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16:01
@DavidFreitag They have their own highway though, right?
@Simon hahahaha, that's funny
Isn't there a highway specifically for trucks somewhere in the states?
Not that I am aware of.
ô_ô
I know there are some highways out west that are really only travelled by truckers, but any car can drive there as well.
16:03
o
There's no more fun than trying to dodge between big rigs
lol public transportation
so glad I don't drive
wat
i live 3 minutes from a trolley hub and 4 minutes from a subway stop
by walking
@Ohnana So glad I do drive
16:09
From someone who's been driving by himself since he's 17: wat
context: i live in a large city
so driving is foolhardy
Yeah I could see that.
That sucks.
it actually doesn't
Some part of me has always wanted to live in a large city
16:10
I'm all about things that go like "vroom vroom".
no traffic, no dealing with idiots who can't drive
just sit back and enjoy the ride
No adrenaline rush from a turbo-charged engine.
NO NOTHING SON.
@Ohnana And also deal with people
And the occasional mariachi band
eww
public transport?
ewww.
@DavidFreitag nobody makes eye contact. and I've gotten used to the socially inept
16:11
ewwwwwwww
eww
@kalina My sentiments exactly.
@Ohnana In that case I will forcibly make eye contact.
my god you are all so opposed
why is public transport so heinous to you all
@Ohnana None of us live in a large city like you. If I lived in NY I would certainly always take the subway.
@Ohnana because you can't live with them, nor without them
funny note: I live in a city with a pop about 3 million and we hate public transport
@DavidFreitag fair enough
i miss public transit in the suburbs when I go back
"you mean I have to drive and park? fuuuuuck"
16:15
@Ohnana How is picking up a lady to go on a date with the subway going for ya?
IT'S STARTING TO SNOW FUUUUUUUUUUU
@Simon I mean I last picked up a lady at a convention
lolololol
@Simon and I go on dates with my partner via the subway all the time
it's the only way to get to center city
@Ohnana Do you pay the bill at the restaurant?
16:16
he prefers the subway too
we trade off
So, you once picked up a lady at a convention, and now your partner is a "he".
Unless you're bi, I'm lost.
@Simon correct
@Simon Don't judge you donut.
Kudos to me for understanding it perfectly.
good work riddling that out lol
16:17
:D
YOU'VE ACTIVATED MY RADICAL QUEER CARD
/s
@Ohnana oh I don't know, the idea of being crammed into the same space as a bunch of smelly people are questionable moralities
the sort of people who will grab your ass on the way past and claim it was accidental
even though you felt the squeeze
@kalina I've actually never had that happen. The worst was someone took my arm because I was wearing the same shirt as their wife
my default reaction to somebody physically violating me in that way is to issue a knee to the balls and then kick them in the face
I was like "o hai" and they stared at me googly eyed
16:19
why would I ever want to be in a confined space with these people
men evolved with their reproductive organs on the outside so that any woman can lay the smackdown on them
@kalina :|
unfortunately, I can't change the way many men behave, my solution is just to avoid being in those situations
@RоryMcCune so installing untrusted packages is a bad idea? revolutionary
@Ohnana well given that a large part of several multi-billion dollar companies revolves around these techs, how much do you want a bet that management in those co's isn't aware of this....
raz
raz
16:30
@Ohnana But they're untrusted js packages, so I'm sure they're fine.
also everyone does this all the time, as root in a lot of cases
no auditing of packages no installing digitally signed versions only
just pull from the repo and trust what it gives you....
raz
raz
@RоryMcCune How else do you update your system?
@RоryMcCune typically official repos have a review process
and they have signing keys
@raz well there's various levels of protection... one is only install digitally signed packages.
@Ohnana npm, Rubygems definitely do not
it's up to the individual dev to push code
and the creds for a library owner are static username/password
@RоryMcCune D: !!!
raz
raz
16:32
@RоryMcCune Should have added a sarcasm tag.
@Ohnana God damn.
@raz ahhh :) sorry I'm researching this area at the moment and the lack of security is making my head hurt
and just to make it worse, Microsoft who actually have a bit of a better record are moving into the "let anyone push libs" market with NuGet/OneGet
raz
raz
@RоryMcCune Yeah there's no nice way to go about it. You generally have to hack together some scripts to make it work correctly.
I completely approve of the installation of any software you find on the internet
raz
raz
16:35
@Ohnana ahahahahaha
in fact, once my company is set up, I'm going to force all users to log in as domain admins
raz
raz
@kalina Well my users are going to be full admins. Beat that.
this isn't a competition
So, they don't release the code of Steam, they just have a repo for bug reports?
raz
raz
@kalina Everything is a competition!
16:37
@raz nope
@raz I'm going to abandon the notion of kernel space/user space and just give all my users full rights to tinker in the kernel. For performance, you understand.
I am going to build a major website and instead of worrying about such things as sql injection and what not, I'll just give everybody a nice and easy to find link that allows them to run commands as root
nobody will bother with SQL injection
raz
raz
@Tinned_Tuna Damn, got me beat!
@kalina Once this whole Internet fad is over your website will be worthless.
oh no, I've already built my product for the Next Big Thing
I just need to wait until this Internet thing is nearly over so I don't reveal my hand too early
raz
raz
@kalina You're CyberInternet (CyberI) ready!?
16:40
wouldn't want the googleplex thieving my idea and then EEE'ing me out of existence
Google really is just this decade's Microsoft
it took me a while to get over their "Do No Evil"
but that's basically the same manipulation as Swift's innocent smile
watch out for Regina George
I can't spell "out"
fml
raz
raz
@kalina Well Regina George needs to watch out for our bus.
All aboard the Cyber train!
I am currently drinking dihydrogen monoxide
Goodbye cruel world
raz
raz
Try not to drown in your sorrows.
It's bad
I'm crying so much that my glass keeps refilling itself
perpetual drink
And you just solved thirst, congrats.
16:47
no, the ever increasing salt content makes that unlikely
Salt made from tears, it's a thing that actually exists
@Simon looks like it.
boredom has overcome me
Do you even bored bro?
you are too weak to survive the amount of boredom I am experiencing
I am in possession of the infinity stone of boredom
I wouldn't live it anyway, since I'd entertain myself before that'd happen.
16:54
that's a euphemism, right?
"I think I shall go and entertain myself"
Sigh, no it's not.
are you sure?
absolutely certain?
oneself spends many hours each night self-entertaining
That's kind of sad.
look at you, the saddest person in the land, calling others sad
Look at you, attacking me once again to feel better about yourself.
16:57
avid avid up on high, who's the guy that makes me cry?
mirror mirror on the wall, the bigger they are, the harder they fall
@AviD I think she's trying to tell you something.
simon simon why so serious? Chatting with you is quite precarious
-.-
17:31
wow all the seriousness killed the room!
oh noes
quick someone, do something silly!
what about some silly walks?
FTFY @RоryMcCune
@RoryAlsop ta :)
@RoryAlsop hows the lurgy
@RoryAlsop what about some still walks?
or some stilt walks?
@RоryMcCune blarg - annoying - sinus pain mostly annoying
@Gilles okay - that could very well be what he was going for...mod abuse!
:-)
@RoryAlsop sucks! one benefit of relative isolation is reduced illness! that said I have a feeling it makes me more susceptible when I do venture into the busy places...
17:37
@RоryMcCune I'm just hoping I haven't turned some undefined threshold into older age
@RoryAlsop where you get ill more... that would suck...
1
Q: Are there any publicly known ways to bypass .Net 4.5 request validation, for XSS?

paj28The request validation in .Net 4.5 has been further tightened, and my previous methods of bypassing it no longer work. (e.g. <input onfocus="..." autofocus/>). Are there any publicly known ways to bypass .Net 4.5 request validation, for XSS?

huh what?
@RoryAlsop BTW quick random question for you.. at the gogarburn conf centre is there usually ok parking?
how is <input onfocus="..." autofocus/> bypassing request validation?
@RоryMcCune yep - but you can give them a call and let them know that you are speaking and will require a space. That would get one reserved for you just in case
17:41
@RoryAlsop cool good call, I guess if I get stuck I could head to the airport park and ride and get the tram for one stop :)
never actually been on one of those yet
@TildalWave yeah IIRC it's <[A-Za-z0-9] which trips it
@tidalwave although I'm hesitant to correct paj on that stuff as he usually knows more about it than me :)
@RоryMcCune I wasn't being serious
@kalina I known but the conversation sounded like serious business , so I felt the need to inject some levity
psh
I'm actively trying to avoid my serious side
@RоryMcCune nothing better than a bit of silly walk
that and I've had about 1.5 drinks at the moment, so alls good with the world!
17:48
my serious side is in deep depression mode
@kalina put it outside and shut the door
metaphorically, that's what I've done
@RоryMcCune I have still to make 4 trips taking kids to and from stuff, so no drink for me
@kalina ya know that blue avatar of yours causes me serious confusion, 'cause it's almost the same as a hacker I follow on twitter
@hackerfantastic, England
Hacker Fantastic is a whitehat who enjoys writing software, tinkering with computers and everything security related. Electronics & Radio enthusiast. @MDSecLabs
35.7k tweets, 15.2k followers, following 3.9k users
I will have a hot toddy at 9:45 when I get home from picking up eldest though
17:50
@RоryMcCune this hacker is 20% cooler than the average hacker
@RoryAlsop boo... still only what 4 years till the eldest can drive...
how can I be everybody's favorite pony, if I'm a pink angel?
@kalina - see, another angel
@kalina I think they sell them at Ann Summers
@RоryMcCune Yay!
@RoryAlsop almost like the freakangels wings!
@RoryAlsop sigh
even if they did, rampant rabbit for life
17:51
@RоryMcCune pretty close - has he written any more of them
@kalina 10/10
@RoryAlsop no :( I think he's done with it, but it was cool whilst it lasted
@RoryAlsop I want to know how you're so familiar with the subject to rate them
no, wait, I don't
I ... will..... resist... starting to read the site again from the beginning as that way a lost evening lies!
@RоryMcCune :-) Eilin still wants one of the shoulder bags
hey @kalina next time you get bored.. go here freakangels.com/?p=23 and read from the start
17:53
I can't do that
@RoryAlsop was some good merch
I'm banned from reading webcomics
@kalina howcome?
due to being unable to do anything but start from the beginning
after reading the whole of xkcd, cad, etc
just a time sink
@kalina yeah, but Freakangels was gooood
17:54
@kalina which is the way to go... man when I first found girl genius online, I lost a looooaddd of time
and freak angels
I read that twice all the way through
yes but then webcomics started jumping the shark and including really serious issues that just had no place in the format
like miscarriages and divorces
can't be bothered with that
@kalina don't worry I've read freakangels end to end, none of that to find
@RоryMcCune unless you count the enviornment they are in as a serious discussion of the future :-)
@RoryAlsop true true
girl genius online is good escapist fun
pretty much no seriousness to be found there at all
@RоryMcCune I got annoyed with it when I had caught up - it needs to be read continuously
17:57
@RоryMcCune are you "shure"? :D
pls
@TildalWave yeahsh I'm as shure as shir shean connery
hehehe
@RoryAlsop that's another thing that annoys me
especially with tv shows
@RoryAlsop yeah they are at least pretty regular, mon/wed/fri
17:59
@RоryMcCune you confused even @raz there :)
yes but don't call them shurely. — raz 13 mins ago
@TildalWave exshellent
I will download tv shows constantly but only watch them in bulk when I have free uninterrupted time
and for some reason
my tv marathon catchup sessions always seem to end one episode before the major conclusion of that particular arc
and then it's months before I see the next episode
@TildalWave ah quality a bit of airplane
what does NUC stand for
oh
@kalina either National Union Convention or Next Unit of Computing
18:02
next unit of computing
it's an intel thing
oh, these are one of those mini pcs my friend has
ok
the reason I asked is you can get them in purple
and they look lush
almost like candy
18:05
@kalina you're such a girl :op PCs should be big and macho with lots of neon and black metal!
you're*
BAM
that's all, it doesn't matter how valid what you said was
@kalina \/\/
I'm more in favor of the tiniest possible form factor with the most functionality
so while I wouldn't buy one of these for my main PC, I'd possibly have one plugged into a TV, if I didn't just use my main PC for videos
but I'm not a fan of big towers
when I do my skylake upgrade I'm going to see if I can go with a mini itx board and still plug a graphics card, a sound card, and a dsp card into it
seriously
that's hot
so purple
@kalina really.. purple
@kalina adorbs
18:12
@kalina And Celeron!!! Wait...Celeron??
@Xander stock picture
Really!?
I've always wanted to get a themed case
the actual layout I like is slimmer like this:
do a TF2 case or F:NV case
18:12
just as purple
with a core i5 in it
but really, do you need a core i5 for pushing 1080p to a tv?
@kalina Oooh...Core i3!!! Wait...Core i3??
and one of these probably wouldn't be able to do 4k anyway
@kalina Ah...If that's all you're using it for, ok then.
@kalina don't forget the facebook/youtube/twitter overlay
6 mins ago, by kalina
so while I wouldn't buy one of these for my main PC, I'd possibly have one plugged into a TV, if I didn't just use my main PC for videos
my life would consist of one big buffer underrun if I tried to use one of those for my main pc
18:14
Was thinking you wanted to put a high-perf proc in it, for which a case like that wouldn't be ideal.
less than 8 cores is not worth my time
@kalina physical cores or threaded?
@RоryMcCune I'm not sure she's serious. I can never tell if she's being serious or not.
@Xander yeah that's the Internet for you :)
@kalina nurd nurd nurd nurd
in b4
18:25
@Simon b4 what?
b4 m4d
1
Q: Are there any publicly known ways to bypass .Net 4.5 request validation, for XSS?

paj28The request validation in .Net 4.5 has been further tightened, and my previous methods of bypassing it no longer work. (e.g. <input onfocus="..." autofocus/>). Are there any publicly known ways to bypass .Net 4.5 request validation, for XSS?

seriously - closed as off topic?
people have a weird interpretation of "specific system"
@paj28 watcha' paj hows tricks?
I think I voted as unclear ... not shure tho :)
@paj28 yeah I've never really got the off-topic rules here
18:27
@paj28 It isn't closed. It's on hold bro. Revise it and it'll get reopened
to be honest, i think you need to change the site's tag to "information security beginners"
2
raz
raz
some of them are straight forward.
@RоryMcCune - hey, things are fine otherwise :-)
was putting together .net training material
and I like to include an example of why not to rely on request validation
but everything I had was out of date
They were right to close it though, soz boi.
@paj28 that close reason basically says "we probably don't know but even if we did we wouldn't tell you because THEY'RE WATCHING!" :)))
18:29
It is asking to break a security of a specific system.
Well, public discussion of request validation bypass has been common in the past
(not on sec.se)
but nothing around for .net 4.5
anyway, clearly nothing I say is going to change the community consensus
just felt the need to vent some frustration
@paj28 CYA is alive and well
that's what we're here for :)
@paj28 Yeah, that's odd. That shouldn't have been closed IMO.
raz
raz
I'll vote to re-open. My vote was it being too broad. Not the breaking of a system thing.
18:30
Thanks guys :-)
raz
raz
I don't think it violates that Off-Topic point.
If that's not breaking security, I have no idea what it is.
raz
raz
It's broad, it's not a specific system
@Simon - it's your interpretation of "specific system"
raz
raz
it's a technology.
18:31
following your logic, wouldn't discussion of, say, Shell Shock, exploits be off topic?
@paj28 OK seriously, I don't quite get your question. How would <input onfocus="..." autofocus/> bypass request validation?
It used to work!
Maybe that was .Net 2.0
Really? Jesus!
@paj28 Did someone post: "How do I abuse ShellShock?" here?
So MS Request Validation = Anything Goes?
18:32
Explanation of a vulnerability != how to abuse it
I don't remember it that open
Not any more it seems - now seems to be very tight
raz
raz
@paj28 Maybe post the old example, and ask if anything more recent is available. And for @Simon sake add in that it's for educational purposes.
Because that falls within our guidelines.
PS: I didn't flag the question, I'm just saying that I understand why some did.
latest one I found: blog.whitehatsec.com/…
18:33
@raz but it's not really for educational purposes if someone answers with "shure, this xyz works"
and no, I'm not gonna let go of "shure" :P
raz
raz
@TildalWave The comment is shurely non-educational, but the question can be.
I am watching very closely how the latest proposed legislation goes - as it will seriously impact on that close reason. Personally I thought this one was ok, a bit unclear for me - but my assumption wa sthat it was because I don't do much in that area, so I left it alone.
@paj28 I'd vote to reopen if you clarify a bit, maybe add that link (so I don't have to add it to the million favorites where I'll never find it again LOL)
frankly, that example threw me off
@RоryMcCune 4 + HT
@Simon Breaking a specific systems means either a) a system that's too specific for us to know about, or b) for other future users to care about, and often some combination of both. (E.G., Here's an encrypted string, how is it encrypted and how can I decrypt it?)
18:37
@paj28 that's the last one I'm aware of, it still works (last time I checked) but only in IE9 and IIRC 10
@Simon erm... no
in after
also, if you think bypassing request validation means breaking security, then you are misusing request validation by the microsoft docs
@Xander "for us", that's very subjective.
Are you asking every single user if he's aware of the said system?
I can't believe I got called a nerd by a PHP "developer"
18:37
@paj28 that's true
@paj28 ooh other stuff on that is that it fails miserably in JSON/JS scenarios where the JS renders the response :)
@paj28 BTW, Microsoft doesn't consider request validation to be a security boundary any longer...Only a defense in depth tool. So, a website that's relying on that alone should be a finding in and of itself, if you have that knowledge.
that's truly next level
@paj28 Ha, yes, this.
@kalina 1) That makes no sense. 2) I'm not a PHP dev. 3) You suck.
18:38
@paj28 OK, I'm sold
you're right, you are not overly intellectual
you can't be a nerd
you are socially impaired though
2 days ago: "I'm a bad person".
Today: "I insult everyone".
w2g
nope, just you
@Simon Most VtC is subjective to some degree. It's about making reasonable judgments as to whether the content is more generally useful than to the single person asking about it.
ask anybody, the unwritten rules of the DMZ is that anybody is allowed to abuse you to make themselves feel better
18:40
@paj28 also IIRC it's limited in terms of the parameters it checks so some data can bypass it. A rather contrived example would be a site that reads header info (e.g. User agent) and replays it, wouldn't be caught by request validation
@Xander Sure. Once again, I do understand some people voted to close the question, though.
@kalina well maybe hell froze over but believe it or not @Simon even made a few constructive comments in the last few days
@RоryMcCune - ooh, that's a twist I hadn't thought of
@kalina If insulting me through the Internet makes yourself feel better, you should reconsider a lot of things about your life.
@paj28 also and I'm scraping my memory hear, it doesn't cover the parameter name, just the value, so in the unlikely case that the dev. renders the parameter name back it'll bypass as well
18:41
wondering if things like JSON POST body are checked
@Simon right now, yes it does
normally, not so much
@paj28 I don't think so but I haven't seen a recent enough example to say... but a decent scenario for a modern app is data entering the application via an API which won't hit it, is then rendered
ok, brill, this was the info i hoped to get
thanks guys, DMZ 1 - Sec.SE 0
It doesn't matter if it's now, yesterday or in 2 years. The statement still applies.
there's been quite a few cases of XSS via input from other sites, so those would serve to illustrate
18:42
@Simon shrug
@Simon @kalina now now you two, I'd say kiss and make up but that would likely produce retching noises from both parties :op
pls.
I'm practically married.

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