Sarvalaghu

In this case, I genuinely think the CW format would be better: I feel what I can contribute may just be a decent start, and there’s much more detail that an experienced teacher will be able to add on top of it.

Shankaraharigowla is almost exactly what I'm looking for, except on the descent it uses D2 rather than D1. That seems to be the closest. For my purposes, it's a good enough answer. Thanks @Malavika and @Sadhana for your help.

room topic changed to Sarvalaghu: A chatroom for discussions on technical aspects of Carnatic music; but we equally welcome discussions on Hindustani music, too! [bansuri] [harmonium] [indian-classical] [saptak] [sitar] [tabla] [tanpura]

I have a deadline and need to leave the chatroom for now, but before I go, I thought I'd point out that ICM has two distinct traditions. Carnatic (south Indian) and Hindustani (north Indian). The terms and concepts are similar but slightly different in the two traditions. So, if you're going to do any reading, my suggestion is to pick one and focus on it to begin with. @Namaskaram is from a Carnatic background, right? My background is Hindustani, but I won't confuse you with it right now.

I have a feeling we may have misled you, @Aaron. While musical phrases in a raga can land or rest on several of the notes in the scale, the Shadaj (Sa) most definitely is the most important note in every raga, and the raga does come to a final rest on Sa.

@Namaskaram We are in complete agreement. I think the OP mentioning scores is misleading. I believe the intention was only to say that through studying scores, OP made the discovery that Sa may not be prominently used. So the "real" question is how to determine Sa by ear, knowing it might not be used much in the song. Now that you and @Sadhana have confirmed my own understanding, I completely agree that NReihling's answer is the best of those present.

@Aaron The variations come from the many languages in which it is referred to: shadaj, shadja, shadjam, these are all valid.

@Namaskaram @Sadhana Very good. I feel confident we're on the right track. So, to sum up, shadaj is the "do" of a raga, and its specific pitch is determined according to the singer's vocal range. So far, so good, yes?

@Namaskaram @Aaron - I agree, it's an extremely confusing question. If the notation of the song is in the Indian style (which uses the Indian equivalent of do re mi fa so la ti do), you can always tell where "do" is based on the other syllables even if the song itself de-emphasizes "do." The only explanation I can think of is that perhaps OP is looking at staff notation of an Indian song? But he/she does not specify.

After hearing you sing, I decide I'd like to learn the same song and exactly copy the way you sing it. However, my voice is higher or lower than yours, so I select a shadaj suitable to my voice, and then shift every pitch you sing by the same amount.

On my own, I would practice singing the scales of the 72 Melakartha ragams, in sequence and also in a random order, to get a feel for the positions of the different swaras. I'm quite sure this helped me, personally.

Then, my guru insisted that we try to notate on our own the compositions that we were taught. (We were only given the lyrics to note down, never the notation for a song.) The process of listening to a melodic line and identifying the notes in it definitely helped in developing svara jnyanam.

@Sadhana Hmm, one big part of the training would be to practice the basic exercises: saralai varisai, jantai varisai, dhatu varisai, uchha sthayi varisai, alankaram and bhriga saadaka varisai in many Melakartha ragams, not just Mayamalavagoulai.

I revived the above question as I thought that it deserved more Indian-context-specific answers (the question had been marked duplicate and redirected to a question on absolute pitch training). Are there any specific exercises used in Carnatic music to train students to recognize swaras/sing them correctly on demand?

Ah, I was going to ask you whether you saw the question about the types of Raga Sarang, @Sadhana, and found that you have already supplied an answer :)

@Sadhana at least in this chatroom, you’re in good company, since @Malavika and I are both enthusiasts, too. :) I underwent training in Carnatic vocal music a relatively long time ago, around 2004–2012. It was a fantastic time, but my sadhana has evaporated since that time 😓

@Namaskaram Thank you! Yes, I have been stumbling along and learning a few things about the way this site works in the process. It's a great place. I hope more ICM experts will join by and by. I hope to learn more about Carnatic music too. As for myself...I wouldn't really call myself an expert. Just an enthusiast, I suppose. Music is more a hobby than a profession. Sometimes I have free time to devote to it, and at other times, I'm swamped with work assignments for months on end...

I think a couple of things you’ve noticed is that answers are expected to be self-contained as far as possible, and also that any affiliations with suggested resources are to be mentioned up front. Apart from that, questions on the main site must not be open-ended, and also must not be too broad.

@Sadhana feel free to ask if there’s anything that confuses you on the main site or chat :) regarding your answering content itself, I’m sure you’re pretty much set. It’s a pleasure to read articulate and accurate information on Indian classical music. The music sites here haven’t gathered a significant number of ICM experts yet.

@Namaskaram, @Malavika, Thank you both so much for discussing my content here! I had no idea. I am very new to this site and still don't know my way around. Just happened to find this, and hope to have some fun discussions. : )

@Bahudari Hehe, the first suggestion is, of course, to upload the notation to some Balamurali composition, if you know one. Apart from that, also if there are any rare compositions that you have learnt, especially ones that are particular to your parampara.

It reminds me of another film song that's in a ragamalika that begins with Todi: Aalaapanam, from the Malayalam movie Gaanam, sung by Yesudas and S. Janaki.

The song itself is in Todi, and then at the end he sings some swarams in ragamalika: Todi, Mohanam, Darbari Kanada, then an akaar in Kanada (our Carnatic one), followed by more swaras and a short tanam in Hamsanandi

Let me start with Naadamaya, a Kannada song from the movie Jeevana Chaitra. The actor is Rajkumar, and he is the singer too!

@Malavika I also like Western Classical, although compared to Indian music, I've listened to very little of it, or I should say I haven't listened to it very carefully, as in spending a lot of time analysing the structure of compositions and such. Similarly I've also listened to certain kinds of rock music, mostly alternative rock (Evanescence, L'Âme Immortelle, and some others), but I don't listen to any of these regularly. Only once in a while when I'm in the mood.

And yeah, although at first I liked Hindustani more, now I enjoy and listen to more of Carnatic music — thanks to Balamurali. For a long time he was the only Carnatic singer I really liked listening to, though I also quite liked Bombay Jayashree. And later on, TM Krishna too. But for the past many years MD Ramanathan has also been my favourite, as much as Balamurali [I can't say I like either one more than the other, now].

The other vocal track was a jugalbandhi with Bhimsen Joshi and Balamuralikrishna, in Sindhubhairavi. And I liked that too, but in that I liked Balamuralikrishna's singing — only, I thought (based on the rest of it) that what I liked was Hindustani, not Carnatic, so I thought this was Bhimsen Joshi -_-

While on the subject of grahabhedam… If you haven't already, check out Pt. Jasraj's idea of Jasrangi Jugalbandhi, where two artists sing different raags at the same time, but in different shrutis, so they're actually singing in the same scale.

Scrolling through the earlier messages here… @Malavika Given that you like Sharreth Sir's music, especially Sudhamanthram and Bhavayami that you specifically praised, you've got be a fan of grahabhedam!

@Bahudari If your username is an indication that that's one of your favourite ragas, I'm curious to know if you've listened Balamurali's Kamala Dalayata Lochana, which is my favourite Bahudari composition