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9:00 PM
@goodguy5 Not really necessary. Creatures raised by Raise Dead, Resurrection, etc. get a -4 penalty to all rolls that decreases by 1 each long rest.
> The target takes a −4 penalty to all attack rolls, saving throws, and ability checks. Every time the target finishes a long rest, the penalty is reduced by 1 until it disappears.
@goodguy5 So if they have 5 levels of Exhaustion, and can get rid of 2 per rest, they'd still be suffering rez sickness after they get rid of Exhaustion anyways.
 
@BESW I do not know of any.
 
I assume the basic rules will be updated soon
Crawford said they would
 
I'm not sure I understand what point you're making.

Yea. they already get -4 to everything. Why also take on exhaustion penalties?
 
@V2Blast oh good.
 
@Delioth Well, I left out the very next sentence, which provides examples.
> If you are a ranger 4/wizard 3, for example, you know three 1st-level ranger spells based on your levels in the ranger class.
 
9:02 PM
@Delioth That interpretation doesn't cause a sensible result. A 19 Cleric/1 Druid would be able to prepare the full 20th level number of prepared spells for both Cleric and Druid- a one level dip for double the number of prepared spells and full access to both spell lists.
 
and besides the fact that the Berserker is the only one who will likely be able to accumulate those many exhaustion levels.
 
oh, btw, it looks like Martial Adept did change between the last errata and now but they didn't mark it as such
http://media.wizards.com/2017/dnd/downloads/PH-Errata.pdf
http://media.wizards.com/2018/dnd/downloads/PH-Errata.pdf
old errata:
"Martial Adept (p. 168). The superiority die is added to any others you have, no matter when you gain them."
new:
"Martial Adept (p. 168). The first sentence of the second benefit has been changed to “You gain one superiority die, which is a d6 (this die is added to any superiority dice you have from another source).”"
 
@goodguy5 My point is that a character with Rez sickness is probably going to be avoiding combat anyways.
 
@Xirema Right, so why double-penalize them?
 
@goodguy5 I mean, the narrative answer is that a character that dies of exhaustion pushed their body way beyond the point of viability, in a manner that exceeds how a character usually dies in combat. So it stands to reason that they'd be that much more crippled upon a successful revival.
 
9:07 PM
But Raise Dead also repairs minor damage and removes disease.

It can destroy germs, but not lactic acid?
 
@goodguy5 \shrug
 
If you raise dead a 6-exhaustion level person, then their speed is zero and you have to carry them wherever you go.

The next day, they can at least move, but they're at half HP.

It's not until day five that they can move at full speed, after the -4 goes away (as in, the same time)
 
Greater restoration costs 100g and removes only 1 level of exhaustion as a 5th level spell. It was probably weird for it to be cheaper at 3+ exhaustion to get murdered and revivified, if the assumption was that all exhaustion was gone when you came back.
 
@CTWind well, 500gp and have a -4 to everything, but yea
Specifically Raise Dead, not revivify
 
I don't think the phrasing is specifically referring to raise dead in the errata. It's not referencing the spell directly by name.
 
9:11 PM
ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
interesting
Seeing as how "Raise Dead" is a spell name, that's how I read it, lol
Your point is actually more weird.

You can just kill and revivify someone to remove one level of exhaustion for only 300gp
"just kill and revivify"
it's all weird.
I've never been a fan of the game's exhaustion system anyway
 
> Patient: "Doctor, I feel exhausted all the time. Can you help me?"
> Necromancer, M.D.: [cracks knuckles]
 
I mean, I feel like that's harder to justify with it costing 200g more and all your current HP. The only benefit over greater restoration is it costing a level 3 slot instead of level 5.
 
yea, which you have more of, in a pinch.
 
Ugh. Co-worker posted on FB saying she wants to get her son into D&D, how should she start.
I was tagged in by another co-worker.
Came to find that people are urging her to buy PHB and DMG in order to "be ready" for her first game for a 10 year-old.
Fighting the urge to scream....
 
don't fight it. just scream
 
9:20 PM
@nitsua60 Step 1: Not D&D. It's not worth it, I don't think
 
I mean, if SHE's into D&D, then it's worth
but I agree. There are better systems, especially with witch to train children. (pun intended)
 
Or at least an OGL version, to avoid needing to pay to start
 
black bear and brown bear went from +3 and +5 to hit, respectively, to +4 and +6 (presumably to make the calculations more logical; they have +2 and +4 Str respectively, and presumably a +2 proficiency bonus)
 
it's weird to me for a parent to not have the hobby and want their kid to get into it.
My parental unit did not approve of D&D
 
Pathfinder with just the core book isn't terrible, and the math therein should be fine for a 10-year-old to grasp (Pathfinder with all the associated rulebooks probably becomes too much, but just CRB should be fine)
 
9:22 PM
I'd much rather choose 5e phb (or that goofy starter kit) over pathfinder for a 10-yearold
 
Grappling is probably too much, but Grappling in Pathfinder is too much for anyone without a flowchart
@goodguy5 Pathfinder CRB is actually pretty simple, compared to the "full game" => remember, no Archetypes in CRB
 
Still a lot of math and a lot of subsystems. Feat chains, build considerations, polymorph, typed bonuses, combat maneuvers, etc...
 
And Archetypes and interactions thereupon are one of the big complexities in Pathfinder (also, Alternate Racial Traits, and Traits)
 
You don't have to tell me, I have about $300 in Pathfinder books. (hrm.... maybe $500)
 
I mean, "compared to the full game" is kinda like saying rocket science is simple compared to relativistic particle physics.
 
9:24 PM
^
 
It's true, but it's only a relative distinction.
 
Mind, I agree it still might not be the best; but I do think Pathfinder CRB is tractable for a 10-year-old
 
Pathfinder CRB is complicated enough for most adult newcomers.
The new player experience generally means being confused and having the veteran players telling you what to do.
 
A lot depends on the whys of getting the kid into gaming.
 
I mean. yea. but I honestly also feel that a 10-yearold could follow new Traveller. I still think there are better things
 
9:26 PM
If you're trying to gamify their math skills, that's one thing. If you're looking for a structured activity to develop interpersonal skills, that's totally different.
 
Hrm... I wonder if FAE would be good
 
riding horse and warhorse got to-hit fixed as well. riding horse went from +2 to +5, warhorse went from +5 to +6 (same calculation, Str mod + 2 (proficiency bonus, presumably))
 
@goodguy5 I'd always start a new person to TTRPG's with Fate (or variations thereupon)
Since it lets the crunch get out of the way, so that they can fall in love with Roleplaying
 
I've yet to actually play a game of Fate* that I enjoyed and didn't feel like we could have been playing another system
But I ALWAYS feel that it COULD have been immensely enjoyable, but that the GM was lacking in some capacity.
 
I'm generally hesitant to start new players with grind-heavy games such as PF or a strict-RAW game of D&D 5e
This somewhat sad thing happens where bright-eyed-bushy-tailed newbies approach the system with creative and fun ideas
And then the emphasis on optimal, cautious, analytical play gradually beats the spark out of them
 
9:30 PM
I'm pretty lenient in my 5e games.
"You want to use your two daggers like scissors to decapitate the goblin? Yea sure. give me an inspiration point and roll some dice."
"A flying elbow onto the giant toad from 10 feet up to make him forcibly puke out the halfling? I don't see why not."
"huh. That's a great point. Hard tac would probably work as a flaming arrow"
 
DMG errata and MM errata are up as well
 
Link plz
 
Thanks, boo
 
> [New] Scrolls (p. 139). In the second paragraph, “requires using an action” is now “requires the user.”
> [New] Spells (p. 141). In the second sentence, “lowest possible spell level” is now “lowest possible spell and caster level.”
> [New] Instrument of the Bards (p. 176). The final paragraph is replaced with the following: “You can play the instrument while casting a spell that causes any of its targets to be charmed on a failed saving throw, thereby imposing disadvantage on the save. This effect applies only if the spell has a somatic or a material
component.”
the paragraph previously said:
"When you use the instrument to cast a spell that causes targets to become charmed on a failed save, the targets have disadvantage on the saving throw. This effect applies whether you are using the instrument as the source of the spell or as a spellcasting focus."
 
9:45 PM
@V2Blast oh nice! I'm glad they fixed that!
 
yeah
 
cc @NautArch ^
 
I think fairly gamey DnD has its upsides as an introductory RPG --- namely, that even if one gets "stage fright" trying to role-play, you can fall back to just making the moves during your turn.
 
I've introduced a fair number of folx to RPGs in a wide variety of ways, and the only universal thing I've learned about what system to use is that it depends on the personality/goals of the person/group you're playing with, and on your own comfort with the system.
 
Rod of Lordly Might's button 1 also specifically states that you choose the type of sword it functions as (it wasn't stated before)
that's all the DMG changes
 
9:55 PM
@Delioth Yeah--when we're talking in person I'm going to try to sell her on "why don't we just have you and your son come over and we and my son and him can all play an RPG together?" And just start them on something smaller. (cc:@goodguy5)
I do think they want to get there--brand cache, the tie-in to Stranger Things, &c. And I get that. I don't even think it's a bad goal.
 
RPGs occupy a weird space, as a hobby.
I don't think anybody would say "I want to get my kid into video games, what game should he play?" or "I want to get my kid into watching TV, what show should he watch?"
 
Agreed. Plus, starting with a less crunchy TTRPG lets you teach the focus towards Role-playing (whereas starting with Pathfinder or even 5e, there's definitely some sense of roll-playing in there)
 
@Delioth My eventual fb post was "uh, don't buy anything until you already like it. I've got extra copies of things and already-printed copies of things and spare dice-sets. Let's play some, first."
@BESW o/
I've been struggling with that for a year or so.
 
@nitsua60 I think this is a fantastic response!
 
I want there to be a console in my house. I like kids playing video games together (in appropriate amounts).
But I haven't owned a console since they got all fancy and "16-bit"ified.... So I'm frozen out of the current market by overwhelmedness.
About every six months I say to gamer-friends: I want to get my kids into video games. Help me figure out what console and a handful of games to get.... And it never ends up anywhere solid.
 
9:58 PM
@nitsua60 The Switch is actually really good. Hell, it comes with 2 controllers for a bunch of things like Mario Cart and similar (Smash soon!)
 
Gotta run--night, all!
 
Switch + Mario Cart + Smash + I don't have a good co-op game for switch yet
Night!
*Smash doesn't come out for another few weeks
 
@Delioth Try Overcooked.
 
ttfn
 
@BESW That is a really interesting point that I had never considered.
I've heard it about comic books.
I wonder why that is?
 
10:05 PM
@Rubiksmoose People do it for reading regular books, too.
And yes, it's weird.
 
I think sometimes people want to get there kids into something they don't know that much about. I think that's usually a good thing
If you only pass on what you know, then your kid will only be as good as you, at best
 
I think a lot of it comes from failing to understand either/or (a) the vast scope of the hobby; (b) that it's not only okay but good to partake in that scope rather than focusing on just one tiny part of it.
 
For the MM: adult blue dracolich's stats were adjusted upwards (saves, to-hit bonuses, and Stealth bonus were increased by 1, Perception increased by 2 to +14 - presumably to indicate that its proficiency bonus should have been 1 higher)
 
user15026
@BESW I get the "I want to start reading romances, where do I start" a lot. Or "what do you think I'd like"....I barely know what I like in ways I can articulate :P
 
Yes, and I really appreciate your patience with me when I did exactly that!
 
user15026
10:09 PM
@BESW At least you let me ask a lot of follow up questions!
 
user15026
(Because yes if you ask me that I am going to ask you follow up questions. I have a list.)
 
I want to start answering on SE sites, where do I start?
 
user15026
Most of these I start with "well what do you like?"
 
And a more nuanced approach tends to be "what am I in the mood for?"
 
@Yuuki Make sure you take the tour and understand how the site works :)
(e.g. don't answer in comments, don't leave general comments as answers)
 
10:12 PM
Because our tastes and desires change depending on the kind of day we've had!
 
Besides that, uh, feel free to answer. People will correct you if you do something wrong. :)
back to the MM errata: black/brown bears were fixed there too (riding horse/warhorse were already fixed there)
 
user15026
@BESW I actually encountered this today - had a book I really want to read, started it last night, and came back to it today and was like "nooooope that is not the right book for today."
 
Can you VTC a facebook post
 
user15026
I wish.
 
Demiliches' number of hit dice was fixed (from 20d4 to 32d4) - they had an average HP listed of 80, which is obviously not the average of 20d4
 
10:20 PM
@Delioth @nitsua60
Not what I meant but find. Stupid mobile.
Lovers in a dangerous space time is phenomenal
 
they clarified a bit of lore about the gith
 
And I love my switch
 
"In the uprising against the illithids, Gith sought allies. Her adviser Vlaakith appealed to Tiamat, the goddess of evil dragonkind, and Gith ventured into the Nine Hells to meet with her. Only Tiamat now knows what passed between them, but Vlaakith returned to the Astral Plane with the Dragon Queen’s red dragon consort Ephelomon"
They changed "Gith returned" to "Vlaakith returned"
gray slaads got an extra +1 to Perception (went from +6 to +7)
Hook horrors got a huge boost in darkvision range. It used to say 10 ft., now it says 120 ft. Which makes a lot more sense for an Underdark creature.
Lich's "Disrupt Life" legendary action went from affecting "living" creatures to "non-undead" ones
PCs as Lycanthropes sidebar now clarifies that only non-lycanthropes need to make the save to avoid the curse :P
Priest NPC statblock got 5 feet extra speed, and Religion bonus went from +4 to +5 (presumably another issue where their "expertise" in the skill was shortchanged by 1)
Purple Worm's to-hit bonus went from +9 to +14. (Its Str mod is +9; I assume they'd forgotten to add the proficiency bonus.)
 
10:37 PM
@V2Blast So you can affect dead non-undead things?
... Constructs, I suppose?
 
yep, I guess so
Thri-kreen's bite can poison, but the timing of the repeated save to end it was previously unspecified beyond the target's turn; the errata clarifies that the repeated save happens at the end of the target's turns.
Revenant's Rejuvenation trait was clarified to only be able to animate another humanoid corpse (not other types)
 
@Yuuki Now it can target creatures who are not dead yet
 
werewolf's multiattack was changed too. It used to be:
> Multiattack (Humanoid or Hybrid Form Only). The werewolf makes two attacks: one with its bite and one with its claws or spear.
now it's:
> Multiattack. (Humanoid or Hybrid Form Only). The werewolf makes two attacks: two with its spear (humanoid form) or one with its bite and one with its claws (hybrid form).
which makes sense given those attacks' specific restrictions
I think that's all the major stuff
(and some minor stuff :P )
 
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