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12:33 AM
Is it too early for jokes about this?
 
jww
12:57 AM
Hi Everyone. I'm not sure if I have missed a previous question during search. If someone could point out a dup I would be appreciative... I'm looking for Q&As on civilization and slaves. Can a civilization move from hunter/gatherers into a modern age like industrial without slavery of some form?
The reason I ask is, I'm having trouble reconciling slavery and its prodigious use throughout Earth history, and some of the positions of some of the great philosophers, like Aristotle and Thomas Aquinas.
It would really bother me to learn that economic models say slavery must exist to push through some barriers. It is kind of a touchy subject and I don't want to ask on the main site.
 
1:26 AM
@JohnLocke We already had some
 
1:58 AM
Where will the hunchback live? ...Unless Andy was right and the hunchback did it.
 
 
11 hours later…
12:30 PM
@jww I don't know how you can get highly coordinated efforts requiring large numbers of people without some form of slavery.
Invariably, there's some component of a great labor that requires grunt work that no one, given the choice, would do.
 
@James I really really hope the rose window survives.
 
12:53 PM
@Green Okay Mr. Wallace.
 
@Gryphon The north one was destroyed, but the other two did, I hear.
 
@Green I mean, most of the great cathedrals in Europe were built without slaves, if I recall my history correctly.
@Hosch250 That's good, they're some of the most beautiful artwork in the place.
 
Because people voluntarily gave the work as a donation to God. That only goes so far (picking cotton year after year isn't a service to God...).
 
@Hosch250 Yeah, but in terms of great labors, those kind of multi-generation projects are pretty impressive. Probably man-hours in the same order of magnitude as the Great Pyramid, and without a single slave.
@JohnLocke I'm gonna go with "Yes, but we'll joke about it anyway because we're terrible people."
 
Joking is a coping mechanism, maybe it means we're all traumatized by it :P
 
1:08 PM
@Gryphon Well, it isn't the worst thing to be
 
1:36 PM
0
Q: Accepted answer is a mix of given answers

HalhexI am new on this site, I asked this question about the logistics of corpse disposal for inspiration on a short story I'm working on. After reading the answers I decided on my own version which involves the mix of both ideas presented in this answer as well as some personal ideas which are not tal...

 
 
1 hour later…
2:48 PM
@Green Historically accurate...but it could probably have been done otherwise. It would have just taken more time and/or more money.
 
@JohnLocke Yes, but it is it the terriblest thing to be?
 
@NexTerren Its too early for you and your...chicanery.
 
@James It's too early for a lot of things. I had to come in an hour early today. The humanity.
 
3:08 PM
@NexTerren It is probably humanity's fault...good call.
 
4:03 PM
@James Humanity can be assigned the blame for a large portion of the problems people face on a general basis.
 
4:18 PM
 
4:30 PM
@NexTerren You're in this chatroom. I'm gonna go with "yes" from that information alone.
 
@Gryphon Fair point.
 
@Gryphon Seems legit.
 
@NexTerren Having read the actual linked post, I'm gonna go with "yes, but I can't stop laughing".
 
@Gryphon Glad to be of service.
 
Don't you mean, "Glad to be of helpfulness"?
 
4:33 PM
@Gryphon You pickpocketed the words right out my mouth.
 
@NexTerren This conversation is making me laugh out noisily.
 
5:08 PM
I possibly would have gone with "don't get your pretzels in a twist", but not for any good reason, and it probably would have been poorer over all for it.
Speaking of poorer over all, did you get my character file?
 
@AndyD273 I like that
@AndyD273 I did but I can neither access personal email at work, or run Chummer at work...
 
Was not expecting anything else, just wanted to make sure it got to you.
 
@AndyD273 I did! And I bet you did a fine job. :)
Although if you're looking for feedback, anything specific, or just "give it a once over?"
 
I'm equally sure I missed a lot of stuff... Mostly give it a once over, looking for stuff I didn't think to do, like "hey, your character might want some shoes."
"You decide to walk to work... and you rolled a 1... you stepped on a nail... you rolled a 1 again... and you have blood poisoning and died."
4
 
You do have to buy clothes, but clothes come as a complete set.
 
5:24 PM
@dot_Sp0T Hey, people are taking note like you hoped. Now England is looking into the state of Westminster Abbey and other buildings.
 
@AndyD273 This sounds like my kind of luck.
 
New England might have some they should look at, but US buildings are, as a general rule, way, way newer, and with the yearly fires out west, most of them are pretty fire-proof anyway, if they lasted this long.
Many places out there only allow you to build with brick because of the fire issue.
 
@Hosch250 We don't really have any buildings more than 300ish years old in Canada either. As opposed to Europe, where there's a building over five centuries old in every other town.
 
Yeah, it's called the New World for a reason.
 
@NexTerren I did think to include some clothes. So that's good at least.
 
5:31 PM
@Hosch250 One of the few reasons I'm jealous of Europe is the architecture.
 
Yeah, other than history and old-style architecture, though, the US has everything I like. Less restrictions on normal people, and lots and lots of good hiking land--especially out west.
 
5:47 PM
@Hosch250 Mr. Musk told me that's Mars.
@AndyD273 Jeff (Pooky) is telling me about his cyborg character. I'm just gleefully listing out all the components I get to hack...
 
@Hosch250 Not to mention low taxes.
 
@NexTerren So you're saying I should put a couple points into decker, just to get a little protection?
 
@Gryphon You say this, but... Bernie 2020.
Haha, it's whatever you guys want to do. I will mess with you if you leave me an opening, but I don't want you guys to run characters you don't want to do. :)

But being a decker is both a skill point and $ investment (to get a good deck).
 
@NexTerren If Bernie gets the nomination, Trump has a good chance of winning again.
 
I think all of you are capable of being a decker if you wanted to, you'd just have to be willing to read/study rules more than you would otherwise.
 
5:51 PM
I mostly just want the ability to avoid getting hacked
 
@Gryphon Statistically, Trump has a good chance of winning simply because he's the incumbent. Obama: 2 terms. W: 2 terms. Bill: 2 terms. Bush Sr, one term, but Reagan 2 terms.
If a big part of winning a political race is just getting your name out there, and people familiar with your name... being the president of the United States helps to that end.
 
Trump has a good chance of winning because the regressive left have drunk their own cool-aid and don't realize that only a very tiny minority want socialism...
 
@NexTerren That's a bit simplistic. But even on a more detailed analysis, he's got a fairly good chance. He does have to keep Florida, but if he does that, he's got a great chance.
 
@AndyD273 Kool-aid. This is important. :(
 
You spell it with a C if it has cyanide in it.
 
5:54 PM
@Gryphon 100% simplicitic, although I meant to be clear I was focusing on just the one aspect (which, I did imply and will stand by, has a strong effect on the outcome)
@AndyD273 Shoot. I can't argue with that.
 
@AndyD273 I'm pretty sure that at this point they're drinking whiskey laced with meth, heroin, and cocaine.
 
That would explain a lot
I am kinda enjoying the show when Trump announces that he has decided to just give them what they want, aka, lots of refugees.
 
@NexTerren That is fair. And yes, incumbency is a fairly major bonus for presidential candidates.
@AndyD273 That would explain a large portion of the stuff AOC has been spouting, yes.
 
@NexTerren Mars. Earth's personal graveyard for uppity billionaires.
 
@Gryphon Her and her clique are just a couple kids with no life experience. No meth needed for that... Also, two uppers and a downer?
 
6:01 PM
"Delving through dungeons.

Party wiped!? How did we fail??

Clerical error."
 
@NexTerren That is horrifying. Very horrifying.
@AndyD273 Which is why it worries me when she gets called things like the "fresh new face of the Democratic party". In regards to that beverage, I just sorta stuck in everything I thought of in a two-second period.
 
@Gryphon Forgot the kitchen sink.
 
@NexTerren I meant every intoxicant. Also, if you can fit a kitchen sink in your drinks, I want to know where you get your cups from.
 
@Gryphon does it blend?
 
@AndyD273 Does what blend?
Also, my last message looks very odd out of context on the starboard.
 
6:11 PM
@Gryphon The sink. You won't need as big of a glass if you can reduce it to powder.
 
@AndyD273 That's true. Although if it's a normal-sized sink, that's still going to be a pretty big glass.
 
I dunno, I generally avoid drinking stainless steel and/or ceramic...just a general rule I have.
 
@Gryphon I think she's a symptom of a deeper sickness. Was watching Tim Pool the other day, and he said something like "historically the role of democrats has been to push the country forward, and the role of republicans has been to keep them from going off of a cliff. The problem is that conservative and moderate voices have been censored and silenced, and all that are left are the fringe wackos with the gas to the floor and the cliff coming up fast."
@James Good source of iron
 
@Hosch250 still sad that it always takes something going wrong first?
 
@NexTerren Bahahaha.
 
6:17 PM
@James :)
 
@dot_Sp0T Yeah, it's still a pity. It sounds like it was close to taking the stone roof down too, that caught the wooden roof when it fell.
If that had happened, the whole thing probably would have collapsed.
 
We're definitely seeing a push on both (all?) sides of the aisle towards the extremes, which is frustrating, because I suspect most people in the US fall somewhere in the middle, rather than on the edges.
 
Because that would've taken the buttresses down and pulverized the floor where it hit.
@HDE226868 Agree. It's sad, because at the end of the day, they'll just turn themselves into casualty lists if anyone pushes too far.
And probably all the moderates too.
 
@Gryphon Maybe it would be out of place on some other site's starboard, but this is Worldbuilding. Nothing is out of place because everything is out of place.
 
@Hosch250 I guess I subscribe to the exhausted majority theory. I suspect I lie near one end of that (not a centrist/moderate, but not a winger, either).
 
6:31 PM
@HDE226868 Ah, you beat me to it
 
I'm in politically disengaged, but if pushed to engage, I'm a moderate conservative.
 
@HDE226868 We have stupid in stereo.
2
Has anyone been keeping up on Butteigig? However you spell it?
He seems sane and fairly centrist...so far as I can tell thus far.
 
@James I wonder who the subwoofers would be. Libertarians? (that's a shot in the dark)
 
@HDE226868 Accelerationist collapsitarian.
 
Gotta step out. Big work meeting going on.
 
6:37 PM
@AndyD273 I can't remember, I think I was in the Passive Liberals group...or was I a Moderate...I forget.
 
@James I've been following him a little. I like his policies, for the most part, and he seems like a good human being. I wonder if he could garner some significant centrist votes in 2020.
 
Worldbuilders. I have a chatroom question for you that would be closed as "primarily opinion based."
 
@NexTerren Are you looking for an engraved invitation? Spit it out :)
 
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/what-does-pete-buttigieg-believe-where-the-candidate-stands-on-7-issues

Is this a reasonable take/overview on his political views? If so, does he really seem like a centralist to you?
@AndyD273 Assuming today's dollar value of the USD, I'm trying to put a price on a cloned body, with the market demand of being able to insert your mind into the body. How the technology works is entirely up to me. I want them to be restrictive, those in poverty or near poverty not able to afford them. My gut says that "the price to raise a child to 18" would be a good starting point.
As I said, primarily opinion based, would be closed on the main site. :P
To clarify, if you could keep buying bodies this effectively could leave you immortal. That's the value of the technology.
 
@NexTerren Might not be all that opinion based. Given mature artificial womb tech, growth acceleration, etc, you could probably estimate a cost, then give it a markup. If you just want the price of raising a human child to 18 in the US, that has been studied, and the number is ~$230k.
 
6:51 PM
@AndyD273 Do you think that price would be enough where most US citizens wouldn't be able to buy a replacement body?
 
@NexTerren Might be a bit low, given retirement plans and social security. If you took the balance of your 401k at 65 you'd probably have enough to buy a new body. Just repeat every 50 years or so, the downside being that retiring probably be out of reach for at least 3 or 4 cycles, and you'd probably have to go back to work after a few decades...
I guess the real question is, how much is "most"?
 
Come to think of it, you're probably right in making this non-opinion based, and I wouldn't even have to make the question long.

"This question has the assumption that there exists a technology exists that can provide a person a new, 18-year-old body, effectively allowing immortality if the individual's brain can be recovered. What cost, in USD, for the body would stop most of the middle class (>60%) from being able to make use of this technology?"
Thoughts before I post it?
 
Maybe just include that social security and retirement plans should be taken into account when trying to get that 65%
 
@AndyD273 Okay, fair point.
 
Oh, and life insurance. If I get a $1,000,000 policy and get hit by a car, can my widow take my brain and the insurance payout and have me resurrected?
 
7:02 PM
@AndyD273 This is a good addition
 
@AndyD273 I'd. I'd actually kind of imagine so. If my car is wrecked, insurance gives me new money for a car.
If I intentionally wrecked it for insurance money, I don't get the money and I might go to jail. Same principles would probably carry over.
 
Actually... if say life insurance stops being a thing, or they refuse to pay because you aren't permanently dead, that would exclude a lot of people who die prematurely. I might be able to work 30-40 years and save up $1,000,000 and be able to afford a new body. But if I die early there might not be enough money to make it happen, which would go a ways toward reaching 65%.
Combine that with low skill workers, liberal arts majors, and other people who don't get retirement plans, and 65% is probably pretty easy.
 
7:18 PM
@AndyD273 Knowing what I know about the insurance industry I can virtually guarantee that companies would end up creating a new form of insurance for replacement bodies. We have Life, Health, Dental, Death, Pregnancy, Pet, Electronics and freaking vacation insurance after all...
Life insurance would probably actually get cheaper...since...you know people are less likely to cash in.
Well...so long as it was bundled with new body insurance
@AndyD273 I struggle with answering this question:
Which statement do you agree with more?

People are largely responsible for their own outcomes in life

People’s outcomes in life are determined largely by forces outside of their control
 
@James or life insurance would actually insure your life (instead of your death), with the idea that you'd get a policy when you're young, and continue to pay them money for the next several centuries...
@James Probably one of those questions you're not supposed to overthink too much. Do you think that people can get ahead if they make wise choices and work hard, or is the driving factor fate and luck?
 
I'm not who you asked, but if I can offer my opinion, I think the question is too simplified.

Even keeping it decently simplified, I'd say "forces outside your control" create both opportunities and obstacles. Some opportunities are basically dumped in your lap, some obstacles are too great to realistically overcome. The individual is tasked with making use of opportunities and attempting to overcome obstacles.
 
As a conservative I'd say that, as a general rule, historically in the US people who work hard tend do get ahead.
 
@AndyD273 Yeah see, I have a philosophy degree...I don't do black and white.
 
If I have two interlocked gears on a machine, which one is more largely responsible for the machine working?

I wouldn't be able to answer that, "Oh, gear A is 60% responsible and gear B is 40%."
 
7:25 PM
:D
 
@James Right. I don't have a philosophy degree, and I'd overthink it too.
 
Well I just re-took the quiz, I came out as a Traditional Liberal...I can relate to parts of the description...others meh...
 
@James Is this the political compass quiz?
 
@NexTerren Yeah.
 
@James have you heard much on Yang? This interview was interesting. I don't agree with all that he said, but I can respect him for being willing to discuss it
 
7:29 PM
Go take it, its quick. I am curious wehre ou land.
 
"These days it seems the rights of Black Lives Matter protestors and activists are more protected than the rights of the police."

I feel like there's an implied bit behind this question, and I don't like the implication.
I assume they are saying "Boo protesters, go cops" - Right, "Boo cops, go protesters" - Left. I assume they are not addressing what rights a civilian might have/should have vs the rights a police officer might have/should have.
I feel like this is a bad question...
Or this is... requesting a binary response to an easily non-binary question.
"Which do you agree with more?

The American government is mostly rigged to serve the rich and influential

The American government mostly reflects the will of the American people"
It assumes that the only two conditions are an accurate representation or one manipulated by the rich.
 
I think they just don't want each answer to be an essay, because it would be hard to turn that into raw data
 
I feel like several of these questions fall in the spirit of the old, "Did you cheat on your wife this week or last week?" without offering "no, I didn't cheat on my wife" as an option.
(Paraphrasing, don't remember exactly how that quesiton goes)
 
"are you still beating your wife?"
 
@AndyD273 Which one?
^ usually stumps them, and works great for a single guy like me :P
 
7:38 PM
@AndyD273 Right, that's the one.
It says I'm a "Moderate."
 
I think the fact that those questions aren't immediate answer says that you aren't on one of the far wings.
 
Although, again, I'm not a fan of the quiz.
 
TBF, they should've made it a sliding choice weighted both ways.
XKCD should do something like this.
A mass-voting on various topics, clean the data up, and show where people are.
 
I mean, take the "Which do you agree with more."

Say that someone (and... there are certainly those with these views) think that "vocal ___s have swayed politics," not assigning it to the rich, and they also don't think politics are accurate of the will of the people.

Which one of the statements do they agree with more, if the don't agree with *either?*
"Do you spend more of your time supporting Nazis, Soviets, or the American Cheese foundation?"

I cannot answer the question, because it's a bad question.
 
@NexTerren I spend the least amount of time opposing the AC foundation, therefore I spend more of time supporting it, LOL.
 
7:43 PM
Sorry, I'm ranting, but it bugs me that this is (I assume) trying to actually gage the responder but the questions are so obviously bad.
 
I like cheese!
I hate Nazies and Commies... So Cheese wins!
2
 
@AndyD273 Cheese is delicious, but my time supporting the American Cheese Foundation, Nazis, and Soviets all tie for 0. I cannot, with a radio-button question, in good faith select any of the three.
 
@AndyD273 If were a Wisconsinite, I'd be duty bound as a Minnesotan to flag you :P
 
I'd have to answer, like you did, "I'm going to intentionally lie in response to this question, and reask myself 'which do you support more?'" The more I have to mutilate the question in my head, the worse of a quesiton it is.
 
(Just kidding, I like Wisconsinites more than Minnesotans.)
 
7:48 PM
@NexTerren Sure, but if you were one of the far left then it would be an immediate "the rich are immoral". Answering some one way, some the other makes someone a moderate. I have no experience in scientific survey making, and my opinion is invalid.
 
 
3 hours later…
10:21 PM
@AndyD273 that probably was more true in the past than it is today -- we're seeing some pretty nasty effects re: polarization-of-the-job-market (through subcontracting, misclassification, part-time abuse, and the likes). I personally would rather it was more true in some ways, although the other half of that is the lack of credit given to caregiving situations as well...
@NexTerren I think you are spot-on that the question's premise is faulty -- it's assuming that the police are operating from a top-down, authoritarian model, if you will. If you assume that the rights of the police flow from the rights of the people in a more Peelian fashion, (which is I think how it should be), then the question is rather....moot.
 

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