…

8:14 PM

@terdon what, you never have to use a weird hack or workaround?

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