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12:00 AM
@Medix2 oo! That one looks like a rare untagged non-5e question. 3.5?
 
12:17 AM
@Medix2 Multiple editions of D&D have books with the same name, and I've even seen directly copy-pasted sections of 3.5 in 5e...
 
@Medix2 You can phrase it however you want. If there are direct book names/quotes/page numbers/etc. and it's seemingly unambiguous which system it is, I'll basically phrase my request to them to edit in the tag accordingly
 
We've also had questions where the querent didn't know that the books they were using were from two different editions in the same game.
 
Regions of Ruin is free to own on Steam if you get it by April 6: store.steampowered.com/app/680360/Regions_Of_Ruin
 
(A vast number of systems dating from the d20 Boom/Bust period share directly quoted passages from D&D 3.5...)
(Ditto games that are Powered by the Apocalypse, or Forged in the Dark, or run on the various Fate engines, or For the Queen, tend to share significant portions of text with their cousins.)
 
Yes I know these things. But I find it highly improbable that people accidentally combining editions occurs in the majority of questions lacking a system tag... That's all for discussion elsewhere though
I just greatly worry how "there are thousands of RPGs out there" sounds coming from a supposed expert when a question involves direct quotes (plural) and the like. But the policy isn't changing so instead I'll attempt to phrase my suggestions to edit in such a way that they hopefully won't cause annoyance and bewilderment for the OP
 
12:30 AM
I will not defend the hostility of the Stack's structures, but experience has shown that trying to make policies more exception-based leads to a lot of arguing and even more hurt feelings. On the other hand, the way the policies are presented can be done with kindness and gentleness.
So long as we choose to play in the Stack's infrastructure, in a hobby whose most visible online spaces are aggressively argumentative and defensive so that most of our users come to us assuming we operate the same way, there will be deep unsolvable conflicts between the way we want the site to be, the way the mechanics of our hosts force the site to be, and the way the hobby's other online spaces influence this one.
 
Yeah that's fair. I suppose much of my upset comes not from the policy itself but from how it's enforced and talked about. Whether that's a result of the type of policy it is or just its history or something else entirely I've no idea
 
All of the above, I think.
There's a tendency for the dicussion of that particular topic to be reduced to "I have shown why one particular argument is weak and therefore it should be changed immediately" and ignoring all the other arguments which in total can be said to justify the policy even if none of them individually is strong justification on its own.
 
Yeah some of the policy debate definitely gets lost in typical and false ideas on "how to shut down an argument". You don't just argue a single point they made and suddenly topple the argument (well, unless the argument stood solely on that single point). It's built on multiple pillars and thoughts and unless you counter enough of them or provide your own demonstrably better option, you're not getting very far
 
There's also a common trend for well-thought-out policies to get angry "you're being mean control freaks for no reason" pushback, so there's a high bar for showing that there IS a problem before meta is going to take it seriously.
 
Or "you're going to ruin the place for no reason" pushback, in the other direction =)
 
12:42 AM
Yeah I always feel a bit... Unusual(?) discussing the system tag policy given that I wasn't around for when it was enacted or previously discussed... Makes me question whether my points are even valid or worth, well, anything
 
This particular policy is, in part, an ideological statement that while D&D happens to be the lion's share of our content, we don't want it to be the default/assumed system for this Stack or for the hobby in general. And because it takes up so much room, we must be deliberate and firm about clearing space for other games to exist alongside it here.
 
Sooth.
 
I think the argument for keeping it that I most agree with is the idea that doing anything else will open the floor for debate over what makes a question "obviously part of X system"
 
@Medix2 Tags are hard and confusing for everybody, I think.
@Medix2 Yeah, we've seen that with other kinds of edits and close reasons.
 
I feel like we and B&CG should have a bit of a meeting of the minds over the shared RPGSE/dnd5eSE BCGSE/MtGSE problem we face. I assume we could learn some from each other....
 
12:46 AM
The fun of "well, is this a duplicate?" and though that can be (and is) taken to Meta, I'm unsure how well the idea of taking every "this is X system, right?" question to Meta would go over or even work
 
I think Arqade gets it with Minecraft, too, but I'm not sure it's as lopsided.
 
Another justification for the policy, or something like it, that I consider very solid, is the "teach a man to fish" argument. We expect users to tag their systems. If we tag systems for new users, we get new generations of users which learn that other people will clean up after them.
 
And yet we edit every single other tag in for them
And like... If we so badly want users to tag the systems on their own, I just think that needs to be far more obviously stated
 
If we could state it more clearly in the documentation, we would.
 
Yeah and now we're back to problems of Stack itself XD
 
12:48 AM
But this gets back to the fact that we're playing in the Stack Overlords' sandbox and they don't let us change much about the structure of the site.
Policies are the only tool we're given to adjust the site to fit our needs.
 
@Medix2 Also, just because you weren't around before doesn't mean your points aren't valid! Obviously being aware of that fact can help you avoid making assumptions due to lack of experience. But if that were true it would mean a whole lot of people's opinions wouldn't be valid for much of anything lol
 
I wonder how many questions have no system tag nor whatever [system-agnostic] does
 
@Rubiksmoose (good edit)
 
Oh gosh, is a nightmare tag.
 
@nitsua60 XD
 
12:50 AM
And at the end of the day a big part of the problem is that our Stack Overlords don't have a clear sense of tagging themselves.
 
@Rubiksmoose I'm also always happy to have newer users pointing out for us where we're doing a particularly bad job of explaining or modeling or teaching things.
 
Tagging is supposed to be an emergent folksonomy, created by the people who write the questions and adjusted by others only when there's a clear problem which needs to be addressed.
 
@BESW so much this. I think the only reason that hasn't been fixed is that it's actually not causing that many problems because we get so few of them. And trying to fix it would cause so much arguing.
 
But in every site, a category of tag emerges which becomes systemic and acquires the weight of obligation.
 
@BESW This as well. We've brought some of these concerns up for changes before and got responses like "you're doing tagging wrong" back from SE people.
That was a while back to be fair.
 
12:52 AM
As somebody who spent a while going into taxonomy as a job... It's alarming how arbitrary and disagreeable even a scientific taxonomy is
 
So... I occasionally sit on a board that visits schools as part of their accreditation process. And one thing I've come to appreciate is that these accreditation organizations evaluate everything through the experience of the student.
 
The Overlords continue to insist that the emergent folksonomy their system mechanics enforce is the best universal solution and that problems with it must be addressed on a site-by-site policy basis, despite the evidence of almost every single site that it requires some additional mechanical nuance.
 
Like, a school can have really inefficient accounting practices that make the business office work a lot harder than they need to. But we have to ask: is it impacting the students? Maybe it's so bad that it's pulling people away from other things, or slowing things down, and it is effecting students' experience. Or maybe it's just making the accountant go grey a little early.
 
So we're stuck trying to adjudicate an imposed system whose flaws are touted as features, and who better to do that than a community that spends its time explaining D&D to each other?
 
That's the difference between a "major" recommendation for improvement that actually needs to be addressed and documented back to the accreditor, vs. a "minor" recommendation that may just help the school, but is not ~required~ for accreditation.
 
12:55 AM
Tags work, they help find questions, there's just the problems of when do you use them and which ones do you use (and many more)... I know other sites (not SE related) have policies of "tag everything you see" though there's certainly some reason that wouldn't work for SE, such as arguments over what is actually seen...
 
Yeah, the five-tag limit is... interesting.
It forces discussion of primacy and value which infinite-tag catalogues do not.
 
Meanwhile Metas have required tags, though Meta is its own weirdness of being exceptionally similar to a mainsite despite at times attempting to function incredibly differently
 
So in a discussion like this I think of the "power users" more like faculty, and the casual askers and readers as the "students" whose experience should be primary in focus. But I worry about neglecting the core, active users, too....
(Sorry, I'm just babbling. Slash: avoiding my work.)
 
@Medix2 The Stack Exchange devoted years to developing an interface and infrastructure to enforce an epistemology that values pithy independent responses to clear, precise problems. This interface and its accompanying infrastructure actively discourages discussion, ambiguity, and accompaniment.
....Then they applied that interface to their space for discussing policies, identifying ambiguities, and accompanying each other.
Sep 6 '18 at 21:01, by BESW
It's very telling that the Stack Exchange, having defined itself by its ability to hone an interface that creates a community, has put literally no effort into crafting the interface for that community's backroom.
Within the Stack Overlords' imposed paradigm, the don't-guess-systems policy is the best solution we've yet to find. But that paradigm is, at its heart, hostile to @nitsua60's concept of valuing the experience of the user--especially new users.
 
I wonder if there's a way to see what % of questions are user's first questions
 
1:05 AM
@BESW Yeah--I was just spelunking to find this blog post announcing the creation of meta from 2009 (!). One will probably notice that almost nothing mechanically has changed in the intervening eleven years.
 
Yup.
 
Though... I also wonder whether that's a meaningful or useful statistic. After all, answers are a major part of the site and if a new user only ever asks one and only one question and does nothing else .. I wonder how much the niceness of the introduction impacted their decision not to stay
 
@Medix2 @Miniman Script work for you!
(Pictured above: A Pearl on the sand)
 
@Medix2 Derp. Re-read what you wrote, not what I was thinking of.
 
Well I missed whatever you deleted XD
 
1:09 AM
@Medix2 If you're trying to look at "niceness" or, maybe more-measurable, "stickiness" of the site... I suspect that looking at retention beyond first response might be a little better? I.e. when you post something and get a response--answer, comment, edit with custom summary--what happens from there?
 
A lack of response is a response. [grin]
 
You could almost call it "user mortality" if you've been consuming too much corona-news.
 
GcL
1:21 AM
@nitsua60 People might continue to visit because they find valuable information, but might be put off contributing. That would show up in a slightly different way than posted and never came back. It would be posted and never posted again. That would be difficult to disambiguate from actually having nothing to say or just being a one-time poster most time lurker and there's no deterrent involved.
 
(Aside, the more time I spend thinking about games as a designer/developer, and the more time I spend playing games from the RPGSEA indie community, the less useful rpg.se becomes to me as a Q&A resource. And while part of that is the kind of people who use this site, it's rooted in the assumptions about valueable questions and answers which come from the site being designed by and for USA tech communities--which also influences the kinds of people who come to these sites.)
 
GcL
As for teaching people to fish, I generally would advise putting in the correct tag and pointing out that's the right way. I dislike the close and prod approach.
 
learning to fish is a nontrivial task
 
GcL
@skullpatrol Does noodling count? I've been keen to try that.
 
sure, why not? :-)
they say "play" is a form of learning
albeit, informal and low stakes @GcL
 
1:56 AM
@BESW @Medix2 62%
That is, 62% of questions were the only question asked by that user, not just the first question.
 
I'm surprised it's that low!
 
Hmmm...deleted users, maybe?
Oops, it's all post types. Sorry, haven't done this in a while.
64%, then.
 
So you're saying that of our 39K questions, about 25K of them are one-offs?
@BESW (btw, I "not responded" as long as I could, [grin])
 
No, that's definitely not right.
Looks like ~6000-7000 out of 39k.
Hmmm...if a user only ever asks one question, but does other stuff, do they qualify? I guess they technically don't.
 
Just depends what statistic we want
If you're looking for "the possible effects of a negative introduction" that's probably "how many people have made 1 and only 1 post (post = question or answer)"
Then again, if you're not counting deleted posts it's a pretty useless statistic
Maybe the number of people who've made a single post and deleted it but were not closed for being off-topic or duplicates and yeah... This all gets confusing and hard to even understand what a given statistic shows, hmmm
 
2:12 AM
numbers are the best way to abstract an idea into uselessness, yeah
 
@Medix2 Assuming I'm doing this right, that number is about 8% (10641/128845). And again, it's been a while since I've done this, but I believe deleted posts will be in all of these counts.
 
@Miniman By the "content generation" value of the Stack Overlords, it probably doesn't count.
 
@BESW Answers, though.
 
True. Can we get % of first posts that never got a followup?
 
And even then there's no way to distinguish people who were put off by the site's presentation/something from people who just didn't ever have more questions and never planned to answer questions in the first place
 
2:16 AM
@BESW That's the 8% above. Hopefully.
 
@BESW lol
 
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Bad keyword in answer, bad keyword with email in answer, email in answer, pattern-matching email in answer, potentially bad keyword in answer (348): Psychic Scream - Healing after your head explodes? by Lisa Steven on rpg.SE
 
But for the sake of the don't-guess-systems policy as it relates to new users, first-time querents who never asked again are really the primary focus--even if they've also given answers before or since.
 
That's true, so people who've only asked one question but it's been a statistically significant amount of time since that first question
Which requires figuring out the distribution of times between first and second questions asked while avoiding all the instances of people asking the same question twice in-a-row after the first is closed and many other things... Or we can just lump them all together and count the people who've only asked one question even though it's statistically likely for them to have only asked one question
 
Like, take a look at my stats: I've asked 88 questions and given 241 answers. It took two months after my first answer before I asked my first question, and I stopped asking questions a year before I stopped answering them.
Questions have always been a lot harder than answers for me, which flies directly in the face of Pearls, Not Sand.
And this is borne out across the site: questions get multiple answers more than they get no answers, there's a lot more people answering than asking. It took four years before this site awarded its first Tumbleweed Badge.
 
2:33 AM
wow
 
@BESW likewise
 
2:50 AM
On the other hand, I tend to research first and then, when stuck, ask a question.
Based on my experiences on five different stacks, that's an exception rather than a common pattern.
 
3:16 AM
I have had some questions I posted where I would have loved more answers
I'm not saying the trend isn't actually generally a lot of answers to each question, but sometimes a question is about a system not a lot of people have even heard of let alone know
XD
like GSS
 
Apropos of literally nothing, I finished Darksiders Genesis last night, and my longtime habit of watching the credits payed off with pure gold - Gareth Coker composed the soundtrack.
 
I mean, one perfect answer is nice, but also,... I'm not sure it's actually practical to wait for one perfect answer either :/
 
Also Keith David voiced a character, but I knew that as soon as I heard it.
 
oh how was that by the way?
I still haven't played the first Darksiders yet but I am interested to hear about it
 
Really fun. Darksiders 2 and 3 both look like the first one, but don't play like it. Genesis doesn't look like the first one, but it does play like it.
 
3:22 AM
huh
how odd
 
I mean, it does mostly look like it. The only real difference is that it's top-down instead of over-the-shoulder.
But, yanno, that's a big difference.
 
I mean, that's enough for some people to decide not to play it XD
 
I mean, I can completely understand people having lost faith in the series after 2 not-so-great sequels.
 
oh I wasn't even talking about it specifically really
 
As far as 1-3, each was based off of trending games at the time. Darksiders 1 plays like Zelda + beat-em-ups (e.g. God of War), Darksiders 2 plays like an action RPG (e.g. Fable), Darksiders 3 plays like Dark Souls
 
3:25 AM
some people don't like changes to a game franchise very much and if you change it say, from third person to top down they will skip that game
I've known people like that and even been that person
XD
3 plays like Dark Souls? huh
 
@MikeQ I mean, that's an oversimplification, but they definitely all blend a bunch of other games together and throw a Darksiders skin over the top.
 
oh I got one
if they made a new Hollow Knight game that was top down I would snooze on it
 
@trogdor It introduced game elements that were (presumably) taken from Dark Souls. It definitely doesn't play like Dark Souls.
 
fair enough
 
@trogdor You wouldn't trust Team Cherry?
 
3:27 AM
no
thankfully they aren't doing that
so I do trust them :P
I mean, the reason I like Hollow Knight is it's mix of platforming and action, you can't pull it off the same way top down
perspective counts for a lot
I'm not saying top down is an inferior game type either, but you have to be making the game around it is all
 
If Silksong is top down, I will buy it. If it's a first-person shooter, I will buy it. Even if it's an MMO, I...no, even I have limits.
 
but it isn't those things
XD
so I will buy it
 
@Miniman Hm yes that's a more accurate way to describe it. Borrows elements from those games.
 
but there are good top down games I like
most recently Wargroove
but you know, also Advance Wars and Fire Emblem
and sort of the pokemon games till you get into the battles which are more just normal turn based RPG type gameplay
 
@trogdor Oh, I get what you're saying. I'm just saying, I trust Team Cherry, so I'll buy pretty much whatever they make.
 
3:33 AM
mm
that's your perogative
 
Oh, absolutely. I'm not suggesting anyone else should have blind faith in a developer.
 
XD
the thing is
I am definitely also getting Silksong
but that's because I have an idea of what it's going to be
"Hollow Knight with different movement and attack abilities"
sign me up
XD
and of course entirely new areas to explore and characters to meet and a new vague mystery to unravel
it's (at least hopefully) like they are making HK all over again and I actually get to play it again for the first time
 
Yeah, but apparently your overall direction is up this time instead of down, so I'm not buying it :P
 
lol
look
if they came out and said "actually all those trailers were a lie, silksong is a first person shooter" I wouldn't buy it
XD
 
@Miniman Just flip your screen vertically, then the movement will be downward
 
3:41 AM
lol
 
@MikeQ I don't want solutions, I just want to be angry about this Very Important issue that has completely ruined everything forever.
Although it could be worse, imagine if someone made a platformer where you go left most of the time.
 
@KorvinStarmast I wonder how bimodal it is...? Like, are there strong cohorts of "answers lots, asks little" vs. "asks lots, answers little", or is it a smooth spectrum from one end to the other? (A simple question which ignores a lot of other ways of engaging, to be sure.)
 
@Miniman oh man that would be sooooo bad right? :P
 
@nitsua60 This might be the least helpful graph I've ever produced.
 
@Miniman Without even seeing it, I assume it looks like US unemployment claims.
 
3:51 AM
 
@nitsua60 Man, I wish.
 
 
@Miniman That's what it looked like the first time I tried knitting, too =)
 
1
Q: Ready actions: Can you knock someone prone?

Lio ElbammalfCould you ready the action: If an enemy attacks me then, once they've attacked, I will attempt to knock them prone. If so it could be used if the distance between you and an enemy was too far to cross in one move, moving to 30 feet from them. Readying this action would give you advantage on your...

 
@BESW Well, that's the thing - data.SE defaulted to plotting the counts as x and y coordinates. I'm trying to do something a bit better in openoffice.
Stacked percentages is probably the closest to "useful" I can come up with.
 
4:06 AM
I was imagining a histogram on ratio of Q/A. (Hence the US unemployment assumption--that there's be a smear generally, and a lot of users with super-high Q/A.) But I'm not saying you need to do that, just what I had been thinking.
 
@nitsua60 Data, go nuts.
 
@BESW Nice.
 
lol
 
The same chart, but with actual ordering:
Which tells us basically nothing, except that there's a lot of people who ask one question or give one answer.
If you remove them, you get this:
 
4:14 AM
@Miniman That's enough for me to visualize just how U-shaped my plot would be. Like c-channel steel, this userbase is =)
 
Which is really the same chart with slightly shorter solid colour bookends.
The overall takeaway for me is that we have too many users to have nice graphs. I'm going to need you moderators to start banning people ASAP.
 
4:54 AM
 
I saw discussion of Darksiders taking different angles with each new game and I'm just sitting here hype af for Sea of Stars the Chrono-Trigger inspired JRPG sequel to The Messenger the Ninja-Gaiden inspired Metroidvania
 
@Medix2 I really need to play The Messenger one of these days.
 
That sign really makes me wonder if they say "Sorry vacancy"
@Miniman It's a fantastic game, well, assuming you even like the genre(s) of course. It's got a good free DLC as well. I'm just waiting on the prequel in... two years
 
@Medix2 I do! I slept on it for a long time, but then I played Ori, then Hollow Knight, and now it's probably the genre I play the most.
 
I need to play Ori 2 and finally beat the Pantheon of Hollownest with all four locks...
 
4:58 AM
Although I still haven't played Super Metroid or SotN, so I sometimes feel like a bad person.
 
I also haven't played SotN XD
 
@Medix2 Ori 2 was great!
 
Thoroughly enjoyed La Mulana and Rabi-Ribi though both are pretty unusual. Axiom Verge and Dead Cells two others games I've enjoyed quite a lot. Honestly... not sure the last time I just disliked a game
 
I can't remember exactly where I got to in HK pantheons, but I know I haven't unlocked Sisters of Battle yet (because that pretty quickly became the goal I cared about most).
 
I adore that fight, the twist was just incredible
 
5:00 AM
@Medix2 The only one of those I've played is Dead Cells - Axiom Verge is on the list.
 
I also misread HK and KH and was like "Oh! Another Kingdom Hearts fan!!"
 
@Medix2 Sorry, not me.
 
Now I wanna go look at my "Metroidvania" category...
 
Same, honestly. Without looking, though, Salt and Sanctuary is a huge standout.
 
Yuuuppp
Sundered is... something else
Randomly generated metroidvania is definitely one of the most interesting things I've seen
 
5:08 AM
Let's see...Bloodstained is on the todo list, Momodora and Minoria were both great, Dust was good but not great, Monster Boy was great, Shantae was great, Iconoclasts is on the todo list, Indivisible was great but I struggled to stay motivated for some reason, Blasphemous was good, Ghost was good, Owlboy was meh and I couldn't bring myself to finish it.
Lets out a deep breath Okay I'm done.
Except for all the stuff I've probably forgotten.
 
Bloodstained I loved, Momodora was interesting but some of my friends just hated it. Time to google Minoria. I loved Dust but am partial to the artwork. Monster Boy and Shantae YES. Iconoclasts, hmm, the story is a wonderfully jumbled blob of never knowing what's going on. Indivisible I kept going only for the many constantly added characters and that ending was great. Plus there's NG+ coming out soon!! Owlboy and Blasphemous are great. I need to actually boot up Ghost 1.0
Unepic I actually enjoyed a lot more than I thought I would though one section of the game is particularly unfair
 
@Medix2 Minoria is a stealth sequel to Momodora by the same developer.
 
It's hard to say what counts as Metroidvania, but Child of Light is one of my favorite games
 
@Medix2 Oh my goodness you went there.
I love Child of Light SO MUCH.
The OST is probably my most-listed album of all time at this point.
 
Like HOW did they come up with the main mechanic
 
5:14 AM
Hmmm, Golden Sun OST. Well, it's up there, anyway.
@Medix2 Apparently it comes from Grandia?
That's literally the only thing I know about Grandia though.
 
Chasm, Cat Maze, and Chronicles of Teddy exist... The first has just the weirdest replayability ever, the latter is short but does some cool stuff, and the last is just plain weird constantly...
 
@V2Blast I'm only just now seeing this, but this is probably the least surprising change they've ever announced for 5e. I like the change, and I think it justifies me unbanning it in my campaigns.
 
5:35 AM
@Medix2 I saw rabi-ribi but I kinda assumed it was a full fanservice game or something and avoided it
@Miniman oh I'm glad you liked Shantae, did you only play uh,... Pirates Curse?
or did you decide to try one of the others too?
 
@trogdor Yeah. I may well play some of the others sometime, though.
 
fair enough
just a word of caution, Risky's Revenge is dated and you can tell, but Half Genie Hero is good, just not quite in the same way as Pirates Curse
also the extra content in Half Genie is all cool but also really annoying
the only one I bothered to beat was the Pirates Curse throwback
which fair warning, has extra fanservice
but thats kinda just what you get in Shantae I guess /shrug
oh and you liked Ghost better than Owlboy?
I don't mean it to sound like I didn't like Ghost but it was mostly an "alright" to me
XD
 
@trogdor Yeah, by a long way. We actually talked about most of this at the time :P
 
in a way that make me even more reluctant to try Owlboy out XD
@Miniman I didn't remember you comparing the two XD
to be fair to Ghost, it has some nice mechanics that kept me playing till the end
 
@trogdor I mean, technically I didn't compare them here either.
 
5:42 AM
there were just occasionally annoying sections
and the controls were at the least usually serviceable
@Miniman it kinda seemed like you did in a way XD
@Miniman also this kinda seems like a comparison to me :P
(yes I know it came after I asked XD)
 
@trogdor You started it. So there.
Gah! Beaten.
 
lol
but yeah literally no shade thrown at Ghost
it just happened to be stuck in my head being compaired to Hollow Knight, and for that it lost points it didn't really deserve to lose
the story is,... slightly basic but the gameplay is nice and fresh
I struggle to think of any game at all that combined all the mechanics it did
let alone in a satisfying way
 
@trogdor It's almost like a scrolling shooter in some ways.
 
it is, it has that element to it
but then it's also actually a Metroidvania like
 
I don't know that I have a preferred type of videogame these days... lately I've been playing Overwatch, Fallout 3, Terraria, and Infinifactory. I also restarted Fallout 1... wow, that's dated... still good in its own way, though.
 
5:49 AM
mm I've been playing just a tiny little bit of Infinifactory
 
@Adeptus I still play lots of stuff, metroidvanias just seem to be what I play the most.
 
it's good but I definitely need to be in the right mood to play it
 
Although it also seems like there are more of them coming out than other genres.
 
I don't think there really are more metroidvanias than alllll other genres
but there's definitely seemed to be a bigger appetite for them than there has been in the past
I think games like Hollow Knight spurred a bit of a renewal of interest in that genre
 
@trogdor I'm kind of hooked on it. I started... a week ago, maybe less? And I've just got the 3rd "trophy".
(oh, I've also been playing FFXIV a little)
 
5:51 AM
@Adeptus oooh I only have the first one
 
@trogdor I think I've mentioned to you before my theory about the genres that get good indie games - 2D platformers are a lot cheaper to make than, say, 3D shooters, so we get a lot more of them.
 
@Miniman yeah i mean, I think there is something to be said for that
 
@trogdor It's honestly just a great bullet-hell metroidvania
 
fair enough
maybe I should just give it a shot
 
At one point it had the highest positive review rating of any steam game
 
5:52 AM
I had a period of time in my life when I just avoided games with any whiff of fanservice
and then at some point I stopped and was able to allow myself to play stuff like Shantae
and I realized I can just ignore that element for truly good games XD
@Medix2 wow
that is actually quite a feat
I think
to be fair I see a loooot of games with good reviews on Steam
 
Shantae and Rabi-Ribi are two of my favorite games though... whatever fanservicing they have doesn't really impact me
 
many of which I just can't buy or else I would be buying all of them and be out of money
XD
@Medix2 I've decided that it shouldn't at least be a full veto, and I'm glad because at the very least I've been able to play maybe,... 3 or 4 games that really were good and not fully relying on fanservice
and that alone has been worth it
I still do,... try to steer clear of anything that looks like that's the whole point
but now I at least evaluate other factors
XD
 
It's a bit odd when Keijo!!!!!!, Kill La Kill, Shantae, and Rabi-Ribi are four things I thoroughly enjoy... maybe I'm just immune to fanservice
 
fanservice still, annoys me a little
but I can look past it
I've heard Kill La Kill was good but I still have to finish Cowboy Beebop and Fullmetal Alchemist and a couple other things
and I haven't been in an anime mood
 
Too many games, shows, anime, movies, etc... too little time
 
5:58 AM
and Kill La Kill is probably at the bottom of the list for,... well the clothes
XD
yeah pretty much
 
I envy those people who can actually manage to watch a show while playing a game and understand them both
 
oh man I cannot do that
I do watch/listen to some media in the background depending on what kind of game I am playing
but not stuff I am really trying to absorb
ignoring fanservice also allowed me to watch and finish Gurren Laggan
thankfully it was short enough and epic enough I managed to finish it
and it was great
 
You are correct
 
it's a real blessing that it was only 2 seasons long
not to say I'm that glad because it was over kinda fast
but it was short enough I could finish it without stopping and having other things pile up on top of it, and it also, I think, reasonably wrapped up it's story in probably the only satisfactory way possible XD
also Viral for life
XD
I'm an extreme fan of him, his character growth/arc, and just yes
and of course his sharp teeth
for some reason I just really like sharp teeth
 
6:28 AM
Hi guys I was getting bored at home, so I joined this chat.
 
6:40 AM
cool
welcome
I know everything above for a good bit was anime and video games and stuff but this is the RPG chat
if you wanted to talk about an RPG this is the place XD
off topic is ok too as long as it isn't being toxic or overriding someone who does want to talk RPG stuff
or a better fit for another room
 
@YuvrajSingh... How's it going?
 
6:54 AM
@Xirema Yep, it's only surprising that it took this long :P
@trogdor KLK is definitely... interesting. The plot is absurd but there's actually some kind of storyline there; the fanservice is given a reason in the plot but it doesn't actually prevent it from being fanservice. The action is over-the-top, just like TTGL. There are also some great blink-and-you'll-miss-it comedic segments with Mako that are the highlight of the show IMO :P
@trogdor Viral is great! Sharp teeth included.
 
XD
I also like when anime gives characters like, a temporary sharp tooth or something, but I like best what they did with Viral, he just has a whole mouth full of sharp teeth and it's just part of him
XD
I think I also mistook your avatar at one point for Viral
XD
 
lol
 
...that's just terrifying
lol
 
In context, it's not terrifying, just absurdly ridiculous XD
 
7:00 AM
@Miniman nice try, I don't watch that but I've seen the character before and those aren't his teeth :P
 
> I also like when anime gives characters like, a temporary sharp tooth or something
 
@Miniman yes
XD
 
I kind of want to explain it, but also not.
 
I assume he stole that from someone
I do know he is a pirate
but maybe he killed a shark
XD
 
I mean, it's entirely unsurprising no matter what it is, given One Piece
 
7:04 AM
@trogdor Close, actually - he was fighting a shark fishman who kept on ripping the teeth out of his mouth to use as weapons, since they just grew back anyway. So of course Luffy grabbed a set to use in his own mouth.
 
lol
 
4
Q: Can a warlock with Book of Ancient Secrets scribe a known spell into a scroll, replace the spell with a new one, and still be able to cast it?

HavenmakerI am playing a 3/3 Divine Soul sorcerer/Hexblade warlock, and have just chosen the Pact of the Tome, along with the Book of Ancient Secrets. I have found a spellbook with Identify, which I am now transcribing into the book. I also have Unseen Servant as a known spell. I create a scroll, using t...

 
@Power dork lock down!
 
7:37 AM
@YuvrajSingh... There's been a lot of really great sales and game jams for one- and two-player TRPGs, and TRPGs that are good for online play.
I feel like maybe I should be getting a head start on mechanizing my Traveling Librarians game guide, its themes are... relevant.
 
8:26 AM
Morning folks !
Tabletop Simulator being at -50% this week-end has been a benediciton for me and my friends
We were playing Settlers of Catan basically non-stop
 
@PierreCathé Speaking of Tabletop Simulator being 50% off for the next day, a link: store.steampowered.com/app/286160/Tabletop_Simulator
 
Oh yeah, where are my manners ?
Thanks
 
 
3 hours later…
11:58 AM
@V2Blast What sorts of things could I play if I bought that thing? What do I run it on? (cc: @PierreCathé)
 
@nitsua60 A few games like go and chess are sold with the base game, more expensive games like zombicide, scythe... are sold separately as DLC, but the main point is the plethora of games available for free* in the Steam Workshop. I've found for example Settlers of Catan, Splendor, Dominion, Munchkin, Ticket to ride, Bang...
*as long as you buy the main game that is
I run it on a windows pc, should run on mac and linux too
Hope that answers your question ;)
 
@PierreCathé Gotcha--thanks.
 
12:30 PM
@PierreCathé There's actually a settlers website. I think it's catanonline but I'll confirm
hrm.... apparently, we played Catan Universe
There's also dominion.games which is solid
 
@goodguy5 I've seen this but apparently many users report that it's pretty buggy
 
eh, no buggier than tsim
 
@goodguy5 This does look solid, thanks for the link !
 
The base game and a random expansion (I think it changes by the week?) are free
looks like it's by the day
The only weird thing is that you can't invite friends to your table. You have to be friends, and then they can join your table.

Unless you can prove me wrong.
 
@goodguy5 I'll have to test with my friends, can't say right now
 
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