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6:00 PM
hey mith
 
yawn I'm procrastinating.
 
If we have a question which is distinctly about a particular character, a character tag seems appropriate
e.g. is both a character and a series/franchise/media tag
 
@DForck42 you are not active on SFF are you? :P
 
@doppelgreener <shrug> I'll just wait for the meta discussion, I'm too lazy to start it
 
@Skooba no
 
6:04 PM
@Riker wasn't there one already?
 
just never gelled with that site
 
@DForck42 We get into polite discussion about character tag and author tags quite a bit
 
@Gallifreyan no clue
@Mithrandir and not doing what?
 
Writing a speech.
 
@Skooba ahh. ok m&tv we don't include directors, actors, or producers unless we're asking about them specifically
 
6:05 PM
10
Q: When should I use an author tag?

fi12If I my question is about a certain book by an author, should I use the tag for both the book and the author? Or just the book? What's the purpose of these author tags in the first place and when can I use them?

 
@Mithrandir oooh, what kind of speech?
 
Secret.
 
@Gallifreyan no character tags
not author
@Mithrandir for debate class or something else?
 
I'm homeschooled, so... no.
 
you can do debate and be homeschooled
I have done it
turned out I hated debate but the point still stands
 
6:07 PM
you can debate with atree
or a chair
 
waves hand I can't debate in my second language.
I just don't feel like saying :P
 
@DForck42 character tags were always the bigger issue. Some user do not agree with existence of character tags to begin with.
 
some users don't agree with author tags to begin with either
 
@Skooba I went ahead and vtc'd that question, cause reasons
 
@Skooba torch the character tags!
 
6:08 PM
Author tags we just to write a proper tag-wiki to point users in the right direction
 
@Riker mostly i just don't see tagging as a thing that needs to be cleared with meta before it's used; on rpg.se we treat it as an emergent folksonomy: if you think a tag is necessary, add it and use it; if you don't, don't add it or use it; the shape of tagging evolves from how people are using it, and issues are discussed when they are worth discussing.
 
And I edited like every single character tag to say Use this tag for questions about this character, not those that merely mention him/her.
 
@doppelgreener I guess that's how SFF got tags like and
 
@Riker see I don't agree with that because you can ask a question about an author independent of the works they have produced, whereas a character is already contained in a work
 
yeah just pointing it out
 
6:10 PM
@Mithrandir hopefully we'll do things that way; tags are after all for what a question is fundamentally about rather than what it might be loosely connnected to. though if i remember correctly (new?) users might sometimes see a tag suggestion mechanism which would encourage them to pick tags they might not otherwise.
@Gallifreyan quite possibly. it's how rpg.se wound up with a lot of pretty decent tags and a lot of weird tags we revisited and removed/renamed/synonymised.
 
@doppelgreener Which is exactly what leads to an utter mess.
(Or what Gallifreyan said.)
 
@NapoleonWilson well, the meta discussion afterwards is important.
i'll point out that on RPG.SE we use emergent folksonomy and meta disscussion. we do meta discussion when it's worth talking about curating our tags. we have agreed-upon tag practices which emerged as we created and discussed things.
we have a pretty good tagging system too i think.
there are definitely times discussion in advance is appropriate. there are also times we've done tagging system overhauls: a particular very large system of games (World of Darkness) got a big tagging overhaul when a particular edition was announced, because our old tagging system for it was evidently facing a bit of a breaking point. we worked it out together and the community went retagging questions dilligently.
other things we standardised effectively along the way, like our tagging scheme for D&D questions, which is healthy and what we're doing here.
just, what i mean is, it isn't always necessary to clear a particular kind of tag usage on meta first. judgement calls can be made there.
 
6:30 PM
Anyone want to suggest 10 tag wiki edits?
@Benjamin ^
 
@Mithrandir sorry about that, didn't mean to
 
...Also, I don't really even want to have a generic character tag, so... :P
 
lol
 
6:46 PM
It seems like a meta-tag to me. Burn it!
@Riker Go here...
And here...
And here...
And here...
:P
 
lol
go go robert ranger
1
A: I typoed a tag, didn't notice, and I can't fix the tag

Robert CartainoDone. For a super straightforward correction like this (requiring no discussion), you can also flag the question for moderator attention.

 
Heh. That's the first time I've seen an employee delete their answer.
 
well f***
that tag? it was originally right
I screwed up
imma just ignore that >_>
 
*facepalm*
 
@Mithrandir we do on m&tv, but it's kinda meh
@Riker HAH! omg
 
6:58 PM
oh god @steelersquirrel are you infecting him
needs more exclamation points if you are
and more caps
 
So on A51 we had 7 self-declared Experts, only 2 of which had any experience on SEbefore
 
@Riker nah
I just found it hilarious
 
lol thanks
>_>
I did a big stupid methinks
@Mithrandir robert fixed it
and nuked my meta Q also
 
heh.
 
7:04 PM
looks like he just nuked the rev history also
@Mithrandir go review suggested edits
ninja'ed
 
I did
I need 3 more
 
for? oh 100
well I'm working on into-my-own rn
 
is that the movie or the collection of asimov
 
7:07 PM
and ooooooh asimov is on-topic? epic
 
Collection.
 
I love his stories
 
See what site you're on?
:P
 
I made it a point to collect every single one he wrote
 
Cool.
 
7:08 PM
eugh metatag nope nope nope
 
Which?
 
unreliable narrator
 
That's a story, I thought?
 
no
metatag
> Did he actually make this statement, or is it an example of an "unreliable narrator"?
 
Ah.
 
7:10 PM
it fits the applied Q but still blergh
 
I'll do a tag wiki for it though
@Mithrandir lol
 
Quick! 2 more!
 
lol
done
 
yay
Now I can be the first with the Proofreader badge :D
 
7:12 PM
lol nice
I was sorta going for it but I've been busy with IRL things and haven't had to much time for lit stuff
 
Why do I get +2 for accepting an answer? I don't recall that happening before...
 
Always.
I had to beat Rand :P He was at 98, and I was at 91.
 
yep
@Mithrandir a bunch more
 
I'm gonna run out :P
 
you still have 10
iirc I've only done like 8 more so you'll be okay
 
7:15 PM
I only saw 2/
HDE's on the reviewing I think now
 
and cheese
they took the rest
 
Nope, that was CHEESE
 
both did
 
HDE did 1
 
you have a hebrew keyboard layout?
 
7:16 PM
@Mithrandir So am I :-D
 
@Riker yep
 
you've only used 12 of your reviews btw, you'll be ok
 
@kristan Good for you!
:P
Wow, that got a lot of votes...
12
A: How do I help with this site?

MithrandirI'm writing this in an FAQ-style answer, addressed to everybody, not just you. There are lots of ways to help! You can help in lots of different ways! Ask questions. We always need more questions - it's very hard to answer questions if there aren't any! We'd like good, interesting, on-topi...

 
@kristan :D 3 of us
 
@Riker :-D
Why is there a starred message that says "No."?
 
7:20 PM
why not
 
Napoleon didn't want to suggest edits
 
because napoleon is a grump cc @steelersquirrel
 
You'll have to cut out that kind of talk if you're a mod ;)
 
Oh, of course. That explains everything.
 
hey @SQB
 
7:23 PM
@Mithrandir nah I'm pretty sure rand's said that before
but yeah ok
in Mos Eisley, Sep 16 '16 at 18:05, by Rand al'Thor
@NapoleonWilson Methinks Napoleon is grumpy today ...
 
mhm
 
SQB
@Mithrandir hey hey.
 
"is grumpy" and "is a grump" aren't quite the same ;-)
 
almost tho
 
Wait, who voted to undelete this?
 
7:27 PM
not me
@Mithrandir you didn't finish the reviews apparently
there are 4 according to the little top bar thing
 
not me
 
yesterday, by Catija
Welcome to the wonderful world of the reviews bar. It's usually wrong.
 
ah ok
 
gone now
 
cool
 
7:41 PM
Another 4 flags till I hit 1k helpful network-wide...
 
@kristan You always get that. Considering that you'd only ever accepted one answer before the two you accepted on Lit, I can understand how you'd forget, though. See your activity from September 19th here: esperanto.stackexchange.com/users/60/…
 
@Catija Ah, I guess I didn't notice the rep change at that time. And yeah, I didn't ask very many questions, and wasn't all that impressed with the answers I got for most of them, so... :-P
 
@kristan Most of the questions I ask are on Metas, so I'm in the same boat... you don't get rep changes when you accept answers on Meta sites unless it's MSE. :)
 
@Catija Yeah, I've noticed that you don't get rep changes for anything on meta, only badges.
But on Literature I've generally found the answers I've gotten to be pretty satisfactory; answering a lot of my long-standing nagging questions :-)
 
8:00 PM
Lit is a lot different from SFF methinks
lot less focus on canon
there was bit at the very beginning where people were like "QUOTE FROM TEH AUTHOR? NO? BAD ANSWER" but it settled down
 
lol
(got three questions now; might be able to fulfill my commitment after all :-P)
I'ma go dig up some grub, see ya!
 
see ya
 
o/
 
?
 
8:30 PM
@Mithrandir Sure.
 
already done
don't worry about it
@Benjamin
 
Well, if you need more I am here.
Is it a minor edit to distinguish the author from the speaker?
 
0
Q: Are book identifications on topic?

Thomas MyronSay you read a book when you were ten and really loved it. Now you're thirty and want to read the book again, but you can't remember what it was called. Could someone in this situation give details about the book (plot, characters, etc.) and ask if others know the book they are speaking of? Thi...

 
@Benjamin where?
@Benjamin you don't really need to comment with "This is a duplicate" when mith has already linked it
 
@Riker When i posted that, I hadn't seen it yet.
@Riker Just in general, I think the distinction between the speaker and the author is important and I was wondering whether that would be classified as a minor edit.
@Hamlet I have never really liked video games and movies, but those videos made it more interesting. Thanks for sharing them!
 
user61230
8:37 PM
@Benjamin Changing from speaker to author is a pretty significant change to meaning
 
@Emrakul I mean in cases where it is clear that it is discussing the speaker, but mentions them as the author or with an ambiguous pronoun.
 
what little thing are we nit picking now? ;-)
 
@Benjamin ah ok
@Benjamin link to q?
or answer
 
user61230
gooootcha, yeah, I mean. If the OP just used the wrong one by accident, sure
 
user61230
"Little" one word changes can seriously change a post's meaning, so if you know what someone meant, sure
 
8:41 PM
@Riker Nothing in particular.
 
ah ok
 
Confusing the author with the narrator is a common and very significant fallacy.
2
 
9:00 PM
What tag should be used for questions about symbolism as a movement?
 
9:10 PM
I asked a question that requires further tagging.
 
@Benjamin I'll add more links (to things written by academics) on Friday.
 
@Benjamin symbolism as a movement?
 
user61230
@DForck42 To boil a broad idea down into a sentence, symbolists wrote poems that were intentionally laced with academic/intellectual substance.
 
@Emrakul ahh
 
user61230
Here's a good link about symbolists, imagists, and modernists in Western & European poetry.
 
user61230
9:18 PM
I'd suggest it with the caveat that the entire way of thinking about the three categories is... very limiting in its generalization.
 
user61230
@BESW If you ever choose to come back to the book, I found out an interesting tidbit that gives House of Leaves a lot more clarity. It was originally published online (even the first print edition is the "second edition") over time as a collection of files, rather than as a completed narrative. This helps explain a lot of questions, not just the appendices, but the exhibits, the Whalestoe letters, and some of the later chapters in the book.
 
Iiinterneteresting.
 
@Emrakul is House of Leaves actually a good read?
cause I see it all over the place, but never see OPINIONS on it per se
 
user61230
House of Leaves is... I don't know. I think it's a worthwhile read, but whether it's a good read depends a lot on what you make of the book.
 
it's weird af
 
user61230
9:23 PM
It's nuts.
 
that too
 
SQB
It's still on my to read list.
 
...I kinda want to ask a question about Campbell's monomyth, but I'm not sure I could get past my own contempt for it to ask something useful.
 
@Benjamin I just updated the blog post with some more links that I think you will enjoy.
 
9:41 PM
It might be improved by talking about the flaws of the monomyth itself--that is, how it's presented as a stretchy, pliable thing so vague and broad that it will claim to describe anything which even sorta implies the movements Campbell describes.
It's sort of like saying "Look, water is shaped like everything we put it in, except the things with holes."
 
@Riker Hahaha! Who did I infect? I will be glad to take full responsibility ;)
@Riker Hehehe! Well, he is your quasi stepfather...just sayin' ;)
 
@Hamlet For a wider critique of the concept of monomyth, rather than Campbell's particular iteration of it, you might find works like Houston Wood's "Preparing to Retheorize the Texts of Oceania" useful.
He talks about how forms and concepts of literature and story which Euro-American critics consider universal are, in fact, artificial products of analyzing a limited cultural sample and prioritizing some kinds of writing as more valuable than others.
 
@steelersquirrel dforck
 
Hehehe! I see. My evil plan is working ;)
 
@steelersquirrel still a grump
I'll move to iceland corporeal punishment is illegal there
 
9:56 PM
@Riker Awwww. Napoleon isn't a grump. He just takes this stuff seriously. Do you think that I would spend my free time with a grump? ;)
Corporal punishment? Wow! Hahaha!
 
Oh my, I shall slowly back out the door.
 
@Hamlet I will add links soon.
 
@steelersquirrel i don't trust these scary orange people
@steelersquirrel and yes I do fwiw
 
@Riker No way! I only surround myself with awesome people! :)
 
such as napoleon
qed
/s
 
10:12 PM
Exactly! Napoleon is one of the coolest people that I know :)
Argh! My battery is dying. Be back later :)
 
see ya
 
10:37 PM
Not sure if I'll be able to be a mod; parents might n
Ot let me.
 
*nay-say?
or that
 
I'll see what they say after I actually get nominated :P
 
@Mithrandir just tell them "But I'm teaching weird people on the internet how to read good books!"
 
@Mithrandir I just don't tell them too much about what I do anyway
 
10:39 PM
They think that I spend too much time on the Internet anyway
Anyway. Going to sleep. Adios.
 
see ya!
@Mithrandir tener un bueno sueno
without accents bc I'm lazy
 
10:59 PM
wow, three avatars jumping off the screen at once
and another one...
"mi sentas min sola, sola, sooooola,
sola, sola, sooooola"...
 
11:41 PM
@Emrakul This is entirely random, but your profile picture is really well-made! At first glance, I thought for sure that it was from a picture online.
 
0
Q: Is it necessary for answers to literary analysis/meaning questions to be supported by quotes?

fi12This is a problem I've encountered from day one on our site: when I'm answering a question that's asking about what certain portions of a work of literature mean, do I need to include quotes from outside sources to support my answer? Is this always the case? Is there a time when my personal exper...

 
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