After two weeks of hard work, I was able to submit my paper!

I'm so happy with this :-)

@RomainPicot Congratulations!

@StefanKottwitz thank you :-)

@egreg one for you:

@DavidCarlisle Worst possible code. One should not try projects like that without minimal knowledge.

@egreg That was my thought too:-)

@LaRiFaRi I've figured out why \mathrel was added to \dblcolon etc in the post you made in chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/23630342#23630342, without it things like \coloneqq can have a line break in text mode between : and =

@daleif There's no need for that \mathrel; if you define \Coloneqq to be \vcentcolon\mkern-.9mu\vcentcolon\mkern -1.2mu= there will be no break possible between the three symbols, because TeX adds nothing between consecutive Rel atoms (and kerns are not break points). So defining \dblcolon to be \vcentcolon\mkern-.9mu\vcentcolon is simpler and has the same effect.

@egreg see this example

That breaks on my system

@Johannes_B When you reply to LC posts, do you use the "Re: ..." title sometimes to add your own post title, different to the topic title?

@StefanKottwitz I think i never did.

@daleif \newcommand{\relkern}[1]{\mathrel{\mkern#1}}

@Johannes_B I think nobody does, I sometimes did very long ago. So I think I remove displaying it to get rid of the repeated h3 headings, to remove obsolete information. Later I may check if a user set subtitle is different to the topic title and only display it in that case. Do you agree?

@StefanKottwitz Yes.

@Johannes_B As we reduced headings a lot then, I think I will display the forum title, then the topic title in a topic view (this does not contain the forum title)

@StefanKottwitz What is the topic view?

@Johannes_B hm, I think: Large topic title, smaller below the forum name ("Graphics, ...") a always missed it to see the forum name itself

@Johannes_B The normal reading view of a single topic

@StefanKottwitz Ah, agreed.

@egreg not understod, what exactly is it you suggest changing the definitions into?

@daleif Use \mathrel{\mkern XXmu} throughout.

I see etextools is causing 'fun' again: I wonder if I should add a test to etoolbox for example in the \AtBeginDocument hook (to print a warning)

@JosephWright Every package that relies on the loop macros of etoolbox will most likely break if etextools is loaded.

@egreg Yes, I can see that, hence wondering about it

@egreg fixed in the devel version

@egreg tex.stackexchange.com/q/267181/3929, the footnote part for multlined can be fixed by adding \measuring@true to the multlined measuring part. Not sure why this was missing. And no idea why the normal multline does not like minipage

Note that as of April 2015, fixltx2e has been declared obsolete, and the \textsubscript{} command can no longer be used. changes can be used to restore the \textsubscript{} command.

@DavidCarlisle @JosephWright @egreg @barbarabeeton ^^^^^^

@Johannes_B sigh... wikibook again?

@DavidCarlisle Sure. I'll delete the rest of that section.

@Johannes_B Oh for pities sake

@JosephWright :-)

BTW: the multlined issue from the other day, I've just going to solve it by making a slight redefinition os subarray inside multlined (using @UlrikeFischer 's suggestion, which seems to work fine).

@egreg a \left\right usage you'll enjoy:

@DavidCarlisle I just copy paste the code linked, It's not the best solution indeed. Whatever it's a really bad question and the OP may not give any feedback

@RomainPicot yes but it's still worth fixing it (or not answering) code from accepted answers gets copied forever.

@DavidCarlisle I edit my answer to add the non \left \right option

@RomainPicot thanks

@DavidCarlisle Fun with upTeX:

\tracingall
\font\test=ec-lmr10\relax\test

ß
à
ı\par
\bye

@egreg You might also enjoy ^^^ (for some value of 'enjoy')

Hello latex and friends :P

Does anyone know how to insert verbatim code from Eclipse? (Not just how to include a file but also keep it's highliting, I use hard-to-find languages so exporting it directly would be neat and efficient)

Actually I'm opening a question, posting in a sec here.

@JosephWright runs without error:-)

@DavidCarlisle Yes, in a way

@DavidCarlisle Did you read the trace?

@user2692669 no reason to suppose that that is possible directly unless eclipse exports that

@JosephWright not in detail this bit presumably: {horizontal mode: kanji character ß}

Completed box being shipped out [1]
\vbox(667.20255+0.0)x469.75499, yoko direction
.\vbox(0.0+0.0)x469.75499, glue set 14.0fil, yoko direction
..\glue -22.5
..\hbox(8.5+0.0)x469.75499, glue set 469.75499fil, yoko direction
...\vbox(8.5+0.0)x0.0, yoko direction
...\glue 0.0 plus 1.0fil
..\glue 0.0 plus 1.0fil minus 1.0fil
.\vbox(643.20255+0.0)x469.75499, glue set 632.00255fill, yoko direction
..\glue(\topskip) 1.20001
..\hbox(8.79999+1.2)x469.75499, glue set 419.75499fil
...\hbox(0.0+0.0)x20.0
...\tenmin ß

@DavidCarlisle ^^^

Notice in particular the font used

@JosephWright I don't get that, I get

..\glue(\topskip) 1.20001
..\hbox(8.79999+1.2)x469.75499, glue set 419.75499fil
...\hbox(0.0+0.0)x20.0
...\tenmin ß
...\tenmin à
...\tenmin ı

@DavidCarlisle That bit is fine (you might guess I'm working on things to do with format mode, hyphenation and the like)

@DavidCarlisle That's a terminal thing I guess, but the important point remains: why's the font \tenmin?

@DavidCarlisle (I get that if I open the log in TeXworks: the copy paste earlier is from the Command Prompt as I'm running uptex interactively)

@JosephWright isn't the model in uptex that all non ascii characters are Kanji (so that's just bad input?)

@DavidCarlisle Could well be

@DavidCarlisle All the docs are in Japanese :-)

@DavidCarlisle Hmm, seems you are right: it ignores the font selection only if the chars are non-ASCII

@user2692669 really that's an eclipse question so more or less off topic here. If eclipse can export the highlighted text in any format (eg html) then you can import it, if not you just have to configure listings or minted to get as close as possible,

@JosephWright Which reminds me of a sad story: I once was in need of a math textbook and could not find it anywhere. Then I found out a torrent with one lonely seed. I waited for 4 weeks until the download had finished and discovered the book was in Japanese. :)

@JosephWright I think I may have read that in some non-japanese document somewhere

@DavidCarlisle There is some very limited stuff but it's not really that informative (or at least the stuff I've seen isn't)

@DavidCarlisle At least this narrows down my ideas for format mode

@PauloCereda You should have asked me, I could have done a Japanese to Portuguese translation for you.

@DavidCarlisle pTeX by contrast does do what one might expect

@JosephWright as in "don't use uptex?" :-)

@DavidCarlisle I think that might not work, but ...

@JosephWright hang on I'll try ptex..

@DavidCarlisle :) How's your car and tree, by the way?

@DavidCarlisle is there a way to search if those packages support the languages that i want? I remember two weeks ago i was trying to peek at some verbatim manuals but they said things like "search the terminal".

@user2692669 minted does anything pygmentize does

@DavidCarlisle what are those? I guess I need a transla(tex)tor

@JosephWright so with ptex (if the file is utf8) it typesets the usual accented A UTF8 misencoding

@PauloCereda I got a mail! <3

@DavidCarlisle That's fine: the same as pdfTeX so easily sortable and understandable

@DavidCarlisle I'm assuming UTF-8 for everything ;-)

@yo' oooooooooh

@DavidCarlisle Gotcha!

@DavidCarlisle With \disablecjktoken everything is 'sensible': phew!

@JosephWright but does anyone use *ptex and disable cjk?

@user2692669 pygmentize s a python library for syntax highlighting usable in general but also by minted

@JosephWright Already described in some threads on the GuIT forum, IIRC

@egreg Ah

@DavidCarlisle Possibly not but this is an iterative process: first get something that vaguely works

@DavidCarlisle: ^^ spot @egreg. :)

@DavidCarlisle Checkins later today (I hope) might make the question make sense!

@DavidCarlisle The real question is more 'Does anyone use (u)pTeX and non-ASCII western European input?'

@PauloCereda Is the guy in the green shirt holding a beer bottle? :-)

@Johannes_B LOL

@Johannes: Let's hope the bloke hasn't attempted to drink his headphones. :)

@PauloCereda Ah, headphones :-D

@Johannes_B You almost got me. :)

@StefanKottwitz texwelt.de/wissen/fragen/5894/meta-melden-zieht-punkte-ab and texwelt.de/wissen/fragen/10964/meta-negatives-punktekonto

@PauloCereda There's a duck missing in the photo

@yo' I am probably looking for free food. :)

Unsupervised free food table. :)

@PauloCereda food for a duck? Soaked bread?

@yo' pizza. :)

@PauloCereda oh :) You're making me hungry

@yo' :)

I think I'll go get something. Not a pizza tho :)

@PauloCereda -- not hard. he's the fuzzy one. a couple other familiar faces there.

(well, I had lunch at 1130 and was teaching 4 hours straight, it's 1700 now here)

@barbarabeeton Indeed. :)

Either I messed up, or someone else did. Freakin' templates.

@PauloCereda a whole row of egregs making a hedge in front of that blue and white building?

@JosephWright no

@DavidCarlisle o.O

@DavidCarlisle Almost certainly true, in which case would could happily ignore the problem (perhaps for the moment that will be my plan, don't know)

What does this error mean?

@MaryStar it means that you are using classic tex where characters go from 0 to 255 and have specified character number 20008 which is bigger than 255

@MaryStar you know that it is much easier to answer a question if you make a complete document that reproduces the error, and if it takes much code to ask a question on site.

@MaryStar why would you do $\text{\foreignlanguage{english}{EXP}}$} goes in to math mode then immediately comes out again?

@MaryStar probably deleting the toc file and using \protect\foreignlanguage fixes it, but without an example that's just a guess

I want to write $\text{EXP}(\mathbb{C}$... @DavidCarlisle

Here is the whole code: pastebin.com/jQFhxCj1 @DavidCarlisle

@MaryStar Hint: Ask the question on the main site, so it is seen by more people than David and others in Chat. It's much faster to get help that way.

Oh @Mary, why? LaTeX does a lot for you, it would even prevent new paragraphs from being indented and adding a little vertical distance between them. Next time, add parskip=half as global option.

@MaryStar Seeing the code and the other questions here in chat i simply have to ask: Did you read anything in preparation to using LaTeX?

@MaryStar you don't want to use \text for operator names, use \mathrm or better \DeclaremathOperator from amsmath

@MaryStar don't use external links (unless you plan to maintain that link forever) as it makes the archive unusable

@DavidCarlisle Wanna know a secret? I got a mail from Vel at L-templates: the margins are the wrong way in the current version on github. Odd should have wide left margins and even should have wide right margins, right now it's the opposite.

@Johannes_B haha

I explained this before in a mail.

@yo' I'm not sure where the TeX Gyre team found that horrible font for Pagella calligraphic math letters. Besides its ugliness, considering how the italic U is rendered should have made for a different choice.

@egreg I dunno :)

@Johannes_B I blame vim, if people used emacs more they would be aware of the need for somewhere to put your thumbs.

@DavidCarlisle :-)

tex.stackexchange.com/questions/277976/… has just been closed by its owner. but before that happened, it caused me to look at tex.stackexchange.com/q/193971 which discusses the same thing, namely eulervm vs. \mathit. i'm convinced that eulervm is handling it wrong. has anyone pointed this out to the maintainer?

\providecommand{\equationname}{Equation}
\providecommand{\sectionname}{Section}
\providecommand{\authorshipname}{Declaration of Authorship}
\providecommand{\byname}{by}% as in:  submitted by
\providecommand{\abbrevname}{List of Abbreviations}
\providecommand{\constantsname}{Physical Constants}
\providecommand{\symbolsname}{List of Symbols}
\providecommand{\acknowledgementname}{Acknowledgements}

@PauloCereda @RomainPicot @yo' @cfr @egreg @others: If you could send me the translations into your native language, that would be great. You will even get a mention and thanks in the (very short) documentation.

@all it doesn't have to be the exact same translation, for example Physical constants is pretty awkward.

@Johannes_B vvv

\providecommand{\equationname}{Equação}
\providecommand{\sectionname}{Seção}
\providecommand{\authorshipname}{Declaração de Autoria}
\providecommand{\byname}{por}
\providecommand{\abbrevname}{Lista de Abreviaturas}
\providecommand{\constantsname}{Constantes Físicas}
\providecommand{\symbolsname}{Lista de Símbolos}
\providecommand{\acknowledgementname}{Agradecimentos}
\providecommand{\duckname}{Pato}

@PauloCereda A \duckname!

@JosephWright <3

@PauloCereda \providecommand{\whoareyouwhoaresowiseinthewaysofscience}

@JosephWright yes Yes YES!

@Johannes: on a second thought, I'd rename Lista de Abreviaturas to Lista de Abreviaturas e Siglas because in Portuguese we have abreviação (for example, bike for bicycle or phone for telephone), abreviatura (for example, num. for number or adj. for adjective, or m for metre) and sigla (for example, SE for Stack Exchange).

@JosephWright and others, We will achieve 100,000 questions very soon, there is no plan to celebrate this?

I tried to install pygments but when I compile from Texmaker it gets stuck compiling, I use Xelatex with: xelatex -synctex=1 -interaction=nonstopmode -shell-escape %.tex

i tried --shell-escape too

any ideas?

@PauloCereda Thanks, i changed it.

\providecommand{\equationname}{Equazione}
\providecommand{\sectionname}{Sezione}
\providecommand{\authorshipname}{Dichiarazione di paternit\`a}
\providecommand{\byname}{da}% as in:  submitted by
\providecommand{\abbrevname}{Elenco delle abbreviazioni}
\providecommand{\constantsname}{Costanti fisiche}
\providecommand{\symbolsname}{Elenco dei simboli}
\providecommand{\acknowledgementname}{Attestazione}
\providecommand{\duckname}{Papero}

@Johannes_B ^^^^^

@egreg awwww a duck too. <3

@DavidCarlisle -- between tex.stackexchange.com/q/272491 and my earlier comment about chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/25358820#25358820, i see more than one serious problem with eulervm (not ignoring known problems with amsmath). do you have any opinions on the matter? (i'm working on the amsmath bugs list; no updates to the package, just getting test materials in order.)

@barbarabeeton just about to eat, will look later

@touhami @egreg is going to ask the 100,000th question

@egreg merci :-)

@DavidCarlisle I installed pygments and tried to use minted but it is stuck at compiling, can you help please? I wrote details 4-5 posts above the current chatlog

@user2692669 probably can't help much where is it stuck, in the tex or in the python? (I've never looked at the sources for minted or pygments)

@DavidCarlisle tex, python works as far as I tested

@DavidCarlisle I used a simple example in case the template is buggy but same thing, it gets stuck at compilation.

@DavidCarlisle I thought you were.

@user2692669 things don't just get stuck, does it stop with an error, or loop forever?

@egreg never found the ask a question button

@DavidCarlisle Forevah, I tried deleting "-interaction=nonstopmode" but same thing.

@user2692669 do it on the commandline so you know what it's doing rather than what your editor wants to do, then add \tracingall to your document and look at the log.

@DavidCarlisle Neither did I. Let's make @StefanKottwitz ask the 100,000th, like he did for the 10,000th.

@DavidCarlisle Which commandline?

cmd? (windows)

@user2692669 yes that will do if you are on windows (that's not essential but if your input is being filtered through an editor which is then filtering tex's messages it is just a more complicated pipeline to debug)

@egreg I could ask something about pTeX ;-)

@DavidCarlisle i tried writting xelatex to my prompt and I see a message "restricted \write18 enabled."

@user2692669 that's not enough you need unrestricted access (-shell-escape)

@Johannes_B I can do that, but note that due to the syntax of my language, most of the items are useless.

@DavidCarlisle Just tried with \tracingall and it went on a crazy loop

\providecommand{\equationname}{rovnice}
\providecommand{\sectionname}{sekce}
\providecommand{\authorshipname}{Prohlášení autorství}
\providecommand{\byname}{}% as in:  submitted by % does not make sense in Czech
\providecommand{\abbrevname}{Seznam zkratek}
\providecommand{\constantsname}{Konstanty}
\providecommand{\symbolsname}{Seznam značení}
\providecommand{\acknowledgementname}{Poděkování}
\providecommand{\duckname}{kachnička}

@Johannes_B ^^

Good maen

@ChristianHupfer Hello Dark One

@DavidCarlisle let us just hope that the 100,000th question be of egreg rank :-)

@ChristianHupfer Hi!

@user2692669 hello "Son" :-P

@PauloCereda Ah, the inevitable Duck :-P

@ChristianHupfer Das Ente!

:)

@yo' Merci. The user will have to change stuff anyway.

Templates are hell.

@Johannes_B Das Template. :)

@Johannes_B sentence templates are impossible in Czech.

@PauloCereda Das Unheil, das Ungeheuer, das Ungetüm, das Unerhörte :-P

@Johannes_B I just think now: What is \constantsname meant for? Is it something like "List of constants"? In that case, you better use Seznam konstant.

@yo' In most languages i guess. I didn't even check for german. It will be complete and utter nonsense.

@yo' constants, as in physical constants

@Johannes_B What's the context? Are these going to be used in sentences? Or are they headings or something? I ask because if this is for use in sentences, there is an issue of mutations.

@Johannes_B I don't want to disturb you, but ... why are you doing it, then? :-P

@cfr @yo' Freaking templates: github.com/johannesbottcher/mastersdoctoralthesislatex

most useless effort of all times.

@Johannes_B ok, that changes some things:

\providecommand{\equationname}{rovnice}
\providecommand{\sectionname}{sekce}
\providecommand{\authorshipname}{Prohlášení}
\providecommand{\byname}{}% as in:  submitted by % does not make sense in Czech
\providecommand{\abbrevname}{Seznam zkratek}
\providecommand{\constantsname}{Seznam konstant}
\providecommand{\symbolsname}{Seznam značení}
\providecommand{\acknowledgementname}{Poděkování}
\providecommand{\duckname}{kachnička}

wow pygment you naughty thing, 32 cmd windows open :D

@yo' changed, thanks :-)

@user2692669 yes but if you stop it it's being traced so you can see whether it is looping and if so, where the loop is.

@DavidCarlisle Could it be that I used x64 version and it's icmopatible with the other tools?

@user2692669 don't know. I don't use the windows binaries. But that's more likely to give a system run error than any kind of loop I would guess. Do any minted examples work?

@DavidCarlisle No they don't, I tried the same method in another machine but I got the same situation

@user2692669 as i say I don't really know much about it, I used it with a few examples and it just worked so never looked too deeply. You may be better asking a question on site

@JosephWright You have time for learning some Japanese.

@barbarabeeton you're american, you can't be expected to guess the pronunciation of english:-)

@egreg You should publish jointly.

Maybe offer a prize.

@FaheemMitha A joint paper on TUGboat would be funny: fighting already when deciding whose name goes first. ;-)

@egreg mine of course

@egreg You should go alphabetically.

Hence David, I suppose.

@FaheemMitha excellent choice

@FaheemMitha The senior author first, it's a sign of respect.

That's how the mathematicians do it, anyway. And you're both mathematicians.

@egreg as a sign of the respect offered, you could go last!

@egreg Is that what you tell your students? :-)

@egreg you could write in italian, left to right I could write in arabic right to left on the same lines, so who is first can be left to user preference.

@DavidCarlisle Do you know Arabic?

@DavidCarlisle Or English right to left. People wouldn't understand anyway.

How many questions a day does tex.sx average?

@FaheemMitha Roughly 80

@egreg -- i think if we try hard enough, we can find a way to emulate the font that don knuth and pierre mackay used in their "right-to-left" article in tugboat.

@JosephWright That's quite a lot.

@FaheemMitha stackexchange.com/sites#questionsperday

11th, which given that there are now 3 SO versions in the top ten (English, Russian, Portuguese) is pretty good

@PauloCereda ^^^ Is that down to you?

@Johannes_B I can't give you correct answers for (all of) those in Welsh because the code is not sensitive to mutations and the correct answers are sensitive to mutations. So when you use the names in, say, a caption, it should be fine because that'll always, presumably, be the first thing. But when they are used in references, I don't know what the grammatical context is or what the previous word is, so I don't know if it is the dictionary form or a mutated form which is needed.

@Johannes_B Not all of them will be subject to mutation, but some certainly will be affected.

By the way, does anybody know a way to prevent xelatex from spinning itself into infinity? It has a tendency to spin up the CPU when it hangs so I could never leave it to compile if I used this engine. (Well, presumably the OS would limit it eventually. Or the hardware would shut off to prevent heat damage, but I'd rather not have things get that far.) It doesn't respond to ctrl+C, either. You need a separate shell to kill it from.