The Sand Trap - 2023-09-27

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lyxal

00:06

user image

rydwolf, listen to me, you gotta go to Kromer st and be a [big shot]

Rydwolf Programs

00:41

Okay so apparently I got rejected for that card because the credit report company doesn't even know I exist yet lol

Ginger

@lyxal LMAO

Rydwolf Programs

@lyxal If I gotta go south on 183 any time soon I'll make sure to stop by ig :p

Ginger

finally, something to [pluck] me from the [Glum Humdrum]

lyxal

@RydwolfPrograms now see if you went to Kromer St and became a [big shot] this wouldn't have happened

because if you did, the bank would know you were [number1ratedsalesman 1997]

and instantly given you 20 million kromer

Ginger

for the [Low Low Price Of] too!

Rydwolf Programs

00:48

Good news: I'll be passing Kromer Street on November 10th on the way to San Antonio for a concerr

2 hours later…

Unrelated String

03:13

@DannyuNDos ooh, nice toast

what is that corn mix on the left hash brown though

Dannyu NDos

03:30

Corn-and-cheese

Unrelated String

what kind of herb is the green bit

4 hours later…

Unrelated String

07:34

@Bbrk24 especially with the volatile nature of exchange rates

Unrelated String

just saw this on hnq and it is so hard to see "CBOE" and not read it "своё"

Unrelated String

08:16

@Ginger it's at least a different kind of terrible taste in music than i usually have

if it qualifies as music

2 hours later…

Unrelated String

09:59

okay less joking CMSR: youtube.com/watch?v=xOJEL3UPEt4

i swear i've heard most of this album already but i just now ran into this and it's got a really unique vibe even for aran

(but less joking isn't to imply it was just joking to begin with--i genuinely enjoy 1bpm lmao)

lyxal

10:35

user image

Weird ahh looking car

lyxal

10:52

user image

Why is the car door melting??!

2 hours later…

Ginger

12:56

hey @RydwolfPrograms

I have a bit of a problem with my VM

specifically:

Filesystem     1K-blocks     Used Available Use% Mounted on
/dev/root      103080888 97683576    138060 100% /
devtmpfs        24675468        0  24675468   0% /dev
tmpfs           24678228     2124  24676104   1% /dev/shm
tmpfs            9871292      492   9870800   1% /run
tmpfs               5120        0      5120   0% /run/lock

I've cleared out some stuff and gotten it down to 94%

but that's still not ideal

lyxal

13:11

user image

Ginger

ginger moment

mfw Coursier's cache is 7GB(?!)

lyxal

oh boy here i go opening a bug on MSE

Ginger

what's happened this time

lyxal

user image

see those facebook and twitter buttons

they broke

forver

they relied on a service called addthis.com

which just happened to be sunset in may this year :p

Ginger

RIP

Rydwolf Programs

13:19

@Ginger Sorry, this is gonna have to be a you fix. The one thing I don't have is storage.

Ginger

uh oh

Rydwolf Programs

I'm going to uipgrade but I'm in some analysis paralysis (and I-don't-want-to-spend-money paralysis) right now

Ginger

okay, what can I nuke

Rydwolf Programs

My options are:

Ginger

hmm

my MC server folder is 2.8 gigs

Rydwolf Programs

13:21

Yeah but out of a hundred that's not much right

I'm really not sure how you're using up a hundred gigs

Ginger

64G of it is in my home folder

and the biggest thing in there by far, taking up almost half the space, is *drumroll* my compiled-from-source copy of LLVM 16

lyxal

0

Q: "Help us Grow This Site" Twitter/X and Facebook buttons on Public Beta sites broken

If you go to any public beta site's homepage, Programming Language Design and Implementation for example, you'll find a box like this: The Facebook and Twitter/X share buttons rely on a service called AddThis which was shut down at the end of May 2023. This means that the share buttons (except f...

bug beta-sites sharing

Rydwolf Programs

1. Add two more 400 GB SSDs (bringing it up to 6×400, 1.2TB at 6× read, with 2 free slots)
2. Add four more 400 GB SSDs (bringing it up to 8×400, 1.6 TB at 8× read, with no free slots)
3. Add two spinning rust hard drives (so 4×400, 800 GB at 4× read, plus 2×4-8 TB, 4-8 TB at extremely slow speeds)
4. Add four spinning rust hard drives (so so 4×400, 800 GB at 4× read, plus 4×4-8 TB, 4-16 TB at extremely slow speeds)
5. Pull the 400 GB drives and replace them with 4-8 800 GB or even 1600 TB SSDs

Ginger

which I can delete if I can just figure out how to make GDB load the apt-installed LLVM debug symbols

so @RydwolfPrograms do you have any idea how to do ^

Rydwolf Programs

@Ginger What's taking up the space, the source or the compiled binary?

I'd assume it's the source

If you've got anywhere near a 32 GB binary you've got bigger issues lol

I'd just grab the binary and delete the source

Ginger

13:25

yeah uh

> 27G llvm-project-llvmorg-16.0.6/build

it's the binary

Rydwolf Programs

tf...debug symbols ig?

Ginger

correct

and even with that build I still can't get GDB to load it

Rydwolf Programs

Still, that's only a quarter of your space. I'm really surprised you've managed to consume so much storage space

Ginger

since it only outputted .as and not .sos

@RydwolfPrograms well, my home folder is 68G total

Rydwolf Programs

I'd check the others too, 32 GB for non-home is huge

Unless you've got a ton of big Docker images or something big in srv or some really big installs

lyxal

13:28

Hey rydwolf did you see this car?

3 hours ago, by lyxal

user image

Rydwolf Programs

Yes, it's beautiful

Ginger

2.1M    /dev
0       /sys
4.0K    /mnt
4.0K    /boot
8.4M    /etc
70M     /tmp
4.8G    /srv
488K    /run
4.0K    /opt
0       /proc
64G     /home
4.4G    /var
4.0K    /media
11G     /usr
16K     /lost+found
4.0K    /root
84G     /

:thonk:

Rydwolf Programs

Wait 84G for /?

lyxal

@RydwolfPrograms reminds me of you :p

Rydwolf Programs

Did you already clear 16 GB?

Ginger

13:29

yes

Rydwolf Programs

Or is the filesystem eating that much

oh

Ginger

by deleting, among other things, 4gb worth of cached wheels and a partially-installed copy of the built LLVM

Rydwolf Programs

Your var's a bit big still

Ginger

saw that, lemme check

it's mostly the journal

lemme vacuum it rq

Rydwolf Programs

Ooh I just found a lot of 6 800 GB drives for $300

Ginger

13:32

2.7G freed

we're now down to 88% usage

which is probably good enough for now

and once I've figured out this LLVM bug I can delete the rest

so now for the million-dollar question: what are .a files and how do I make GDB load them

Rydwolf Programs

I think they're the same as .so right

Ginger

> '/home/ginger/llvm-project-llvmorg-16.0.6/build/lib/libLLVMCore.a': can't read symbols: file format not recognized.

they are not

user

I thought one was for dynamically linked stuff and one for statically linked stuff?

@Ginger Answer: files with the "a" extension, and carefully

Gimme my million bucks please

Ginger

file says they're current ar archives

@user no

lyxal

@Ginger I swear I've asked this somewhere before

Ginger

13:37

you're right about the difference tho

.a is static and .so is dynamic

user

Ah, so I guess .so is shared object?

lyxal

in The Nineteenth Byte, May 25 at 1:58, by lyxal

What's a .a file?

in The Nineteenth Byte, May 25 at 2:00, by Bbrk24

@lyxal static libraries you link into during compilation

user

in The Nineteenth Byte, May 25 at 2:00, by Bbrk24

@lyxal static libraries you link into during compilation

Dammit ninja'd

lyxal

:p

Oop rain time

Everyone make sure you ☂️

Ginger

okay, I think I got it to load the symbols from the binaries

#0  0x00007fffe0af662d in ?? ()
#1  0x0000000000000206 in ?? ()
#2  0x00007fffe0af6724 in ?? ()
#3  0x00007ffff7d3f490 in ?? () from /usr/lib/jvm/java-17-openjdk-amd64/lib/server/libjvm.so
#4  0x00007ffff6702400 in ?? ()
#5  0x00007ffff795d50a in VM_Version::get_processor_features() ()
   from /usr/lib/jvm/java-17-openjdk-amd64/lib/server/libjvm.so
#6  0x49656e696c65746e in ?? ()
#7  0x01040800000406f1 in ?? ()
#8  0x1f8bfbfffffab223 in ?? ()
#9  0x01c0003f0c000121 in ?? ()
#10 0x000000000000003f in ?? ()

narrator: they did not

lyxal

13:40

Rain time over

Everyone put their ☂️ as 🌂 please

Thamnk you in advanece

Ginger

I do not think that this method is working

time to take a long, hard look at my Scala

lyxal

Scala! :D

Ginger

>

val malloc = LLVMAddFunction(module, "malloc", LLVMFunctionType(ts.pointer, PointerPointer(1).put(0, ts.platformint), 1, 0))

find the null in that line

lyxal

PointerPointer(1)?

user

ts.pointer?

Ginger

13:42

oh right yall don't have context

user

What's ts?

Is ts.pointer an object representing a pointer type?

Or is it an actual pointer?

Ginger

given LLVMContextRef = context

there, you should be able to understand everything now

user

Wow thanks

Ginger

:p

user

Such helpful

lyxal

13:43

is context null? :p

Ginger

ts is a TypeSupplier, which is a utility class containing lots of LLVMTypeRefs representing types used by the builder code

user

Ah

lyxal

Nah context being null shouldn't be impacting anything

user

Are there any classes with similar names to PointerPointer?

Ginger

nope

user

13:44

Like IntPointer?

Oh ok

Ginger

PointerPointer is a class from the JavaCPP core libs

lyxal

Is module null?

Ginger

and I suspect it's the source of the error

user

I don't get why it's called PointerPointer and not Pointer

If you set it to something other than 0, does it segfault instead?

Ginger

because the LLVMTypeRefs are pointers themselves

lyxal

13:44

Oh oh I said that! I said PointerPointer!

Does that mean I got it right?

user

Yes you did!

lyxal

Do I get [wild prizes]??!

Ginger

I was getting errors earlier from PointerPointer about the types being null

lyxal

@user oh good stuff. Very good stuff.

Ginger

which were replaced by this segfault after I changed how I was constructing it

user

13:45

@lyxal As an award, you win 👌

Ginger

so something is null that shouldn't be

lyxal

@user oh brilliant

Wonderful

Excellent evem

*even

user

@Ginger Are you sure the segfault is because it's null and not because it's a pointer to some inaccessible part of memory?

lyxal

@Ginger print all the values and see which is null

Ginger

> siginfo: si_signo: 11 (SIGSEGV), si_code: 1 (SEGV_MAPERR), si_addr: 0x0000000000000000

yes

@lyxal I'll try

lyxal

13:47

Bonus points if you get copilot to generate the println boilerplate for you

Any news?

Ginger

I have a suspicion that it's not the parameters that are null

the segfault happens when I try to build a call instruction for that function

so maybe the function isn't being added to the module correctly

well, it's being added to the module

maybe I skipped a step...?

...since when has the builder been able to just make mallocs

and frees too???

but not reallocs

lyxal

Since forever probably

Idk I've never used llvm

Ginger

it seems to be a utility function

that is so very strange

sadly there's nothing for realloc ;-;

Ginger

14:25

@lyxal imagine having copilot

math scat

14:55

@Dlosc I have no idea why, but this seems to work. Is my guess correct? I'm not quite sure.

Someone

alrihgt

(waiting to see how long it takes for someone to get triggered by the typo)

Ginger

OMG

I fixed it

I was passing the return type of the function to LLVMBuildCall2 instead of the function type itself

and now it works :|

smh can't believe I did that

anyway, the fruit of my labors:

; ModuleID = 'vyxal'
source_filename = "vyxal"

declare i64 @malloc(i64)

declare void @free(i64)

declare i64 @realloc(i64, i64)

define i32 @main() {
entry:
  %alloca = alloca i64, align 8
  store i64 1, ptr %alloca, align 4
  %alloca1 = alloca i64, align 8
  store i64 2, ptr %alloca1, align 4
  %load = load i64, ptr %alloca1, align 4
  %malloc = call i64 @malloc(i64 72)
  %getLengthPtr = getelementptr inbounds { i64, i64 }, i64 %malloc, i32 0, i32 0
  %getNItems = load i64, ptr addrspace(64) %getLengthPtr, align 4

1 hour later…

Bbrk24

16:16

TIL []=[] is legal JS

(destructuring assignment where you don't bind anything)

Rydwolf Programs

ooh interesting

Unrelated String

phenomenal

...now i wonder if that also goes in python

it does

Rydwolf Programs

I would assume not

Unrelated String

both []=[] and ()=() appear to be perfectly legal

Rydwolf Programs

Doesn't Python's destructuring assignment use commas without an outer delimiter?

Oh intertesting

Unrelated String

16:18

@RydwolfPrograms that's the idiomatic way but it's just tuple syntax

i had no idea it would also work with [] though lmao

Rydwolf Programs

Yeah does Python even have destructuring assignment for lists?

Unrelated String

it works with arbitrary iterables on the rhs

well, as long as there's no length mismatch

Rydwolf Programs

oh that's actually kinda neat

Oh it seems JS does too?

[a, b] = "cd"

Unrelated String

nice

Bbrk24

I discovered this because I was looking at a new language that compiles to TS, and I got it to generate const [,] = m;

Unrelated String

16:22

ahaha they even work in haskell

Bbrk24

user image

@noodleman and/or I might start golfing in Civet

Someone

16:43

noice

JS does it again

DLosc

16:57

@emanresuA Ok well first of all, "smaller than a kilobyte" was intended to exclude the tinylisp formatter from consideration. :P But if you're saying you can't use multiple recursion because it'll blow the call stack on too-large inputs, that's true, but I'm not sure how that's different from any other language--you could say the same for my Python code.

user image

@mathscat So close!--but reversed & palindromized doesn't work (should output cbaabc, but gives cbacba). That's because it's parsing as .(R(a.a)), but you want (.(Ra)).a (see the output from verbose mode).

Also, this is on-topic about CGCC, so we should probably move to TNB ;)

Rydwolf Programs

17:25

wth...every time I reload I either get Ginger's pronouns or Bbrk's

I guess there's not enough gender to go around

DLosc

@UnrelatedString Doesn't work in Pip, tho (well, it's still a no-op in any case, but it generates a warning about assigning to a non-lvalue)

1 hour later…

math scat

18:51

@DLosc oof

I do have a 10+ byte solution, but that’s pretty intuitive

emanresu A

@DLosc I guess that's true, and mostly up to personal preference

Ginger

19:33

yo @Seggan

do Vyxal arrays store references to their contents or the content objects directly

user

19:55

It doesn't matter

It stores references to their contents because that's what Python and the JVM do

If for some reason you need to store the contents directly, that would work too, because all Vyxal values are immutable

Ginger

ighto

user

Also, there's a dedicated chat room for this :P

Someone

what?

Ginger

@user feel free to move it yourself :p

can strings go in list literals?

Someone

20:15

is this about vyxal?

Ginger

yes

user

@Ginger Yes, as can list literals

@Ginger ...I'm not an RO

Ginger

@user then why does [# "amogus" #] cause a MatchError?

@user that's the joke :b

oh wait nvm

I may be stupid lol

user

No you're Ginger

But I guess you've found out that opening brackets are #[?

Ginger

20:32

yes

and I said I may be stupid, not that I was stupid

checkmate atheist

1 hour later…

Rydwolf Programs

21:51

Okay I've resigned myself to the fact that I will never understand girls

The girl I've been talking to hasn't replied to a message I sent like a day ago asking about AP chem, and she set her note on insta at 5 am today to Yellow by Coldplay with a sparkly burrito emoji and I don't even know how to BEGIN to interpret that

Bbrk24

22:38

user image

I feel like “I’m not gonna doxx myself what |:<“ is something @Ginger would say

Joao-3

i just installed rust

i now consider myself a rustacean

user

22:55

Nice

~~You'll be a true Rustacean the day cat ears magically appear in your closet~~

7

@RydwolfPrograms Rydwolf incel arc

I'm taking a class on compilers right now, and the thing I was most looking forward to, type checking and other compile-time analysis, isn't a part of it. We're just directly compiling a Lisp to assembly :(

And there's a research group at my university that researches programming languages, but the Zoom link to their weekly meetings doesn't work and there's no other way to find them (I emailed them and was pointed to the Zoom link; the person I emailed isn't even here anymore)

I think I'm gonna have to completely give up on becoming a researcher studying programming languages

Seems like it's too niche to easily get a position

Much easier to become a normal software engineer and make programming languages as a hobby

DLosc

@user Can confirm

Ginger

@Bbrk24 it wasn't me I swear

DLosc

@Ginger But if it was you, you'd still deny it so you don't doxx yourself

Ginger

I guess we'll never know

DLosc

Anyway, the main thing we know is it's not Radvylf :P

Ginger

23:06

I know Rydwolf's:
- full name
- school name
- age
- appearance
- town of residence

and I didn't even have to go look for that stuff, he just posted it all here

Dannyu NDos

Is it just my opinion, or is "Department of Standard & Intellectual Property" too long?

Seggan

@Ginger references, because JVM and Python are both like that

Ginger

ended up not mattering

Rydwolf Programs

23:36

@user wtf

user

23:51

Because there's all those jokes about Rust turning people into furries

Not sure how you interpreted it but I wasn't trying to poke fun at furries or something, just joking about Rust's community has a disproportionate number of furries

Oh you meant the other message

That was a joke too. I just found it funny how one person didn't see your message or forgot to respond to it for a day and you jumped straight to all girls being impossible to understand

I'm not actually calling you an incel, I know you're anything but. Should've left a :P

lyxal

@Bbrk24 38°43'32.0"N 80°48'48.0"W

user

@Bbrk24 I once heard that home is where the heart is

Which must really suck for heart transplant patients :P

lyxal

@lyxal the best part is that this is in West Virginia

meaning that the lyric "take me Home, country roads" was about a guy literally asking to go somewhere on country roads

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Sep '2327

The Sand Trap

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