The Frying Pan

Jefromi

00:10

oops we all missed it

Phrancis

You did :)

Cerberus

01:39

@Phrancis Hey that looks like pea soup?

Happy New Year!

Phrancis

01:56

@Cerberus It is!

Cerberus

I like pea soup!

With sausage and good stuff?

A very traditional Dutch winter dish, erwtensoep.

rumtscho

03:02

happy new year everybody

Jolenealaska

08:19

Happy New Year! Ours turns in 41 minutes.

Jolenealaska

08:38

Is this done my someone here?

chefsteps.com

Cerberus

09:08

Happy New Year!

Oops I was 9 minutes late.

Wow, you're ten hours behind.

A lot could have happened in that time!

Jolenealaska

Hi Cerby! Fireworks are still going nuts

They'll keep it up for another half an hour, then it'll slow down to just often enough that people who want to sleep, can't.

shit.

0

Q: I left a fully cooked honeybaked ham out overnight, and i am planning on making it into soup-is that ok?

I plan to make soup out of fully cured ham that was left out overnight-since it will cook another two hours, should it be safe to eat ?

food-safety

Cerberus

@Jolenealaska Haha it was the same here.

Are the fireworks nice?

This is the first time I have actually watched the fireworks outside in the city.

Jolenealaska

8 hours old dangerous misinformation

Cerberus

I used to got o my parents' house, and last year I was in the city but inside.

Jolenealaska

I'm not watching them, but I've seen some pretty impressive flashes through the curtains.

Cerberus

09:20

@Jolenealaska So what's dangerous about it?

Jolenealaska

left out overnight means room temperature to me.

Cured or not, that's dangerous and boiling doesn't make it safe/

It's one of those things..I'd eat it, I'd but I wouldn't serve it. Especially not to kids.

Cerberus

Why doesn't boiling make it safe?

Jolenealaska

Because boiling does not eliminate toxins or stores already produced by dangerous bacteria.

Cerberus

I once had a large pan of Bolognese (or ragù, as they say in Italy) from my aunt that I kept on the stove for a week. I reheated it every other day to kill the bacteria and ate from it every day.

@Jolenealaska But those toxins should be negligible after a night?

Jolenealaska

It only kills the bacteria itself. A lot of people do that...most don't get sick from it.

Cerberus

09:27

Overnight means 10 hours to me.

Jolenealaska

probably. Like I said, I'd do it. But a restaurant would be shut down.

Cerberus

I have never in my life had anything turn bad left on the stove for 24 hours or less (maybe except when it was very hot, like over 25 degrees, but then of course one would deal with all food things differently).

Restaurants may be shut down when they violate norms that exceed what is actually dangerous by a large factor...

In a restaurant, as a chef, I would feel I might not be 100% in control of everything, so I would want cast-iron discipline with certain things.

On a restaurant scale, consistent rules become more important.

Jolenealaska

That particular issue has been done to death here, I went against the "official guidelines" when it was a cured ham in the danger zone for 3 hours. That is as far I will go for making the recommendation.

Cerberus

Hehe.

Jolenealaska

I'm violating today in a big way.

Cerberus

09:31

I have learned not to partake in any discussions about spoiling and danger on this website...

I just think being too cautious in advising people makes them disbelieve you and mistrust the rules. I know it works that way for me, even with medicines.

@Jolenealaska You minx! What are you doing?

Jolenealaska

My second steak is still in the sous-vide, I didn't realize I had shut it off. I'm not even boiling it, I'm bringing it back up to med rare, then searing it.

Cerberus

How long has it been turned off?

Jolenealaska

Big time violations of safety rules, but I'm only serving myself.

Cerberus

I knew this was going to be something about sous-vide...

Jolenealaska

It's been in the gradually cooling off water for about 24 hours

Cerberus

09:34

I have to say I would be extremely cautious when sous-viding myself, because I have no experience with it and I cannot monitor what's happening properly. It is like a black box to me.

Jolenealaska

I know enough to know that what I am doing is high risk.

Cerberus

@Jolenealaska Raw meat, gently warmed for a long period of time, but not long enough, then slowly cooled down. What is this, a conspiracy to make me warn you against dangerous food behaviour??

@Jolenealaska If you think you know enough, I will not judge you. I have no experience.

Jolenealaska

It's not raw, it's rare...and in going to sear it. And it is heavily salted.

Cerberus

Rare is semi-raw, right? In that the bacteria haven't been killed yet?

Jolenealaska

So, if someone asked be if it was safe, I'd tell them, Hell No!"

Cerberus

09:38

Heh.

Jolenealaska

yes, so riskier in ground beef than in steak.

Cerberus

Yeah.

But still, if you cook half of the meat...

shakes heads

And are you sure the meat wasn't glued?

Jolenealaska

My inability to type tonight is pissing me off.

Cerberus

Your fingers won't coöperate?

Jolenealaska

I cut one big steak into two, and bagged them separately

Cerberus

09:41

I mean, some supermarkets glue bits of meat together to make steaks. But I presume you got good meat.

Jolenealaska

Yep, and it's getting f**ing frustrating.

Cerberus

Have you ever tried voice input?

Jolenealaska

I have not, it's on my list.

Cerberus

I have never tried it myself.

But many people use it, and it has been getting better and better.

Jolenealaska

I've got a professional level mic, I would just need the software. Any recommendations?

Tonight I am starting St. Louis Style ribs

Cerberus

09:57

@Jolenealaska Sorry, I have absolutely no idea.

@Jolenealaska SV?

Jolenealaska

Yep. I'm doing a dry rub and then 140 (60C) for 7 hours (I think). Then brush with sauce and broil.

With cornbread, baked beans and potato salad.

Cerberus

I'm sure it will be good.

Have your sous-vide creations so far met your expectations?

Jolenealaska

They sure have, and then some.

I'll put the ribs on just before I go to bed. Between now and then I'm making an Asian beef noodle soup.

4

Q: How to hold and then poach egg yolks?

I've been working on this riff on an Asian noodle soup. As the final garnish, I want to drop an egg yolk in the middle of the individual serving bowls of soup, to warm for a couple of minutes in the boiling hot soup and to burst with the first stir. Sounds simple, right? It's giving me a problem ...

eggs

chefsteps.com/activities/perfect-yolks

Cerberus

Haha you're such a spirited chef!

I'm going to take my second sleeping-shift too.

I slept for 2.5 hours between 4:30 and 6ish.

Now again from 11:15 for as long as I can.

All AM (or I would have said 16:30 etc.).

Sleep well!

Jolenealaska

10:13

I'm going to add a neato picture to the above question.

Cerberus

I remember your question.

Jolenealaska

Sleep well!

Cerberus

@Jolenealaska So why do they use an oil bath?

If you put them directly into the water and "sous-vide" for an hour, what happens?

Jolenealaska

I'm not entirely sure. I've got plenty oil, so i'm going to try it with and without.

I'm going to try it too in a marinade I would use for soft boiled eggs in Ramen.

seriouseats.com/recipes/2012/03/…

Cerberus

Hmm.

Jolenealaska

10:20

I don't have any sake though, only sherry.

Cerberus

Looks nice.

I like oriental soup.

As long as it is free of mushrooms.

Jolenealaska

Me too, very much.

Cerberus

I use to make very simple Thai curry soups.

Jolenealaska

I love wood ear...it's kind of like a mushroom.

Cerberus

With ready-made curry paste and stuff.

covers ears

uncovers cross, extends cross towards evil

Jolenealaska

10:27

Ready made curry is one of the few things like that I DO use.

To expensive to get all of the ingredients.

Cerberus

Right!

And it probably won't taste as good...

Rummy, I wish you a happy near year!

Or at least a tolerable one.

rumtscho

10:43

Hello Cerberus

I'd much prefer a happy one :)

A very happy new year to you, to o

Cerberus

Gracias.

We shall see.

rumtscho

How was your old years eve?

Jolenealaska

Speaking of old....

I went into the liquor store to buy a bottle of sherry.

The clerk was on a tear

her back hurt, she forgot her pain pills and to make matters worse, it was her 50th birthday.

All booze sales require an ID, so I handed over my driver's license.

She looked at it and said, "I'm even older than YOU!"

Hmmm!

rumtscho

Oops

Jolenealaska

(as it is, I look a LOT younger than her!)

rumtscho

11:00

Dont take it personally. On such a bad day, she was probably too deep in self pity and desperately trying to find a small thing to lift her up

Jolenealaska

I found it pretty amusing actually. I thought of a snarky comeback, but I wished her a Happy New Year instead.

Cerberus

@rumtscho It was nice, a little party at my boyfriend's. And you?

@Jolenealaska Umm...that's weird. Does she know you? Otherwise, it would be rude.

@Jolenealaska Well done!

Okay, it's noon. Bedtime! Really this time.

Jolenealaska

Nope, she was being weird and rude

g'night!

rumtscho

Also very nice. A party of the people I visited Slovenia with. Even the girl who lives 100 km away came. There were lots of their friends and colleagues too. I met lots of new people and liked most of them

Cerberus

You handled it well.

@rumtscho Wow! 100km, you say? Very impressive.

Who organised the party, one of your fellow Slovenophiles? Was it far away?

rumtscho

11:07

@Cerberus i didn't know you had a boyfriend. I'd start asking about him, but our of respect for your sleep deprivation, I'll postpone

Cerberus

Haha, you are so good to me.

He's 24 and studies history.

I was trying to postpone the boyfriend label for as long as possible, of course.

Bai bai!

rumtscho

The party hostess was the girlfriend of one of the slovenophiles, tigether with her flatmate. But i think the boyfriend did more organisation, he absolutely loved playing host

Bai, and sleep well

Cerberus

17:55

Sounds like fun!

Happy New Year @derobert !

I congratulate you on the adoption of the Euro by Lithuania.

Support for the Euro in Lithuania has grown to 63% of the population. Reasons are probably partly political.

rumtscho

hi @cerberus. You're awake now?

Cerberus

18:11

I am.

I got another 4 hours of sleep.

It's probably almost your bedtime again already...!

rumtscho

no, only 7:20 PM. I have a few hours yet :)

but I also didn't have a normal sleeping pattern on Silvester

so, how was that party?

Cerberus

Hehe.

What time did you go to bed?

It was nice, we had dinner and chatted and went out to watch the fireworks.

rumtscho

quarter to 4 AM, I think

Cerberus

That is a decent time.

My friends went to a club around 3...

But I decided to go home.

rumtscho

@Cerberus for New Year's Eve, yes. For other days, not (at least for me). I'm glad I managed to rotate it to more usual hours.

Cerberus

18:22

Rotate it, how exactly?

rumtscho

I went to a club's Silvester party 3 or 4 years ago. It was terrible.

Cerberus

So I imagine!

rumtscho

@Cerberus I did this "sleep compression" thing and now my normal sleeping time is 23:00 to 7:00

Cerberus

Did you have to buy expensive tickets and all?

Sleep compression?

rumtscho

@Cerberus I don't remember about the tickets

@Cerberus the idea is, you start out with a "laying down window" which is way too short on purpose

6 hours at the beginning

it doesn't matter if you sleep or not during that time - you're not allowed to sleep at any other time

Cerberus

18:23

I already sleep less than that on most days...

rumtscho

preferrably, you don't even lay down during the day, so you don't nap by accident

the hours are fixed, for example 2 AM to 8 AM

Cerberus

But if that means you get 3 hours of sleep for most of the week, how will you function?

rumtscho

and you stick to it every single day. Weekend, workday, doesn't matter.

@Cerberus the first few days, it's absolutely terrible. I was barely functioning.

But soon, the body reset its clock to fall asleep almost as soon as the head hit the pillow

it was still terrible, because 6 hours consistently is just too few

I know several people who try to do on that or even less, but in reality they nap a bit some days, and sleep in on weekends

and also, because it's a new sleep time, it has a jetlag effect

derobert

@Cerberus Happy new year to you as well. They may actually be better off on the Euro for now... There are positives to it, e.g., it's a huge commitment to not print money like crazy. Much more of a commitment than a young country can manage on its own. Also does save transaction costs (though I think they trade with Russia a lot, so not nearly as much there). And of course political benefits.

rumtscho

and then, after you've managed to hold it for at least a week, you start increasing the sleep time by 15 minutes per week.

@derobert Hello @derobert. How are you?

derobert

18:27

@rumtscho Well, it's been a while, since I've been hanging out in the Unix & Linux chat room recently...

Cerberus

@rumtscho I have sort of done that a few times, I think. And it is true I get a normal cycle after a week or so of horrible lack of sleep. But the problem is that I will relapse within a few weeks, and it all starts over again. The underlying problem for me is that I lack self-discipline with respect to going to bed. Sorry to sound pessimistic...

rumtscho

@Cerberus I know, it's a terrible drain on force of will

I did have a few relapses during the training time, but managed to stick to it on most days

Cerberus

@derobert Exactly! They project a 2% boost in economic growth because the insecurity of exchange rates has been removed (do we believe that?).

rumtscho

after a relapse, I had to fix myself on the "current" level of sleep for a week again, before giving myself 15 minutes more

Cerberus

@rumtscho How long have you been able to stick to the new pattern, on average?

rumtscho

18:30

but I had to reduce other commitments very aggressively just to have the discipline to stick to this one

derobert

@Cerberus Well, if the proponents are the ones doing the projecting... probably not. In general. It'll be too optimistic.

rumtscho

@Cerberus I've been on it since July (that;s when I started the 6 hours)

Cerberus

@derobert Yeah.

@rumtscho Impressive!

rumtscho

and relapses go for 3-4 days, but then I can return to it

Cerberus

It never lasts for longer than a few weeks for me.

rumtscho

18:30

and that's the best benefit.

Since my main sleeping time is when I want it to be, it's very easy to return back to it

before doing this thing, I've had a few days of proper sleep times scattered through a life of bad sleep times

and any time I got them good, I'd return to the "bad" times automatically

now, when I slip into "bad" times, I need very little effort to return to "good" and keep them

Cerberus

@rumtscho But if your relapse is like 8 days, surely returning to the good pattern is not so easy?

rumtscho

@Cerberus Much easier than in the old times. I don't need to start from the beginning. I set the "go to bed" and "get up" alarms, make myself follow them for a few days, and even though I get some irregularities in the first 3-4 days, it goes back into full nights pretty easy

A thing which helped a lot was giving myself 2 hours before the "go to bed" alarm

Cerberus

Hmm.

All patterns are usually erased for me after a few days.

rumtscho

earlier, whenever the time came around for going to bed, I was reluctant to stop whatever I have been doing

now, 2 hours before going to bed, I give myself 1 hour for a pleasant hobby, whatever I feel like doing on that day.

Cerberus

I have tried setting my computer to shut down half an hour before my projected bed time. It kind of worked.

Have you ever tried sleeping pills?

rumtscho

18:36

And then, 1 hour for winding down. First, I shower, prepare clothes and breakfast for the next day, and so on. Then, whatever is left, I use for something pleasant, but not too exciting.

reading old magazines is a good one. Meditation sometimes, when I can be bothered.

Then, when the "sleep" alarm sounds, I easily go to bed.

@Cerberus No, I never wanted them. They don't give good quality sleep, and are addictive in the long run.

Cerberus

I would just take them to get back into a normal pattern.

Shouldn't be more than a few days on end.

rumtscho

@Cerberus if it works for you, go for it

Cerberus

I haven't tried it yet, but I think it's worth a try, because it doesn't depend on self-discipline.

rumtscho

@Cerberus I would be afraid of the sleeplessness that occurs when you stop them

Cerberus

I cannot go to bed earlier than the day before, so it is hard to fix my cycle by simply going to bed earlier. If sleeping pills can remove that obstacle for a few days, that may be enough.

rumtscho

18:40

I think it will be present in some amount even only after a few days

Cerberus

But I generally don't suffer from sleeplessness at all, except when I go to bed early.

But maybe you're right, we shall see.

rumtscho

@Cerberus I wish you luck. The compression path works if you stick to it, but it's really hard. I can understand if you want to try something else.

Cerberus

Maybe you're right. But I have set my mind on this now.

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