TRPG General Chat

KorvinStarmast

20:02

@NautArch I keep feeling that the problem is "there must be a pony under here somewhere" when a kid is looking at a large pile of horse crap and hay.

GreySage

I never know how to properly answer balance questions. I feel like it should be just "Nah it's fine", but that'd be a terrible answer

Sir Cinnamon

@GreySage "looks good to me! approved stamp"

probably not that though

Colin Gross

Wow, that damage progression question is an entertaining read.

I googled up some videos of angry cats to provided the appropriate background sound track

Sir Cinnamon

@ColinGross We get to live it

Rubiksmoose

@KorvinStarmast I just don't know...what is going on with this question anymore lol

NautArch

20:07

@Rubiksmoose ohgod, i re-engaged. what is wrong with me?

Colin Gross

I'm entertained. Poor Korvin trying to be helpful and getting a text wall full of frustration.

KorvinStarmast

@ColinGross It's been an interesting test for me to bite back all of the snarky one liners I could offer back, and try to be constructive. A worthwhile exercise. :)

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch I'm pretty sure I just engaged in like a 30 comment long chain about tags that he is 100% definitely going to add to his question anyways. Why do I do this lol?

Colin Gross

I hope BlueShocker has a mechanical keyboard with a satisfying click. I always imagine that nice clackity clack when envisioning someone hammering out text in frustration.

Sir Cinnamon

@NautArch "Why do i want to solve X? Because i've spent MONTHS trying to solve X"

dog meet tail

Colin Gross

20:11

I poked him. I couldn't help myself.

Rubiksmoose

I agree now with whoever said it earlier, we might be having language issues.

NautArch

@Rubiksmoose I don't think it's language, but I think it is something.

Sir Cinnamon

@Rubiksmoose He mentioned in an edit reason that "English was giving him a headache" which tipped me off

Colin Gross

:46739176 I was thinking the opposite... actually, come to think of it, the cartoon in my head resembles and angry version of me with a white beard.

Rubiksmoose

@SirCinnamon BTW I don't think that comment you responded to wsa actually in response to our tag discussino.

Colin Gross

20:13

@SirCinnamon Isn't that true for native speakers as well?

or do you think he meant The English?

showing up in boats wearing red jackets. It can be quite distressing.

KorvinStarmast

Yes, @ColinGross, it is. ;) (true for native speakers as well).

Sir Cinnamon

@Rubiksmoose Meant to aim one higher

ah well

Colin Gross

That's probably it then. There's a bunch of chaps in crimson overcoats running around his front yard.

While he's trying to get some research done and questions answered. The nerve of them!

Rubiksmoose

@SirCinnamon actually, in 5e, each creature is expected to have a weapon of appropriate size proportional to themselves. Large Creatures get Large Weapons. Gargantuan Creatures get Gargantuan Weapons. Also, there is a generic set of information for Custom Weapons, as it clearly states that players are fully capable of customizing their weapons from the available attributes, such as Light & Finesse, with a few exceptions. — Blue Shocker 64 40 secs ago

Is this true?

David Coffron

@Rubiksmoose Yes

Rubiksmoose

20:15

@DavidCoffron Good to know.

David Coffron

Sort of

He's over-simplifying though

KorvinStarmast

Yeah, you can't have a heavy light weapon.

Rubiksmoose

@KorvinStarmast That would be fun

Colin Gross

@Rubiksmoose Uranium dagger!

Rubiksmoose

@ColinGross Take 2d4 rad damage

Sir Cinnamon

20:18

@DavidCoffron Where is this outlined?

KorvinStarmast

But you can box in the light heavyweight division; maybe shocker is a boxer?

Rubiksmoose

I love how the combined efforts of this entire SE is failing to educate one stubborn user, but we are so stubborn that we don't want to give up.

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast I snarked. I'm sorry/not sorry.

Sir Cinnamon

"players are fully capable of customizing their weapons from the available attributes, such as Light & Finesse, with a few exceptions" I am pretty sure this is false....

David Coffron

@SirCinnamon Oh. That part is.

Changing attributes does not exist in core 5e

Anyone know italics in mathjax tables?

GreySage

20:22

@DavidCoffron No, but reskinning existing weapons is allowed. Maybe thats what he meant?

David Coffron

@GreySage Maybe, but changing certain properties DOES have an impact on damage dice

For example, light weapons decrease it by 1 size

Rubiksmoose

Is there even any chance this question gets posted with out being a dupe though?

@DavidCoffron will have to post his answer fast lol

Mike Q

By the emperor, what happened to our anti-comment policy when we need it?
The comments on these questions and answers are really out of hand. Can a mod move them to chat?

NautArch

@MikeQ meta is different

Rubiksmoose

@MikeQ Yeah meta is much more lenient about that because it often has to be. The Q&A format is not really that great for debugging issues, so we have to appropriate the tools we have at hand to compensate.

Sir Cinnamon

20:26

@DavidCoffron Strange that the info about "wielding large/oversized weapons" only appears in instructions on making custom monsters and not next to... any of the monsters it would apply to

Rubiksmoose

However, even for meta, this is an extreme amount of comments and I would not be surprised to see a diamond mod purge at some point tommorrow.

Sir Cinnamon

DMG 278 by the way

NautArch

@Rubiksmoose I may just delete my answer

GreySage

@SirCinnamon The monsters have it included in their stat block (the effect, not the rule)

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch I truly feel for you. Saw you comment thread going just about as great as everyone else's

Sir Cinnamon

20:28

@GreySage Right - thats what is odd. On stat blocks its just called a greataxe

Apparently it should a "large greataxe" which is more difficult to wield

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch No reason to delete though. Metas can be useful to future readers.

David Coffron

Is the question ready to be reopened or is it still Unclear what he's asking

Rubiksmoose

@DavidCoffron I'm not sure reopening that question is this best option is it?

NautArch

@DavidCoffron I think it's clear what he's asking. It'sjust a low quality question whose answer is "does not exist"

Rubiksmoose

THey say it was changed in scope.

NautArch

20:32

and they won't be happy about it.

it's what @KorvinStarmast said.

GreySage

@NautArch The question (while badly worded) is asking a clear question, but the OP in all his comments seems to be looking for something else, so I think it is still unclear.

Sir Cinnamon

He wants a compiled list of every example showing something's damage die being modified by size, level or any other factor

NautArch

@GreySage My gut tells me they're trying to figure out how to design 'custom weapons'.

Sir Cinnamon

it's just not worth answering

NautArch

it still is unclear what the use is, which makes it hard (in my mind) to answer it. Mostly because it doesn't exist and they won't say what they're trying to do with it so we can pointt hem in the right direction.

Sir Cinnamon

20:38

@NautArch He wants to devise a system/formula which at any time will allow him to create a custom weapon for a player or monster which has fair and balanced damage. Dont you see? it's simple

3.5 had it so it must exist in 5e

doppelgreener

@KorvinStarmast I'm not sure. Getting up to speed now. Seems SSD has been handling it.

David Coffron

@SirCinnamon It's not just for custom weapons I think. He mentioned Monk damage tables and weapon sizes and stuff

GreySage

@SirCinnamon The thing is, it would be pretty easy to homebrew something like this (-1 die size for light, +1 for heavy, etc). But thats no what hes asking, he wants something RAW, which doesn't exist

Sir Cinnamon

@GreySage Yep

@DavidCoffron Because in 3.5 the same tables applied to both

2

Q: Is there a way or feat to give a weapon the finesse property?

Are there rules that describe how to give certain weapons the finesse property?

I'm 99.9% sure you cant "customize" a trait on or off a weapon

> I would assume that there are at least 10 other GMs currently looking for this exact information at any given point in the day. do you intend to ask them what they wish to use it for as well? it's a comprehensive list for the sake of being the first comprehensive list, intended use is irrelevant.

David Coffron

I worked up an answer draft with the most "comprehensive table"-like thing I can imagine. Anyone have anything to add or adjust (feel free to comment on the google doc for suggestions if it's easier than chatting it): docs.google.com/document/d/…

Sir Cinnamon

20:45

Well that's dramatic

10 people constantly need this info every day and yet he's the first one to ask for it

David Coffron

@SirCinnamon Well he might be the first person to not realize that 5e wasn't made that way

NautArch

@DavidCoffron THat's why i'm a bit worried about your answer. You're feeding the idea that it IS made that way. Unless you'r answer would be "here are some tables, but these by no means provide a methodology that you can extend to others"

David Coffron

@NautArch My planned Introduction literally says its not

> Many of the rules for 5th edition are not balanced around each other. For example, *eldritch blast* is almost exclusively the best spell for a Warlock to take. This is not a bug but a feature. While most of the classes and subclasses are approximately balanced, overall power level is not the sole defining factor for the rules’ designs. The Blowgun weapon is a glaring example of this. There is almost no reason to ever use a blowgun other than for aesthetic purposes.

> Because of this design principle, **there is no single table that fits all damage progressions.** However, there are some …

And I repeatedly say throughout my draft that any extrapolation from the table is not playtested, should be used with caution, and should be subject to individual analysis

NautArch

@DavidCoffron cool - but maybe it's just me, but i'd highlight that these are simply your observations and not actual rules, progressions, or methods that are approved or confirmed by WoTC.

David Coffron

@NautArch That's a good point

Rubiksmoose

20:50

Here's my question: what direction are we pushing here? New question or edit/reopen old question? Bc OP is not happy with the old question (for reasons that are still unclear to me).

GreySage

Blarhg, My group's DM is getting too busy to prep stuff, so I'm back at DMing

Sir Cinnamon

Alright now i snapped a little bit

GreySage

My poor Dragon Sorcerer will never see the light of day...

David Coffron

@Rubiksmoose I like edit and reopen. The other two answers are good answers

Rubiksmoose

@DavidCoffron I worry that if we do that OP is going to reedit the question such that it invaldiates them though.

David Coffron

20:52

@Rubiksmoose I could make a new account and use suggest edit to get his validation before hand

(or is that bad practice)

Rubiksmoose

Only one account per user.

(that can get you in real trouble for sockpuppeting). It does violate the ToS.

David Coffron

Thanks for the warning

Anyone have less than 2,000 reputation here?

Rubiksmoose

@DavidCoffron Hurry everyone downvote all of David's answers!

(also against ToS lol)

David Coffron

@Rubiksmoose Hahahaha

That would be a lot of downvotes. Especially since many of you probably have locked in votes on some of my stuff right now

Rubiksmoose

Yeah that would be a heck of a lot lol

David Coffron

20:56

I'm really close to the final privilege actually

175 to go

Rubiksmoose

I remember it being thoroughly underwhleming.

Oh yeah site stats. Pretty interesting.

David Coffron

@Rubiksmoose Yeah. Site Analytics. Cool for a little bit probably, but only when you are actually curious

Rubiksmoose

@DavidCoffron Exactly correct.

David Coffron

Then again, all Trusted User did on the surface was give me the fast edit tags button (which I've used like twice I think)

(mostly because I do most of my edits on mobile)

Rubiksmoose

Is that a priveledge? I thought that might have been a SoX thing.

Shalvenay

20:58

@Rubiksmoose SoX?

NautArch

@SirCinnamon technically, they're trying to have the stack create this list.

David Coffron

@Rubiksmoose Maybe I'm misremebering. I got my 20,000 around the same time as my gold badge

Rubiksmoose

@DavidCoffron I think you are right though actually.

Sir Cinnamon

@NautArch Well we have to, seeing as they own none of the books

Rubiksmoose

@Shalvenay Stack Overflow Extras. It is a browser add-in that tweaks some stuff on here.

Shalvenay

20:59

@Rubiksmoose ah. analytics are the "capstone" site privilege at 25k rep

David Coffron

@NautArch And also that isn't what S.E is for at all. We want one question and one question only. Something like "what are all the rules pertaining to damage progression and can you design a table that addresses all of them" is way too broad.

It's very much a collaboration on a major project thing. Something even beyond forums.

It's like a Discord server thing

Shalvenay

@GreySage what system?

@DavidCoffron or pulling them into a Stack chat?

David Coffron

@Shalvenay It's even a bit much for here

Rubiksmoose

Plus they don't have the rep

David Coffron

It requires exorbitant amounts of analysis and fact checking

And cataloging and formatting

And debating how much a spell effect is worth

Etc, etc, etc

And the final product would be a mess of checklists and cross-tables.

Because 5e just isn't made that way

GreySage

21:04

@Shalvenay DnD5e, I made a cool Tiefling Draconic Sorcerer with a strong affinity for Fire. At level 6 he would have added +1+Cha mod to all Fire spells, and reroll 1 and 2s.

Shalvenay

is this the sorc spell cast from item -> Wild Magic Surge Q or the homebrew magic weapon Q?

@GreySage XD would be a good pair with some of the Kossuthian Druids I've played (but they've all been 3.x chars)

David Coffron

@Shalvenay We're talking about this question

And the debates surrounding it and this meta

Shalvenay

ah

Sir Cinnamon

1

Q: Is there a way to add or remove a weapon property from an existing weapon?

Can a weapon's properties be modified in any way? For example, a Maul is "Heavy" and "Two-Handed". Are there any rules which govern the adding a property (Such as "Reach") or removing a property (like "Two-Handed"). Specifically regarding non-magic weapons off of the base weapon table.

dnd-5e weapons

Posted this and an answer, I think it's correct but it's always hard to prove a negative

throw some counterexamples if you got em!

David Coffron

> Cantrips are another example as they follow a simple algorithm of (Calc.exe equation): (Int((Level +1) /6) +1) (Int(): always Round Down rule, Level: Player Level).

This is not the equation they used

Sir Cinnamon

21:09

Or vote to close if that's too broad or whatever, i dont care, it's friday and i wanna go home. Have a good weekend everyone

David Coffron

Tiers of play don't scale "every 6 levels." It's just how they happened to fall

NautArch

@SirCinnamon I could give him the link to join the 'campaign' i created on dndbeyond for stackizens.

David Coffron

A level 23 character wouldn't deal 5d8. That's not how 5e is designed

Sir Cinnamon

@NautArch After the rudeness he's shown to everyone here that's a kindness I wouldn't personally extend but perhaps youre a nicer person

Rubiksmoose

Time to go superhero with my buds. Hopefully they don't blow up another building this time!

See you all later.

GreySage

21:13

@Rubiksmoose Hopefully they do, its more fun

And I'm envious of everyone who gets off work around now

BESW

By the way, multiple accounts are not a violation of the ToS and will not be punished. It's what you do with multiple accounts that can get you banned, but there are legit reasons to have more than one account and the Stack's cool with that. (cc @Rubiksmoose, @DavidCoffron)

Tiggerous

You guys all have the patience of saints. Massive respect for the way you're all trying to persevere with that question.

Carcer

@Tiggerous I think it's called masochism

Yuuki

@BESW I know a number of diamond mods that have sock puppets because the diamond version of the site is rather different from non-diamond.

Tiggerous

I must admit, I bowed out on this one some time ago.

BESW

21:19

@Carcer Isn't that a kind of cherry?

GreySage

Anyone know a good 5e pre-made campaign that goes from level 1 to 3-ish that isn't LmoP?

Mike Q

@GreySage Does it need to be published? WOTC only?

GreySage

@MikeQ No

Tiggerous

Some people like Death House - I've heard it's pretty deadly though.

David Coffron

@GreySage There are a lot of DDAL adventures that you can string together

@GreySage And I really enjoyed Tales from the Yawning Portal's Sunless Citadel

Tiggerous

21:26

I think it might be freely available online though (legally). It's the precursor to Curae of Strahd.

Shalvenay

@GreySage Sunless Citadel might be worth a try, although that reminds me I need to dig up the notes I have and see further about converting them into a campaignlet of about that size

BESW

But be careful; if you make a D&D Adventurer's League Extended Campaign, you get a DDALEC.

GreySage

@BESW yes? Is that... bad?

Joel Harmon

@doppelgreener I'm leaning more toward attempts to kill other PCs end in a TPK, which I seem to recall seeing in both Paranoia and GOG. It's not that often, but compared to my D&D experience of a TPK (iirc, never), it's far more likely.

BESW

@GreySage It's prone to TPKs.

David Coffron

21:29

@GreySage How soon do you need it? I could make one up with a theme of your choice if you want. Level 1-3 isn't that much work

Tiggerous

If you're after one shots you can string together, I had fun with the Wolves of Welton for level 2 / e.

David Coffron

(I have a group of players that basically just do one shots every other week since they like messing around with new characters, so I have playtesting covered ;))

Shalvenay

@Tiggerous Wolves of Welton?

Tiggerous

Sorry 2 / 3* (can't edit on my phone)

GreySage

@DavidCoffron My group is probably going to play either next week or the week after. I was thinking going through one of the less extended AL campaigns, but wanted to do something shorter to get everyone back in the groove since its been a while since we last played

Then we could take those chars and start the campaign slightly higher level than normal, to make things start off faster

David Coffron

21:32

@GreySage Ah so you want a premade prologue to get everyone into the game and see what direction the campaign will go.

GreySage

@DavidCoffron Yeah

Although the 'prologue' doesn't necessarily have to be closely related to the later campaign (yet to be determined), just something to establish their characters

David Coffron

How many sessions do you want the 3 level prologue to take? Getting to mid level 3 can take up to 5 or 6 sessions (or more) depending on how tangent-ey your players are

Tiggerous

@Shalvenay Yes, it's available for pwyw on DMsguild. It's a nice little subversion of the classic low level quest of 'gi and kill some wolves'.

GreySage

4-5 feels good

Shalvenay

@Tiggerous I'll have to check that out :)

David Coffron

21:34

@GreySage Do you have character profiles yet?

Because 4 fighters will breeze through a dungeon crawl but struggle in a heist (take more sessions) while a couple wizards or rogues can knock out the heist in a session or 2

GreySage

@DavidCoffron What do you mean by profile?

David Coffron

@GreySage Race/Class, plans for playstyle, basic backstory/background

When I DM'd for my brothers they took almost 8 sessions to beat Sunless Citadel, but my AL friends beat it in 3

GreySage

@DavidCoffron No, but probably a decent spread of classes. I'd be amazed if we didn't have at least one fighter/barb and at least 1 caster

5 people in the group (besides me)

David Coffron

@GreySage Low/Middling/High Magic?

Any specific setting planned?

GreySage

@DavidCoffron I like High magic, and no setting as of yet. I'm just starting to put all this together today

I was thinking of Tomb of Annihilation at some point, but it might be too hard/too long for my group

David Coffron

21:39

@GreySage Well I will go work up a basic plot line with encounters and NPCs for levels 1-mid_3. I'll keep it vague enough that you could change the specifics for whatever setting. Going to go pretty generic on the creature-types, but try to make it diverse in terms of the types of challenges.

My group meets on Monday. I'll do some playtesting then and be back with you after any necessary revisions ;)

GreySage

@DavidCoffron That's awesome, thanks a ton

David Coffron

@GreySage Any specific requests? Inside jokes your players would enjoy? Big boss you have been working on? Magic item you want to get in there somehow?

GreySage

@DavidCoffron One of the characters is afraid of spiders. I'm not sure how bad it really is, but she was uncomfortable when they fought the giant spiders in LmoP. So no spiders.

David Coffron

@GreySage M'kay. ~~Will do~~ err. won't do spiders

Shalvenay

@GreySage that is most unfortunate, since the best-playtested of my short-form materials is definitely not for arachnophobes.

KorvinStarmast

21:48

@DavidCoffron david, I am taking a look at your google docs proposal. Uh, I need some more time, so will get back to you later. Cheers. :)

GreySage

@Shalvenay When she got uncomfortable, I described all the spiders as easter-bunnies and the webs were half-melted chocolate. It seemed to work

I personally want to play a Cavalier or Paladin mounted on a Giant Spider one day

David Coffron

@GreySage What's the age group of your party? Should I avoid deep moral dillemas and/or adult themes?

(not saying adults can't enjoy some good easter bunny fun, but just wondering)

Shalvenay

@GreySage XD! if you don't mind riding a party member into battle -- we had a scene in 3.5e once where my halfling druidess hitched a ride on the back of the party's celestial drider monk ;)

GreySage

@DavidCoffron Youngest is 25. We're all married/in committed relationships, so adult situations are fine. No excessive gore or sexualization would be preferred.

David Coffron

@GreySage M'kay just checking. Didn't want to give any young teenagers some nightmares or something

KorvinStarmast

23:32

@DavidCoffron I love your analysis. Let's figure out a way for me to ask a question so that you can post that as an answer.

Shalvenay

23:42

hey again @KorvinStarmast

KorvinStarmast

@Shalvenay Hello, I am taking the D&D survey nits linked to a bit ago

Have you?

Shalvenay

I have not, may not bother

KorvinStarmast

Also, if you get a chance, read Dave Coffron's analysis "answer" to a question that is still closed. I think he did a nice job

Please do, I am liking a chance to offer some feedback. But your call. Only so many heartbeats in a lifetime. 8^D

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