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16:00
(I already know what to think when I see a USR modem sitting on top of an RS6000...)
AS1239 SprintLink Global Network
IP-range/subnet	199.0.0.0/14
199.0.0.0 - 199.3.255.255
But I like my photo tours... Sure, you say... how do you connect your PC's to a serial-only server solution?
user image
5
Right. Still is. And some of those addresses are in use by other people...
The tape is a nice touch.
@MichaelHampton Better than the rubber bands I've used in the past.
@MichaelHampton Yes, I know... so when people are logged in, sometimes, we'll see the Linux server resolve the internal IP to an external hostname.
@ewwhite oh. my. god. I'm almost impressed.
16:04
Was it just previously unassigned, long ago, and people started using it for private space? I can't find an RFC that mentions it.
@ewwhite I always think it odd when they put the company name on darn near every screen... Like employees will constantly be forgetting where they work.
r0ar
@MichaelHampton It started being used in the early 1990's by the company I used to work for long ago.
199.3.63.x was their IP space... no NAT.
and they shipped their Unix systems out with the scheme they used internally
mainly because remote access was Dialup -> Modem -> serial terminal server -> telnet -> server
Morning
16:08
I kept looking around that desk for the box of floppy disks.
@ewwhite how do you connect your PC's to a serial-only server solution? with clear packing tape, of course. LOL!
No worse than the fscking login banners legal makes us put up everywhere. Just as pointless, and much more annoying/intrusive.

"Well, I was gonna hack this network, but now that I see a login banner warning me not to, I'll just disconnect immediately!"

Jag-offs.
@ewwhite Is that a PIX?
And how do you convince a customer to upgrade their networking?
@ScottPack No, 1700 series router.
16:12
I think we have the exact same model at one of our remote sites, still.
@ewwhite off topic, but what camera did you use to shoot that pic?
I think that's a 1700 series router
@ewwhite Ok good. That's the one I was looking at.
@ScottPack There's a Pix 515e sitting on top of a Symantec SGS, with a Cisco 1700 T1 router...
and a 5-port Mini Hub
and two lines going off to a phone system that bypasses the Pix
@ewwhite Wait. Hub? Seriously? Is it a 10/100?
My previous job I had just replaced a 515e PIX w/ a ASA 5505
16:13
@vCole Canon 30D at that time.
@ewwhite Do you bring it with you everywhere? I have a 50D, seems like it would be too bulky to tote with me everyday.
@ewwhite In a mess like that? Unplug one cable at random, and then disappear for a week.
@ewwhite You put that in your bag right now. Do you have any idea how useful, and hard to find, 10/100 hubs are?
@vCole I've since moved on... usually a Canon 1DMk4 or a Fuji X100
Oh yeah that's a def a hub, we had those at my previous job....@ewwhite are you at my old employer in CT? :P
16:15
@ScottPack a hub, because no crossover cables were handy
It seems
@ewwhite Hope you kept it. We always keep hubs in our jump bags.
@ScottPack It's been removed. Today, the setup is... um... different.
@ScottPack I'll take it with.
@ewwhite I like how all those cables on the right hand side were clearly installed by a climber.
Expanded to a 48-port switch
:)
@HopelessN00b The idea behind those banners is that it makes it clear the person was told he couldn't access the system. Helps with the law in some countries, and helps make your case in all of them.
16:19
@ewwhite What are those two big grey boxes with the fan grills?
@ewwhite What are those white connectors on the green cables?
So I've told customer that a cleanup is in order
wow, great cabling
@WesleyDavid Phone systems.
@tombull89 Serial over Cat5 going to Micom Serial->IP multiplexers
It sucks... Every phone, security, video and PC tech who comes there adds a layer of WTF to the equation.
Ahh that's a scary mess.
16:24
Oh, that's just the rear...
I don't like messy rears...
3
The front.
Dan
Dan
@ewwhite I had to do an audit on something similar to that. It was a live system and I was trying to get serial numbers - every time I went near it I was just waiting for the dreaded sound of a dozen fans powering down, or for the phones to go mental
Still got some serial connections on my network here >:D
16:28
I was there last weekend, and I left because there were so many roaches coming out of the servers...
Okay, "so many" == 3
Dan
Dan
Okay, I wouldn't like that
@ewwhite Fly me to LA and I will gladly recable your mess
@ewwhite There's other options
Anyway, I'd love to get this place into better shape. Need some Los Angeles reinforcement
Dan
Dan
A CIsco chassis switch:D
I can't get them to agree on an HP chassis switch.
so there are 3 x 24-port netgears hidden in that mess
Well, I could do that, too
Dan
Dan
So why won't they buy proper stuff? Just money?
16:36
@gparent Problem is they're legally worthless (almost as bad as the disclaimers at the bottom of emails), in point of fact. (At least in the US, where we're based and do all our business.)
lotsa money
Dan
Dan
I mean is that the reason they won't go for it
Or do they just not see the benefit?
@Dan "Why do we need it? Everything works fine now"
Can someone cast their eye over my Q and A to make sure it makes sense? serverfault.com/q/450038/106401
@ewwhite Do them a favor and troll /b/ from some of their systems. Once anonymous is done with them, they'll have no option but to replace it all with something... less insane.
Dan
Dan
16:39
@ewwhite Yeah, tough one with that attitude
You need an etherkiller
but the justification for better stuff should be, "easier for your admin to manage?"
@HaydnWVN Makes sense, but better solution is to set SBS on fire and replace it with something less sucktastic (and new hardware, from the sounds of things).
Not just "easier" to manage, but "possible" to manage.
If I said, "buy Elfiq load balancers to make your interwebz more resilient", I get a yes and a blank check
Hey @ewwhite, have you scripted any vSphere config changes like I'm doing? Such that they actually WORK?
16:42
Or a Barracuda web filter to make your employees do less Brazzers and xHamster.... (blank check)
@ewwhite Another option - make sure there's a bottleneck that impacts backups... "Our backups are failing/taking too long, HALP!" "You need this, this and one of these."
@MichaelHampton Gremlins live in ALL unmanaged switches
@HaydnWVN they don't have backups.
@HopelessN00b Combustion is currently not an option
@ewwhite :EEEEEEEEEEEEE
Gremlins, dude. Gremlins live in those unmanaged consumer switches. And they like to come out and wreak havoc on your poor network...
3
16:43
(and seriously, "unmanaged consumer switch" is redundant. There's no such thing as an unmanaged enterprise switch -- EVERYONE can afford a fucking netgear GigE managed switch these days :P)
So I now have triply-redundant diversified inbound/outbound net, an MPLS between sites... local and remote data replication for their app servers (no official backups, though)
but can't force them to buy my HP switch (last one in my stock)
@ewwhite Don't tell anybody that last weekend I pointed at a certain web site as an example of what happens if your backups don't work perfectly...
@ewwhite So, on that note, I have a question. Are all your clients insane, or just all the ones you talk to us about?
2
We've found it's almost cheaper to buy new switches every couple of years instead of pay hardware support on them...
@HaydnWVN What do you think the odds are that they have (or it's possible to get) hardware support on their unmanaged, SOHO network devices?
16:47
0
Q: redmine repository management

AlexWe are trying to setup a redmine installation for our group which should work with both SVN and Git repos. Since we want to keep the repos on the server and avoid the whole privileges and hosting mess (root access, local repos, ...), we want configure redmine to manage repo creation and destructi...

Not sure if off-topic...
@HopelessN00b Like I said, it depends on the country. And either way, it still makes your case stronger than not having one.
@gparent Not in this country, it doesn't. (Trust the guy with experience in this arena.)
Maybe you'll only ever get hacked from and in the US and jurisdiction will never be an issue for you.
They're not required, but it's false to say they're entirely useless.
@ewwhite Every geek. That's almost as good as pr0n, innit?
@HopelessN00b All are a little crazy...
16:48
I know, I read your chat above.
Repeating yourself won't change my point...
But they each have their quirks...I mean, who wants to hear about the perfectly-managed site with pristine data center?
Okay... so is THIS porn?
That's frightening in completely different ways.
Here's the secret...
the rear...
And half the equipment you see in the first photo isn't even plugged into anything.
@MichaelHampton why no DV for the LQ ?
16:54
wtf
So that UPS is completely unused. Figures.
It was all a big front... to make it look like the systems were doing something.
@MichaelHampton I don't really see the point of flagging them if you're not going to do something yourself
@Iain Eh, I generally don't bother with downvotes for anything other than spam or wrong answers.
@MichaelHampton completely... never even finished installation
16:56
@ewwhite Is this at a place in Chicago or NYC?
@MichaelHampton or leave a comment to the effect thet we don't like link and run answers ...
Maybe write another answer? But the question is kind of crappy...
@Iain Speaking of flags, what does "disputed" mean in a flagging summary? (From a practical standpoint.)
@MichaelHampton I downvote for poor punctuation, grammar, or spelling.
@ewwhite Are you in LA right now?
@WesleyDavid LA. Another produce company.
In Chicago.
16:59
@Iain I just did that... and then your comment appeared. The AJAX stuff has been acting weird for me all morning...
@HopelessN00b AIUI if someone (non mod) flags something as for example NAA and then some other (non mod) disagrees then it becomes disputed
oh boy that was a horrible URL/domain btw, it's not that bad
So, in an effort to bring a solution to a customer, I'd like to know how to fix this situation: The place with the roaches and cabling mess has no Windows domain. Users are on Win7 or XP Home. They use the hell out of Dropbox.
I suggested a file server.
hmm, someone just came back and read the constructive comment I left them and has unaccepted my answer :)
17:03
They obviously don't have a lawyer?
"But we like Dropbox... We can see our files everywhere, without worrying about VPN's, logging in or anything"
Haha, so can anybody else.
Yes and it will be for exactly the same reason. I'll leave it as an exercise for you
to figure it our yourself. This is all very basic stuff you should invest some time in learning the tools you're working with rather than blundering from one problem to the next. It'll save you lots of time in the long run.
@ewwhite That's a server room mullet.
Is there a corporate-palatable version of Dropbox for a firm like this?
@ewwhite - any opinions on Michelin Pro Race 3 tyres ?
@MichaelHampton What's wrong with Dropbox in this context?
@ewwhite Windows Server + Windows 7 Enterprise with DirectAccess
and i'm not joking, I really think it's the closest alternative
@ewwhite Dropbox has access to your files, and if users aren't extremely careful, so does the entire world.
@Iain Man, I'm on tubulars only... But it depends on what you think you need. I'm a huge fan of Veloflex tyres.
17:08
@MichaelHampton This, basically. If you must use teh cloudz for something like that, you really need to use a place that encrypts your data and doesn't have the keys to decrypt it. Don't think there's one like that which is as user-friendly as dropbox.
Make up your mind which message you want to star!
@MichaelHampton The most sensitive files still sit on the fileserver..
@ewwhite I generally use Michelin Krylion Carbons but a local store has the PR3 down to $30 from $55 (approx)
@ewwhite I've heard good things about Wuala in the last few seconds; perhaps you could look into them? :)
Wuala protects your privacy: In stark contrast to most other cloud storage services, all your files get encrypted on your computer, so that no one - including the employees at Wuala and LaCie - can access your private files. Your password never leaves your computer.
17:10
but with a BYOD policy (and this place was BYOD before "BYOD" was coined), the users need a way to get files wherever...
@WesleyDavid Guess where I am!
@Iain go for it
@HopelessN00b We have a 'Jetstream' device covered (serial printers network hub) easily with our hardware support company that's 15 years old and they'll never be able to replace or repair...
Good gawd, you could probably rearchitect the whole network for the price of that support contract.
@HaydnWVN I'm not familiar with it, but I'm guessing it's not a switch you can pickup at BestBuy for $149.
17:15
@ewwhite Linux, Samba, no permissions...?
there are 5 locations and mobile salespeople
@HopelessN00b Definately not, but when paying ~£150 per year for 3x48 port HP switches and we could buy new for £120 (each)...
Just replace one and keep the 'old' for support
so people just want to be able to share a single PDF, for instance...
@Iain buy it
@MichaelHampton Fair play to them, nothing else (even D-Link print servers) comes close to speed
but then with the Jetstream the spoolings setup to happen on the server not the client
17:23
morning
@HaydnWVN Ha, yeah, I googled the product and found the user manual on their site. Then I found they're still making the stuff.
@MichaelHampton Oh, I have plenty of those devices.
These are older dotmatrix printers with custom size tractor feed labels... There doesn't seem to be many recent advances in dot matrix printers lol
@ewwhite Why is the server on the left photobombing the switches?
17:25
@ewwhite i'll take them off your hands
I run my green-bar and impact printers in some of these sites using the Perle/Chase IOlan terminal servers
@MikeyB loooool
@ewwhite That picture is of stuff being removed, not installed, right?
@ewwhite One of our customers has this awesome huge high-speed impact wheel printer. When you start printing it revs up and it takes about 4 seconds (ISTR) to spit out a page full of text. It's nuts.
@MichaelHampton gulp...
@MikeyB I have two of them in the same room as that photo.
Datatronics and IBM
17:27
At least your cables are labeled.
@MikeyB And you have to wear ear protection to get within 100 yards of it?
I came across an install a few years ago where some idiot had cut cat5 cables from the back of a patch panel, twisted them together (+electrical tape) to similarly cut patch leads and plugged them into switches...
@MichaelHampton It's quiet enough that it's in their office space.
Now that's state of the art!
(ie cut cables from the patch panel and bodged RJ45's onto the ends)
@HaydnWVN Hope you told him that Base-T doesn't require terminators.
17:30
@HaydnWVN Gremlins.
@MikeyB I was brought in to solve some network 'connectivity' issues...
hometime anyways, ciao o/
So what's the dropbox equivalent?
Didn't we go over that already?
23 mins ago, by HopelessN00b
@ewwhite I've heard good things about Wuala in the last few seconds; perhaps you could look into them? :)
r...roar?
17:33
28 mins ago, by Michael Hampton
@ewwhite http://www.wuala.com/en/business/
I mean, is there a good-er reason to move this place from dropbox?
@ewwhite Depends entirely on whether or not there's valuable information I could steal from their Dropboxes, TBH.
not really
@ewwhite Then yeah, convert them over for the reasons the porcupine just linked. :)
17:35
Not to mention the Dropbox security breach a couple months ago...
pcworld.com/article/2010282/… I haven't tried any of these.
I just want to avoid them DDOS-ing themselves when Jim-Bob uploads a 30mb PDF file.
If there's a nice Microsoft product that handles this, or even ties to sharepoint or something, that'd be coo, too
Citrix ShareFile?
But why not Dropbox? This wasn't their first breach... zdnet.com/dropbox-gets-hacked-again-7000001928
I'm looking at Sharefile
working in "the cloud", I now see that many of these services are probably run in a shady manner
@MichaelHampton why not A GODDAMN SFTP SERVER?
@ewwhite If that was in London, I'd take it off your hands.
17:40
@voretaq7 Because the clueless users will never figure it out.
Hey, remember when you had to be smart enough to figure out FTP to share files on the internet? Let's go back to that!
@MichaelHampton See above ^
Yeah, and go back to searching for stuff with archie and veronica!
@MichaelHampton Also you know some UX cockbiter will just make it an explorer / gnome shell extension.
@MichaelHampton Altavista, you n00b!
Altavista was for n00bs.
@voretaq7 While we're bettering the internet, let's limit chat and IM to people who can figure out IRC too.
17:41
@voretaq7 When home users think they're savvy due to the commercialization of certain technologies, they begin to demand the same in the workplace.
Forget it, just ban anybody who never got on the Internet before Endless September. That'll also fix the IP address shortage!
@HopelessN00b nah, leave IRC to the 13 year olds with hairless nutsacks. I like the more mature 14-year-old level of discussion we have in hre.
Oh, and limit "fourms" to people who cam figure out newsgroups.
@MichaelHampton @ewwhite We use ShareFile, Citrix just bought them a few months ago
I like it well enough; and their dev teams seem to be fairly responsive to idea suggestions
@ChrisS do you have mobile device support?
17:43
@HopelessN00b Limit chat rooms to people who can spell?
@chriss and AD support?
@ewwhite It's included... Some free app, I haven't used it myself, boss has.
@ChrisS :(
@ewwhite No AD support
@ewwhite Wow, these guys actually have Active Directory?
17:44
@ChrisS who manages users/permissions?
@MichaelHampton Nope... But I will implement.
@ewwhite We do through their web interface.
We use it for sending/receiving files to/from clients.
Active Directory Integration: Activate, authenticate, create and update ShareFile accounts against the Active Directory
As soon as I plan a way off of dovecot and squirrelmail...
@MichaelHampton You think gremlins live in consumer switches, try those stupid fscking USB<>Network "print servers" that were sold before HP printers came stock with RJ45 jacks.
@ewwhite RoundCube spanks SquirrelMail in every way.
17:46
Nothing wrong with dovecot.
Half those damn things had brain-dead little DHCP servers in them that would randomly turn on after a power cut (whether by power strip or building power...)
I was attached to SquirrelMail for the longest time, as it's super simple. But RoundCube got their SQLite support together and there's no reason to use SM ever again. =]
@ChrisS except when users have large mailboxes...
@ChrisS Yeah, we still have it for users who want to access email in a hurry. We also have it for users who are too stupid to figure out Thunderbird.
Lot's of I/O wait with Roundcube
17:47
@ewwhite I can fix that
@ewwhite Interesting. I haven't seen problems like that...
(delete the rrd file)
But I've got the largest mailbox on the server, and I keep my inbox to <1k e-mails. Plus my IMAP and RoundCube installs are on different servers 500 miles apart.
just one user causing issues... but I'll push them to Exchange.
yeah, Postgres backend, vacuuming, XFS filesystem, etc.
BBWC and all of that
:-X
17:57
@TomO'Connor Nobody guessed where you are. =(
I'm going to guess...
YOU'RE AT STACKEXCHANGE'S LONDON OFFICE!
2
Frabjous Joy. While the D-Link DGS1248T switches that we use here support Link Aggregation, it only works with D-Link's proprietary protocol (WTFFF?) and does not work with 802.3ad....
@Adrian Caloo Calay.
well, less than an hour into work, i'm already bored!
=(
@David KITTY ALL THE THINGS?
@voretaq7 w....whhaa....what?
Is this some kind of sexual innuendo...?
Thats what you kids are calling it these days...?
Kitty'ing?
@David . . . sure, let's go with that.
@David it is now, but that's your fault
(this is how rumors get started)
@freiheit @voretaq7 youre the ones who are talking about it!
18:08
@David But you made it sound sexual!
@voretaq7 Like the one about you and the cross-dressing bartender on 74th street with the greased kangaroo and glitter?
there needs to be a way to collapse posts here
without clearing the entire screen
@WesleyDavid 72nd street. Get it right.
@David Like that? :-)
(unfortunately you can only collapse your own posts, or bug mods to do it)
yes
im sure at least one person thinks less of me now
(in my office)
18:25
"Windows failed to apply the %8 settings. %8 settings might have its own log file. Please click the "More information" link."
The following Group Policy client-side extensions do not provide additional troubleshooting information at this time:
<list of ~20 items I'd love to troubleshoot>
:/
postgres[79998]: [2-1] FATAL: the database system is starting up
damn impatient client programs...
@pauska And? What did you change about your %8 settings? =D
18:44
yawn
Hey guys, would you like this question? OP has asked if this is better for SF instead of SU?
0
Q: TCP: Maximum number of connections (client and server)

lxgrIn the description of TCP in the Wikipedia, it is stated that The number of sessions in the server side is limited only by memory and can grow as new connections arrive, but the client must allocate a random port before sending the first SYN to the server. The first part seems logical: The ...

@ewwhite did $magazineWebsite get figured out?
@studiohack I think it would probably be a better fit on Unix and Linux. Might get beaten up a bit here for being a bit broad and not explicitly a practical, answerable questions based on actual problems that you face and not related to managing computer systems in a professional capacity.
I wouldn't mind it, and would probably throw an upvote at it, but I dunno about everyone else.
@HopelessN00b Okay, was just curious, I wasn't sure, hence why I asked you guys, since you're the experts of SF :)
Hi Erik,

Thank you for your revert on the issue. I would have a research done on the event received and see if there is relevant documentation available for the issue, at first glance I did not find information on the same.

I would revert to you with an update on the same and there might be a small delay for a revert as I would have to involve my SME to assist me with the analysis and provide you with an update on the same.
18:48
cheers!
WOULD WOULD WOULD WOULD
I love outsourced tech support!
@pauska Tech support from India FTW?
I would say would a lot less. Maybe.
@pauska WOOD WOOD WOOD WOOD
especially when we're talking about a $100k SAN
18:50
Hate to link to a "competing" site, but anyone feel like answering my question over on Quora? It's about IT and choosing a Bachelors degree program. quora.com/Information-and-Communications-Technology-ICT/…
@David Huh, why did I think Quora was dead?
@HopelessN00b probably because of the annoying name. Your brain secretly tried to hide it from you.
QOUUORA
it's like queueuuueueu
@studiohack We've got one of those laying around somewhere too... If you want to migrate we'll just close as a dupe. Hopeless is also "correct" that it probably should have been OT for SF, but... meh.
@ChrisS thanks for the info. Probably just going to leave it on SU as it is. see what the community does.
@David Short answer is "maybe," though. You'd have to check the official government agency reqs for what qualifies as an "IT" degree. I personally have an MIS degree (transferred outta CIS), and find it immensely more useful in the private sector to have a basic education in the important areas of business, but my gut says the government would probably consider a BA to be a BA, regardless of concentration.
18:55
@David Why do you want to work for the government... Being the sysadmin for a organization that employees spies doesn't mean that you are Q, or get to date bond girls. :D
@HopelessN00b by BA do you mean Bachelors? or Bachelor of Arts
If they have an MIS degree instead, that should be pretty safe in that regard, and as I said, much more useful than a CIS degree.
@Zoredache you never know, man!
@David No, Business Administration. If that's what you're degree says, that's generally as far as the government cares to look, in my experience.
@HopelessN00b oh gotcha
yeah...thats what has me worried
while looking through the degree programs, they all seem to come back to being the same as Business Admin, even if they're called something else
18:57
Minors and "concentrations" they either don't care about, or are too stupid or bureaucratic to consider. In my experience, again.
I dont think a true "IT" program exists within the CSUs
@David What do the school and/or the agency say about it?
@HopelessN00b what do you mean?

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