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00:00
Ahhh - so maybe I should go on my Australian passport (advantage of dual nationality)
 
4 hours later…
 
6 hours later…
10:18
@RoryAlsop w00t!! DRINKS!!
@Gilles @RoryAlsop what @Gilles said, absolutely.
they wont cause real problems, just maybe waste a little bit extra time.
though for the most part, the airport security here is not as random or clueless as it is most places (e.g. USA...)
@RoryAlsop definitely a good solution, especially if you tend not to use that one often.
I dont think they'd get stuck on why an australian is coming from england...
they will probably ask you if you have another passport though...
@RoryAlsop other tips: bring a swimsuit. March in Tel Aviv tends to be a bit... flippy.
one week rainstorm, next week heat wave.
and the heatwaves here are definitely beach weather. not too humid.
How long will you be in for? Looking for some touristy types of things?
10:41
@AviD well, the conference will be the Sat and Sun, so was thinking of heading there with Claire and taking a couple of days either side
@RoryAlsop oh very nice.
needing a tour guide? :D
@AviD Has been on my list of places to see for a long time, so any touristy advice is welcome :-)
or just looking for "fun stuff"?
@AviD cool
the cool bit about Israel is there really is a little bit of pretty much anything.
of course, it's all mostly smaller than anywhere else, but that is what it is.
you like antiquing? hiking?
bungeeing?
10:45
I'm guessing getting much outside Tel Aviv may be a challenge, but looking forward to trying the cuisine, seeing the sights etc
heh - bungeeing is interesting. Don't think Claire would go for that though
hahah, the "cuisine" = mostly international, except for the exotic
there is no "Israeli" food, it depends on which culture you're in.
We're not really antique types, but do like really old historic buildings or sites (which I guess you have quite a few of :-)
well, except for houmous and falafel. :D
like seeing different cultures
and topic #2
@RoryAlsop ayup - from may different periods, too.
@RoryAlsop oh, absolutely the place for that.
@RoryAlsop heh, you can definitely find enough of that in TA, for sure.
and #3, for that matter
10:47
hahahahahahaha
everytime I park on the street in TA, I get one (sometimes more) of this little "business cards" on my window, advertising "massages"
@AviD sounds like Vegas
@RoryAlsop hehe. a little bit, yeah - but like I said, much smaller in scope.
there were 5 options for this conference, that we voted on. One was Malta - turns out it is really small
just went to check - yeah, its less than 10% the size of Israel. Shocking.
anyway, there is plenty what to see or do. lemme know what you guys prefer, and I'll make you some suggestions :)
10:59
Cool - will have a think. So are you near Tel Aviv? Potential to get a Sec.SE mod meetup for drinks
@RoryAlsop excellent - now we just need to get Hendrik to make the hop over, and drag @JeffFerland halfway across the world, and we'll have the whole set
I'm m about 20 minutes drive from the edge of TA, at least that much more to cross the traffic to the hotels area.
most of them are along the beach... you know already where you're staying?
@AviD not yet - that will be arranged centrally. And we don't yet know whether it will be first or second weekend in March.
@RoryAlsop cool cool.
11:38
You just had to mention the 'F' word didn't you?
Falafel?
"first"?
Ferland?
12:15
Falafel.
The only place that I know of that had a reasonable one in town doesn't anymore.
Or, at least, they still have a falafel but now it's not that great.
12:34
@ScottPack I was never a big fan. my kids love it, though.
so, other than street vendors, where would one typically find falafel over there?
So do you ever watch Jersey Shore to feel nostalgic?
@ScottPack huh? never.
We do have one street cart that's run by an old Pakistani man who makes a mean gyro. I think he has a falafel, I need to find out.
I didnt live anywhere near the shore. and people like that - well, lets just say we can find that type here too.
I typically get it from, believe it or not, a brew pub.
12:36
@ScottPack really? thats... random.
@AviD That's pretty depressing. I had hoped they congregated more.
@AviD It really truly is. And it was actually pretty good too, that was the most surprising part.
@ScottPack cmon, douchebaggery is universal.
3
Almost as universal as asshattery.
there are a ton of falafel places here, especially in TA. I guess its like a pizza shop, 2 on every block.
also, I have a pile of notes from 44con
12:38
@Polynomial Oh, so on your recommendation I checked out LiquidSecurity.
here though, they usually offer both falafel and schwarma at each of these places.
It's good stuff. Not nearly as interesting to listen to as ISD, but the fact that those guys updated daily was bad news.
yeah, it's a good laugh
We do have a Mediteranean/WestAfrican that sells schwarma. Haven't had it yet.
Topic #1 is taking over. :O
12:40
@ScottPack I recommend having a strong stomach. I grew up on it, and it's not the most healthy of options.
@AviD How do you mean?
well, usually, its a rach of beef/lamb/whatever slowly cooking on an open heat, for several hours.
some places, depending on traffic, might have it going all day.
Personally, I prefer to have my meat preserved a bit better. As much as I like the stuff.
13:12
Sanitation is for the weak.
13:30
@ScottPack yeah, well, thats exactly how I mean.
heh. just handled the first flag I've seen, since @JeffFerland was moderatorated. He's been busy.
probably trying to catch up on the modstats board....
Hey @ScottPack! HowToGeek wrote about your favorite file type recently.
You're referring to my penchant for posting pictures in here, eh?
@ScottPack Noooooo....
Pronounced with a soft G? Odd, never heard that.
@ScottPack Neither have I. That's odd indeed.
13:47
@Iszi so's your face.
@AviD So's your mom.
Back off.
Cmon guys.. keep the childish namecalling to a minimum. you are all grown men... nevermind.
@TerryChia Something you'll learn when you hit puberty..."grown" does not mean "mature".
2
@ScottPack I know that TOO well hanging around here. :P
13:49
Wait a sec... Google did WHAT?!
We recently had a 14 year old kid join out gaming group. Except for him I'm the youngest by about 8 years.
@Iszi Didn't that happen on like Wednesday?
@TerryChia He commented on the fact that the biggest difference between us and playing with his friends is that we drink more.
@ScottPack I know CW is usually a bit behind on the news.
@ScottPack Gaming as in online, or tabletop?
@Iszi You're right. We should be impressed that ComputerWorld is slightly less than a week behind the times. They're typically on the Gartner delay.
You guys should pick up a copy of GW2 sometime. ;)
@Iszi Tabletop. Generally Pathfinder, though we pull out the board games if we're missing enough people.
@TerryChia I spend my weekly 4 hours of game time in the same room with people, thank you very much. :)
13:54
@ScottPack Yeah, I'd like to get together with a tabletop group again sometime. DnD 4 is really all I know, though. Around here, I usually end up being the oldest at the FLGS gatherings. Plus, the dependents typically make it a bit difficult for me to regularly have time in my schedule for it.
I do know another gamer in the area, but I think he lives closer to the parks.
@ScottPack If you're talking about my area, and the parks I think you're referring to, that's actually not far from home for me.
I thought you guys were on opposite sides of town. So it's possible either I'm wrong, about his location, or about your ugys relative locations
I think you might be wrong about my location.
Sure, that's something else I could be wrong about
2
14:03
In other news. are we having @ThomasPornin do the QOTW post? I think D.W. made a good point and the schedule should be shifted slightly this week.
This. Is. Fantastic.
@ScottPack Seen it before. Strangely, my wife - who's really not that much into sci-fi things - follows George Takei on Facebook. I think he sent it out awhile ago, and she shared it with me. Still, really awesome.
It was email to me by the wife, who also follows Takei on fb.
I feel bad for my boss today. Apparently, I'm supposed to be getting some sort of award or something this afternoon. He wanted it to be a surprise, but it seems just about every woman that knows the both of us is determined to totally spoil it. First his wife brought it up while I was waiting for him (we carpool) in his apartment. Now, one of our female coworkers sent me a congratulatory e-mail while still somehow managing to not say for what.
From the e-mail she sent, it appears that he let everyone else know about whatever this is while intentionally leaving me off the distribution list. Somehow, everyone got the clue except her.
That's what happens when you tell people a secret.
14:17
@ScottPack Sacha Guitry (French actor from a few decades ago) told that "for women of the 17th century, keeping a secret meant repeating it to only one person at a time"
He was well-known for his rampant misogyny.
@ThomasPornin is there any other kind?
@AviD I suppose, theoretically, that one's misogyny could be more subtle and/or restrained. In reality though, I'm not sure such a thing exists.
@Iszi umm.... sure. Like subtle racism.
Watching Numberphile's Rubik's Cube videos really makes me want to go out and get one right now.
Depending on your culture it's actually possible to make a distinction between malicious and non-malicious racism. Presumably that could be extended to misogyny.
14:37
Argh. YouTube ads are especially annoying during election campaign season.
%s/YouTube a/A/
There, I fixed that for you.
15:01
@ScottPack do you mean malicious/nonmalicious as in, violent/nonviolent? Sure, I'd agree with that.
or did you mean "non-malicious" as in "positive racism"?
Funny, just had an example of that.
I'm actually not exactly sure the best way to describe it, so I'm going to use an example.
Koreans (aka a large electronics company) believe Jews/Israelis are all smart, so give them the complicated projects.
there is a small difference between racism and misogyny (besides the objects) - one is "there is a difference" and the other is "I hate them".
ADD is in full gear today...
I'm more thinking culturally ingrained thought patterns that are largely considered racist, but do not stem from an inherent distrust, dislike, or other negative thoughts related to the subject in question.
15:04
arguably racism affords more room for non-maliciousness, but its still arbitrary.
Like the old woman that still uses the term "Negro", but uses more because that was just the term used in her history and readily changes language when told that it's no longer culturally acceptable.
@Iszi oh lord. I glanced at that while typing our conversation about misoginy, and apparently I misread the last word, because I assumed it was from militant feminist anti-males who were intent on pulling a Bobbit.
@AviD Nice.
@ScottPack In that case that's not racism, it's just ignorance.
@AviD hahaha
15:12
@AviD rofl, took me a while to get that one. eventually misread it myself and though "ooooohhhh..."
@Iszi okay, now that I've watched it, it is lovely. Love that guy.
Love this: "Money Fail".
ugh, I've had some seriously frustrating conversations with militant feminists.
@Polynomial While it's not a universal truth, a large amount of the racism in my culture is very likely as a result of ignorance.
@ScottPack Sure, I agree. But there's still a difference between racism and ignorance. The former stems from the latter, but they're not equal.
@ScottPack I've seen a lot of it result from malice. Which of course leads to willful ignorance, so....
15:13
racial ignorance is not knowing that what you're saying is offensive.
racism is knowing that what you're saying is offensive.
That's a pretty fine line that I'm not sure is necessarily meaningful to try to find.
"What, why would anyone be offended by the fact that Negro's are stupid and lazy??"
umm, not necessarily.
@AviD that's both.
well, there ya go.
as I said, they're not equal. they're also not mutually exclusive.
in fact, racism usually implies ignorance. but it's not a requirement.
15:16
@Polynomial Note that "being offensive" is a two-party protocol.
@Polynomial yo momma's not mutually exclusive.
3
of course.
It depends on context and who you are speaking to.
Sure, what's offensive to one is funny or inert to another.
On the subject of feminism, I did actually experience a mild case of sexism at 44con, sadly.
For instance, if I say that Black people run faster than White because they have higher muscular density, then this is technically true (statistically) but non-scientists may find that offensive (because they do not quite grasp the concept of statistics and averages).
15:19
overheard a conversation between a couple of guys discussing whether any women at the con actually knew anything, or were just wives / booth-babes.
@ThomasPornin Racism is a touchy topic. It's far too easy to get painted with the same brush, when you are just stating facts.
@ThomasPornin I guess that applies to Jews being smart, too ;-)
(The reverse also works: Whites swim better, because dense muscle does not float well; just follow the Olympics and you'll get the idea, because Olympic games are a marvelous extractor for the edges of bell curves)
@ThomasPornin is that actually true (I suppose you mean on average)? “Black” is very diverse, genetically speaking
I suspect it depends a lot on who you include in “black” and “white”
@Polynomial well, if they did know anything, that would make them exponentially hotter.
gets 10x worse when discussing historical genetics, where you have to explicitly make links to particular genealogical lines that are closer to pre-modern man in terms of genetics.
@AviD Perhaps, but the content of the conversation essentially boiled down to "girls suck at computers", with sexual overtones thrown in.
15:22
@Gilles I think it works for a number of Bantu ethnies (as opposed to Khoisans and Pygmies)
And there are local variants
@Polynomial also, much like the definition of "subjective", what is "racist" is also kinda subjective.
but there is a reason why sprinters are jamaicans but marathon is for Kenya and Ethiopia.
what frustrates me most is when people refuse to accept facts because you're not their particular gender / race.
a while ago had to help sort out a fight on Travel.se... two sides of racists didnt realize they themselves were also expressing a racist position.
well, it was racist/politica/religious, so it was pretty much worse....
I had a conversation with two militant feminists that refused to believe that a high percentage of women were living happy "normal" lives, because they'd both suffered abuse and because I was "part of rape culture" because I'm male.
15:24
@Polynomial ... / religion / policital party / OS fanboy / etc...
its an "us vs. them" mentality, over the most arbirtrary and trivial of things.
"If you're not with us, you're against us".
nothing new here, nothing to see, move along.
@Polynomial thats brilliant.
0
Q: Gravatar being used to reclaim ownership of an account, a good idea?

Eduard FlorinescuThere is a very big probability that the owner of a gravatar for an email address is also the owner of that email address that is associated with SO account. So if a user wants to recover an account for an email that he can no longer access but still has access to the gravatar account the issue ...

> User completes a form, and an administrator gives a random hash number.
User goes to gravatar and changes the avatar with an image with that hash number.
15:27
in this case it wasn't arbitrary or trivial - it was a discussion about gender roles in society. which frustrated me more, because I actually really care about getting more gender equality in computer-related jobs.
@Polynomial lovely. I need to start using that site.
yeah, it rocks
I had a conversation with my dad that devolved into mostly latinspeak at some point...
and, as he is a lawyer, he slammed me.
@Polynomial It often happens that active militants for a given cause are the cause's worst enemies. But they never realize it.
15:29
@ThomasPornin So true,
what frustrated me most was that they said "feminism is about getting women as high as possible in society"
which, by definition, it's not.
or at least not what it should be about.
Let's replace all the ocracies with different ocracies. That sounds like a great idea.
0
Q: Are Windows Updates susceptible to tampering, eg. using a MiTM attack.

Keith LoughnaneMy real question is how are patches and updates authenticated in general. But for example how does windows know a windows update is really a windows update, does it just trust the URL or is there some kind of certificate?

Is this a dupe? I remember seeing a similar question some time back.
@TerryChia I have nothing against a blog post on my answer but I would prefer that somebody else writes it: apparently, my employer would like to get an internal meeting for the "attack knowledge in advance", so, while it is OK that I have published it on SE, I would prefer not to actively propagate it any further myself for the next few days (but I am all for other people chanting my glory far and wide, of course).
@Polynomial Cheers.
In completely unrelated news
15:35
@ThomasPornin To be honest, your answer is already blog-worthy. How about @RoryAlsop publish a blog post quoting your answer wholesale as a separate post. And Jeff or someone else can do the writeup on the carding question for the QOTW.
@TerryChia That's fine for me.
15:53
@TerryChia I could do that. From your comment above, @Thomas, are you happiest if I mention your name in the blog post, or just leave people to find it if they go through to the question itself?
16:44
So, apparently it only takes a week for the FBI to come up with a plausible cover story that includes a real scapegoat company. redtape.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/09/10/…
@RoryAlsop By all means, quote me by name. I quite like the fame.
@ThomasPornin :-)
@ThomasPornin @RoryAlsop Remember, it's spelled S-M-O-K-E-Y.
@Iszi heh
Who's the Bandit?
16:54
In other news, I just read that Skyrim DLC for the PS3 is on hold indefinitely. Looks like time to get a 360.
17:11
@ScottPack I'll put on the famous 'tache
@ThomasPornin security.blogoverflow.com/wp-admin/post.php?post=839 draft for your perusal
@RoryAlsop Odd. I know I'm a blog editor, but I get page not found.
wonder what I have done wrong... it should now be pending review
and it appears for me. Permissions look right
I suppose I could just publish - I have just ctrl-C ctrl-V'ed the majority of it from @Thomas's post, so it will be right :-)
It's me, not you
I'm not a writer
The power of the clipboard
17:29
roryalsop on September 10, 2012

For those who haven’t been following Juliano Rizzo and Thai Duong, two researchers who developed the BEAST attack against TLS 1.0/SSL 3.0 in September 2011, they have developed another attack they plan to publish at the Ekoparty conference in Argentina later this month – this time giving them the ability to hijack HTTPS sessions – and this has started people worrying again.

Security Stack Exchange member Kyle Rozendo asked this question:

And the community expectation was that we wouldn’t get an answer until Rizzo and Duong presented their attack. …

17:43
I dunno what your guys problems are. Works for me.
Of course, Rory just published it.
Well played.
@ScottPack I figured worst case was that folks could tell me I'd published with mistakes and I'd ninja-edit
Hey, I did that last week!
@RoryAlsop Sorry, I was out. Did you actually link to the question ?
Ah yes you did.
@ThomasPornin links everywhere :-)
18:24
haha, is this serious?
-3
Q: IT security except deep freeze software

maverickI have used deep freeze software. but it also allow virus. May i have another software like deep freeze also from torrent?

Sadly, i think it could be...
@terrychia - congrats on your 3k :)
@RoryAlsop Ummm.... wow. Uhhh... welcome to the party.
@David Just for reference since it has been flagged a few times: I'm leaving it up but in a closed state. I think the current answer + not constructive close does us more benefit than deleting it.
kk
@JeffFerland Good point. Though, I totally would have proposed deletion if I had that privilege.
What's that? 10k?
Said it before, but I feel it bears repeating. 3k is SE's 21.
18:41
@Iszi Does this make me ready for retirement?
@JeffFerland No, you've already been consigned to civil service.
Don't you hate it when you reboot a computer remotely, and then you remember it's got whole-disk encryption?
aaaaaaaaah - not good!
18:57
@RoryAlsop It's just down the hall, and not something that affects anyone outside our department. Still, damn annoying.
@Iszi So I am 275 years old ?
@ThomasPornin Is that in Sec.SE years, or Crypto years?
Holy crap-on-a-pogo-stick! You're about to turn 40k here?!?!
@Iszi Yes I can !
Oh, I hate it when things repair themselves and I do not know why.
Let there be some Windows systems with smartcard logon, and the CRL publication gets broken.
So certificates can no longer be validated, and smartcard login does not work.
We repair CRL publication, and smartcard logon... still does not work.
But exactly 6 hours later smartcard logon works again.
19:17
sounds like caching fun
Yes... an anti-cache somewhere, which remembers that a given URL is no good, and will not try it for the next 6 hours...
Now I must roam the Interweb for some information on a 6 hours cache.
@ThomasPornin Don't recall if it was here or elsewhere, but I recall someone saying that the only thing we hate more than something that is inexplicably broken, is something which has become inexplicably fixed.
@JeffFerland That deep freeze question you closed? I don't think NC is quite right. Probably more OT. Or, if you've got a special mod-only "closed for ToS violation" option, that might be great.
Ummm... is security.stackexchange.com/questions blank for anyone else?
Yeah, all of a sudden the site shows no questions.
And, now it's back. WTF?
20:08
0
Q: Unauthorized activity on port 3389

Chris WebbIf you detect activity on port 3389 (the mouse starts moving) What is the first steps you should take from a security standpoint, and who should be notified?

This is good one
IMHO if you sit close to such paranoid, you can actually lost your life, if you live in US and he keeps gun in the drawer, and has PSTD at the same time
Did they check their mouse sensor for tape?
due to strong psychosis - no
some guys just go and kill whoever they perceive threat
or end-up with strong hallucinations - depends on the person
if it's sys-admin, and he runs without firewall and XP SP1, then this is very difficult case
without paralyser I would not try to approach
21:04
LoL. Godaddy Blows! =X
ehhh this is it, they dont have decent anycast dns load balancers
let's check the version of their sofrware
I guess it's the centos 5
 
2 hours later…
22:43
You may now address me as "Your Epicness".
6
23:12
@ThomasPornin congratulations, your one-third-of-a-legendariness
23:28
@Gilles You were right, by the way: it really works with days of 200+ rep, not with days where the cap was reached.

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