The Comms Room

MichelZ

19:00

@pauska are there good devs?

Iain

@pauska just look at the front page of SF

MichelZ

ah je, Skeet counts as a good one probably :)

HopelessN00b

@ChrisS That was true, once upon a time. I don't think IE9 was any better than IE8, or IE11 is any better than IE10. Or IE8, for that matter. More of a matter of opinion, though, whereas IE5.5 is/was undeniably vile.

Nathan C

Arghhhh, ruby is pissing me off

Trying to get rmagick to install, but it's refusing to take the directory i pass it

pauska

@NathanC can't you just gem it inside a docker?

Nathan C

19:17

@pauska It's failing because it can't find imagemagick headers...but I have them installed

they're just in a different location that i can't pass to the installer

pauska

@NathanC I'm just messing with you, I have no fcking clue about ruby or dockers or anything the like

Nathan C

@pauska Heh...it's okay. I tried manually compiling it (which worked), but then the files vanished

MichelZ

@pauska they just announced that they bring docker to windows

Michael Hampton

Why? You've already got App-V?

ewwhite

Docker, interesting

pauska

19:28

Device naa.600601601d6231001efc9cf61af3e211
performance has deteriorated. I/O latency
increased from average value of 15606
microseconds to 851124 microseconds.

Santa, please get me a flash SAN for christmas

patch tuesday is murdering the one we have..

MichelZ

@MichaelHampton app-v solves a different problem, I think. app-v is mostly client apps, isn't it?

pauska

App-V is only client apps

MichelZ

@pauska stagger them

yeah, just disabled SSL3.0

go gpo, go

Nick

@MichelZ and im just here with a sore throat and coughing like no tomorrow

MichelZ

@Nick i knew that you're a sick basterd

:)

Nick

19:37

@MichelZ yeaa I may have to call in sick tomorrow... dont feel like going to work

voretaq7

@Nick YOU HAVE EBOLA! GO LOCK YOURSELF IN THE DATACENTER!

MichelZ

@voretaq7 not the DC... it kills all the bits

pauska

ignite.microsoft.com

ThoriumBR

don't worry, they have antivirus installed...

pauska

(the old TechEd, MEC, Lync etc)

Nick

19:42

@voretaq7 But... I have AVG installed in my brain, its suposed to protect me!

voretaq7

@Nick that's probably how you got it! :)

Mathias R. Jessen

@pauska Chicago 1871 revisited

lol

MichelZ

damn hotel wifi

can't watch plex :(

Chris S

Unfixed problem with DFS deleting reparse points when the namespace root is a drive root since 2008 - Nope, don't worry about fixing it anytime in the last 6 years, or having the GUI throw a warning when creating the configuration, nobody will ever feel like throwing a server out a window or anything.

ThoriumBR

@MichelZ because of bandwidth or restriction?

Chris S

19:57

Seriously Microsoft - what's it going to take to get a Bugzilla tracker or something? It's 2014 already!

Nathan C

Heh, I really like aptitude ...I was finally able to get concerto to start installing

MichelZ

@ThoriumBR bandwidth

Nathan C

it has a pretty nice dependency resolver

MichelZ

@ChrisS it's called connect.. connect.microsoft.com

Mathias R. Jessen

@ChrisS connect.microsoft.com

Chris S

19:59

Yeah, I've used that bit bucket before... I know exactly where those bug reports end up.

MichelZ

i've actually seen stuff get implemented

it just takes like forever :)

Nathan C

oh boy...and it failed on that same damn gem

-_-

Chris S

How do you employ 64,000 "Engineers" (programmers et al) and it still takes the better part of a decade to fix bugs??

I probably shouldn't be surprised... Especially after HP announced it's cutting 55,000 redundant jobs.

It just blows my mind that you can have THAT many employees who are doing the repeating the same job as someone else in the company.

MichelZ

@Chris: they have like 64'000 products... so 1 dev per product in average :D

Chris S

@MichelZ Well, I twitch a bit when I see Talks given by actual development teams from MS... Things like DFS are a great example, the team is only like 3 people. Makes me wonder if those 3 devs have 57 managers or similar.

Ry Jones

20:06

@ChrisS we worked in triads at Microsoft in 2005-2007.

One test, one dev, one PM per feature

Chris S

Sounds like things haven't changed.

@MathiasR.Jessen Am I blind or is there no "Windows" product there to report bugs?

MichelZ

yeah, there isn't @ChrisS

you have to open a support case, I think

Michael Hampton

Yes, you have to pay Microsoft to report a bug. I never could quite get over that.

MichelZ

@MichaelHampton imagine the pile of crap they get... proabably SF^100

Michael Hampton

@MichelZ Yeah, there is that.

Ry Jones

20:14

I wrote up my experience running a beta at Microsoft. It sucked. The bugs sucked. It wasn't worth it.

Michael Hampton

Well, there's always RHEL. You can report bugs, but you have to wait a year or two to get a bug fixed.

Ry Jones

People get into betas just to get new software, they aren't skilled at filing bugs, and they complain about the low quality.

MichelZ

yeah, now imagine RHEL being used by >1 billion people... and what that would do to the bug tracking system :D

@RyJones most people do, yes

Iain

Red Hat's bugzilla is as slow as a slow thing

Michael Hampton

@Iain Bugzilla is slow, no matter whose it is.

Iain

20:23

The zforce bug I found has been assigned

Michael Hampton

A bug I found 15 months ago is finally getting fixed in RHEL 6.6

Since it was quite important, (and for some other reasons) I wound up with a mix of Fedora and RHEL 7 :)

Iain

mine is a month or two short of 2 years

the one I found is entirely unimportant and clearly no one uses it

Chris S

@MichaelHampton That would be completely acceptable.... How I think most companies should approach bugs. Report for free, prioritizing costs, otherwise it gets fixed eventually/probably, if they get to it.

Ry Jones

@ChrisS no commitment to fixing bugs should be made.

you can't save every puppy, no matter how cute

MichelZ

@RyJones you could

but you are certainly going out of business doing so

ThoriumBR

20:31

@MichelZ so you could, but only for a short time...

Chris S

@RyJones Sure, you have to make a reasonable guess at what's the impact, the cost to fix, and such.

Michael Hampton

Ah, but you're thinking of a Microsoft, which can't really leverage the open source efforts of a million developers.

Ry Jones

@MichaelHampton You know Windows source is widely distributed in CS programs, no?

Chris S

It would be perfectly valid for them to close anything they think is too insignificant, or the fix to costly. Similarly if they can't be arsed to fix it after X years just auto-close "nobody cares".

Ry Jones

At least it used to be.

pauska

20:32

a million developers, all with their own special mindset that they must get everyone to agree on with endless banter on mailing lists..

Michael Hampton

@RyJones Nope, first I've ever heard of that

MichelZ

@pauska or with a million devs - and noone cares

pauska

Linux would never ever have existed in the form it does today without a mad scientist/nazi at the top..

Ry Jones

@MichaelHampton IIRC the only redactions were some of the licensing code and non-redistributables (codecs licensed from Dolby and the like)

Chris S

@RyJones The current, or recent, code? I know the NT4 and Windows 2000 source is out in the wild.

Michael Hampton

20:34

What really makes Red Hat enterprisey, though, is taking 15 months to fix a bug which had a patch available when the bug was reported.

Ry Jones

@ChrisS this was Vista-7 era.

MichelZ

@RyJones yeah, they share code with certain organizations/governments

Chris S

Vista.... ::shudder::

Ry Jones

mseducommunity.com/programs/academic_programs/pages/…

So WRK looks like 2003/XP

Nick

@ChrisS XP ::bigger shudder::

Iain

20:35

@MichaelHampton your patch ?

Michael Hampton

In any case, I wouldn't go anywhere near the Windows source code myself. Too risky.

@Iain No, the upstream developer's patch.

Who also happens to be a Red Hat employee!

MichelZ

I always love stuff like this

don't they have like a small cloud or something?

:)

voretaq7

@MichaelHampton Anyone who reads the necronomicon will die.

Chris S

I avoid reading proprietary code when possible... Don't want it effecting something I write in the future or anything.

Michael Hampton

@ChrisS Yeah exactly.

MichelZ

20:37

@ChrisS as if anyone cares about that...

Michael Hampton

@MichelZ Expensive lawyers care about it.

MichelZ

@MichaelHampton not if they don't know about it

we're all small fish :)

Chris S

@MichelZ They wouldn't care about me, but if my code makes it into a project MS hates enough to send a lawyer after...

MichelZ

@ChrisS I doubt that they do that

and as long as you don't copy the source code and use it in your project

I bet you'll be pretty safe

Chris S

I agree - but easier to just not

MichelZ

20:40

"you're IP address browsed our sourcecode last year. Everything you produce belongs to us now" :)

ok boys, I need to catch some sleep

good night

ewwhite

Damn computers...

[10/16/2014 20:27:36.0188] [1] [RECOMENDED] Setup will prepare the organization for Exchange 2013 by using 'Setup /PrepareAD'. No Exchange 2007 server roles have been detected in this topology. After this operation, you will not be able to install any Exchange 2007 servers.
[10/16/2014 20:27:36.0204] [1] Failed [Rule:AdInitErrorRule] [Message:Setup encountered a problem while validating the state of Active Directory: Couldn't find the Enterprise Organization container.  See the Exchange setup log for more information on this error.]

Ry Jones

►

HopelessN00b

@ChrisS To be fair, DFS is one giant bug that's packaged up as a feature.

Joel E Salas

This POODLE shit is driving me nuts

ewwhite

@JoelESalas hah!

ThoriumBR

20:55

@JoelESalas I always hated poodles...

Zoredache

@JoelESalas how is it driving you nuts specifically?

ewwhite

@JoelESalas Poodles don't like you either!

Joel E Salas

@Zoredache Vendors that don't update their shit

Chris S

We'll be hearing about Poodle vulnerable devices for the next 3 years.... Just like Heartbleed.

ThoriumBR

and shellshock

HopelessN00b

21:05

...and liverbruise and beakcrush...

cole

sup

Ry Jones

@cole nada

cole

Just woke up from a nap.

Killer headache earlier.

HopelessN00b

What a coincidence... I'm about to head home form my nap/killer headache. I mean, work.

Ry Jones

I went drinking yesterday and I got a whanging headache from it

cole

21:10

We had a meeting with Veeam today.

I really hope we move our VM backups to it.

pauska

I've used that before, works great

cole

@pauska looks super slick.

pauska

@cole it's really easy to set up and administer

cole

@pauska which would be nice - since NetWorker is a pain.

and there's only two of us supporting NetWorker - using Veeam for the VM backups (we have probably an 80/20 VM/Physical split)

Would help us let the other sysadmins help out.

Falcon Momot

21:33

hmm, disabling SSLv3 with tomcat APR is really a pain in the ass

Mark Henderson

@cole It is really, really good

We bought our licenses a few weeks ago

We have our on-site backups, it then keeps the most recent single backup on another storage for off-siting

cole

I doubt we'll buy it though.

Mark Henderson

I've alreayd done a granular file recovery

Falcon Momot

hey, it's @cole

cole

it is

Falcon Momot

21:37

I heard a rumour you planned to move to someplace cool

cole

Yep, in the spring.

Mark Henderson

And right now I literally have a 2TB USB drive taking the most recent backups to our DR site so we can seed the replication to DR

Falcon Momot

we should hang out around then.

cole

Need to find a job first.

Falcon Momot

... I can probably help with that.

Wesley

21:38

@cole Wait, did you bail?

cole

@Wesley nope

@FalconMomot doesn't that sysop position require programming experience?

@MarkHenderson we use EMC NetWorker

Falcon Momot

@cole depends on which one

cole

@FalconMomot oh I thought you were only hiring for one position?

Falcon Momot

@cole we're about to have some major expansion in one of our lines of business

cole

@FalconMomot oh snap!

TELL ME MORE

I'll leave tomorrow.

Falcon Momot

21:40

tomorrow might be a wee bit soon of course

we expect expansion soon as in there are lawyers lawyering on a bunch of contracts for zillions of dollars

and my research team needs to be doing research, so we'll be wanting someone to operate our cloud SaaS product

probably working with @jacob though really we have an open structure in the company and nothing is siloed at all

Ry Jones

I haven't seen @Jacob around much, you must be keeping him occupied

Falcon Momot

lol

yeah there is enough work to do around here, shall we say

cole

but yeah - let me know man, I'm ready to go

Falcon Momot

@cole I think the person who makes decisions on these things wouldn't mind talking to you again at some point; I'll let him know.

it could definitely be months though

cole

@FalconMomot awesome, thank you.

Falcon Momot

21:43

hey, no problem at all

cole

Yeah we were planning in the spring

or post-holidays

Falcon Momot

what is the impetus for your reconsidering the awesomeness of the PNW?

if you don't mind me asking of course

cole

Friend and girlfriend had an intervention

Falcon Momot

huh.

Ry Jones

@FalconMomot: he's stopped chewing paper and feels free to travel

I worked with a guy at Amazon that folded and tore paper all day, then took it home and stored it.

cole

21:46

I applied at Amazon as well

Falcon Momot

@RyJones that is because employees of large companies are crazy

Ry Jones

@FalconMomot we were all employees of another company that subcontracted to another company that ran Lab 126's game for them, so in no way were we employees of a large company :)

Wesley

@RyJones I fold paper a lot: flickr.com/photos/26148816@N04/5671659840 =(

Falcon Momot

@RyJones so he was just crazy then.

Ry Jones

@Wesley not that cool. Imagine folding fans of paper and tearing them up.

@FalconMomot yes

tombull89

21:53

ewwhite

Oh yeah... Microsoft.

0

Q: Exchange 2013 Setup - Couldn't find the Enterprise Organization container

I'm working on an Exchange 2013 CU6 installation at a site whose AD was comprised of two Windows 2003 domain controllers. New Windows 2012 R2 DCs have been added, and the necessary roles migrated. However, the Exchange installer process fails with: Setup encountered a problem while validating...

ewwhite

22:10

with a visual...

Shane Madden

@ewwhite Ooh, roller ball mouse? Don't see those much anymore

Ry Jones

@ShaneMadden I was focused on the CRT above

ewwhite

or a CRT, or a yellowing keyboard... or Ultra SCSI disks...

or a dot-matrix printer

or any of it...

it's a time-capsule... and my first step to modernize it has been thwarted by this Active Directory issue.

Shane Madden

@ewwhite They're already on Exchange 2013 right, not switching major versions?

ewwhite

no...

they are on Dovecot/Sendmail

freiheit

22:18

@ewwhite Is that a pair of 2-post racks assembled to simulate a 4-post?

ewwhite

@freiheit yes.

Shane Madden

Ohh, fresh install

cole

Anyone used ExaGrid?

ewwhite

@ShaneMadden except I have to bring their goofy AD along for the ride.

Shane Madden

@ewwhite I wonder if this might be a bug with the new exchange bits not behaving right on a fresh environment.. maybe try an older installer rev? (lol)

ewwhite

22:27

:(

PS C:\Users\ewwhite\Desktop\CU6> .\setup.exe /preparead /organizationname:PBS /omgwtfbbq /iacceptexchangeserverlicenseterms

Michael Hampton

22:49

0

A: Simulating failover DR test. After moving mailboxes, Outlook clients can't connect

Disregard. We uncovered an incorrectly set Default Gateway on one of the DR servers.

Shane Madden

@ewwhite No such luck?

@ewwhite Wait, I remember there being something odd there. Is there both setup.exe and a setup.com?

ewwhite

@ShaneMadden No luck.

I'm not having a good time with this

Shane Madden

@ewwhite Yeah, this should not be the hard part. This makes no sense. Maybe some kind of oddball deny ACE somewhere in the config partition? Maybe light up some AD object access logging and see what's hitting where?

ewwhite

@ShaneMadden Not sure where to go with this one

Should I just demote the old 2003 DC's and bring the functional level of the domain/forest to 2012?

Unfortunately, I'm not certain what the impact of demoting these DCs will be.

Ry Jones

23:05

@ewwhite the only way out is through

Michael Hampton

@RyJones I like that song

cole

I wish our domain was at 2012

Shane Madden

@ewwhite Hmm.. yeah, but wait for stuff to break after demote and before functional level change

cole

That's the route I would go ^

Mark Henderson

@cole my baleeted message was this in case you didn't see it:

cole

23:08

@MarkHenderson ohhh

Mark Henderson

Our Veeam trial had expired before I'd even really got stuck into it, so I had to look at alternate options

cole

Yeah my boss wouldn't go for that lol

Mark Henderson

Before Veeam I had Windows backups

@cole No. mine would have been pissed if he'd known too

But it's all above board now

cole

EMC NetWorker will stay around for physical systems

all the Oracle/Solaris stuff

Mark Henderson

We're 100% virtualised at the moment, but probably adding some physical SQL servers in the near future

cole

23:09

It all looks so slick.

I just wish I could work for a company that actually invested some money in their IT infrastructure.

All I'm doing is firefighting - no real exciting projects.

All of our projects are for the applications group or other groups.

ewwhite

23:23

@ShaneMadden client told me to hold off... "What's another 12 hours at this point?"

Shane Madden

@ewwhite Hmm.

ewwhite

They want to be able to be onsite if there's a problem that results from demoting the old DCs

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