Ask Ubuntu General Room

Fabby

9:01 PM

@Tim That's inappropriate leaving a comment like that... The guy has a problem, we need to help him...

@ByteCommander Good night!

@Tim :P

Tim

@Fabby 631KB/s atm :P

Fabby

I understand...

He might be in a big city and you in a rural area...

I know someone who has a fiber @1Gbps... So what?

Tim

yep. rural cambridge, no fibre... old copper cables. He probably also doesn't live in the UK...

Fabby

@Tim Thank you!

Yeah... And no incentive by BT to invest...

Nor Virgin...

@Tim What other providers do you have?

None with good speed? MCI? COLT?

Tim

BT, plusnet and virgin

that's it. Up to 38Mb (that means I'd get about 5)...

Darth_Vader

9:11 PM

evening

Nathan Osman

I used to have 100 Mbps at work - and wireless AC to boot :(

Fabby

They all use the same cables.

Tim

Oh virgin do 100 but that's 4x the cost

Fabby

MCI and COLT have their own fibre...

Ah, yes!

Tim

School has 20 upload and 50 download...

Fabby

9:12 PM

How much do you pay for 631?

I have 50mbps in my flat...

for about 10£/month

(in the centre of a big city)

Nathan Osman

That wouldn't even cover the cost of dial-up here!

Fabby

now I have:

Tim

We pay about £2 i think... cos we complained and threatened to leave etc

Fabby

26 Mbps download and 2.8 Mbps upload (at my mum's place: she uses that for facebook)

@NathanOsman Does that still exist or was that Irony?

(with a capital I) ;-)

Nathan Osman

It's pretty rare around these parts.

Virtually everyone has moved to broadband now.

Tim

9:16 PM

@Fabby we had dial up less than 6 years ago!

it cost 2x the amount of broadbad tho cos it was per computer so we changed...

Fabby

Dial-up like in a 56K modem???

yep, 56k

Yes.

wow...

AKA 7-8 KB/s if you were lucky.

Fabby

9:17 PM

I haven't hear the sound of a dial-up...

for... I dunno...

Tim

but our computer was so slow we didn;t realsie the internet was bad... at our old house we had to have dial up, and we just forgot to change...

Fabby

15 years?

Tim

so my age? :P

Fabby

:D

Apparently!

I've lived in Holland, France, Belgium and Russia...

Tim

Cambridgeshire all my life...

Nathan Osman

9:19 PM

Europe seems to have much better connectivity than we do here.

Fabby

Well, at your age I never left the Shire neither!

Tim

Waterbeach then east of cambridge...

Fabby

@NathanOsman But you're in Canadia, right?

Nathan Osman

Yes.

Don't get me wrong. There are companies offering 100 Mbps. It's just prohibitively expensive.

Fabby

I always thought you were more advanced then the US...

(Never been there though: just from the people I've met elsewhere)

Nathan Osman

9:20 PM

As in more than $150/m.

Fabby

ah. Business account like

Nathan Osman

@Fabby Then how come the US is getting Google Fi before we are?

Tim

The uk says we will have superfast by 2020... they also said we would be out of debt 4 years ago in 4 years so...

Fabby

:D

Nathan Osman

@Tim ...but nobody believed them, right?

Tim

9:21 PM

Well... it was an election promise...

Nathan Osman

There you go.

Fabby

To be honest: what drives the Internet speed locally?

Tim

:P

the copper cables running 3 miles across fields...

Fabby

Wrong!

Nathan Osman

@Fabby Depends what you mean by "local"? If it means my local network, then I'm doing fine - I've got a gigabit router with Wireless AC.

Fabby

9:22 PM

Humans bitterly complaining!

Locally as in MAN...

WAN...

what is Google Fi?

Google Fibre: 1Gbps

ahh

@Tim New wireless carrier in the US.

Tim

bt do "infinity" but...

Nathan Osman

9:23 PM

@Fabby No, not Google Fiber.

That's something else.

Fabby

Oh?

I misunderstood you then...

anyway: Pr0n is what sped up the Internet in Europe!

Tim

yeah :/

Nathan Osman

Fiber is Google's 1 Gbps Internet package like you stated but Fi is their new cellular venture.

Fabby

Countries with very large Pr0n users have fastest Internets!

@NathanOsman Ah!

Look at the global data next time...

Nathan Osman

fi.google.com

Fabby

9:25 PM

Cultures with very little or no shame have the best Internet speeds!

Everything everywhere always drills down to hookers&blow! ;-)

Nathan Osman

...and the largest debt and greatest number of problems.

Fabby

@NathanOsman Who specifically are you talking about?

Nathan Osman

Most European countries.

Fabby

Sweden? Norway? Netherlands? Belgium? France. Russia?

Nathan Osman

Sure.

Fabby

9:26 PM

:D

I'm not an economist, so I'll bow to your wisdom...

(too lazy to update my database with the latest data)

Nathan Osman

I'm not either (penguins don't typically excel at economics).

Fabby

I should one of these days...

@NathanOsman gif with a penguin waving a Canadian $ bill!

Yeah! ;-)

I'bve got a historical database with economic factors going back to 2000

But I haven'yt updated it yet...

Anyway, smoke!

BRB

terdon

@NathanOsman Do you know which country has the largest debt of them all?

Tim

@terdon jamacia?

Nathan Osman

Ima guess Greece?

(They're always asking for more money.)

@terdon Do you mean in Europe?

Tim

9:31 PM

cityam.com/209294/…

terdon

Huh. It is actually Greece, yes.

I had thought it was the US but that's only at number 11

stats.oecd.org/Index.aspx?DataSetCode=GOV_DEBT

Tim

hu

Darth_Vader

anyone mind telling me what tail -n1 | cut -d" " -f4 means?

Tim

anyway, gnight all

terdon

Ah, no, that's sorted as a percentage. I think the US has the highest in terms of absolute numbers. Not sure anymore though.

@Darth_Vader Print the 4th word of the last line.

tail -n 1 => print the last line

cut -d" " -f4 : print the 4th field, where fields are defined by spaces

Darth_Vader

9:35 PM

you know where I can go to learn more about it?

terdon

@Darth_Vader Which?

And yes, the US has the highest national debt in pure numbers.

Darth_Vader

both would be great... tail and cut, IVe seen some use it in their code and when I go to the man page not much on it

terdon

The man page has everything you need on those two. They're quite straightforward.

Other things have more details in the info pages (info command) but cut and tail shouldn't.

The -d sets the field delimiter and the -f the field you want printed.

$ echo "aa-bb-cc-dd" | cut -d"-" -f 2
bb

Darth_Vader

so basically after the -d" " is setting the separator in this case the -?

terdon

@Darth_Vader Yup

Darth_Vader

9:39 PM

ok I see where I was getting cofused

terdon

The empty quotes?

Darth_Vader

ya

terdon

Understandable. Space is a character though, just like any other.

Chan-Ho Suh

hence -d\ should work too (there is two spaces between '\' and 'should', the backslash is escaping the space character)

Darth_Vader

trying to pull info out from Imagemagick I saw people were using tail and cut

terdon

9:40 PM

@Chan-HoSuh Only if you leave an extra space: cut -d\ -f 2

Chan-Ho Suh

there is... can't you tell? :)

terdon

@Darth_Vader Yes, both are part of the coreutils package on Linux, the basic tools that all systems will have.

@Chan-HoSuh :)

Chan-Ho Suh

actually, I typed two, but it looks like something happened in chat... let me see

yep

Darth_Vader

I feel like I need more knowledge sometimes then

Chan-Ho Suh

entering in chat will reformat spacing

terdon

9:41 PM

@Chan-HoSuh Yes, you need backticks to make it render correctly.

@Darth_Vader Yeah, well, join the club :)

Darth_Vader

ha.. ok I dont feel so bad then, lol

terdon

The core utilities are really very powerful. Some of them are fiendishly complex. join, paste and sort, for example.

cut and tail are among the simplest.

Chan-Ho Suh

this is just... stuff. When you have to parse a bunch of delimited files, you will become master of 'cut' whether you like it or not

Darth_Vader

Im looking to become better Im trying to force myself into scripting day and night now

terdon

@Darth_Vader Well, for questions about that sort of thing, I suggest you ask on Unix & Linux. They're also on topic on Stack Overflow, here and Super User but the greatest concentration of experts is probably on U&L.

And I am, of course, completely impartial.

Darth_Vader

9:45 PM

I kinda get afraid of asking on unix because I find sometimes I get an answer but I spend hours trying to figure out what the answer means

4

I like asking on ubuntu because I still like using it and the community and forums are very good

terdon

@Darth_Vader Ah, yes. That does happen. Please don't hesitate to ask for clarification though, people tend to be quite good at complying with such requests.

Nathan Osman

Unix is a deep, dark, and mysterious beast.

Darth_Vader

@NathanOsman indeed

terdon

@Darth_Vader Fair enough, ask wherever you feel most comfortable. I just find that such questions fare better on U&L. Then again, I do tend to want that level of detail.

Chan-Ho Suh

Not trying to be Captain Obvious, but I usually google rather than query specific StackExchange sites, as that will usually get me the most relevant answers quickly

terdon

9:47 PM

No worries, Cap'n, we all do that :P

Darth_Vader

@Chan-HoSuh yes but when you dont know what to google for how does that help, lol

Chan-Ho Suh

@Darth_Vader strengthen your google-fu, grasshopper :)

actually, nowadays google seems very good at natural language queries

Darth_Vader

ahh... yes OB1

Chan-Ho Suh

sometimes I put in the exact question I want the answer to and it works

terdon

@Darth_Vader Tsk, mixing your TV-tropes there.

What was the name of Caradine's teacher on that show, anyway?

Fabby

9:50 PM

@terdon that's per gdp

last time I looked it was the US...

terdon

17 mins ago, by terdon

Ah, no, that's sorted as a percentage. I think the US has the highest in terms of absolute numbers. Not sure anymore though.

Chan-Ho Suh

re: your original question, what does "tail -n1 | cut -d" " -f4" mean? I guess you'd have to know the commands are tail and cut, with a pipe

terdon

14 mins ago, by terdon

And yes, the US has the highest national debt in pure numbers.

@Fabby Read the whole transcript befopre answering :P

Fabby

@terdon :/

Chan-Ho Suh

but if you google "tail -n1 | cut -d" " -f4" directly, you get a StackOverflow question that indicates the general pattern is "tail <something> | cut <something", at that point you can google "tail cut |" and find a guide on using this kind of combo

so I guess the google-fu tip here is, re-adjust your query based on your initial results

@Darth_Vader anyway, hope these comments are useful and not too obvious

Darth_Vader

9:55 PM

@Chan-HoSuh only thing I get is a super user question on it

terdon

@Chan-HoSuh don't forget that Google tailors your results based on your search history. YMMV

Darth_Vader

with a link only answer, lol: superuser.com/questions/273939/problem-using-cut-with-tail-f

Chan-Ho Suh

@terdon true

I was hoping you'd see this on your search results, @Darth_Vader, normalesup.org/~vorgogoz/BioInfoCourses/…

anyway, the next step would be to start a less restrictive search

so tail alone, | alone (but you'd realize shortly you should add "unix" or "linux" or something), etc

Darth_Vader

@Chan-HoSuh nah that didnt come up... but Im going to print it as a PDF and read it, lol

Chan-Ho Suh

I wonder how much of my search history is looking up unix commands

Fabby

10:06 PM

I need a few more close votes on "too broad"... Look at the comments to the answer of this question

hbdgaf

Most clever git commit message I've seen in a while "Fixed speeling error :)"

Fabby

@hbdgaf :D

Chan-Ho Suh

10:28 PM

It makes sense US has the most debt and not Greece. Not many going to Greece's door anymore asking to lend them money

hbdgaf

There's also a lot more real-estate and a lot more people to hold the debt, unless you've already determined there's more per-capita debt too.

You could say it's a function of how many people you have, their anticipated earnings, and room to expand whatever business it is you are in. So, in most of those areas, it would indicate the US should have more debt than Greece

Chan-Ho Suh

yeah, what he said :)

RPi Awesomeness

10:46 PM

@NathanOsman Do you have a good tutorial for using GitHub? 'cause I'm kinda confused...

Or anyone for that matter?

hbdgaf

if it's your first time ever rogerdudler.github.io/git-guide

RPi Awesomeness

Whoa. Okay then, time to edit that <title> element...mother would not be pleased with me :P

hbdgaf

Well, you wanted simple. Sometimes, simple is a little coarse.

Nathan Osman

@RPiAwesomeness Sure do.

Give me a minute to find it...

Chan-Ho Suh

huh Chrome bookmarks manager is all weird now

Nathan Osman

10:58 PM

@RPiAwesomeness So Nitin wrote a nice article that describes the process for forking a project, making some changes, and then submitting a pull request: github.com/2buntu/2buntu-blog/wiki/Contributing

It's for our blog, but would apply equally well to nearly any project.

Fabby

@NathanOsman Saved for later reading!

I know that I know nothing! ;-)

RPi Awesomeness

@hbdgaf lol, yeah. My mom tends to freak out about that sort of thing, understandably, but still.

@NathanOsman Oh, I'm not looking for a tutorial on how to pull/fork. I wanted a tutorial on the basics, like setting up your own & pushing your own changes.

Nathan Osman

Setting up your own project is easy.

github.com/new

^--- just fill that in

After you submit the form, it will give you detailed instructions on what to do next.

RPi Awesomeness

Yeah, I've got the repo already up, I'm just trying to figure out how to set it up so I can git push stuff to the repo

Nathan Osman

What's the URL of the repository?

And do you have a Git repository locally on disk?

RPi Awesomeness

11:06 PM

Also, the "create a working copy of a local repository by running the command" section of @hbdgaf's link mentions running git clone /path/to/repository. Do I run git clone https://github.com/Username/Repo?

@NathanOsman github.com/RPiAwesomeness/Keyboard-Mail-Desktop and no

Nathan Osman

In that case...

Simply run this command:

git clone github.com/RPiAwesomeness/Keyboard-Mail-Desktop.git

That will create and setup a directory named Keyboard-Mail-Desktop that will track the remote repository on GitHub.

Once it's done, you can make changes, commit, etc. and then push them to GitHub with:

git push

RPi Awesomeness

from within the directory?

Nathan Osman

It's that easy.™

@RPiAwesomeness Yes.

RPi Awesomeness

Awesome!

Nathan Osman

It will ask for your username & password for each push.

...but that's probably easier than setting up an SSH key.

RPi Awesomeness

11:09 PM

Yeah, I figured that much out. I was just having issues figuring out how to push changes.

Thank you :)

Nathan Osman

No problem.

RPi Awesomeness

Now, second question. My friend and I are going to work on this together. What happens if he makes a change, but I have another version that I make a different change to and we both push it. Do the changes merge? Or is there some form of conflict resolution that has to occur?

hbdgaf

git tries to just solve it, but for the love of god, don't use the web-ui

RPi Awesomeness

lol :D

Nathan Osman

Merging is best done locally, as @hbdgaf says.

However, I recommend something completely different.

GitHub is designed for the fork/change/pull-request workflow.

Rather than both working on the same repository, have your friend fork it and have him submit pull requests as new changes are committed.

hbdgaf

11:13 PM

^^ that. So even if you're working on it together, someone has to be the PR yep nope monster.

Nathan Osman

(That's where my article I linked to comes in... :P)

RPi Awesomeness

Ah.

git push doesn't seem to be doing anything...

Nathan Osman

Don't feel bad if this all sounds confusing. Git (and by extension GitHub) have a very steep learning curve. But once you master them - they are very powerful.

RPi Awesomeness

I ran git add file.py and then git push but nothing seems to be changing in the repo.

Nathan Osman

What is the output of git push?

RPi Awesomeness

11:15 PM

warning: push.default is unset; its implicit value has changed in
Git 2.0 from 'matching' to 'simple'. To squelch this message
and maintain the traditional behavior, use:

  git config --global push.default matching

To squelch this message and adopt the new behavior now, use:

  git config --global push.default simple

When push.default is set to 'matching', git will push local branches
to the remote branches that already exist with the same name.

Since Git 2.0, Git defaults to the more conservative 'simple'

Nathan Osman

You forgot to "git commit" :)

You can see what's changed / staged by doing "git status" - I use that command a lot.

You can also make that annoying warning disappear with:

git config --global push.default simple

Woo!

It worked.

Can I delete a file?

Yup. "git rm something.txt".

RPi Awesomeness

11:17 PM

Oh hah. There we go :P

Accidentally included something I shouldn't have :P

Nathan Osman

You can avoid that in the future with a ".gitignore" file.

RPi Awesomeness

What does that do? Ignore certain lines?

Nathan Osman

Just stick the filename in there prefixed with a / and it will never be accidentally added again.

For example:

/somefile.txt

RPi Awesomeness

Ah

Nathan Osman

...will keep Git from accidentally adding somefile.txt to the repository again.

RPi Awesomeness

11:19 PM

Awesome :D

Nathan Osman

It can do wildcards for extra awesome. Here's one - guess what it does:

*.py[oc]

RPi Awesomeness

So, anything in the git folder will be set to be uploaded when I run git commit?

Nathan Osman

@RPiAwesomeness No, only what is committed.

RPi Awesomeness

But everything in the folder will be set to be uploaded, but not actually uploaded.

Nathan Osman

There are three "areas" in Git - the working area (what you see on disk), the staging area (what you see when you run "git status"), and commits.

Files in the working area are ignored unless they are added.

Once they are added, they move into the staging area.

RPi Awesomeness

11:22 PM

Oh, duh. git add soandsofile.py

duh

Nathan Osman

Once you commit, they become a permanent part of the repository and only then are they uploaded.

Commits are (for all practical purposes) permanent.

RPi Awesomeness

Uhh....is there anyways I can totally remove a commit from the history?

Nathan Osman

Yes, but pretend there isn't.

99.99% of the time, it's the Wrong Thing to Do.™

RPi Awesomeness

Well, I'll do that, but I seriously do need to remove one entirely from public access.

I forgot to remove a friend's email :P

And other things that are worse to accidentally disclose

Nathan Osman

The best way (and after doing this, forget that I ever taught you :P) is to delete the GitHub repository, create it again, and push your local copy up after expunging the commit.

RPi Awesomeness

11:27 PM

Ouch. Will do

Nathan Osman

So to get rid of the commit...

...was it the most recent?

Oh, I see what happened now.

RPi Awesomeness

Yeah.....

Nathan Osman

You reverted it, so we'll have to get rid of the last two commits.

RPi Awesomeness

No, I did a git rm base.py after I realized my mistake and the did git push

Nathan Osman

Yeah, that's the proper way of "reverting".

But it's two commits we need to remove.

RPi Awesomeness

11:29 PM

Yup

Nathan Osman

Okay, let me put together a command for you.

RPi Awesomeness

Thanks :)

I just made the world's worst mistake when it comes to git :P

Nathan Osman

It happens.

RPi Awesomeness

So you saw what I accidentally left in?

Nathan Osman

Remember when I said not to do this in 99.99% of cases?

This is the 0.001%.

RPi Awesomeness

11:30 PM

Exactly

Nathan Osman

:)

RPi Awesomeness

Since I have the only python file locally, couldn't I just re-write the README.md file and commit it and just delete the git directory entirely?

Nathan Osman

Okay.

git reset --hard 01daf6e8063752eb33c35219a3b5b7b5853e79fb

^--- never ever use that command under any other circumstance :P

@RPiAwesomeness That... works... too.

RPi Awesomeness

Is there something wrong with doing that?

Nathan Osman

That's a hard reset. It destroys commits permanently. Everything else in Git can be undone. Except that.

And for this particular case, that's what we want.

RPi Awesomeness

11:33 PM

Yeah

Nathan Osman

After running that command, you can push the repository back up to GitHub.

The offending commits should be gone.

RPi Awesomeness

Yeah

Well, I deleted the repository entirely from the repo's page.

Awesome. It has been purged from the public eye.

>.< I can't believe I actually forgot to do that.

That could've been really bad had I not caught it D:

Nathan Osman

Lesson #194: never ever put credentials into a source file. Even "just for testing".

RPi Awesomeness

Yup

I have now learned that lesson well and truly.

Gosh I don't think I've had a heart-attack like that ever.

I thought I had got rid of it with that git rm base.py command...and then I went into the history and it was still there.

Nathan Osman

If it makes you feel better, this happens to everyone:

Apr 18 at 17:17, by jrg

well that password is being changed

That was posted after he accidentally pasted the password in chat :P

RPi Awesomeness

11:42 PM

xD Really? ouch

Well, if jrg does it, then I guess I feel a little better :)

Also o/ @Braiam Haven't seen you around in a while!

Thomas W.

what've i missed so far if anything?

Nathan Osman

GitHub lessons.

RPi Awesomeness

@ThomasW. Oh, nothing, just me posting my email & Gmail password to GitHub, and my friend's email, and me proceeding to have a heart attack.

Nathan Osman

@RPiAwesomeness For 2buntu, we have a separate Python file that contains the names/passwords for the database, etc. That file is specifically included in ".gitignore" so that nobody could accidentally commit it.

RPi Awesomeness

@NathanOsman That makes sense.

I should try that.

How does that work though? Do you import it as a module somehow?

Thomas W.

11:47 PM

@RPiAwesomeness heh

@RPiAwesomeness nuke the repository start again

Nathan Osman

...and then we supply a template that each user copies/pastes.

@ThomasW. Basically what we ended up doing.

RPi Awesomeness

Like def db(): return("Username: USERNAME Password: PASSWORD"?

@ThomasW. Already done :)

Thomas W.

@NathanOsman heh

Nathan Osman

Not exactly. Let me show you.

Thomas W.

@RPiAwesomeness indeed.

RPi Awesomeness

11:48 PM

@ThomasW. Heh nothing. I was scared!

Nathan Osman

So here's the template: github.com/2buntu/2buntu-blog/blob/master/twobuntu/…

Each user who checks out the repository copies that file and removes the ".default" from the filename.

Then they can fill it in and it won't accidentally be committed.

Thomas W.

@RPiAwesomeness I know, but now it's not an issue, so there.

Nathan Osman

As long as you learn from it, that's the important thing.

Thomas W.

indeed

RPi Awesomeness

github.com/RPiAwesomeness/Keyboard-Mail-Desktop

Yay! First real git push/repo and now it's security leak-free :P

@NathanOsman So, what you were saying is that my friend should fork the project, make his changes, then pull request the code with his changes?

Nathan Osman

11:57 PM

Yes.

RPi Awesomeness

Wait, git commit -am?

Why the a?

Nathan Osman

Where?

RPi Awesomeness

github.com/2buntu/2buntu-blog/wiki/…

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