The Heap™ – Consultancy ©® - 2018-01-17 (page 1 of 2)

12:41 AM

-- NOTE: THE IMPLEMENTATION (ie. using trace bit 1717) IS *VERY* LIKELY TO CHANGE,
--  SO DONT EVEN *THINK* ABOUT USING THIS TRACE BIT DIRECTLY!!!

hrm...

echo "DBCC TRACEON(1717)" >> ~/.mssqlcli.ini

sp_BlitzErik

@_@

Evan Carroll

tracebit that sets all new objects as system objects

sounds like a plan!

Joe Obbish

4:36 AM

@PaulWhite Thanks for the edit

interesting that connect item is marked as won't fix

Evan Carroll

4:56 AM

Is there a list of DBCC Trace Flags?

I heard you all talking about that earlier. Does anyone actually have a list of them all?

Paul White

5:14 AM

@JoeObbish Won't Fix stuff sometimes gets fixed in a later version

@EvanCarroll We talked about this in here just recently. The 'best' list according to a few people was github.com/ktaranov/sqlserver-kit/blob/master/…

3

But the official list is docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sql/t-sql/database-console-commands/…

Evan Carroll

yea, no one cares about the official list. ;)

that guy did a killer job with that

That's some through documentation

Paul White

It's not a complete list

Evan Carroll

Is that method of discovery flawed or total?

Paul White

hm?

Evan Carroll

oh nvm he's only dumping the optimizer rules

so no one has a complete list of dbcc tracon flags?

Paul White

5:29 AM

employees

Evan Carroll

this will be fun. ;)

If this is right, it's certainly doable: dba.stackexchange.com/a/141108/2639

Well, I got my Microsoft Crapdoku puzzle for the night

Paul White

If it were that simple :)

Evan Carroll

@PaulWhite I assume they're all stored in a global memory address.. Have you ever scanned the code for things that moved the address into a register, followed by a call to cmp?

Paul White

Yes

Evan Carroll

And can't you get a total list of numbers that way?

if not, why wouldn't that work?

Granted, that doesn't tell you what they do

Paul White

5:42 AM

Well, the answers there (including mine) pretty much cover it.

Evan Carroll

Well the part you have that addresses it is here,

> can be useful in simple cases, but the interesting cases aren't often simple - and not all trace flags are checked at the point where they affect the code path taken.

That's true, but my method would find cases that aren't live.

Paul White

Let us know how you get on

Evan Carroll

going to try to stub SetSessionTrace to see the memory address it writes to, then I'm going to core dump and see things that would read from that address and compare after

(no idea if that will work)

Paul White

Me either. Have fun!

Evan Carroll

=)

Paul White

5:47 AM

My interest in trace flags is usually limited to how they affect specific things I'm investigating.

Including ones that produce debug information of course.

Evan Carroll

Well, making the list useful would be a massively more complex task

Paul White

Yes indeed.

McNets

7:52 AM

Morning all

Evan Carroll

8:02 AM

@McNets GOOD MORNING ! =)

I'm about to crashhhh

2 AM for me.

I hereby give the entirety of DBA.StackExchange to @McNets for the night: he's in charge until I get back. ;)

McNets

@EvanCarroll Hi, there is a bed waiting for you, I suppose...

@EvanCarroll haha, I'll take care!

hot2use

8:25 AM

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft I'll second that any time

Good Morning.

Philᵀᴹ

9:45 AM

Front page full of shit questions at the moment :(

hot2use

:-)

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

11:41 AM

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft Well, back when I were a wee lad, folks used to be able to install and run thousands of applications on a Sun box without the individual applications shitting on each other. My alma mater had a portfolio of literally thousands of applications they ran on three sun servers and served up to a network of workstations over NFS.

Nary a hypervisor in sight.

Jails used to be a thing on BSD-derived *nixs. You could set up a jail with just the binaries and shared libs you needed to support the application's run time and run the application in a jail. The concept got re-invented as containers but they seem to have added a lot more melodrama to the process.

I'm starting to feel like an old fart. Get off my lawn.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

1:32 PM

@ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells That was a little different IIRC. It was time division based on the actual hardware, whereas the oversubscription model in current hypervisors isn't quite the same.

I totally get it though

hehe, let's put a fence around your lawn... we'll call it LPAR and paint it yellow.

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

I don't think they even bothered to use LPARs; I don't think the machines they were using were big enough to even have LPARs.

Although on a heavily loaded server you might want to use them to prevent one LPAR from gobbling all the CPU.

LPARs are something between containers and VMs run by a hypervisor-ish thing in the machine's firmware.

Depending on the architecture they can go down to CPU or slice-of-CPU level of grain.

Closer to VMs than containers - you can run separate O/S's in LPARs.

sp_BlitzErik

People still say things like "logical data center" and it makes me wanna smash their Blackberries.

Paul White

Well I get strange results when I use an illogical data center

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik or their faces...

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft The technical term is 'Percussive Stakeholder Management'

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

1:44 PM

LOL

sp_BlitzErik

@PaulWhite CAPTAIN (Spock voice)

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

WOOOT - an XE question

0

Q: Extended Events replacement for Virtual file stats

Is there a way to monitor virtual filestats data with Extended Events, instead of doing (select * from sys.dm_io_virtual_file_stats) in SSMS?

Tom V

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft Masochist

sp_BlitzErik

I'm getting ready for that resource semaphore question when I get home from the gym

Paul White

A: Use fewer resources

sp_BlitzErik

1:49 PM

Not everyone's carbon footprint can be a vape trail and cucumber ends pal

Paul White

I suppose that may be true

Q: Which events did Extended Events extend?

sp_BlitzErik

None. They just extended the lengths you have to go to not to find the problem.

4

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik I don't know how you gym in the morning. I used to go at 5 am, but I wasn't nearly as strong... and I was super hungry.

sp_BlitzErik

Aw man I only do cardio and I like mornings because Charmed is on the big TV

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik No matter how fast you run, I think you've fallen behind in catching those girls...

sp_BlitzErik

2:03 PM

Lol

In absolute terms it's the only thing that can distract me from the misery that is running in place

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

Truth, I don't know how people do that

sp_BlitzErik

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft there are about 1.5 non-contiguous months a year where it's nice to run outside in nyc

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik False, you put your trash on the street - it's never a nice time to run outside.

sp_BlitzErik

i'd rather dodge trash and homeless than snakes and gators

dezso

@hacksoar you are very welcome to receive help from me. If you compared your question lacking punctuation and capitals, you will see why I edited it - you are welcome on that, too. Please also note that questions here remain for years, hopefully helping others, too. For this purpose, good formatting is better than bad formatting. Furthermore, you don't have to listen to good advice, but then don't even ask - you still got your answer, after all, it seems. No one said concatenation won't work, but ''' is exactly the messy thing you can avoid using the features Postgres kindly offers. — dezso 9 secs ago

yes, I am pissed off

sp_BlitzErik

2:12 PM

did they roll back your edits?

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik No snakes and gators here, just ate the last three.

sp_BlitzErik

oh, that you're not allergic to

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik I can eat all of the animals.

It's a quest I've been on

sp_BlitzErik

serious question: if the apocalypse happened after shoulder day, would you eat a person to not get doms?

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

A few years ago had antelope, gazelle, kangaroo, horse, and a few others

sp_BlitzErik

2:14 PM

where'd you have horse? almost tried horse tartare in mtl

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik Considering my shoulders are already effed up... I'd probably have some long pork.

I ordered it through one of the butcher shops in Pittsburgh... though a horse on the farm did die of colic - so I could have jut hacked off a flank.

sp_BlitzErik

lol

how was it?

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

tasted like meat

I mean, I've been to Ikea before so horse wasn't new

( Ikea meatball joke)

sp_BlitzErik

D:

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

bear, bison, moose, elk (my favorite)

pheasant, dove, wild turkey

Snake, gator/croc, frog

I should create a database

have a list of animals in the world and a list for what I've eaten

though, I'm sure somehow @JoeObbish would find a way to make those queries slow

sp_BlitzErik

2:19 PM

would beat wwi

hot2use

@dezso See. Told you so.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@PaulWhite That's a good list of TF's, more than I've seen anywhere else.

sp_BlitzErik

it's open source like bol, so you can add to it

right?

Tom V

@sp_BlitzErik Why is horse special?

I love a good horse filet

sp_BlitzErik

in america we don't eat our cars

you animal

Tom V

2:26 PM

What purpose do horses still have other than eating?

There are no Amish around here

sp_BlitzErik

cigarette ads

beer ads

a guy in enumclaw found a particularly bad use for them

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@TomV Watching cute women fall off of them as they compete to jump over the highest and longest obstacles?

or maybe I just like to watch people fall off of things and eat dirt...

otherwise known as airport people watching

@EvanCarroll Good luck with that... it's not really going to work, but how you choose to waste your time is your decision!

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft I had horse in Italy once.

When I first came to Europe (and went home via Kyoto), I had sausages in Germany, snails in France, pasta in Italy, Sushi in Japan and mushy peas in England.

I've kangaroo and croc before as well.

Barbecued crocodile with beer marinade.

Simon Righarts

Both of those last two in Australia, I assume?

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

New Zealand - at one point Big Fresh had them.

sp_BlitzErik

2:35 PM

ya'll are making me hungry

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

They also had water buffalo but I didn't get any of that.

I also tried Mutton Bird once, but it's really nasty.

Tom V

@ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells Grilled moose isn't bad either

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

@TomV Much like venison, I guess.

dezso

@sp_BlitzErik no, they did not. That I find even more curious.

Tom V

@ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells No moose was much better

Sweeter also, so if you don't like that you may prefer venison

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

2:40 PM

@TomV I can find elk here, but I had the impression that an elk wasn't the same species as a moose.

yorkshiredalesmeat.co.uk/products/exotic-meats-game

Tom V

@ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells I think that's what I had, european moose :)

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

@TomV Ok.

Tom V

or european elk

In Oslo

ConcernedOfTunbridgeWells

I might order some and try it here maybe.

Many years ago, my folks raised angora goats. We used to have a surfeit of G4 (half angora) bucks, which we ate one year. There was once a conversation that went:
*Sister (aged 7):* What's for dinner?
*Me (aged 14):* Babbles.

She works as a programme manager on telco infrastructure projects now. I think I scarred her for life.

Simon Righarts

Something tells me that probably wasn't the only time you traumatised her like that :p

hot2use

2:55 PM

@PaulWhite But why ...The 'best' list according to a few people was... Is it no longer the 'best' list?

Paul White

@hot2use No significance. I was writing about a past event, so used a past tense.

hot2use

3:56 PM

okey dokey

sp_BlitzErik

@PaulWhite but why were you tense

Paul White

@sp_BlitzErik Because of links to poor Stack Overflow answers in comments

sp_BlitzErik

@PaulWhite did i do that?

Paul White

@sp_BlitzErik No

Well, you might have, but if you have I haven't noticed (yet)

sp_BlitzErik

you'll have to review all my comments thoroughly

Paul White

4:03 PM

Busy destroying spammers will add context in a moment

sp_BlitzErik

happy friday!

hot2use

@PaulWhite Did I do it?

Paul White

Yes!

sp_BlitzErik

10 demerits

hot2use

:-(

EXCEPT?

Paul White

4:05 PM

Stackoverflow : Error when using except in a query — hot2use 1 hour ago

To be fair all answers on SO are terrible

sp_BlitzErik

hard to believe how much infrastructure is written on code from there

Paul White

It's amazing humanity has lasted so long

sp_BlitzErik

if i == 2 return 4;

hot2use

@PaulWhite I'll go home and be ashamed of myself

Paul White

Well let this be a lesson to you :)

Spammers nuked. Less tense now.

hot2use

4:07 PM

for about the duration it takes to open a bottle of Brooklyn Beer.

ypercubeᵀᴹ

@PaulWhite Emulating EXCEPT ALL in MySQL would be a real challenge.

Probably in SQL Server, too.

Paul White

Remind me what the tricky aspect would be?

ypercubeᵀᴹ

If there are 3 identical rows in a and 1 in b, except all b would have to return 2 of them.

I don't think I have even seen it used. Neither I can imagine a use of it.

Paul White

Ah true! Thank you that's the bit I always forget

Do you happen to know if Postgres implemented it that way?

ypercubeᵀᴹ

Yes, I just tested in Postgres

Paul White

4:10 PM

> EXCEPT returns all rows that are in the result of query1 but not in the result of query2. (This is sometimes called the difference between two queries.) Again, duplicates are eliminated unless EXCEPT ALL is used.

That's pretty much all the documentation has to say, as far as Google will tell me.

Evan Carroll

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft why won't it work?

;)

WHERE THERE IS A WILL. THERE IS A WAY.

Paul White

yesterday, by Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@EvanCarroll Everything we do as a company, everything, is just to piss off @EvanCarroll

@ypercubeᵀᴹ On dbfiddle? I'd like to see the plan for that.

Assuming it's interesting.

Evan Carroll

@dezso yea that guy was kinda being a d-bag

sp_BlitzErik

iirc itzik had a workaround with row number for sql server

for except all et al

Paul White

Rings a bell

@sp_BlitzErik itprotoday.com/software-development/set-operations?

Evan Carroll

4:17 PM

The workarounds for not having row number are awesome

I asked a question on here a while ago

(tremendously downvoted)

-4

Q: How can I generate a row_number without using a window function?

In PostgreSQL, how do you generate a row number, WITHOUT a Window Function (like row_number()) WITHOUT a Temp Table Only using a single SELECT Here is some sample data to play with, CREATE TEMP TABLE foo AS SELECT * FROM ( VALUES ('wgates', 'Gates', 'William' ), ('wgrant', 'Grant', 'Wal...

sql postgresql

sp_BlitzErik

well i'm not clicking that

looks like bad luck

Paul White

Are you soliciting delete votes?

sp_BlitzErik

@PaulWhite could be, i don't recall it being on a ms site though

Evan Carroll

Love em'. I'm secretly trying to amass the most negative votes without getting banned. All my good contributions are an illusion.

Paul White

@sp_BlitzErik I'm pretty sure he's written more than once about it.

sp_BlitzErik

4:20 PM

might even be in a book

Paul White

Almost certainly

ypercubeᵀᴹ

@PaulWhite not really: dbfiddle.uk/…

"HashSetOp Except All"

sp_BlitzErik

to this day operator names in cursor plans still surprise me

POPULATION QUERY WHAT THE

scroll cursor -_-

Paul White

@ypercubeᵀᴹ HashSetOp is mildly interesting.

@sp_BlitzErik Populating the hidden table backing the cursor. U no speakada inglish?

That paged explain plan thing is a bit nifty

sp_BlitzErik

@PaulWhite i speak proper english and don't cursor at my server

Paul White

4:25 PM

Well played

sp_BlitzErik

i want to start naming tables after weird query plan operators

Table Scan Constant Scan

Paul White

I always thought Constant Scan was an implied criticism of the dba's inability to use indexes effectively

sp_BlitzErik

or write a sensible where clause

0

Q: Which all application/SQL agent jobs or any other process executes a SP

I am trying to get info on one of the table for which all process inserts the data into it and came to know there is this SP " sp_abc". Now how can i get the information on which all processes or application executes this SP to insert data into that table? Please suggest

sql-server sql-server-2008-r2

the meek shall inherit the database

Paul White

wtaf

sp_BlitzErik

4:44 PM

anyone else finding that creating indexes is taking a lot longer since the whole spectre/meltdown thing?

Paul White

Performance testing is now a complete nightmare

sp_BlitzErik

you have to redo like a decade of demos ;)

Paul White

And so now to compare performance we need the same version, configuration, and bios!

Zane

@sp_BlitzErik nah. We are still vulnerable. I set the wheels in motion for that day one so they'll probably get here in a few months.

sp_BlitzErik

@Zane hopefully the downloads won't be blocked, eh?

Zane

4:53 PM

ha!

Don't scare me like that man. It wouldn't be surprising.

sp_BlitzErik

i'm just preparing you for a future ruled by people whose only coding skill is powershell

Paul White

Ever since I patched for those vulns, every oddity or perceived slowdown is blamed on that

Zane

I actually just got forwarded a great gig opportunity but it was still in this company so I'd be stuck with the same BS policy. So instead of taking it I'm going to look elsewhere.

@sp_BlitzErik ha! You wish I can't run powershell without written permission to log onto the box to run said powershell.

sp_BlitzErik

@Zane DUMMY take the new position and raise first, then interview with new money

Paul White

Isn't it a thing in the US now that interviewers can't ask about current terms & salary?

sp_BlitzErik

4:58 PM

i've always been asked current salary

but who knows

Paul White

Maybe that's just California or something

I thought I read a recent-ish news thing about it

But who can keep up

sp_BlitzErik

wouldn't surprise me in california

they probably just ask your current rent

Paul White

right

sp_BlitzErik

and base salary on that

Paul White

I guess people will always find a proxy

Zane

4:59 PM

@PaulWhite Seems to be. I tended to move up based on my previous salary as opposed to my skill level.

Paul White

"So, what sort of fine art have you been buying recently?"

sp_BlitzErik

"what's your favorite flavor of sorbet a the savoy?"

ohyoudonthaveone

thanks for coming in!

Paul White

heh heh heh

Zane

Erm I misread that comment and so my comment makes no sense.

Paul White

That's ok.

The love is unconditional in here.

Zane

5:09 PM

If we'd punished folks for misreading, poor grammar, or spelling I'd have been out of here ages ago.

Paul White

It'd be a ghost town

Cue Erik

sp_BlitzErik

@PaulWhite too much fighting on the dance floor

Paul White

tada!

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@PaulWhite Yeah it's a California only tihng

Other Kalifornia only things: 1) You don't have to tell people you gave them AIDS 2) Using the wrong pronoun for a person will get you fined/jail time 3) They use more tax money to pay for subsidizes for illegals than citizens

4) shopping bags will cost you $0.10 each at the store at checkout if you didn't bring your own

ypercubeᵀᴹ

5:27 PM

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft that's also in many countries in Europe. For plastic bags (I suppose it's the same in cali?)

0.05 pounds in UK, 0.04 euros in Greece for example.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

thta's good to know! I didn't get hit with any in Germany, Luxembourg, France, or Ireland... that I know of...

LOL I got an email from someone and their official designation has, "Storage, Things, and Connectivity" in it

Forrest

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft I wonder if that's more virtue signalling or pigouvian taxation

ypercubeᵀᴹ

England started in October 2015, Scotland earlier. Greece only this January.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@Forrest The money goes into a "General" tax fund... so it's just a money scheme.

under the guise of "saving the planet"

@ypercubeᵀᴹ You get around!

ypercubeᵀᴹ

it's supposedly to lower plastic use. According to official stats, it helps

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

5:31 PM

@ypercubeᵀᴹ Who writes those stats, again?

ypercubeᵀᴹ

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft I am from Greece, moved to UK a few years ago.

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft I'm sure many people reuse the bags, even if it's just 5p per bag. How good that is for the environment, no idea.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@ypercubeᵀᴹ Just call me Winston Smith ;)

@sp_BlitzErik Shoulder day... I can feel my rotator cuff crying already.

sp_BlitzErik

5:48 PM

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft just keep your abs tight bro

Tom V

6:09 PM

@Zane we'd only have @AndriyM left

@ypercubeᵀᴹ in Belgium a lot of shops pay the tax and don't charge the customer as some kind of service

Andriy M

@TomV I've misread questions or answers countless times, so...

Thanks for thinking so well of me, though

hot2use

Tom V

But I have never seen you misspelling anything

@hot2use those are pretty decent

I discovered those in a bar on a corner not to far from where the twin towers used to be and have ordered it the rest of my stay in nyc

Then again anything beats Heineken

hot2use

@TomV even water beats Heineken

@TomV Yes they are pretty decent

Andriy M

6:30 PM

@TomV I think I have something close to misspellophobia, or whatever is the proper name for it.

4

ypercubeᵀᴹ

Anal retentiveness

The term anal retentive (also anally retentive), often abbreviated to anal, is used to describe a person who pays such attention to detail that it becomes an obsession and may be an annoyance to others, potentially to the detriment of the anal-retentive person. The term derives from Freudian psychoanalysis. == Origins == In Freudian psychology, the anal stage is said to follow the oral stage of infant or early-childhood development. This is a time when an infant's attention moves from oral stimulation to anal stimulation (usually the bowels but occasionally the bladder), usually synchronous with...

;)

Tom V

6:44 PM

@ypercubeᵀᴹ remarkable isn't in any way the same as an annoyance

Admiration even

Lamak

Thanks a Million, Jon Skeet!

Julia Silge & Nick Larsen on January 15, 2018

Yesterday, Jon Skeet’s reputation on Stack Overflow passed 1,000,000. ONE MILLION. Those of you who are highly engaged with the Stack Overflow community probably have a general idea of a) who Jon Skeet is and b) exactly how amazing and ridiculous this statement is, but just to make sure we are all on the same page, let’s dig a little deeper. For starters, how many answers has Jon Skeet posted on Stack Overflow? Let’s look at Jon, together with the other 100 folks who have the highest reputation on our site. …

2

Tom V

I wish I was as good at English grammar and spelling

sp_BlitzErik

64gb of ram in the laptop, let's see you ruin my demos now

little bugger

Zane

7:10 PM

@TomV Seth was usually the person addressing my spelling and @Lamak in spite of his nation of origin still tends to correct my grammar. lol

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik I have 64 and now I run out of CPU :(

Zane

@sp_BlitzErik good grief I thought 32 in my PC was a bit much.

sp_BlitzErik

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft different components, dontchaknow

@Zane for what? zelda?

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

Trying to do demo's with 2 DC's, a router, appliances, and 8 SQL Servers using AG makes my laptop smoke

Zane

@sp_BlitzErik erm. Well two things. SSIS testing and there was a sale so the RAM was cheap.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

7:12 PM

on the flip side, it's easy to create perf problems

sp_BlitzErik

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft it does that in real life, too ;)

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

LOL

sp_BlitzErik

@Zane i keep hearing about this ssis thing

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

Sadly if my laptop is the same performance as your server... there's a problem

although...

I put the 1TB 960 nvme in and I can say...

sp_BlitzErik

we've had so many clients where i have to show them my laptop specs to put things in perspective

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

7:14 PM

I beat customer's "enterprise grade" solutions

Zane

@sp_BlitzErik It used to be my jam when I got hired out of my low tier sweatshop job and into an ETL position here.

sp_BlitzErik

it's always some vm admin's fault

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

Dear people, SAN's aren't magic and aren't generally for performance

6

@sp_BlitzErik If it isn't the network

sp_BlitzErik

WHAT DO YOU MEAN 1GB ISCSI ISN'T FAST ENOUGH

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik ESPECIALLY BECAUSE WE DONT SEGREGATE TRAFFIC AND USE IT FOR NORMAL COMMUNICATIONS TOO

WHY DO I NEED DOUBLE INFRASTRUCTURE?!

Zane

7:15 PM

@SeanGallardy-Microsoft Honestly I'm surprised by the industries adoption of SAN's in general. It's another layer of abstraction to cause additional troubles for companies.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

alright, bbl... I'm oddly b*tchy today

sp_BlitzErik

"stop comparing my hardware to a usb drive"

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@Zane They do it because of admin ease

Zane

I'm not saying SAN's are inherently bad but it's another human layer of interaction/infighting to solve a problem.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

@sp_BlitzErik Stop having hardware slower than a 1.44 " floppy

Andriy M

7:16 PM

@ypercubeᵀᴹ Curiously, it probably became more OCD-like for me when I became conscious of it.

Sean Gallardy - Microsoft

alright brb

Zane

Not to mention the cabling between a SAN and a database server can be a really difficult problem to analyze.

sp_BlitzErik

@Zane eh just make people copy a 1gb file and time it

Zane

@sp_BlitzErik We ended up tracking it down two ways. First I measured what SQL server was giving us for latency matching it to Windows latency and proving that SAN latency was lower. However those numbers were hard to match since the SAN team wouldn't give us Read only access to their monitoring tools for us.

sp_BlitzErik

san teams and vm teams are usually so difficult

Zane

7:24 PM

The second way was I remembered a Presentation David Klee gave me in Minneapolis a few years ago where he ran into that problem. Which is why I had asked for multiple connections in the first place.

Turns out they had wired them all up but stopped short of connecting them since they assumed we wouldn't need the bandwidth.

lol

sp_BlitzErik

-_-

Forrest

7:38 PM

@sp_BlitzErik I track our index rebuilds, so I ran an analysis on durations pre/post patch. Too high of variance to say much, but it doesn't look like a significant change.

sp_BlitzErik

how long do they take?

Forrest

Looking at everything above 50ms, average is 5% longer, standard deviation is 40%

sp_BlitzErik

interesting

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