Hi folks. Anyone know of any RPGs that manage speed like Final Fantasy X did? That the combination of the character's speed or dex and the action the character took is used to reorder when characters get to move.

@DampeS8N I believe Valkyrie Profile 2 did this, but I'm not 100% after reading up on it shortly, might want to check it out on youtube. to see if I remember correctly, but I'm busy atm :P

@AsadaShino Looking for pen and paper RPGs, sorry.

@DampeS8N And FF:X is pen and paper?

@AsadaShino Nope. Read it again.

Pen and paper RPGs that manage speed like a video game did.

@JonathanHobbs You got it.

Aha, I see.

Nvm then

Doesn't need to be exactly, just that concept of what a character does changes when they next get to act.

Never played a table-top rpg (apart from a 2 hour D&D session)

So I can't really say much :P

@AsadaShino But, you are interested in them, then?

For those unaware, FFX uses a mechanic where a character has an "energy" meter that, when full, grants the character a turn. Different actions consume different amounts of energy and thus result in the turn coming sooner.

The energy bar itself is hidden but its workings are fairly easy to infer.

@DampeS8N I am, yes

@DampeS8N Just noone to play with and never bothered to look further, since I had other things to do that I could do with friends :P

@AsadaShino I only ask because you are in a chat room dedicated to table top RPGs

@DampeS8N Are you suggesting I should leave because I've never played one?

I would not be here if I were not interested ;)

No, you're free to stay.

Every now and then someone pops in, confusing this with a computer rpg site though.

Oh, good morning.

I thought he did, by referring to FF:X, so I responded in kind. But prior to his entry I was talking about table-top, rather than computer rpgs, guess he can't know that, though

@Metool [ugt] Afternoon :)

@kviiri Interesting assessment. Calling it a meter is probably too dramatic. Each character has a number, the number is derived by their last action minus their speed (or some similar formula) and they just go in order of the number, subtracting the last acting number from each number as it goes. So if you have a rat at 50 and a guy at 75, the rat will go and the guy will then be 25, and the rat's new action might have cost 50 so now the order is guy 25 and rat 50.

COMMINUCATION

we are good at it

@JonathanHobbs is we?

@AsadaShino Not At All! You are totally welcome. Just isn't common for people who don't play TRPGs to be here. ;)

@AsadaShino so i have heard

@DampeS8N One has to start somewhere, lol :P

@AsadaShino Absolutely.

@DampeS8N Yeah, that sounds simpler.

While technically the same, it does sound simpler

Noice

@kviiri Which is why I think it might work for a table-top RPG.

Howdy all! Where would be a good place to get started on DnD 3.5. I had a few drinks last night with some friends who are experienced DnDers and they invited me to join a new campaign that they're starting

@AsadaShino Calling it a meter suggests it works like the ATB system in other FF games. But there is no sense of time in FFX so it isn't really a meter that is slowly draining, it is just an ordering.

ATB?

ah action turn based?

@AsadaShino Active Time Battle

oh, was I ever wrong, lol!

I see

does this relate to what they did in final fantasy tactics?

@JonathanHobbs I believe all the Tactics games were straight turn based with each character going once in each turn. Ordered by speed. FFX would allow the same character to act sometimes twice in a row directly.

@DampeS8N They had a reordering thing too. Or, the one I played did. There were cards lined up a long the bottom of the screen telling you the next dozen or two (can't remember how many) characters to act, and you'd see your current character get repeated there once or twice, probably. And then you'd act, and your character's position in the list would move around depending on what they did.

@JonathanHobbs Was this the one on the GBA?

It was pretty frustrating for me though. I'd plan something based around turn order, then the turn order would change completely because of the thing I did.

I can't remember!

@JonathanHobbs Yeah, it has been a very long time for me too. I can't rightly remember.

FFX, however, was really smart about it and when you'd hover over a selection before picking it, it would show you how your action would place you next in the order.

Aha!

It was FFT2, which I played on the DS. You can see the turn ordering in the top screen there.

Ah, I see. I never played that one.

My favourite in this category is Disgaea, though, and that is in no small part because it has a structure that goes like this: It's your turn. It's their turn. It's your turn again.

(And you can cancel and undo moves.)

Also, screenshot that makes more sense:

@JonathanHobbs Have you played Phantom Brave? Same guys, same engine, no grid.

nothing compares to Fire emblem

You can scroll through turn order with L/R. In this screenshot, the person's viewing the person whose turn is next. In the above screenshot, they were scrolled way to the end.

@DampeS8N I haven't!

@JonathanHobbs Really good game.

If you like these sorts of games but want to try the logical next progression, find a copy of Valkyria Chronicles on the PS3.

Also, it is frigging gorgeous.

That's a mid-battle shot, btw

Here is a bigger and better shot

Really need to see it in motion tho. It is a moving watercolor painting.

What sort of 3e information are you looking for?

Starting points. I bought the players handbook and it should be here on saturday

not sure what else I need to get started

@DampeS8N It looks lovely C:

I know nothing about character creation, rules, anything like that though

@Ampt Read the character creation rules, get an understanding of combat, find a class you might be interested in. If those people invited you to the game understanding you know very little about playing it, they're prepared to help guide you.

@JonathanHobbs I think that's the idea, I just wanted to try and learn as much as possible jumping into it. Always wanted to play, just never had a chance

wasn't sure if there was a 3rd party resource that was often used

@Ampt there's a lot to learn

don't expect to pick it up quickly

or, i mean, the entirety of everything

myself, as a newbie, i found D&D 3.5e confusing in a bunch of areas - there were some I understood pretty well, but not others - and I didn't even understand how the people who understood had managed to understand.

Greeeat

so is the players handbook the #1 resource for newbies?

Yes, Players handbook is a great starting point

any extra material you can probabbly get from the free online resource, called the SRD

d20srd.org

But you won't be able to navigate it well until after you read the player's handbook

(the SRD doesn't contain everything, just the stuff they released under the SRD, mind)

(but it will cover most things you'll be concerned about at this stage)

are there any practically canonical additions to standard 3.5e play?

I know that there are a billion extra rule books, but are any of them thought of as mandatory for good 3.5e play?

or is it a campaign to campaign thing

@Ampt Campaign by Campaign

Or my accurate, Table by Table. Which books are used tends to depend more on the people choosing the books rather than the story behind the campaign.

Thinking about Dex and Str modifiers in D&D 3.5/Pathfinder - why is it that Str modifies to-hit roll and not Dex? I understand Str modifying damage inflicted, but Dex seems the more intuitive choice for modifying the to-hit roll. Also, shouldn't Str, not Dex, be the attribute of choice for modifying to-hit with ranged weapons like a longbow? Holding a 100 lb draw weight longbow steady while aiming an arrow is a feat of strength, not dexterity.

@RobertF To reduce MAD (Multi Attribute Dependancy)

Is MAD a bad thing?

@Ampt I didn't have access to it myself, but I've known people who felt D&D for Dummies was exceptionally useful.

I'll look into that too, thanks :)

@DampeS8N ...deadEarth, maybe. My understanding is very rudimentary and I don't actually suggest ever playing it, but deadEarth has a "Moves" stat which determines how many things you can do each round (each action costs X moves), and various effects and actions will temporarily or permanently decrease (or sometimes increase) your number of moves. So part of combat is tactical move attrition.

@RobertF MAD is a thing which makes it noticeably more difficult to create an effective character if you choose a class or build with multiple attribute dependency.

@Ampt I love your icon, btw.

@BESW It's a running joke in the whiteboard that I'm a sock puppet of a couple guy who wanted to get more close votes, so I figured I needed to look the part

Hee.

But I'm not one... I think. They never got that far in my programming in any case

So, my experience with learning D&D 3.5: It was my first tabletop RPG system. I was given the 3.0 books to read over a winter break at college, and when I returned for the spring I started my first game--running it as a dungeon master, using the 3.5 books.

Half the players in my group had some small experience with other RPGs, but none of them were experienced with 3.0 or 3.5, so we were all stumbling along together. I mostly ignored the rules I didn't know/understand yet, fudged things during the game and looked them up later.

After that I brought a lot of new players into RPGs and my strategy for heavy systems like 3.5 is to give them a simple pre-built character for the first session or two while I help them with the basic rules, and then I walk them through making their own character.

Many groups will be happy to hold your hand as you learn the game. Some will be more sink-and-swim. The 3.5 Player's Handbook is useful, but can be a little overwhelming, so take it in chunks and ask lots of questions--of your group, in this chat, and do rpg.se site searches.

But I'm living proof you can teach yourself the game from the books and little else, so there's that.

(NB: a lot of RPG groups have house rules and individual conventions/traditions which vary from the rules text. Sometimes it's on purpose, and sometimes it's because they misread or were mistaught.)

@BESW But, @BESW, you're super-human: does it still count? ;p

@GamerJosh So long as I'm unregistered.

@BESW haha, nice

@Quentin, @RedRiderX Hi!

Howdy

Fifth illustration down: What is this, a hilt for ants?

(And I'm assuming the first hilt illustrated is for thri-kreen hands.)

(If it's not a hilt, it's gotta be ceremonial; look at the size of the connection to the shaft! The pineapple will just snap off the first time it hits something hard, like a shield or a dwarf.)

-rolls on in-

[wave]

-fanfare plays as he leaps up and bows-

What's new?

nm, just dis>

Oh, thts right, and my new job. Been going pretty well. 9-5 m-f call center job, easy enough to handle.