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13:00 - 19:0019:00 - 21:00

19:00
Well, that means you're at least getting SOME sleep. How old?
@ChrisCudmore Access is a desktop relational database with an extremely powerful front end for form and report creation, using VBA as its scripting language, and with a built in back end engine that sucks monkey balls
@ChrisCudmore almost 4 months. He's been sleeping through the night since 8-9 weeks :)
but it can link up nicely with SQL Server for the backend in which case it can be quite a robust little data app for small offices
@TheEvilGreebo Agreed. I use SQL Server myself, but the front end sucks balls.
@TheEvilGreebo I've converted enough access apps into actual web apps to start sobbing uncontrollably at the mention of the product
19:01
My twins are 6 now, but we didn't sleep for a year.
access is targeted at the end user, its very easy to use badly
@ChrisCudmore yeah, that's what my parents tell me. first year or two is an absolute fog.
sorry at the "power user"
@waxeagle You CAN actually get well designed access/sql apps that convert nicely...
You just never DO...
Someone reasonable educated in relational design can do a decent job of an access application for appropriately sized data sets.
@TheEvilGreebo yeah. people here keep getting into trouble with it. they develop some nice small app that is useful for them, or their group, then their department starts using it, then their entire division uses it and then it's "oh shit, we better get this on the intranet"
19:03
But it does suffer from the "Massive Flat Table" issue.
and then I have to convert their access app into a useful web forms product.
@ChrisCudmore That's not access' fault, that's end user
My big issue is Excel as a data transfer mechanism.
it is a fully fledged self contained RDBMS that about 1% of its users know how to use
@TheEvilGreebo yes. Because even basic DB design isn't something they teach in computing courses
19:05
@waxeagle THAT scares me. Interestingly enough when I took my first course on Access back in ... 95/96... the instructor DID teach data normalization
and he was teaching to power users for the most par
part
Yup. My formal Normalization was all Relational algebra. It would have been better to give us a bunch of fields and tell us to play with it until it worked well.
@TheEvilGreebo not sure they teach much access in school these days...I mean if you're going to take a course in access can't they just teach you how to use a real database?
And Sprocs!!! Why don't they teach sprocs in the one DB course you have to take?
Since I don't have an I.T. degree I don't know.
I did major in it briefly (one of 6 passing majors) but the OO programming course was gronded in Ada
@ChrisCudmore Lol I don't know, I didn't learn sprocs until I got into the "real world"
19:08
er, one of 6 passing majors means one of 6 majors I passed through, not one I PASSED
The theoretical is nice, and important, but sometimes you need to know how to GET STUFF DONE!
Hence, Stackoverflow.
php and JS (and mysql) are eminently usable for most techno-types
I do big iron cisco routers, not programming 'per se' but I find it very useful to put together some php and js to help my group accomplish our goals
Or, you could just do it 3 lines of PERL
@Aaron You hear about Cisco's recent PR fiasco with the home users?
perl is for sick twisted bastards who are just showing off
19:11
(Full disclosure: I work for Ciena so dissing Cisco is a professional duty of mine ;) )
@TheEvilGreebo the "Cloud Connect" for the linksys?
PERL: Write once, read never.
@Aaron yeah
@TheEvilGreebo yeah, big stupid company makes stupid anti-consumer move, news at 11
My big problem with PERL and PHP is my typing. I hate $, _, etc.
19:12
LOL
Well don't worry, I do custom app dev for Ciena - I couldn't even tell you what products we should sell you to replace Cisco ;)
We looked at Ciena on the long haul optical network 10 yrs ago but it never came together
Long time ago. Things have really changed as I understand it (before my time). We purchased the MCS division of Nortel about ... oh 3 yrs back now and added a lot of cool stuff to our line
None of which I can talk intelligently about other than it's really cool sounding :)
Half of what I say is cool sounding BS.
I just make stuff up, add some "Proactively"s and "Leverage"s and Bang! I'm a manager.
Synergy. Makes the execs melt.
@ChrisCudmore I consulted for 15 years. I can BS with the best of them. ;)
We must dynamically insure that our key resources are leveraging our values in synergistic alignment with our core values while simultaneously empowering our employee culture.
er I used values twice, sorry, i'm rusty :)
s/key resources/key competencies/
and you left out a "Vertical Integration"
19:23
Hey I left the market 2 years ago, so maybe I USED to be able to bs with the best
Stop being a hater!
I was once asked for my boss' "Coordinates" I said 43.8N 79.5W
headdesk DirecTV just called my work # trying to sell me their service
@TheEvilGreebo lemmie guess, you're already a customer?
I get Payday loans calling me on the Batphone all the time.
No, I use FIOS
but i reamed the guy for calling me at work anyway :)
19:33
only odd calls I get on my work phone are the randoms trying to reach the guy who had this ext before I did. I've been here 4+ years.
And some ass in the US Gov. published our tech support 1-888 number as the number for the Social Security Office. Printed it right on the form!
@TheEvilGreebo nice :)
@ChrisCudmore that's awesome. Can you bill the gov't for those calls?
Wish we could. We're in Toronto, so it'd be far too expensive to pursue.
That departing gravatar animation is sweet.
@TheEvilGreebo I'm hoping these guys expand outside of just their power grid soon epbfi.com
@ChrisCudmore Do you come to Michigan to buy our milk?
19:36
Too far. And it's $4.50 each way to cross the bridge. Not worth it.
I could go to Buffalo if I needed to, but it's still a couple hours
we'll go have a drink!
you can help me finish the spare bedroom lol
Wings. If I'm in Buffalo I'm doing wings and beer in a dive.
@lsiunsuex Make sure you get the work done, before the drinks ;)
La Nova's
Americans can do dive bar like no others.
They're actually enjoyable to be in.
19:39
@ChrisCudmore The worst are the dive strip bars.
Haven't been since I left the Army.
Besides, I hear the Americans prefer our "Ballet"
strip clubs in buffalo suck
they'll do anything in canada for a 20 though
(6 years ago - last time i went i think)
I'm more of a pub person. I like to talk to the guys I go out with.
Especially at my age, and with kids. I don't get out much.
I'm a grab a growler and head home kinda guy :)
I don't keep too much beer at home. It's too easy to just grab one.
19:43
out of here guys - till tomorrow.
With wine, you've got to think about whether or not you should open the bottle.
Later.
@ChrisCudmore true, true
It's kinda like keeping cookies on hand. And then suddenly they're all gone. Best not to keep temptation in stock.
@ChrisCudmore at least with the growler you've got to make the specific trip to the growler shop and it's only good for so long...(which is why I still keep bottles around :))
once you pop it open it's really only good for about the next day and a half
Good for entertaining. Need some bottles on hand for BBQing though.
19:46
@ChrisCudmore yep.
I typically drink the 1/2 litre euros. One is good, but if I drink bottles, I need 3
Getting thirsty now...
@ChrisCudmore :) same here and I've gotta go put on my tech guy hat tonight after I get off :(
I've gotta grout the basement tile. I'll wait until that's done.
@ChrisCudmore probably wise :)
I'm wondering if I'm going to end up needing to put tile in my basement. We've got carpet in there right now and it doesn't seem like it should have a water problem, but...
I was making a reference to the flap in Minnesota or some similar place where ppl are complaining cause Canadians are coming to the US to buy cheap product
making for longer lines
19:53
Once you open a growler it only lasts a day and a half?
And, this construction has severely limited time with kids. Might squeeze a bike ride in.
@TheEvilGreebo I think it was in Bellingham WA
That's it
@Aaron that's what I've been told, but I haven't let mine open longer than that. I've only got a 1L one so it's about 2 glasses
19:54
On behalf of sane "Americans", allow me to apologize for the dumbass rednecks making this fuss.
@TheEvilGreebo I echo this apology
Please feel free to come and spend your hard earned Canadian dollars within our borders (provided you convert them USD first of course)
Promise not to shoot and I just might.
@ChrisCudmore I can assure you that I will not shoot you. I cannot speak for my countrymen as they're are far too many redneck assholes that I claim no responsibility for.
The men stepped in front of us, then said in a very aggressive tone: "Been to the Stampede yet?"
"a very aggressive tone"
And, one should go to the Calgary Stampede if one has never been!
19:59
Rumour has it they were Calgary Oil employees giving out free tickets. Not sure if true.
I've never been to Calgary.
Will take the boys on a drive out west when they're old enough to do 8 hours a day in the car.
lol wth, Canadians tryin to be friendly and dumb 'merikens wanting to pull a gun on them. classic.
Actually, I generally find Americans to be friendlier and more gregarious than Canadians.
We might be more polite, but we're not friendly.
Step on my foot in a line up, and I'll apologize. But god forbid someone strikes up a conversation with a stranger.
20:32
We sure get some strange questions around here
0
Q: Is checking the oil in a fridge as straight forward as a car?

dangowansI see in another question that the compressor in a fridge has oil in it, and that it has the ability to get dirty over time. Based on the knocking sounds of my fridge, I wonder if it's due for an oil change. Is it possible for the average person to change the oil in a fridge?

@BMitch doesn't A/C fridge work require certification?
legally
Purchasing coolant usually requires a certification
not sure how that varies by state
But I'm not sure how a fridge compares with AC systems, whether it's the same type of coolant
@BMitch gotcha, I see our walmart's/drug stores here in GA selling AC coolant by the can, but I swear I've read/heard that you're not supposed to be allowed to work on it yourself, so yeah may vary by state
@BMitch yeah I dunno, probably at least very similar, there aren't that many refrigerants IIRC
Yeah, I've purchased AC coolant for a car before, but it's no longer freon, so it may not be as harmful to the atmosphere
@BMitch right R134a is supposed to be OK as far as being a CFC
20:36
My dad took a few night classes and now lugs around a big tank to work on any of his properties
@BMitch cool (literally)
20:47
This was a quick close, anyone disagree?
-1
Q: Are non-electric noise cancelling headphones available that are suitable for extended home improvement?

Michael BarnesI'm going to be tearing up a sizable cement area on my property, and I'm looking to invest in a durable set of noise cancelling headphones that will protect my ears from the noise. Obviously it won't be silent, but it would be nice to have something that would dampen the sound of a jackhammer a b...

I think @Tester101 and I are reversing roles on who wants to try to save a question, I'm thinking a good answer could have gone into the pros and cons of ear plugs, over the ear muffles, electronic noise canceling, etc.
@BMitch It's a shopping question
Fair enough, I can see that
I'm just reminded of my step mom chasing my dad around the yard with a broom because he couldn't hear her yelling for him over the leaf blower and ear protection. Apparently the neighbors think my parents are a little nuts now.
I have neighbors like that, but I think it's selective deafness after many years of marriage.
13:00 - 19:0019:00 - 21:00

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