Project Update Thursday - 27th Oct 2011 – Conversation in Home Improvement

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 18:48

I'm gonna do this now:

Welcome to Project Update Thursday!

Whoo.

crickets

Hey there, @ChadCooper what's shaking? :D

ChrisF

I've got nothing to report project wise or site wise.

BMitch

The Evil Greebo

Neither do I. We're saving money for our next project still.

BMitch

I started drywalling

The Evil Greebo

Metal furring strips?

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 18:54

this weekend will be mudding

@TheEvilGreebo sound attenuation channel

The Evil Greebo

Ah, which means metal furring strips with purpose ;)

BMitch

keeps the drywall of the studs for noise

The Evil Greebo

yep understood ;)

BMitch

this is my common wall with my neighbors, which, because they decided to redirect some water into my siding, I had a bit of damage to fix

The Evil Greebo

I hope they're paying for it

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 18:56

decided to go with foam insulation to minimize the risk of mold, but I had to go with fire rated drywall and they didn't have that in mold resistant in the store

The Evil Greebo

not spray foam, I note

foam board?

Steve Jackson

So I'm having a hard time picturing a common wall with siding. What am I missing here?

BMitch

I didn't push them on paying for anything, it's something they did years ago that only to have the ground settle the wrong way

@SteveJackson town houses where each is a few feet offset from each other

this is in my back, so about 2' is siding and the rest is the common wall

Steve Jackson

Aha. Thanks.

BMitch

they are also slightly different height wise, so I'm about a foot below them

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 18:58

<3 I love everything about PUT.

The Evil Greebo

spammy buggers

BMitch

so when they built up their back yard to be level with their walkout patio, it was above my foundation line

The Evil Greebo

oh I do have a project this weekend, but it's a "spread DE to kill bedbugs" project, not very interesting

BMitch

doh, /afk

ChrisF

@BMitch Watch out for soil buildup against your wall. A major source of damp

Steve Jackson

Oct 27, 2011 19:00

@BMitch Your townhouse builders seem like very creative folks.

@TheEvilGreebo I'm interested if you found a cheap place to pick up DE.

The Evil Greebo

Dirtworks

www.dirtworks.net/Diatomaceous-Earth.html

but define "cheap" :)

BMitch

sorry about that, client likes to make me work at the worst times :)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

ha

@BMitch how dare he

The Evil Greebo

@BMitch Those bastards

BMitch

@ChrisF yeah, soil buildup was the reason for all the damage

@SteveJackson the ones the built my place were cheap cheap cheap, I'm finishing my repairs to get ready to move

exterior is aluminum siding on top of sheet rock, no wood sheathing

Steve Jackson

Oct 27, 2011 19:03

????

BMitch

@SteveJackson that's the same reaction I had, as did the ones that swapped out a door and realized I wasn't kidding.

ChrisF

In the UK where we have largely brick exterior walls and a damp proof course I'm sure that most of the cases of rising damp "cured" by expensive injection systems and replastering etc could well have been fixed by clearing away the build up of detritus on the outside wall that's bridging the dpc

BMitch

@ChrisF in our case, it wasn't so much rising damp as falling damp from a hurricane

we had people tubing down local highways

ChrisF

@BMitch That's the one sort of weather we only get once in a 100 years in the UK

BMitch

so to answer an earlier question, yes, foam panels that I just glued up and then filled in the gaps with great stuff

and that's about the extent of my work this week, the mudding should be fun

I'll pull out some of my "what's wrong with this construction site" photos in a bit, just have to fix an emergency first

joshmax

Oct 27, 2011 19:08

I can see I'll be learning a lot on Thursdays... :S

Steve Jackson

No updates from me. A roll of insulation is sitting in the attic taunting me.

The Evil Greebo

Buddy of mine has a townhouse where they put siding on top of MDF

we pulled some of his siding off and the mdf just fell apart

Steve Jackson

It seems like there should be a way to seal MDF. I used some for a subfloor and would go into a panic anytime it got wet.

Here's a highway in Houston during a tropical storm 10 years ago. I'd say that water is 12 feet high easy.

BMitch

Not exactly 12 feet, but this is just down the road from me:

►

I am curious about the common wall construction in my home, it looks like 3 layers of drywall, one fire rated on my side standing off via sound attenuation channel, another in the middle, and then the third would be the outside for the aluminum siding or interior of my neighbors. I'm not exactly sure of the purpose of the middle layer.

I would have thought 2 layers of fire rated drywall would be plenty

Tester101

@BMitch it may be there as a sound break, to prevent sound from traveling through the wall.

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 19:19

@Tester101 maybe, I can still hear things pretty easily despite the sound attenuation channel being used

Tester101

Holmes did a show on sound proofing a common wall, Seemed like quite a pain in the neck.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Hmm. I wish my apartment had that. I can hear my upstairs neighbors having sex on the weekends.

BMitch

@AarthiDevanathanΨ lol, insert scene from "secret of my success"

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@BMitch laughs yes precisely.

ChrisF

@AarthiDevanathanΨ There's a question about that (well not exactly that) on DIY

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 19:22

@ChrisF squeaky squeaky squeaky squeaky....

ChrisF

3

Q: How can I temporarily soundproof my apartment ceiling?

Currently I'm living in an apartment that has poor soundproofing. My upstairs neighbors get up at 4:30 am to go to work. They have two dogs. So there's a lot of noise between 4:30 am and 5 am. Like any sane person, I don't want to wake up at 4:30 am. I've had many issues with noise in this apar...

sound-proofing

There's an excellent answer by a fine looking chap there too

Tester101

@AarthiDevanathan if it's only the squeaking you hear, you could offer to buy them a new bed frame.

BMitch

just leave a can of wd-40 outside their door with a note saying "your bed could use this"

@TheEvilGreebo there's a reason I always decline whenever someone offers to replace my aluminum siding or windows, I'm leaving this disaster for someone else

joshmax

@BMitch Maan, why didn't I think of that when I the same problem as @AarthiDevanathan :P

The Evil Greebo

@BMitch lol

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 19:26

@ChrisF ha

@BMitch best idea

Steve Jackson

@BMitch I'd like for Aarthi to ask the question so you can put this as an answer.

BMitch

:)

ChrisF

@SteveJackson Problem is it would a duplicate

Steve Jackson

@ChrisF Well @BMitch's answer won't help the two dog problem :)

BMitch

ChrisF

Oct 27, 2011 19:27

@SteveJackson That is true.

BMitch

thought I'd play a little "what's wrong with this construction site?" unless anyone else has updates

ChrisF

Oh, so that's what it is. I thought someone was building a 1:1 scale sandcastle.

joshmax

@ChrisF Would eggcrate soundproofing work here, since it's a temp situation? Maybe reverse them against the ceiling?

BMitch

for the first entry, they seem to have a little silt getting past their silt fence

ChrisF

@joshmax Possibly. Depends how much you like looking at eggcrates :)

Steve Jackson

Oct 27, 2011 19:29

@BMitch It's generally good for the dirt to be higher than the "retaining wall", right?

joshmax

@ChrisF I'd rather look at gray eggcrates than blue foam board :)

Tester101

That's the fence guys fault. He put that damn fence in the wrong place!

Steve Jackson

@Tester101 You've obviously worked on a construction site before :)

Tester101

Damn surveyors never mark stuff right!

BMitch

it's that crazy single fence design, when will the fools learn to use a 4 layered fence

Steve Jackson

Oct 27, 2011 19:32

If we just had some frickin coffee up here none of this would have happened.

Tester101

I'm more curious as to where the random pipe sticking out of the side of the pile goes?

Steve Jackson

That's not the first layer of fence? ;)

Doresoom

@Tester101, hey now, I worked as a survey tech for two summers!

Tester101

It'll never drain like that.

BMitch

to their credit, I watched when this happened, and they had a large excavator lifting a massive cement form through a narrow path and he had to avoid all the utility lines on the other side, putting him on an incline

Tester101

Oct 27, 2011 19:34

@Doresoom oh... sorry. I'm sure you were good at it.

Doresoom

darn right :)

the gps system accurate to 4 mm helped too

BMitch

@Tester101 part of the conduit, there's a load of it in the ground, every utility in the world in a narrow path. they had a bunch sticking up to mark where they stopped digging the last bit, so this might have just been a marker

Tester101

@Doresoom It's all those construction workers always messing around, moving flags, using the flag sticks as shims and what not.

BMitch

I think they might be using them for sword fights too

I kid you not, I saw the cement truck driver pull out a machete and threaten the day laborers if they didn't get back to work

Doresoom

we almost always put giant nails in the ground as well when accuracy was really important, and only used the stakes to locate them

easier to find with a metal detector, and nosy neighbors would usually just pull the stakes out without noticing them

property dispute surveys were the worst

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 19:38

@Doresoom lol, I bet

joshmax

I posed a question to the blog contributors a few days ago, but thought I'd ask it here, since there's more movement now.

**All time worst thing you've come across in your reno's that someone *else* did that you had to fix.**
Go.

Tester101

"Hey look somebody left a scrap piece of wood for me. They even tied a ribbon so I could find it!"

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

(PS: Hey there, @Doresoom nice to see you here again :D)

joshmax

@Tester101 lol

Doresoom

:)

mine's not that bad, but i'll go

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 19:41

doh, sorry @Doresoom, go ahead, this one can wait

Doresoom

while replacing water damaged ceiling drywall, i found a random 2x4 in the attic

i tried to remove it and found out it was attached to the ceiling drywall

Tester101

Patch brace?

The Evil Greebo

sounds like a patch brace to me

Doresoom

the 12' sheet ended between joists, and they didn't feel like adding enough lumber to attach everything

yeah, i guess that's what it was, but it was really poorly done

The Evil Greebo

Oh... so it was a 4' long 2x4?

unattached to anything else?

Doresoom

Oct 27, 2011 19:43

yeah, just floating there on the drywall

The Evil Greebo

they should have trimmed the drywall back to the nearest joist

guess since it was the ceiling htey just wanted a flat join

Tester101

drywallers needed something to screw to, and the framers had already left the site.

Doresoom

haha

BMitch

for me, my biggest fix was plumbing, and after a dozen fixes, the biggest problem turned out to be a lack of an expansion tank

Doresoom

"not my problem...grumble grumble"

The Evil Greebo

Oct 27, 2011 19:45

"Drywallers can screw in the gaps"?

BMitch

was it a tapered span or non-tapered that they joined the two pieces of drywall on?

Tester101

I worked with a guy who used to say "Can't see it from my house", when he did stuff like that.

BMitch

non-tapered should be cut back to the joist, and tapered should be perpendicular to the joist

joshmax

@BMitch I'd have to say plumbing has been the biggest blunder in my house, too.

The Evil Greebo

@Tester101 Guys like that should be fired

Doresoom

Oct 27, 2011 19:47

i need clarification on what a tapered span is

BMitch

on a 4x8 sheet of drywall, the 8' side is tapered to make the joint disappear with mud

The Evil Greebo

drywall edges (the long edges) are slightly thinner than the rest of the board

Doresoom

non-tapered then

The Evil Greebo

for what bmitch said

Doresoom

yeah, i figured it out - just didn't know the terminology

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 19:48

yeah, should have cut it back then, lazy lazy lazy

joshmax

@BMitch Good to know.

Doresoom

or running out of drywall at the jobsite

The Evil Greebo

well get out, we have no room for ppl who dont know the... word...thingies...for... yeah

Doresoom

haha

The Evil Greebo

;)

<-- professional smartass

Doresoom

Oct 27, 2011 19:49

ok, i should be getting back to work

bye everyone!

BMitch

/waves

so anyone want to work on a framing 101 lesson:

Steve Jackson

Well that's obviously the lumberyards fault. They should've thrown that piece out.

The Evil Greebo

@BMitch No no I see the problem. Your camera's crooked

BMitch

I really should hide a picture of this somewhere that only the homeowner will find

ChrisF

someone needs a new bubble in their spirit level

Tester101

Oct 27, 2011 19:51

Make the guy on the ground stand under the ladder not next to it.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Ahaha.

The Evil Greebo

You know what's really sad is you don't notice it at first but the one to the right of the REALLY crooked one is also off

BMitch

not only is it not vertical, but the window was cut short or something

The Evil Greebo

its too narrow at the base or too wide at the top

joshmax

Maybe their saw broke before they could trim those boards down properly "Noone will notice, quick! Screw 'em up there!"

The Evil Greebo

Oct 27, 2011 19:52

4" narrower at the bottom

if you put your mouse on one edge up top and then hold it and scroll you'll see the tilt

BMitch

I just don't know how they get the header up, and start on the next floor, before thinking they should fix this

Niall C.

I want photos for when they try to put the windows in

Tester101

Probably done after lunch, and a few too many cold ones.

The Evil Greebo

srsly

Steve Jackson

I'm just thinking about some sap going to attach a cabinet or something. Screw holes will be all fudged up. "Stupid Studfinder"

Tester101

Oct 27, 2011 19:54

@NiallC That's the window installers problem then, the framers are on to the next site.

The Evil Greebo

photo stolen and posted on FB

BMitch

lol, that would be the second time it made it to FB :)

Steve Jackson

@Tester101 Oh I think it might be worth tracking them down :) @BMitch mentioned there's a lot of townhomes in this development going up.

The Evil Greebo

there isn't a single friggin plumb board on that place

BMitch

I'm just amazed that this is what the professionals do when they have inspectors checking on them

yeah, the framing crew would have still been around, they were going up like an assembly line, 7 town houses at a time

I also noticed they would leave studs un-nailed at the bottom of doorways, guess that's the lazy way to cut the bottom plate out

we always under cut ours before raising the wall, and a quick sawzall finishes it off.

The Evil Greebo

Oct 27, 2011 19:58

I've seen that before

put the base plate all the way across, don't nail at the door area, cut it out after

ensures your base plate is straight

Steve Jackson

@BMitch That might be another good target for your envelope of photos. Let the inspectors know that someone is watching them - so they should make a fuss.

BMitch

yeah, we leave our base plate in too, but the studs are nailed in from under rather than toe nailing. which, since this was a cement foundation, toe nailing would be a pain.

The Evil Greebo

OH I see

Tester101

@BMitch They'll cut the plate when they are ready for finishing (drywall, door install, etc), keeps everything square and lined up in the meantime.

The Evil Greebo

I thoguht you meant not nailing down the base plate

I thought they usually built the walls flat then lifted them

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 20:00

nope, base plate was nailed, but the studs on either side of the door were hanging free so they could push them out of the way to cut the plate

at least that's my assumption for why they did it

The Evil Greebo

oh... well thats... stupid. The door won't be supported

why would you need to leave the studs free... you cut teh base out inside the door frame not outside

inside your jack studs

BMitch

might be hard to get a saw against the jack studs

we always under cut our base plate about a half inch or so

The Evil Greebo

a sawz-all will fit easy

BMitch

that keeps us from running the sawzall into the foundation or through the floor

The Evil Greebo

hmm, I would put the blade in upside down and lay the tool flat on the ground

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 20:03

they went with option B: leave the jack and king studs completely free, dangling in the air

The Evil Greebo

yeah... either of our methods is better :)

bmitch you should send that picture to the local permit board

BMitch

I've already got the county supervisor working with me to get the privacy wall raised, want to stay on their good side while they appear to be cooperating

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Good call, that.

BMitch

I sometimes wonder how the crane operator can see what he's doing

The Evil Greebo

psychic

joshmax

Oct 27, 2011 20:07

@BMitch must work like DareDevil... echolocation?

Niall C.

Use the force, Luke

BMitch

these walls have more fake windows than real ones

and I have no idea why that little one is sitting there at an angle

Steve Jackson

BMitch

@SteveJackson lol

The Evil Greebo

what's with the fake windows?

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 20:11

no idea, they're even putting shutters in them

Tester101

Ultra energy efficient windows!

BMitch

maybe without the glass, people won't walk into them by accident

Tester101

Far less heat loss than those windows you can see through.

joshmax

I'll go...

Mine was finding out that the new corner shower & toilet installed in the utility room had crooked pipes.

The sellers decided to "fix it" with duct tape. The ends of the pipe were about 3/4" off from the sewer drain pipe and the duct tape did not hold up well.

When I got into the crawl space to fix it ... well, let's just say it didn't smell like a flower shop...

Tester101

@joshmax they made a pipe union with duct tape?

Steve Jackson

Oct 27, 2011 20:15

They needed MOAR duct tape

BMitch

they were just following the org chart

joshmax

@Tester101 indeed. Searching for the photo now...

Steve Jackson

Oh good, because I'm confused on the crooked pipes.

joshmax

"Crooked Pipes" you mean that's not a technical term? :P

BMitch

only if you're a doctor

The Evil Greebo

Oct 27, 2011 20:17

sounds like the pipes weren't properly joined?

later all

Steve Jackson

Yoda should really have a hard hat - I'll have to improve that picture.

/waves

BMitch

/waves

joshmax

blast, can't find the photo but I had to get one of these:

/wave

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

/waves

Steve Jackson

So they joined three pipes together with duct tape? I hope you find that picture, that one's going to thereifixedit post haste.

joshmax

Oct 27, 2011 20:23

@BMitch lol I missed that comment.

@SteveJackson Me, too. It's probably on my home pc.

Steve Jackson

Did it look like this?

ChrisF

From the description I think the water wasn't that colour :)

joshmax

haha, no, actually, they didn't care enough to use that much duct tape.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

oh wow

Steve Jackson

I think I found a new awesome site: home-inspection-nightmares.com

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 20:30

oh god

Steve Jackson

BMitch

yikes

joshmax

@SteveJackson What's a picture of my crawlspace doing online!

Steve Jackson

Your attic?

BMitch

Attic? No, that's my bathroom!

Steve Jackson

Oct 27, 2011 20:34

It's quite environmentally friendly for use to reuse your rainwater like that :)

joshmax

@SteveJackson Nah, it's probably @Doresoom's. He's got random stuff in his attic.

Steve Jackson

@joshmax Oh I see...he probably tried to put his indoor pool on that 2x4 and found it wasn't a joist.

Tester101

@BMitch are you saying you pee in the pool?

BMitch

/me whistles innocently

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

D:

Meanwhile: my favorite bloggers continue to be awesome:

younghouselove.com/2011/10/counter-conclusions

BMitch

Oct 27, 2011 20:38

a bathroom is where you take a bath, we use an outhouse for those other purposes

Steve Jackson

@BMitch Your townhouse builders were really cheap, huh?

BMitch

we have running water, assuming you're talking about the alternative to walking with the bucket

Tester101

Worst part... It's a community outhouse.

joshmax

@AarthiDevanathanΨ link reminded me: has anyone used this or something like it?

Tester101

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 20:43

@joshmax remodelaholic.com/2011/08/…

I swear, I read all the blogs.

ChrisF

@BMitch Posh version of the org chart:

Tester101

BMitch

@ChrisF I'm saving that one

joshmax

@AarthiDevanathanΨ thanks for that. I have a good friend who's looking into doing this now, I'll probably end up helping him, so that's a good walk-through.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

No problem -- not the first time others have asked about kitchens, right @SteveJackson?

smushes @MichaelMrozek

Steve Jackson

Oct 27, 2011 20:52

@AarthiDevanathanΨ <--- knows stuff. I was sold on recessed lights, but my better half didn't think it would light up our kitchen quite as well.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

You should totally comment on the latest YHL post, then.

they're picking a countertop

Steve Jackson

I'm still hurt that they're your favorite bloggers :p

@Tester101 I'm really not sure what to do with this information now that it's in my brain.

BMitch

@SteveJackson I was actually feeling complemented about us being her favorite bloggers until she started posting the sites of others, then I was crushed and went into a deep depression.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Awww~!

GUYS.

You're my favorite blogging collective

Steve Jackson

@BMitch EXACTLY. Pass the Ben & Jerry's.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 20:56

Hey!

I love you guys!

2

the DIY.SE Blog is awesomesauce.

YHL is the only other blog I adore this much. Maybe MAHAH, too. BUT MOSTLY Y'ALL. PROMISE.

ChrisF

I'm off. See you all later

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

byeeeee~!

BMitch

/waves

Steve Jackson

/waves

BMitch

@SteveJackson I think I'm going to find something to hit with a ramset, that always make me feel better

<-- gets out my 22cal charge... fire in the hole!

well, there it goes, another PUT is over, just like that

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Oct 27, 2011 21:01

Awww.

Thanks for joining us for Project Update Thursday! We'll see you next week!

But hey, this was super fun! nonstop chatting for two hours. I'm so proud! wipes away a tear

Project Update Thursday - 27th Oct 2011

Home Improvement

Participants