TRPG General Chat

2:10 PM

Hrm. It occurs to me looking at the death item question, there are dozens of spells/items/whatevers that instantly kill a PC, why aren't there more items that prevent this?

NautArch

@JohnP Maybe because it minimizes those things? If everything has a counter, then nothing is special?

And that there are options for returning to life.

Personally, I dont see an issue with having that item. If they want a safety net, use a safety net. not a big deal.

John Clifford

Yeah, death has to be at least a possibility (unless you've houseruled no PC death) otherwise the stakes are always meaningless. Having too many options to circumvent that possibility cheapens the feeling of danger.

Nyakouai

Beg your pardon, there is at least one item that prevent death

Lich's phylactery :P

John Clifford

And assuming something happens to 4 reelz kill a PC, that just becomes an epic sidequest to gather the stuff for a True Resurrection.

Nyakouai

(Okay, that doesn't count, but I couldn't resist)

Pierre Cathé

2:18 PM

@Nyakouai It does count, you can learn the ritual to make one in Curse of Strahd

JohnP

@NautArch I'm not saying it has to be common, but I'm not seeing anything.

At least with the effect the poster is describing.

David Coffron

@JohnP Well the most obvious thing that has that effect is revivify on a contingency

9

Q: Is it possible to delay the Revivify spell so it's activated when a character dies?

The other day I was speaking with one of my players and he thought "Is there actually a way to delay a revivify spell so it is activated when the character dies?" I thought it could be a great idea but couldn't remember any way of delaying spells. Is there any other way to delay a spell so it ac...

illustro

@JohnP there is at least one item which is death adjacent the Periapt of Wound Closure, which stabilises a PC if they are dying

NautArch

@DavidCoffron I still think it's mostly a non-issue and more about table play agreement

illustro

(at the start of their turn)

JohnP

2:27 PM

@DavidCoffron But that relies on an outside agent with the appropriate abilities/spells.

@illustro That is true, I had forgotten that one.

David Coffron

@JohnP That can be said of many magic items that replicate spell-like effects

JohnP

@DavidCoffron mmm...peripherally, I suppose.

illustro

it doesn't interact with instant death effects (as you would be dead as opposed to dying at the start of your turn)

JohnP

Aroma of Curdled Death, that's a nasty little item...

David Coffron

If I were to allow a character to craft such a magic item, I would place it at Very Rare or Legendary rarity, since it does something usually only attainable to level 11 or higher characters.

John Clifford

2:30 PM

Since Revivify's cast time is 1 action, could you not ready it with the trigger of "when one of my allies dies"?

JohnP

Die no save/save or die/Con damage.

David Coffron

However, if crafting isn't an aspect of your game, and you can limit access to the item, it is totally up to the GM whether to provide it or not.

@JohnClifford Yes, but then you have to Concentrate on it, and you lose the spell slot if none of your characters die in that round

13

Q: Does a Readied spell immediately use a spell slot?

The PHB is a bit unclear when it comes to readied spells in combat. If I lose my concentration do I lose the spell slot? What about if the trigger never occurs, do I get the spell slot back?

dnd-5e spells readied-action

illustro

@DavidCoffron it's essentially replicating the death ward spell, once

John Clifford

True. You'd probably have to ready it when an ally had failed 2 death saves or something.

illustro

which is a 4th level spell, and would put it at the rare rarity

(according to the DMG)

MikeQ

2:32 PM

@JohnP But not as nasty as Aroma of Curdled Milk

David Coffron

@illustro No, it explicitly works differently than death ward, functioning after death saves are failed or an instant-death effect

John Clifford

It works as an answer to the question as written though: you can delay a spell via the Ready action assuming your chosen trigger happens and you're able to maintain concentration.

David Coffron

You still have your normal capacity to recover from dying, and then a safety net.

illustro

@DavidCoffron in particular the second half of death ward states: If this spell is still in effect when the target is subjected to an effect that would kill it instantaneously without dealing damage, that effect is instead negated against the target, and the spell ends

David Coffron

@illustro Still isn't a consideration for the dying recovery chance

illustro

2:34 PM

The death saving throws effect is already covered by the Periapt of Wound Clousure (which stabilises characters if they are unconscious and dying)

and does so without limit

and is set as an uncommon item

If you were to combine part of a 4th level spell, with a single use portion of an uncommon magic item (which would normally have unlimited uses), why would that elevate it to Very Rare or Legendary?

Essentially you need an item that works once, performs the second half of the death ward spell, and is a single use periapt of wound closure in one

NautArch

I really want to believe we're overthinking this :)

illustro

You can of course replicate that effect with a combination of Contingency and Revivify...but that seems like overkill

David Coffron

@illustro The OP hasn't clarified if it stabilizes them after the failed death saves, or ressurects them (like rolling a 20 on a save) or if they are still dying

If it just stabilizes then I agree that Rare is probably fine

But a full rez after a 3rd fail save is very strong

NautArch

@DavidCoffron Yeah, i'm deabing on a VTC as unclear until we know.

David Coffron

It lets you get out of a dangerous area without having to drag someone with you (who'll be unconscious for a few hours), or waste resources on healing that person

illustro

2:40 PM

@DavidCoffron yes, a "bring back to life after 3 failed saves" is strong, but only if it's a multiple use effect, otherwise you are just replicating revivify

John Clifford

OP probably does need to clarify, but I would say they almost certainly don't intend for the effect to involve the PC continuing to roll death saves since that would essentially just make it "the next time you're reduced to 0 hit points you get 4 death saves instead of 3" rather than saving you from death.

illustro

(or healing word...)

NautArch

@JohnClifford it's either 1 HP or stable at 0.

but of course, a particularly intelligent/mean NPC could still kick them while they're down.

John Clifford

Agreed.

NautArch

But that's also why I don't think this is a big deal and up to the DM/Table. DMs pull punches all the time (or at least, I do.)

John Clifford

2:45 PM

I absolutely do. I don't think my players actually realise just how easy I go on them when they're in trouble.

Our next session is going to start with them up against 6 Vampire Spawn. That should be interesting.

illustro

As a DM I pull punches up to (and including) level 4, once characters get above that level the kids gloves are off (as they will be, generally, fighting more intelligent and battle hardened foes) and the dice rolls land as they may

NautArch

I make suboptimal attacks all the time once things start to not look good. But even then, sometimes bad decisions by players end up causing death. I used one in my 2nd session to create a plot hook by putting themin debt to someone who resurrected the PC.

JohnP

@illustro Does that include a 2nd level character that firmly whacks a gas spore because they are convinced it is an illusion? :p

NautArch

@JohnP Ha! Used them and players kept killing them when others were in range of it's death burst. Teamwork is kind of a problem with my group still.

illustro

@JohnP If a character does stupid things...I can't help them...but with a level 2 character I might have them make a wisdom check before completing their swing, coupled with an attack roll to see if they hit it (to give them a chance)

John Clifford

2:51 PM

Our cleric got one-shot by a bandit and the others were in bad shape so I had Strahd rescue the party because he's still curious to see what they're about and doesn't want them dead yet (though they didn't know this at the time because he was disguised as Ireena)

illustro

I had a character almost die on me the other week because they thought they could stop a rolling sphere trap by putting an immovable rod between them and the sphere

it did not end well...

NautArch

@illustro How big was the sphere? But that seems like a good idea.

John Clifford

If I ever run Tomb of Horrors my group is completely screwed.

JohnP

@illustro My DM gave me a strong hint of "Uh...are you really sure you want to whack it? I mean seriously, yer just gonna walk up and swing?"

Me: Yes. It's an illusion from mega high level screw with the PC's NPC we are chasing.

DM: ooookayy....

illustro

@NautArch 7ft diameter sphere of granite. Using an online calculator we worked out that it would weigh 34,000 lbs

(which does sort of justify the 10d10 damage in the DMG!)

JohnP

2:54 PM

Final outcome: I struck it, made my save for 1/2 damage, DM rolled all 1's on the damage and I made my fort save.

John Clifford

Oh, if anyone remembers my question about portals to Sigil, I figured it out: the druid's gate key doesn't transport you to Sigil, it just gives you innate knowledge of when and where the next portal to Sigil on your plane will be opened. It happens to be in several hundred years (so the Druid won't be able to rely on it) but Strahd doesn't care when it is because he never plans on dying, so it still makes sense as an object he would want.

illustro

@JohnP If the player ignores all the warnings...or objects to my attempts to save em...then they are just looking for an opportunity for me to take away their character sheet

JohnP

That was the weirdest campaign, almost every single off the wall idea I came up with actually worked.

NautArch

@illustro Yeah, I'd say either letting them straight up realize the Rod won't stop that or offering a roll is reasonable.

illustro

and hand them a blank one for their next character

JohnP

2:56 PM

@illustro Heh, after the third session of weird stuff that worked, my dm refused to call my character anything but "macguyver"

MikeQ

It's important to differentiate between "character is being stupid" and "player is misinformed". If you're not sure, ask the player.

David Coffron

@NautArch What kind of roll would that be? Arcana to know the capacity of the rod (unless it was identifyed earlier)? Straight intelligence to gauge the weight of the boulder?

illustro

@DavidCoffron Wisdom to judge how good of an idea they have...

NautArch

@DavidCoffron Could be several options for that. Both of those sound reasonable. But I'd assume once identified, characters know the limits of a magic item. The harder bit is in gauging the weight. I'd probably do an INT check, and given it's size set a pretty low DC.

illustro

It depends on the character specifics really

and their expertise

NautArch

3:01 PM

^ that too. Give them a reasonable option they'd likely succeed at.

But hilarity ensues when they don't.

Rocks roll, everyone dies.

illustro

@Behacad discussion we had about the "avoid death item" started about an hour ago

JohnP was the first to bring up the lack thereof of items in the game as is

David Coffron

@illustro Wisdom (Animal Handling) to understand the rock!

At least my Earth Genasi insists that all rocks are sapient

John Clifford

It could be Korg.

Did you check whether it had pamphlets?

illustro

@DavidCoffron I suppose the rock could be a sleeping earth elemental baby

(or an earth elemental egg)

David Coffron

3:17 PM

@illustro Or a dormant Galeb Duhr

illustro

@DavidCoffron Wisdom (Survival)...to understand your chances of surviving a close encounter with a rock

true!

John Clifford

I'm still holding out hope for Korg.

illustro

@JohnClifford It's certainly possible...If I had to stat out Korg, I'd make him a very intelligent Earth Elemental tbh

JohnP

3:52 PM

@illustro If I was making an embodiment of Korg I would think a bard would be more appropriate

:p

Although thinking about statting it makes me want to dig out my old Champions rulebooks.

kviiri

4:13 PM

Afternoon

JohnP

@KorvinStarmast - Given the age and the timeline, Liara had to either be wife/sister/cousin. But that's just a guess. It would have been helpful if Perkins had said how she was related in that tweet....

Huh. Someone created a 3d printer plan for Liara.

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