The Litter Box

TildalWave

00:00

cat and a dog here, not necessarily in that pecking order LOL ... run a shelter for small animals and had all kinds of other pets too ... not arachnophobic either

did ride on a donkey once...

user15026

As a kid I lived in a small country town, so all sorts of animals are familiar. :) But now I am in a small city apartment, so I just have the cat (I had frogs ,but they died, and so did my fish (they died from move-stress))

JohnB

aww

user15026

I haven't put anything new in the tank I have because I still feel bad about hte frogs and fish dying

Anonymous

00:38

iKlsR

01:18

This tag is bothering me..

introducing-pets

:D

JohnB

Yeah, there's gotta be a better word for that

hmmm

iKlsR

communication?

Brant

introductions?

iKlsR

could go for both with people and between animals..

JohnB

acclimation? acclimating?

iKlsR

01:21

I also created controlled-environment, saw people tagging specific places like personal ponds etc

@JohnB to meta?

JohnB

@iKlsR good idea

Baarn

@iKlsR I disagree that pond is a generic tag. It is crucial to distinguish questions about in- and outdoor habitats.

JohnB

there is only one way to settle this....your pets must fight to the death

Brant

pokemon

iKlsR

@Baarn Disputable, but I think something general for all the future specific environs might work rather than having pond, yard, perch, cage etc

@JohnB Bring it on.

JohnB

01:27

D:

Baarn

I don't think that it is helpful to group all those tags together in outdoor. I can imagine that some people want to look for (ie: fav the tag) questions specifically tagged with pond but don't care about creatures living in perches or cages.

TildalWave

natural-habitat and unnatural-habitat maybe?

or artificial... dunno, it's not my vocabulary day

Baarn

do we have to make it artificially complicated? who is going to search for that?

JohnB

I'm not on one side or another, but tag synonyms would resolve that

Baarn

Just that those things are not synonymous ;)

Only because things can be put in groups, it doesn't mean that they should be.

user15026

03:18

@iKlsR I loved the Oatmeal comment link on my question, it really made me laugh

iKlsR

@AshleyNunn haha, yeah, it's a good one. :)

user15026

@iKlsR Ah, so I am doomed, then. ;)

iKlsR

@AshleyNunn You were warned. ;)

user15026

Thank you for the warning :P

TildalWave

03:50

yey vox populi badge ... we should get 20 more votes when we get this badge too, it's not fair we're rewarded for voting and still remain vote capped :(

user15026

@TildalWave hahaha yeah, waiting for more votes can be annoying sometimes. I see why they do it, but sometimes I am like "but there is another good question or answer I want to reward"!

TildalWave

@AshleyNunn I just realized it's only 4 hours into new SE day... long time to wait for 40 more votes :(

I feel like I'm being .... conditioned! :D

one of Pavlov's dogs... :|

user15026

@TildalWave Yeah, I always forget that the SE day is UTC......

user15026

@TildalWave appropriate for a pets site I suppose ;)

TildalWave

hehe yes true

it's always the same tho with the first week of active betas ... never enough votes

user15026

04:00

@TildalWave Pretty much. I am like "but look we are being awesome must reward the awesome oh no out of votes how can this be"

TildalWave

that's why I thought we should get more votes with those two badges ... 30 votes and 40 votes in a day, whatever the other one is called ... they're a one off anyway

re chatroom name.... any ideas?

4

Q: What should our chat room name be?

Right now, our chat room's name is just Pets. I think we can do better than that, what sort of clever and appropriate name could we use instead?

user15026

I am not good at being clever :(

TildalWave

Zoolatry?

The Feral Tribune?

The Pecking Order?

Common Ancestry? LOL

...

Pet Shop Boys?

Pet Peeves

Tree of Life

The Kennel? :D

user15026

I like the Kennel!

user15026

its kinda funny

Mistu4u

04:21

Huh, finally pets started. Rejoice Yo mortals!

:-)

TildalWave

04:37

3

Mistu4u

@TildalWave No wonder, we knew we would be called someday :-)

Ankit Sharma

06:59

@TildalWave i am happy that finally we gathered

Tim Post

11:41

Woof.

Baarn

I wonder why the suffrage badge is called that way? I didn't suffer finding 30 things to vote on…

2

Tim Post

Back in the day, we had to walk 8 miles uphill in the snow to vote on a good post.

Baarn

The snow is gone and the hills are eroded. Climate change seems to have an effect on StackExchange, too.

Maybe it is called suffrage because you know that you only have 10 votes left…

Baarn

13:21

what a nice example question on the about page

Beofett

13:38

@Baarn Suffrage means the right to vote gained through the democratic process :)

Baarn

@Beofett this is why I love English as a second language. It makes much more fun that way :P

Beofett

@Baarn That particular word is one most people who speak English as a primary language are unfamiliar with :)

In fact, there was a bit on a TV show where some pranksters went out and asked people to sign a petition to end women's suffrage (women in the US have only been able to vote since 1920). They got a lot of people to sign before someone pointed out what the petition actually meant, and how offensive it was. It was in pretty bad taste, but its a good indication of how poorly the word is recognised.

Baarn

Right, I remember hearing about this prank, but completely forgot it. The "right to vote" is the most common expression today, I guess.

John Cavan

13:56

The word doesn't get a lot of use anymore, in many English speaking countries, because the right to vote is generally available to all citizens.

Tim Post

3

Q: Do my horses need to be shod?

We have two horses, a thoroughbred and Arab cross that have spent most of their time in paddocks being ridden occasionally into the local bush land. They are not shod and their hooves are filed periodically. However the children are riding them more frequently and onto the road to meet up with ...

horses

2

I read that as shot and now I have coffee mist on my monitor.

iKlsR

@TimPost XD

@TimPost I'm always drinking when I read stuff like this. :/

Tim Post

I try to only drink when I'm writing. Oh .. wait.

John Cavan

@TimPost - LOL, I can see that first glance read

Beofett

Whee! Mortarboard :)

John Cavan

14:10

Congrats. :)

Beofett

ty!

Mistu4u

@TimPost LOL..You forgot never drink coffee while infront of your laptop :P

Baarn

14:26

"Daily vote limit reached; vote again in 9 hours." … now I have to bookmark things that definitely deserve to be upvoted.

iKlsR

@Baarn Hit mine not too long ago too. Off to classes then.

Beofett

Vote limits and reputation caps... two of the most frustrating aspects of the first few days of private beta :)

Monica Cellio

@Beofett yeah. This is my first private beta, and I hadn't anticipated the effect of asking a bunch of questions early. In addition to vote caps (I haven't hit the rep cap yet), some unanswered questions have already been pushed off the main page. Whee! Tag search here I come. :-)

John Cavan

14:43

Yeah, I'm still answering anyways since it's about building some initial content.

Beofett

@JohnCavan same. Plus its fun :)

John Cavan

Yeah, a site like this makes an animal lover like me happy

Mistu4u

Honestly, I thought dogs are more in number than cats as pets. But it seems it isn't quite true.

Cats questions are also dominating the front page as well as dogs.

John Cavan

No, I think cats are a larger population. I love dogs, but cats are a kind of easier to keep and that tends to grow their population. Also, I think, cats have a more cross-gender appeal whereas dogs are typically more of a guy thing.

Mistu4u

@JohnCavan There are also dogs IMO who are like made for ladies. Dogs who have deep fur and are small in size.

Beofett

14:48

In my (anecdotal) experience, cat owners are more likely to own multiple pets than dog owners.

Mistu4u

@Beofett That's practical.

Baarn

Hmm, I don't think dogs are a guy thing… all the girls I know love our labs :)

John Cavan

Don't read too much into a "guy" thing, dogs are very generally popular amongst men and women, it's that I think the balance tends to the guy side more for dogs than for cats.

Cats also tend to be less work and you can leave them for a couple of days more readily. Except mine, needs medication on a daily basis.

Mistu4u

@JohnCavan What happened to her?

John Cavan

He has mega-colon so I need to treat him with lactulose to keep his stool soft enough for him to pass on his own. It's a fine balance though, too soft result in unpleasant messes to clean up.

Mistu4u

14:56

@JohnCavan I see.

John Cavan

Ah well, it's a pain, but less so for me than for him.

Baarn

Any suggestions for a put-to-sleep tag? euthanasia sounds a bit technical to me…

Mistu4u

@Baarn Well I never heard it before.

John Cavan

@Baarn - It's accurate though

Mistu4u

but the tag-wiki should help.

Baarn

15:01

wikipedia distinguishes between euthanasia and animal euthanasia, that's why I was wondering if it is appropriate to use it without "animal" on a site that is dedicated to pets.

John Cavan

Given the topic (and that keeping humans as pets is normally illegal in most countries), it's probably safe to assume the relationship. :D

Baarn

OK, I just introduced euthanasia. I think we can still change it to a more fluffy word if someone has a better idea :)

Tim Post

15:27

You want to euphemise all that euthanising ? :p

John Cavan

15:48

0

Q: How can I keep rats out of my chicken pen?

I've got 5 chickens who all live in a pen that is being attacked by rats! The rats keep burrowing under the walls of the pen and it would be impractical for me to brick it up. What's the best way to keep them out without harming the chickens?

chickens

Seems off topic

Beofett

@JohnCavan Agreed. Commented and VTC'd.

John Cavan

Me too, well voted anyways... I think livestock questions should be off topic, they're not really pet questions.

Baarn

it might be on topic on diy.SE

Beofett

@JohnCavan re: livestock... I see it as borderline. Some might be on topic.

John Cavan

I think if the purpose is food production it's probably left the realm of pet though.

Beofett

15:58

To repeat an argument I made in the proposal discussion: why is "how do I do x for my goat?" fundamentally different from "I love my goat, Mark, and he's a part of the family. Yet recently I have found that I need to do x for Mark... how should I do that?"

Baarn

Yeah that's my stance on that, too. As long as the animal is considered a pet in the sense of the question, the question can be on topic.

Beofett

I like Skippy's definition:
"I believe that any animal or group of animals that a human being has an interactive personal relationship with could be considered a pet."

3

John Cavan

"How to tell my cat he isn't an archaeologist?" - I really don't know how to answer this... you can't tell a cat anything, they do what they do.

Baarn

… what?

wait … is it intended that you can go beyond the vote limit, when voting on answers on your own question?

John Cavan

Your own questions are usually excluded from restrictions as far as I know.

Beofett

16:12

@JohnCavan Just tested this, and I could not upvote an answer to my question because of the daily limit.

John Cavan

Oh, well there you go... the other site I'm very active on I'm a moderator and we're not that super busy like this is right now.

Baarn

True, I wasn't able to upvote an answer on another question I posted …

John Cavan

Doh, after all this time, I just figured out how the rep score gets listed on the user board... All time is your overall score, anything else is your score less the starting 101 that gets you past the limits.

Mistu4u

16:54

@JohnCavan, No personal feelings.

But the question really was opinion based.

John Cavan

@Mistu4u - I deleted the question, but I think that definition fits almost every question asked so far...

Mistu4u

@JohnCavan Which definition?

Opinion based?

John Cavan

Opinion, yes, a lot of behavior questions are opinion. Even the one you asked is opinion oriented. What all of us are trying to do is crowd source the ideas because it's not like the animals can speak up.

Mistu4u

I guess you can get some objective answers there having some common points. Well, you can undelete the question again flagging for the mod's attention.

John Cavan

No, it's okay, I'll leave it. It may be better to do it by animal anyways. I just wanted to point out that opinion questions aren't always a problem and there is going to be a lot with site.

Beofett

16:59

I was actually leaning towards "too broad", but agreed that it was primarily opinion based to the point where it was a better closure reason.

Ankit Sharma

Didn't know that unicorns are allowed as pet O-o
Now i can ask question on my pet dragon too ;)

Beofett

Its unavoidable to get some amount of opinion in answers, and there's really nothing wrong with it.

But the best answers will have some basis in fact or logic, and then possibly expand upon that using opinion.

John Cavan

@Beofett - I ultimately deleted it because I leaned towards too broad as well.

Mistu4u

@Beofett I agree. But that particular question was kind of "buying" suggestion.

@AnkitSharma Where? O_o then I am gonna ask about 2headed cobra I pet in my house :-D

Beofett

@Mistu4u I don't necessarily have an issue with buying suggestions (although I would be very careful about how any we might allow would be phrased), so long as they provide sufficient details to work with.

Ankit Sharma

17:02

@Mistu4u have you noticed about page with unicorn question?

Beofett

The "what kind of dogs are best for children" question is a good example... I'm still torn on whether I think its a good fit, but the answers seemed adequate

Mistu4u

@Beofett Actually "buying" in turn produces opinions.

Beofett

@Mistu4u generally, yes, but as I said... opinions are necessarily bad, particularly if backed by fact.

Mistu4u

@Beofett And in some SE sites "shopping recommendation" questions are OT.

John Cavan

Product buying advice needs to be managed carefully, we get a ton of that on the photography site, but unlike camera gear, stuff for pets tends to stick around longer so not as likely to become dated advice quickly.

Beofett

17:04

E.g. if someone were to answer 'what breed dog should I buy for my kid' with reputable studies on dog bite frequencies against children, by breed, or an analysis of innate behavior tendencies by breed, and how that might correlate into positive or negative experiences for the kids, I would probably consider that a good answer

(of course, there are no reputable studies on dog attack frequencies by breed that I've ever been able to find)

Mistu4u

@AnkitSharma Just saw now!

Beofett

@Mistu4u the majority consider them off-topic, but I believe some allow them. Or perhaps some did allow them, and then decided to change the rules to ban them.

I haven't kept up with any of the sites I recall allowing shopping questions.

We've certainly discussed it at parenting.se many times, and never have quite come to a consensus that they should be allowed, even under heavy regulation.

Mistu4u

@Beofett @JohnCavan, that's why I told to undelete the question and then raise a meta to see what the community thinks about it. As the site is now currently taking shape.

If it's decided not to be OT, fine, I will definitely +vote it.

Baarn

I always prefer "what should I look for in $product" questions instead of "which is the best $brand"

John Cavan

Well, shopping-like questions such as "Are there products to help with situation X..." are probably good. Shopping-like questions like "I was thinking of buying X or Y, what would you pick" are bad. Shelf life of the question and answer is relevant.

Beofett

17:09

@Baarn That's what we try to steer people to in parenting.se. IMO, its about the only type of shopping question that really fits the platform.

Baarn

especially because shopping questions are prone to carry a heavy subjective load, eg "what is the best $stuff" without describing what the OP considers to be best.

John Cavan

@Mistu4u - No, I'm pretty sold on the question being too broad at this point. Less about opinion oriented really, it wasn't intended as a "shopping" question.

Mistu4u

Anyway, you guys discuss about what should be done. I am gonna attend my dinner :-) Bye

Baarn

I agree we should discuss this on meta. Sooner or later it will come up anyway

Beofett

@Baarn not to mention what's "best" now can quickly become out of date.

@Baarn agreed. Anyone volunteering, or shall I write up the question?

John Cavan

17:17

@Beofett - Go for it. :)

Monica Cellio

17:45

@JohnCavan yeah, I'm looking for questions to answer, but holding off on adding new questions for just a bit.

John Cavan

@MonicaCellio - I tend to answer far more than I ever ask on these sites anyways... I usually find the answers to any questions I might already have on the site before I needed it. :)

Monica Cellio

@JohnCavan I saw a news report not long ago that said that in the US more households have dogs than have cats, but there are more cats/household than dogs/household.

John Cavan

Hmm... I suspect location matters. I wouldn't be surprised that cats are more common in large cities, dogs in less densely populated regions.

Monica Cellio

@JohnCavan that's generally true for me too. I haven't been part of a private beta before, and the initial ramp-up is different. Usually I see questions come by and answer the ones I can, and ask less often (except for one site where I ask and answer a lot). But here I'm actively hunting for things to answer now.

@JohnCavan that makes sense. There were also regional differences reported, but I don't recall the details other than that Texas pegged the scale on dogs.

John Cavan

Not surprised about Texas...

Baarn

17:52

private beta is strange … I can access the close vote review queue without gaining the privilege…

Monica Cellio

I did not know you could earn Mortarboard on meta.

John Cavan

Yeah, it'll probably tighten up when it goes public beta.

Monica Cellio

@Baarn ooh, thanks for the tip!

Baarn

I have no idea what the restriction was… earlier today I wasn't able to use it :)

John Cavan

18:40

Hmm... You know, I don't think it really crossed my mind. I think I just assumed it was there because I'm so used to seeing it on Photo.SE.

Baarn

22:06

Now I have to bookmark meta discussions, as I just ran out of votes there, too…

John Cavan

LOL, you don't take this suffrage thing lightly!

Baarn

I wasn't really focused on getting that badge. I simply voted on stuff I liked (or disliked in one or two cases)

We already have over 100 questions on the main site. A lot of them are good and deserve the upvotes. On meta it is more about expressing consent, but as meta is the main place to form the site I think participation in the early stage is crucial.

And as I can't express some thoughts on meta due to being non-native I prefer using votes and comments.

John Cavan

I agree, the first week of meta is going to decide a lot.

I wouldn't worry about your English, seems plenty fine to me.

I almost regret that I'll be going on vacation as of Saturday and may be cut off a bit.

Baarn

Thanks, I know it is readable, but some things on meta are just too hard for me to express correctly (even in German I would probably spend an endless amount of time writing and deleting stuff)

John Cavan

I've been to Germany, I suspect that's more a function of the length of your words... :D

Baarn

22:22

Our chained nouns are highly practical! I never get why there are certain words in English that are written as one and others are separated.

John Cavan

That's because we're crazy...

Actually, English is a language that kind of came together from all sorts of sounds. It's been described as the language of Poets because it's almost built to make rhyme easy at the expense of other facilities.

Baarn

considering how many other European languages got mixed into English… I wonder how much of the original language is left

Why do we even need Esperanto as an artificial language that combines them all if English already does that job? ;)

John Cavan

I don't think there really was an original English, it basically formed. Consider that the English nobility spoke French until more modern times.

English is supposedly the hardest language to learn as a second language. Mostly, I think, because of things like "to" "two" and "too" amongst many others. Then there's the noun, slang, and other assorted crazy usage patterns.

Baarn

I found it to be quite easy to learn. There are some irregularities, of course, but I guess every language has its complicated areas.

John Cavan

22:39

I think German is a lot closer to English than many people realize. I found it remarkably easy to figure out what words meant when I was wandering about Lahr years ago. I do okay with French/Italian too, but that's mostly a result of taking French lessons in school.

Baarn

The biggest thing people complain about when learning German are the articles. I can't understand why that should be so hard, to me it sounds logical to simply learn each noun as a unit that always comes with that article.

I can't speak french, but I can pronounce it a lot better than most (german) people who actually speak it. When it comes to Italian… well, I wont starve to death

I had Latin lessons in school. I never really managed to learn anything about that language, but I learned a lot about the theory behind other languages.

JohnB

we've had as many questions in 1 day as Tor had in 2 weeks o_o

John Cavan

Tor?

JohnB

Baarn

\o/

JohnB

22:49

Good sign, gotta keep the momentum going though!

Baarn

tor was the most recent proposal that made it to beta. It went through proposal and commitment phase in only two months or so…

far too quick I think.

John Cavan

Ah... I was wondering. Hmm... Interesting idea.

JohnB

Astronomy came right after it actually

Baarn

Oh right, forgot astronomy.

Not sure about pets, but I think it had an earlier proposal that was closed in commitment phase before beta?

JohnB

not that I'm aware of, but they sometimes delete any trace those :\ so it might not exist anymore

John Cavan

22:54

I expect the Pets site is going to get a lot of activity in the coming months

JohnB

er, do you mean Astronomy?

Astronomy had a previous incarnation that I know of

Baarn

Nah, I meant pets

JohnB

ah. Dunno!

Baarn

Me neither… just wondered that no one came up earlier with such an obvious proposal

John Cavan

Good question... I wonder why about that too. I committed to it the moment I spotted it on Area 51.

Baarn

22:59

What I like is that pets.SE really has the potential to attract more users without an IT background to the SE network.

That might have a positive effects on other sites of the network, too.

JohnB

For sure, it's very hard to launch a non-IT site

John Cavan

That would be nice. Photo.SE is loaded with IT people (self included), but I'd like to see more pure art types on it.

Apparently I'm 58 minutes from being able to vote again...

Baarn

I am an IT guy, too. But sometimes the stereotypical pedantry can be a bit annoying (contrary, that's what I like most about the network, too)

Oh well, I think I wont wait until I can vote again. I can clean all those bookmarks tomorrow, too.

John Cavan

Have a good night, it's pretty late in your neck of the woods.

Baarn

Good night guys!

Oh and: Vote me for more dog gifs!

iKlsR

23:17

@JohnB I guess The Kennel is a go.

10

Q: What should our chat room name be?

Right now, our chat room's name is just Pets. I think we can do better than that, what sort of clever and appropriate name could we use instead?

discussion chat

JohnB

Sounds good! Would you do the honors?

John Cavan

I don't know, I'm really leaning to The Litter Box myself...

iKlsR

@JohnCavan The Litter Box sounds a bit nicer to me too. Kennel is so localized.

John Cavan

Menagerie got posted, which I kind of like as being more generally inclusive of all types of pets. I voted for that one.

iKlsR

Litter Box is more general.

@JohnCavan I say propose it.

Kennel sounds good for now, has the majority of votes.

John Cavan

23:23

Done, I proposed it.

Wow, today has been a busy day on the site...

James Jenkins

23:43

@JohnCavan do you have cats and bunnies?

John Cavan

I had bunnies, they passed away of old age a few years ago. Great companions.

I have 2 cats right now (we had one pass away a year ago at 21).

James Jenkins

Sorry for your loss, they are great pets.

John Cavan

At one point I had 3 cats, 2 rabbits, 7 guinea pigs, 1 hamster, 3 goldfish, 2 turtles but no partridge in a pear tree. :)

3

Thanks!

James Jenkins

:)

John Cavan

I love animals, it's heartbreaking when they pass, but having them in my life is worth it.

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