TRPG General Chat

BESW

13:00

It's currently settled at "one player," and I'm very glad that we've found systems we prefer to D&D which also better accommodate tiny groups.

Gameboon

Ah, what system do you use for small groups? I honestly haven't really played anything besides d&d 3.5 for table top roleplaying games.

BESW

We're currently using Fate Core.

It's a simple, robust system that can easily adapt to different settings, styles, and group sizes.

Professor Loki Caprion

I honestly think I'll never use another system.

Inbar Rose

Fate ftw :)

BESW

There are other systems out there which are specifically designed for "twosies," and I'm looking into some of them.

Inbar Rose

13:02

@ProfessorLokiCaprion It has totally eclipsed other systems for me..

Gameboon

click

BESW

@Gameboon The pdfs are pay-what-you-like to download, including free.

We did a brief rundown of the game's mechanics here:

What kind of game is Fate?

Jul 24 '13 at 7:43, 22 minutes total – 43 messages, 5 users, 0 stars

Bookmarked Aug 26 '13 at 15:00 by BESW

Professor Loki Caprion

@BESW I downloaded them by donating $5 each for the Core and the Toolkit, then I bought the hardcover books at my local gaming store.

Gameboon

click

Inbar Rose

There is also the Fate-SRD Which is free, and very informative.

Gameboon

13:07

Thanks for the links. I'll look at the fate site and read the fate explanation later today, most likely in the evening. I've been wondering what other kinds of RPG's are out there since I'm fed up with certain aspects about d&d 3.5, and honestly the one 4E campaign I briefly played just....wasn't for me.

Zachiel

@BESW not the same thing as high BAB, unfortunately.

BESW

@Gameboon Yeah, I spent eight or nine years in The D&D Bubble.

@Zachiel With claw/claw/bite/gore, you hardly need the iterative attacks of high BAB.

@Gameboon I'm still in the dizzying "oooh, look at all the shiny different ways RPGs can be shaped!" mode.

Gameboon

@BESW I'm atm in the 'Disillusioned with D&D-mode'.

I'm assuming Fate goes better with 'a bit more roleplay, a bit less roll-play' than d&d ?

BESW

@Gameboon Welcome to the club.

@Gameboon Fate basically requires it.

Zachiel

@BESW Persist divine power. Quickly Polymorph into a cave troll. Use pounce with your magical greatsword instead of your natural weapons. ... Profit.

As of now, I'm only trying to find a way to plolymorph into a good looking cave troll

BESW

13:11

@Gameboon Instead of stats like "Str" and "Dex," your character's defining stats are short, pithy phrases that describe something about his nature, ability, gear, or relationships.

Professor Loki Caprion

@Gameboon Fate is pretty much always "story first". It's an RPG that focuses a lot more on the RP than the G.

BESW

These phrases ("aspects") are used to justify actions and to make your character's life both easier and more challenging, as appropriate.

Professor Loki Caprion

Stuff like "Black Sheep of the Delphi Council" or "What's the worst that can happen?" aren't just catch phrases for your character in Fate; they're stats.

Inbar Rose

@Gameboon Fate has 3 core rules:

The Golden Rule: Decide what you want to do, then consult the rules to
help you do it.

The Silver Rule: Never let the rules get in the way of what makes
narrative sense.

The Bronze Rule: You can treat everything like a character.

Professor Loki Caprion

And one thing they say in the Fate Core book that I've found to be amazingly accurate: you will be amazed at how often a player will want to "screw over" their own character if it makes a fun story.

Aaron

13:13

Mornin

BESW

@Aaron Yawp.

Gameboon

hmm, seems more like what I'm looking for I think.

Inbar Rose

@Gameboon Someone did a summary of all the mechanics in Fate: fate mechanics summary You will be surprised how short it is :)

BESW

If you want something really lightweight, the "Roll for Shoes" system is hard to beat; it consists of 7 bullet points.

Gameboon

Thanks, I've put all the Fate links I got here into it's own little map to read through later today :-).

Roll..for..Shoes?

Inbar Rose

13:15

@Gameboon :) good luck.

@Gameboon Another time.... :)

Gameboon

Anyway, for now: Thanks for all the suggestions and links and explanations. I will be off to eat lunch and do other stuff.

BESW

@Gameboon ttfn! Hope to see you around.

Gameboon

See ya! ( I might hop in here sometiem soon)

Inbar Rose

@Gameboon "do other stuff" = contemplate the meaning of your existence now that you realize suddenly and harshly that D&D is not the end-all and be-all of rpg's ?

BESW

@InbarRose Sounds like he already did that on his own.

8 mins ago, by Gameboon

@BESW I'm atm in the 'Disillusioned with D&D-mode'.

Inbar Rose

13:17

:)

lisardggY

@Gameboon When I read Fate, I was struck by how much the system was designed to let me do the things I've been doing despite the systems I was playing in before.

Zachiel

I have a deja-vu

Inbar Rose

@lisardggY That is so true :)

lisardggY

@Zachiel Yes, I'm repeating things I've said before. But chat.rpg.se is a very Fate-missionary room. :)

Zachiel

And now is when I usually chime in saying that I don't really like putting my character into risks at all.

Inbar Rose

13:22

@lisardggY :)

BESW

@Zachiel Now we wait for someone to ask why you play RPGs rather than tell stories, if that's the case.

lisardggY

@Zachiel That's also good. That's a different sort of character for a different sort of story.

Aaron

anyone know of a good map generator that can generate forests?

Zachiel

@BESW I think I like reading actual plays set in the same universe I'm roleplaying in and I sometimes wonder about what would happen if I was the protagonist, instead of them. Just reading is awesome, but makes me wanna be part of it.

Inbar Rose

@Aaron I have always wanted to know if there is a good map gen, or map tool somewhere.

Aaron

13:26

@InbarRose I know of a few good world map generators but I am looking for a forest specifically.

Inbar Rose

Care to share some links?

Zachiel

@Aaron gozzys.com/article.php?cm_id=12

sorry, link fixed now

Inbar Rose

That's far too focused for the kind of map I am looking for.

Aaron

@InbarRose let me find that world gen I was talking about

Inbar Rose

I am looking for something that will help me create worlds so I can layer terrain, with cities, roads, and even zones of control

Zachiel

13:28

@InbarRose your GM has enough rep now

Inbar Rose

@Zachiel But he is currently teaching a class :)

Zachiel

@InbarRose later, then

Inbar Rose

He works as an instructor in extracurricular activities in schools, teaching kids D&D ... :)

lisardggY

I like the automatic +100 rep you get on all SE sites once you have enough rep in one. It lets you skip all this tedious business to downvote or join chats.

Zachiel

@InbarRose Is that a job? Do they pay him for that?

Aaron

13:31

@InbarRose How do I get this job

Inbar Rose

hahaha

Zachiel

That could be a job I could do

Inbar Rose

You will have to ask him next he comes to the room.

lisardggY

It's not fun, let me tell you.

I did it a couple of times after highschool. It's not fun to run a game to 12 teens crammed together.

Inbar Rose

I prefer my programming job anyday

Zachiel

13:33

What? 12? I'll bring more DMs

lisardggY

Lots of elementary and middle schools offer (paid) extracurricular activities to students, like art classes or, in this case, D&D. We're trying to convince my nephew to go.

Professor Loki Caprion

@lisardggY When I was in High School I tried to do that with a Torg game, and it could be quite unfun.

lisardggY

@Zachiel And split the already meager salary?

The schools try to cut costs by squeezing as many kids into the same class, and RPGs don't scale as well as other hobby classes.

Though there are quite a few good stories, too, and kids who went on to be serious roleplayers.

Zachiel

@lisardggY I'm fine with that as long as I get something in while having fun.

lisardggY

@Zachiel When you're half-babysitter, it's not as much fun.

I have a friend whose first RPG experience was actually teaching one of these classes. She never played before. The company gave her a quick tutorial (using a system they developed in-house, to keep it simple) and sent her in.

She had two groups, one she loved, one she loathed.

A few months after that she joined our PF game. She was surprised that people do actually role play in these games, rather than just hunt down and kill various monsters, in as vicious and violent a manner as possible.

2

Zachiel

13:38

@lisardggY It depends on the age of the players

Aaron

@InbarRose Here is one ok generator still looking for the one I really like. donjon.bin.sh/fantasy/world

Inbar Rose

@Aaron Looks cool, thanks.

Aaron

@InbarRose Here is the one I really like and have used quite a bit. topps.diku.dk/torbenm/maps.msp

Inbar Rose

@Aaron Their servers are busy :(

Professor Loki Caprion

@lisardggY I find that the older I get, the less I care about "roll-play" and the more I want "role-play".

Inbar Rose

13:44

@ProfessorLokiCaprion I think most of us feel that way.

Professor Loki Caprion

Indeed, the less I have to look at my sheet or toss dice, the better I feel about the whole situation.

Inbar Rose

@Aaron That's kind small ?

Aaron

@InbarRose If you change the color to black and white the maps scale up quite well.

Inbar Rose

Cool. I like them. Though now that I have them - I wish I could have a tool that lets me design my own maps, the generator is awesome, but it doesn't get exactly what I want. I have the map in my head already - I just suck at drawing.

Zachiel

@InbarRose maptools

Inbar Rose

13:53

Plus - I want to be able to manipulate the map digitally, including labels, territories (that could shift and change) roads, etc. and castles/towns... :)

@Zachiel maptools?

Zachiel

oh, sorry. maptool. rptools.net/?page=maptool

unless you want to really go for a cartographing software it's pretty neat for drawing maps

Inbar Rose

Is it online or offline?

Zachiel

offline

Inbar Rose

Ah, can't look at it now - at work.

Zachiel

IIRC you need to have premade "terrain type" squares

Inbar Rose

13:57

So I can't download stuff onto the computers.

BESW

I haven't used rptools for years... they were the best free stuff I could find pre-2008, when I actually needed such things, but weren't very satisfying.

Zachiel

@InbarRose legit

@BESW I use it for my 4e campaign, using the original maps as a background, to move tokens around on a screen that's visible to everyone

it also manages lighting

BESW

I never got combat fog to work...

Eh, it was 6+ years ago.

Zachiel

@BESW it's kinda awkward to be true. You need to mash ctrl+something at every step to reveal what's new

BESW

Is "ctrl+something" the new "any" key?

Zachiel

14:08

no, any is not specific. IIRC Ctrl+I removes fow from the new current location's point of view (useful for teleports), while Ctrl+S de-fogs the whole path

Aaron

@InbarRose There are some downloadable map makers that do that.

Tim Timmy

14:25

Does anyone know a marketing executive here? Thanks ;)

Aaron

15:08

I think you might be in the wrong chat for that.

Alex P

I have many marketings! Send $240 by Paypal and I will give you best pro marketings. 100% executive quality guarantee. Also, local singles in your area.

Professor Loki Caprion

@AlexP Local singles in MY area?!

Alex P

Sure, why not!

Aaron

15:40

Inbar Rose

@Aaron HA! awesome.

Professor Loki Caprion

@Aaron Ha, I love that one!

There's another like it, though...

Dammit, I can't find it!

It's like "Singles in your area." "In your house!" "RIGHT BEHIND YOU!"

Inbar Rose

16:09

Wow, getting a lot of love on this changeling answer I gave :) Got a "Nice Answer Badge" and everything! :)

GamerJosh

16:23

@InbarRose Gratz! =)

Inbar Rose

@GamerJosh Thanks.

Alex P

18:11

End-of-year RPG news bitlets:

Shannon Appelcline on industry trends: D&D coasting, industry as a whole doing well, some strong market penetration from "indie" products like Fate Core and Dungeon World, plus a bunch of other stuff, if you care.

As an alternative tidbit: Vincent Baker says the publication rights to Apocalypse World are worth at least $50,000.

That last part makes me happy because screw the OGL.

MadMAxJr

Meanwhile, in other news, that one niche system that you love but have a hard time finding others to play with still remains something you can only discuss online but never play. (We all have one if you've been at this more than a few years.)

3

Lord_Gareth

18:26

Heh, @KRyan and I crossposted the same answer.

Alex P

@MadMAxJr Get married and play one-on-one with your spouse. It's some of the best gaming you can have, anyway. :)

MadMAxJr

It's still a 4-5 year plan before we discuss getting married, but I do need to drag her into more sessions.

Lord_Gareth

@ProfessorLokiCaprion Yes, and at the same time no. Strictly speaking anything that isn't Lord Pun-Pun, Dread Prince of All, is mechanically inhibiting oneself. More practically speaking, I tend to define 'inhibiting' oneself as choosing options that don't make your concept work.

MadMAxJr

18:42

Unless your Barbarian is made of not just fire, but vorpal fire, you're holding yourself back.

Lord_Gareth

@MadMAxJr - Well if your concept is 'highest damage Barbarian possible' then yeah. I'm thinking more along the lines of something like, "I want to represent a sorcerer with some draconic heritage."

You might be a half-dragon (shooting self in face), a draconic creature (easily bought off), or take lineage feats (weak but screw it you have spells)

wax eagle

@MadMAxJr our "we'll probalby get married in 3 years" turned into engaged in 7mos, married in 11mos..

Lord_Gareth

So in that scenario I'd yell at people who take the Half-Dragon option because it's the absolute worst way to represent what they're aiming at

MadMAxJr

[Not-serious reply] Dig through dubious quality 3rd-party materials until you find the re-write of that thing you want that is totally unbalanced and constantly ask your DM to accept the material

Half Dragon may not work, but Half Awesomeagon has the same rules and can use wands of magic missile as ammo magazines in a crossbow.

2

I used to let my players propose solutions to character building problems if they could make something similar to an existing feat/class/race/rule, but unfortunately over time, this became more the norm than the exception, so I've had to roll back to by-the-book to have any hope of playing and not stopping to discuss custom rule interaction every 5 minutes.

LitheOhm

19:32

@KRyan I did no such thing. You presume overmuch.

3

Q: Multiclassing in Pathfinder-How do Feats work?

I'm making a character who is going to be multi-classing, specifically Fighter/Cleric. He's a Reach Cleric, so I wanted him to have some good feats (Selective Channel, Power Attack, Combat Reflexes, Improved Initiative, and Extra Channel), thus he will have a fighter level. Thing is, I can't figu...

Metool

@Lord_Gareth You got how feats in Pathfinder worked wrong, which I can't blame you for. It's 1 at every odd hit die.

That... probably should have been a comment.

[Absconds]

Joshua Aslan Smith

20:00

@waxeagle Mawwage is what brings us togethwer todaayy.

Metool

Yup yup.

So that happened.

Pureferret

20:56

Yo

Metool

Heyo.

Pureferret

Hows tricks?

Professor Loki Caprion

As Run DMC would tell you... it's tricky.

MadMAxJr

tricky TRICKY

Professor Loki Caprion

Here we go!

Pureferret

21:12

@ProfessorLokiCaprion I guess it's like that

@MadMAxJr And that's the way it is

BESW

21:35

How did we go from Run DMC to Walter Cronkite?

wax eagle

22:51

@BESW rewind by a few dozen years?

BESW

Apparently so.

And here I am finishing up a Doctor Who answer about time paradoxes and the BLE.

Lord_Gareth

23:10

So, @BESW

Am I bad person for running a half-dragon (black) gelatinous cube as an NPC, or am I a bad person for running aforementioned cube as the assassin sent to slay the party?

BESW

[blink]

I think that depends entirely on the party.

Lord_Gareth

It used Shadow Blink to teleport into their inn room and swallow the entire party

Because it was bigger than the room was

MadMAxJr

Is his mount a monster truck made of skeletons?

Or is there a template where we can have a half gelatinous cube dragon to be his cohort?....

KRyan

23:42

am I crazy?

> The rules say X

> No, they don't

> KRyan, the rules aren't the legal document you think they are! This isn't just about how you would play the game! Blah blah blah

wut.

this has nothing to do with how it's played

Lord_Gareth

Myx again?

KRyan

a claim was made that the rules say X

they do not

no, d7

Metool

@KRyan ?

KRyan

13

A: Can you cast Invisibility on a large box and hide inside?

"items picked up disappear if tucked into the clothing or pouches worn by the creature." – Invisibility, d20srd Based on the above, I'd say stuff put into the box arguably becomes invisible. A pouch is a container. A box is a container. Stuff put into an invisible container disappear. S...

the rules really leave no room for argument

none

that doesn't mean you have to, should, or are best off if you follow them

nor did I ever claim it was

I just said that the claim that the rules support his "interpretation" is inaccurate

because it is

they do not support that interpretation in the least

they quite explicitly block that interpretation

Lord_Gareth

[Reads]

.....

@BESW, I need the Edwardian version of a rant that could be summarized, 'that scumsucking wretch'.

KRyan

23:46

well, later

had to rant

@Lord_Gareth actually, the question didn't specify RAW, and you're only inviting more argument suggesting it was.

the real problem is that the answer claims to be supported by "unclear" rules

Lord_Gareth

Eh, screw him anyway, it was implied.

KRyan

which is inaccurate

@Lord_Gareth several members of this site will object massively to that claim

anyway, dinner

BESW

@Lord_Gareth Wat.

Metool

Is including a disclaimer 'This is not a strict reading of the rules, and is, in fact, one man's opinion' not common?

BESW

@Metool It's the necessity of such disclaimers which is being debated.

Specifically, SSD is right: the space between descriptive and legal text is often very fuzzy in 3.5, and taking all text as legal text leads to strange internal contradictions.

However, there is no way to confidently determine which text is intended to be legal--and often intended-legal text is also problematically fuzzy.

tl;dr: 3.5 doesn't know or care about the difference between flavour and rules.

@Lord_Gareth No, really. Wat.

What kind of game is Fate?

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