TeX, LaTeX and Friends - 2013-01-30

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12:01 AM

@egreg maybe say that tighter spacing is given by sth like 1em plus 0.05fil ?

@tohecz Let's wait for the OP. :)

@egreg well, right. He could have known what MWE is for...

Oh my, some people are really in an edit/retag frenzy

12:17 AM

@NicolaTalbot I read it just now. Did the bug reporter(s) say something about the length of the file name? No problems here with a file path C:\Temporaer\Téte.

8 hours later…

8:37 AM

@Rico I must've been tired last night. I missed seeing your message. If that's my site you're referring to you can go ahead. My LaTeX tutorials are all FDL.

@Speravir The problem path was C:\Users\Cécile\Documents` and xindy complained *** - LOAD: A file with name C:\Users\CCILE~1\AppData\Local\Temp\NTlhTzJ0ob does not exist`.

9:00 AM

Anyone with unicode knowledge able to help with this one:

0

Q: How to put kana with CJK in the name of a "polyglotic" glossary entry?

After discovered how to mix glossary and acronym system (See here), and how to put kana/kanji working with pdfLaTeX (See here), I was trying to mix the both, in order to create kind of dictonnary, with the name of the object, in romanji (with our alphabet), in kana/kanji in parenthesis, and then,...

pdftex glossaries acronyms cjk

I've trimmed down the OP's example to:

\documentclass[12pt,a4paper,oneside]{book}

\usepackage[utf8]{inputenc}
\usepackage[T1]{fontenc}
\usepackage{CJKutf8,pinyin}
\usepackage[colorlinks]{hyperref}
\usepackage[acronym]{glossaries}
\makeglossaries

\DeclareRobustCommand{\kana}[1]{\begin{CJK*}{UTF8}{gbsn}#1\end{CJK*}}
\DeclareRobustCommand{\kanji}[1]{\begin{CJK*}{UTF8}{bkai}#1\end{CJK*}}

\newglossaryentry{Test}{name={Obon (\kana{お}\kanji{盆})},
  description={This is ...}}

\begin{document}
\gls{Test}

\printglossary
\end{document}

It's causing an inputenc error

! Package inputenc Error: Unicode char \u8:お not set up for use with LaTeX.

9:43 AM

@NicolaTalbot probably \DeclareUnicodeCharacter{304A}{something}

@NicolaTalbot not sure you can have cjk's utf8 handling and inputencs in the same document, both are trying to make 8bit characters active and expand to some unicode related definition.

@brunolefloch On your point about building a format, what I'm trying to get at is that where \tex_dump:d fits into the overall scheme is not clear. Should absolutely everything be in the dump (for speed), or should some parts of L3 always be loaded dynamically (so basically as always-loaded packages).

@DavidCarlisle Perhaps you have a view on this (see tex.stackexchange.com/questions/95635/…)

10:41 AM

@JosephWright not sure I understood, what's the problem with including a font in the format? you can preload before dump can't you?

11:10 AM

@DavidCarlisle Yes. The point is @Bruno is interested in using the font data structures purely for array storage (an 'abuse')

12:03 PM

Meow.

!!/choose Meow, Woof

@topskip Oh my, let me enable the bot.

(Oh, Mr. Psmith is still sleeping)

!!/choose meow, wook

@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great oracle says: wook

oh no, wook! :P

I'm stoopid today.

12:45 PM

@JosephWright @Bruno I remember some discussion on c.t.t back then about it, seems OK, actually I think someone (JF perhaps) was suggesting going further and implementing state machines for specific tasks by coding up tfms with bizarre fake ligature tables that would implement specific operations quicker and more efficiently than coding it in macros

@JosephWright @Bruno tug.org/TUGboat/tb14-3/tb40fine.pdf

Brent.Longborough

johnaugust.com/2013/introducing-courier-prime

Anyone taken a look at this? It's a new Courier called 'Courier Prime'.

@Brent.Longborough with bold and italic, interesting

@Brent.Longborough License?

Ah, SIL Open Font

Brent.Longborough

@DavidCarlisle Yes. The glyph set is (only just) reasonable - ~370 glyphs, no small caps

@JosephWright Yes, you beat me to it

1:00 PM

@Brent.Longborough Yes, only Latin.

Brent.Longborough

@egreg Yes. I can understand that -- each glyph you add is an enormous amount of added work, I suspect.

@Brent.Longborough Here's a comparison; first is TeX Gyre Cursor, then my system Courier, then Courier Prime

user image

Brent.Longborough

@egreg Hmm, yes. At first sight, (IMO) the colour is a bit better than T.G.Cursor, but I need to do a kantlipsum to compare better. I'll be back

1:16 PM

@Brent.Longborough: i.stack.imgur.com/540a2.png :)

Brent.Longborough

@PauloCereda Brilliant (Metido! LOL)

@Brent.Longborough LOL - I still prefer the Turkish translation, as it has more wacky chars. <3

Brent.Longborough

@PauloCereda But Turkish only looks wacky because it's close enough to 'non-alien', whereas Greek is totally alien...

@Brent.Longborough ooh we need a Greek translation!

Brent.Longborough

@PauloCereda Uê? Wasn't that a Greek translation? Surely you didn't lipsum in Greek?

1:24 PM

@Brent.Longborough That was Russian. :)

Brent.Longborough

@PauloCereda Oh, god yes. Do we have a Russian translation?

Of course, Russian looks totally alien, too

@Brent.Longborough Yes, a contributor sent me the translation file. :)

arara is growing up.

Brent.Longborough

@PauloCereda Brilliant

@Brent.Longborough And I'm working in the manual.

Brent.Longborough

@PauloCereda arara is now a "Polly glot"

4

1:26 PM

@Brent.Longborough Brilliant! :)

@PauloCereda great!

@topskip <3

1:58 PM

For the chemically reactive people, what might be that A+, A- in the following picture?

user image

It's supposed to be the swinging arm model of how muscle contract

I'm working on robots so ... yeah... I need to learn these. Why me?

Ah nevermind I've found it by searching the other names in the caption.

Brent.Longborough

@egreg OK, in terms of colour, in increasing order of darkness: T.G. Cursor; Courier Std; Source Code Pro; Courier Prime; Inconsolata; (Consolas/Lucida Console tie for darkest). I think I'm going to stick with Source Code Pro

Wow. Live stream from my muscles

user image

@Brent.Longborough I like it, too.

Brent.Longborough

@egreg Yes. Lucida Console may be interesting for some applications, as it's sans-serif and looks very clean on the page. After all, no-one is going to read solid fixed-space text for very long {:-p

2:19 PM

Augh! I can't be in here until that thing goes away. Its driving me crazy! =(

Brent.Longborough

@LordStryker Me too. Here's another message to send it upwards...

Another message to expel @percuße 's brain-rotting memegif upwards

If I had muscles like @percuße, I'd probably shoot myself

@Brent: What does the -c flag mean for latexmk? :)

@Brent.Longborough Isn't it lovely?

:-)

Wow, this is so cool.

user image

3

Aaaargh

@Brent.Longborough Actually you have :)

Brent.Longborough

2:22 PM

@PauloCereda Cleanup - it removes a bunch of intermediate files

@Brent.Longborough ah thanks.

Brent.Longborough

@percuße I want a button to flag as 'duplicate GIF'

user image

@PauloCereda One of the options that shouldn't be given generally. :) For instance it removes also a .bbl file.

@egreg I'm only writing the documentation for the rule. Ask Brent, he's the author of the rule. :P

Brent.Longborough

2:24 PM

@PauloCereda I've starred the original so's people look at it and have their brains pwned. This is called percußerolling

@Brent.Longborough OK let me clear the screen

===================++====+++=========+==++++++++++=++===========================
===================++===+==+==========~~===+++++=+===+=+========================
===============+===++==+++++=+===~~~===~==+???+++==++++=========================
====================+=++++=+++~~~~~~=====++??I77II+++++=+=======~~~~~==~~=======
==============+==++++==+?II?~~~~~~~~~~===++??I$$777?++=========~~~~~~~~~~=======
===============?++==+=+II?~~~~~~:~~+=====++??7I777777I++=====~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
==============+?=+=+??II?~~~::~~~~~====++++??II77$7$$$$I+=+===~~~~~~~~:::~~~~~~~

:)

Brent.Longborough

You all need to read this story:

The Riddle of the Universe and Its Solution

The Riddle of the Universe and Its Solution is a short story written by Christopher Cherniak appearing in the 1981 book The Mind's I. It describes a research project in computer science which includes content that produces catatonia in anyone who views it. The material is harmful only if comprehended by its victim—in some cases there is an incubation period before an exposed subject reaches the fatal conclusion. Often, the last thing said by such individuals before slipping irrevocably into a coma is "Aha!" Only after the lethal files tragically affect a team which fetches them remot...

I'm safe :)

Brent.Longborough

Aha!

user image

Look, it's coming back now!

user image

@Brent: just a quick help: differences between -c and -C? :)

2:33 PM

@Brent.Longborough Source code pro is awesome, in my opinion would be the best monospaced font if it had italics. Development is still ongoing, so italics may be added at some point :)

Brent.Longborough

@PauloCereda -C = -c + (.dvi, .ps, .pdf), I think. For all the gory details, the manual is called latexmk.man1.pdf

@Brent.Longborough Ah thanks.

Brent.Longborough

@Silex Yes. Currently, the stuff I do uses an absolute minimum of fixed-space text

3:28 PM

@PauloCereda What colour's guaraná ice cream? I have a vague recollection that it's a pale colour, but my memory may be playing tricks on me.

@NicolaTalbot It depends. :) It's usually pale, but there might be other preparations that make it darker. :)

@PauloCereda Thanks :-) My friend who does the illustrations wanted to know what colour to use. Also, is an arara just a macaw or is one a subset of the other?

@NicolaTalbot ooh can I suggest a lovely model? :)

Link: github.com/cereda/arara/blob/master/docs/figures/arara.png

It's in the arara manual now. :)

@NicolaTalbot I think it's the same species. :)

@PauloCereda Oh that's great. That's the colour scheme she went with. Now we just need to think of an animal that would look cute selling ice cream on the beach :-)

@PauloCereda Thanks :-)

@NicolaTalbot a frog with a cap? :)

3:39 PM

@PauloCereda And an apron :-) But a frog might be a bit on the small size. But then again, the other animals aren't really in the correct proportions to each other any way.

The software update thingy tells me I need to restart the computer. Back in a bit.

Back again :-)

@NicolaTalbot Yay! :)

Have you seen this:

LOL

3:54 PM

@DavidCarlisle It seems CJKutf8 automatically loads inputenc. I still get an inputenc error when I remove \usepackage[utf8]{inputenc}. I'm sure it's an expansion issue, but I don't know how to advise the OP on getting around it other than to do a kludge:

\documentclass[12pt,a4paper,oneside]{book}

\usepackage[T1]{fontenc}
\usepackage{CJKutf8,pinyin}
\usepackage[colorlinks]{hyperref}
\usepackage[acronym]{glossaries}
\makeglossaries

\DeclareRobustCommand{\kana}[1]{\begin{CJK*}{UTF8}{gbsn}#1\end{CJK*}}
\DeclareRobustCommand{\kanji}[1]{\begin{CJK*}{UTF8}{bkai}#1\end{CJK*}}

\DeclareRobustCommand{\testname}{Obon (\kana{お}\kanji{盆})}

\newglossaryentry{Test}{name={\testname},
  description={This is ...}}

\begin{document}
\gls{Test}

\printglossary
\end{document}

user image

@NicolaTalbot \newglossaryentry{Test}{name={\unexpanded{Obon (\kana{お}\kanji{盆})}},description={This is ...}}

@NicolaTalbot I saved the above text ran pdflatex makeglossaries pdflatex pdflatex and got no error, what did you expect to happen?

@DavidCarlisle I expected that bit of code to work, but it's an ugly hack. It's okay for just one entry, but not for lots of entries. @egreg's solution is neater. Thanks.

@egreg That's great, thanks. Do you want to post the answer?

@NicolaTalbot oh I didn't look at the code I just ran it expecting an errror:-)

4:07 PM

@NicolaTalbot What's the question?

@egreg This one:

0

Q: How to put kana with CJK in the name of a "polyglotic" glossary entry?

After discovered how to mix glossary and acronym system (See here), and how to put kana/kanji working with pdfLaTeX (See here), I was trying to mix the both, in order to create kind of dictonnary, with the name of the object, in romanji (with our alphabet), in kana/kanji in parenthesis, and then,...

pdftex glossaries acronyms cjk

@lockstep That glossaries question is a duplicate. Same cause and solution.

1

Q: Getting rid of Glossary text in glossary in memoir style (Bug?)

I would like to get rid of the glossary in the first line after header. How can I do that? lualatex and makeglossaries is used. MWE: \begin{filecontents}{main-acro.tex} \newacronym{pdms}{PDMS}{Poly-dimethyl-siloxane} \newacronym{dc}{DC}{Direct current} \newacronym{ac}{AC}{Alternative current}...

memoir glossaries

@egreg Using \newrobustcmd doesn't get rid of the error. (I used \DeclareRobustCommand in my mwe and it still threw an error.) It only works with \expandonce in the name value.

\documentclass[12pt,a4paper,oneside]{book}

\usepackage[T1]{fontenc}
\usepackage{CJKutf8,pinyin}
\usepackage[colorlinks]{hyperref}
\usepackage[acronym]{glossaries}
\usepackage{etoolbox}
\makeglossaries

\newrobustcmd{\kana}[1]{\begin{CJK*}{UTF8}{gbsn}#1\end{CJK*}}
\newrobustcmd{\kanji}[1]{\begin{CJK*}{UTF8}{bkai}#1\end{CJK*}}

\newglossaryentry{Test}{name={\expandonce{Obon (\kana{お}\kanji{盆})}},
  description={This is ...}}

\begin{document}
\gls{Test}

\printglossary
\end{document}

tex-tipografia.com/babel_news.html

3

@NicolaTalbot Yes, I noticed. Will change.

@PauloCereda :-)

@egreg Thanks.

@PauloCereda Javier seems to be active on the job!

4:29 PM

@PauloCereda Oh, how about a giant river otter? They look quite cute.

@NicolaTalbot ooh great idea! :)

@PauloCereda I have a Portuguese friend who's going to translate the story. So there's going to be a Portuguese version as well as the original English one.

@NicolaTalbot Really? That's awesome!

Heresy alert!

0

Q: Equations that go up

I was working on a file and inserting equations normally on a word doument, suddenly the equations started to go up, so not all the elements can be seen. What should I do? Thank you

@egreg Yes, I'd seen that

Brent.Longborough

4:56 PM

@egreg "The power of Knuth compels you!"

4

@Brent.Longborough That's clearly the dark side of the force.

Brent.Longborough

@egreg :)

@egreg Mind you, even if he'd said 'on a LaTeX document', the question is still a bit incomprehensible.

Thank god that horrendous headache is gone.

!!/eightball Was that gif annoying?

@LordStryker Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: how about reading source2e?

Brent.Longborough

@LordStryker The memes, the memes!

5:03 PM

@Brent.Longborough I just added those links to my adblock list. :D All good now!

Brent.Longborough

@LordStryker Too late, there's no such thing as 'unsee'

5:14 PM

hi there =)

@JosephWright would you have 5 minutes spare for me please?

@tohecz Fire away

@JosephWright is your mail available somewhere?

@tohecz joseph.wright@morningstar2.co.uk

thx

5:24 PM

Isn't that a British pub? :)

@PauloCereda What?

@JosephWright Morning Star? :)

@JosephWright Morning Star? btw, mail sent

@PauloCereda Yes: my parent's house used to be a pub called the Morning Star (also the Drum and Monkey). It was de-licensed by the 1950s, but the name remains. WE are number 2 in the street, hence the e-mail address.

@JosephWright Wow! That's epic. :)

5:29 PM

@tohecz I'll read it properly a little later and get back

ok, thx million times

@JosephWright a pub? That's a shame I thought it referred to communist tendencies:-)

@DavidCarlisle My dad is quite active in the Labour party :-)

@DavidCarlisle Can we have a party?

!!/eightball is the Labour party the kind of party @PauloCereda wants?

5:38 PM

@DavidCarlisle Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: very doubtful.

@PauloCereda has a party hat! o-<|:)\-<

Get get get get get on up! And DANCE!
o-<|:)\--<
         o-<|:)|--<
                  o-<|:)/--<

@DavidCarlisle It seems that Psmith actually knows something.

!!/cricket

Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode: Let's take a look at the last cricket results:

- South Africa Under-19s 163/9 &  194/9 * v England Under-19s 313/10 &  151/10
- Mashonaland Eagles 247/9 * v Matabeleland Tuskers 268/10
- Mid West Rhinos 183/10  v Mountaineers 252/10 &  161/7 *
- Odisha XI 155/6 * v Pakistan Women 154/10
- Kandurata-Uva Combined 215/9 * v Wayamba 348/4

Our cricket expert David might explain these results later on.

@PauloCereda After the last matches, I decided to be more interested in cricket. ;-)

@egreg people shouldn't load breqn and anything else and then expect things not to break:-)

6

5:49 PM

@DavidCarlisle People shouldn't load breqn at all. ;-) Let alone nath!

@egreg agreed

@DavidCarlisle Maybe \newcommand\xce[1]{\begingroup\let\mathchoice\xxmathchoice\ce{#1}\endgroup}?

@egreg something like that but not sure if it needs to be robust or how many other top level commands the chem package defines and It's home time:-)

@DavidCarlisle Also for me. The bus won't wait.

bye, gentlemen

6:03 PM

@egreg Hernanes would be a great addition to Juve. :)

@NicolaTalbot Ah xindy, I forgot … No problem either here in a short path with accents. I made it even worth with C:\Temporaer\Têté. But in a long path there’s really a problem. I’ve made it as bad as I could with my German keyboard mapping, so the mesage in the log file was:

*** - PARSE-NAMESTRING: syntax error in filename
      "C:\\Temporaer\\dírêctöry-wìth-ä-véry-löng-nämè\\" at position 14

What is position 14? In makeglossaries or in the log or where? The error you showed in your message used OTOH the short Windows names. SO I don’t know, if this really related.

@NicolaTalbot And no problem with this long path and makeindex – or actually without package option xindy.

6:45 PM

Ehm, if I may bother the native English speakers for a moment; how do I use a phrase like if we allow ourselves to be subjective ? I have the closing remarks of a chapter in my thesis and I talk about this works like this and this works like that. And I have two algorithms where no conclusion can be drawn about which one is the best practically.

So I want to say I prefer one over the other due to such and such subjective properties

7:08 PM

Don't make me paste that animated .gif again!! :P

@percuße Oh my, I thought of pasting it!

@PauloCereda We will be banned soon :)

@percuße Worth it. :)

user image

@percuße: Run, sir, run!

Old movie FTW

guacamole!

sepia muscle fiber FTW

LOL

7:13 PM

This is why I love adblock :)

@LordStryker You can also ignore us from our avatar menu

:)

but life would be so dull

@percuße Why would I want to do that??

@LordStryker Just in case. It seems that I have to follow @PauloCereda until we get banned :)

!!/eightball Am I going to get banned?? :(

@LordStryker Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: reply hazy, try again.

7:16 PM

:(

!!/eightball to the corner pocket

@percuße Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: signs point to yes.

user image

hahahaha

I'm pretty sure that biology course had never this much of internet traffic in its history

user image

amoeba style!

In case anybody wonders those cones are Mg++ and small yellow balls are Ca++

The middle twisted part is titin filament

and the other golf club is myosin

now you are smarter

7:36 PM

@DavidCarlisle: I'm half way done with the arara manual. Will you use arara when it finally reaches CTAN/TL? :)

@PauloCereda next time I need to use tex...

@DavidCarlisle ooh it doesn't happen to often, does it? :)

@PauloCereda not counting mwe's on this site? Once a decade or so...

@DavidCarlisle :)

1 hour later…

8:55 PM

@PauloCereda this does not look lika a amoeba :D

9:06 PM

@percuße Don't ask a native english speaker about English Grammar:-) I think " if we allow ourselves to be subjective" is sort of correct but sounds very pompous, It's conventional to use the plural in papers, but to avoid sounding like the Queen I always avoided referring to myself as much as possible:-) Can't you just say The analysis of these algorithms is necessarily subjective but....blah blah blah...

Did anyone in SE network know that we exist? I wonder if it was the internal company party time when they've selected the fonts

@DavidCarlisle Indeed I also felt like I'm being ridiculous :) so went back to something with chopped up shorter sentences.

@percuße Huh?

@JosephWright Check out the Drupal.SE for the fonts

9:43 PM

@DavidCarlisle: Am going to resist using the new syntax for subscripts, but just wanted to let you know that pfdlatex seems to hand with a superscript: $a_11^22

@PeterGrill ending the subscript with a ^ wasn't in the spec I was provided, so that's user error:-)

@DavidCarlisle :-) The OP did mention it under More things. Seemed really promising until you mentioned that it might break other tools -- that is why I am going to resist...

@PeterGrill We could try for a syntax where the subscript ends at a random place.

@PeterGrill you just need to add \ifx\tmp^\let\next\egroup\fi but it could go on all night with having to add more and more stuff to support a hopeless syntax

@egreg :-) Hey, I guess David is actually useful for something. It seems his sense of humor is rubbing off on others. :-)

9:48 PM

@DavidCarlisle Quite

@DavidCarlisle Yep...

@PeterGrill I only answered at all as it looked like easy points and I have been ahead for the week but @egreg scraped together 320 somehow or other and got ahead again...

@PeterGrill I wouldn't try that code with \[a_11\]

@egreg That's silly we all know everyone uses $$ not \[\] (\end{align} would be interesting as well)

@egreg Well, the OP did spec that a space was required and \[a_11 \] does work.

9:51 PM

@PeterGrill What about

@DavidCarlisle Seriously, does anyone actually use \( notation? I tried but really hard when you know a single character works.

\[
a_11
\]

@egreg also works..

@DavidCarlisle You still have a 500 bounty pending.

@PeterGrill yes but then he said \frac{1}{a+b} where the`}` isn't even an end of group it's a macro delimiter so what you see depends on how \frac is defined.

9:53 PM

@DavidCarlisle Oh how I miss the gold 'ol days when I was almost able to keep up..

@egreg well deserved:-)

@DavidCarlisle I don't have Matlab, so I couldn't even start.

@PeterGrill I used it in an answer this week (for the matlab question)

@egreg one of mine: nag.co.uk/numeric/MB/manual_23_1/pdf/index.html

@DavidCarlisle And I didn't get 320 "somehow", but giving brilliant answers. :)

@PeterGrill I do :-)

9:55 PM

@egreg That's what I said (You probably mis-translated from the english if you thought otherwise)

@JosephWright Ok, I guess it is possible then to actually use \( \). :-) Will have to try again then.

Mariano Suárez-Alvarez

is there a way to have tex be typeset in a question, as we can in Math.SE?

@MarianoSuárez-Alvarez You mean on the main site? 'No': we prefer to see the output from real TeX, so you'll need to upload an image

Mariano Suárez-Alvarez

I feared so

13

Q: Why doesn't maths render as maths?

On some other SE sites, code in between dollar signs gets rendered as mathematics (using MathJaX, I believe). This doesn't seem to work here? Why not? And how do I get round it?

10:01 PM

@DavidCarlisle Nice... Surpsised the the code does not have any formatting applied. Also the comma following the first display mode equation in c02ag.pdf really looks bizarre in Acrobat.

Hey there should be a badge for having an accepted answer where all the other answers outscore you by some amount...

6

A: Regularized Product Symbol

Here is one way to do it: \documentclass{article} \usepackage{amsmath} \usepackage{graphicx} \usepackage{mathtools} \DeclareMathOperator{\MyProd}{\scalebox{1.4}{$\mathrm{I\kern-0.2ex I}$}} \begin{document} $\prod $ \quad\verb|\prod| $\MyProd$ \quad\verb|\MyProd| \end{document}

@MarianoSuárez-Alvarez As you'll see, this is a deliberate decision, and makes sense in the context of a TeX site

Mariano Suárez-Alvarez

a local switch might make maximal sense, though :-)

@MarianoSuárez-Alvarez Not really: MathJax (the technology used on for example the maths site) is not TeX, so things like kerning, etc., would always be questionable

Is it possible to load a medium-weight font with fontspec?
MediumFont = ... is unknown and I can't find any reference in the manual

Mariano Suárez-Alvarez

@JosephWright, with that understanding, of course. I am almost sure your screen renders colors with minor divergences from perfect calibration, as pretty much everyone's, but we do not disable color for fear of imperfection! :D

10:08 PM

@MarianoSuárez-Alvarez Well, if I was looking at an image site I'd expect people to upload images with colour profiles ....

@MarianoSuárez-Alvarez The key point is that we don't talk about maths except 'in passing', but we do talk about TeX code a lot

Mariano Suárez-Alvarez

I know

but avoinding the minor annoyance of having to upload an image from time to time is one of those things we invented computers for!

@MarianoSuárez-Alvarez Something like QuickLaTeX would be more in keeping with our needs, but you still have the issue of package versions, etc.

@PeterGrill The one where Gonzalo and I concentrated on the symbol the OP didn't want! :) And, of course, chose the worst implementation. :P

@egreg Well since the side David Carlisle recommends not to read documentation, I don't actually read the entire question anymore (as many of my answers have shown). I saw "large like $\prod$" and answered that... :-)

@PeterGrill personally I think sentence punctuation always looks wrong in display math, but I don't have absolute power (and the document base is quite old, that's a mark 13 function so before I joined the company (15 years ago)

10:21 PM

@DavidCarlisle Yeah I have noticed that too since I started added punctuation to my display math. So have been tweaking cases where a period or comma follows a fraction. There was a question on this site about it.

@PeterGrill yes but the documentation is around 2000 documents and 150000 math expressions typeset in pdf and in mathml/html in fortran C and matlab flavours, so we try to keep manual tweaking to a minimum:-)

@DavidCarlisle I know a site where you could post a question that might provide an automated solution. :-). Since I am doing all mine manually I just add it as I go... Only 655 so far...

10:38 PM

Evening!

@tohecz Ciao!

@egreg cross your fingers for me. My university has finally registered me and I'm just writing to the government institution, humbly asking them to give me my scholarship

@tohecz Crossed

@egreg thanks!

@tohecz Now you're at least officially allowed to enter the building? ;-)

10:51 PM

@egreg yes ;) but I've got no lunch card because my scolarship is not "University Paris Diderot"

@tohecz Pomme de pain. :)

@egreg juste a cote de notre nouveau batiment ;)

@tohecz You're missing a ton of accents. :)

@egreg At least the vowels are there. :)

@egreg I'm lazy you know ;) We do that actually quite a lot in Czech, you know, it's still a problem sometimes to enter řebříček, naň etc.

Mariano Suárez-Alvarez

10:55 PM

@DavidCarlisle, thanks!

@PauloCereda žyst a koté d notr nuvó batimán

@tohecz Batman? :)

@PauloCereda betmen

@MarianoSuárez-Alvarez :-)

Mariano Suárez-Alvarez

one could retypeset spivak's book with that, a nice typewritter font and an ugly handwritten font for the greek letters :-)

10:58 PM

@tohecz "cote" is a very dangerous word: it can be "cote", "coté", "côte", and perhaps also "côté".

@egreg you know how many such we have in Czech? That are the same without accents ;)

Can I start a competition on the site? I have a simple logo that I would like to draw (basically in plain TeX plus plain LaTeX with no picture or tikz, possibly using only \color and \rule from LaTeX). I'd offer a bounty for this logo drawn with the shortest code (and not in xii style)

@tohecz We have some that differ for the tonic accent, which is not written. So "principi" can be "principles" (second syllable is tonic) or "princes" (first syllable tonic); "ancora" can be "anchor" (first syllable tonic) or "yet, still" (second syllable tonic). We have also "pesca" that can be "fishing" if the "e" is open or "peach" if the "e" is closed.

my favourite one is when you say that a girl is "zadaná" (engaged) vs. "žádaná" (wanted, popular)

@tohecz I object! What's wrong with my style?

@DavidCarlisle it is bad to be put inside a LaTeX package

11:05 PM

@tohecz It's simpler in English you just drop all accents and make up the pronunciation as you go along,

@tohecz Or "botte" is "barrel" if the "o" is closed and "blows" if the "o" is open.

@tohecz yes package code should follow the readable style of latex.ltx

\long \def \@yargd@f#1#2{%
  \def \reserved@a ##1#1##2##{%
    \expandafter\def\expandafter#2\reserved@b ##1#1%
    }%
  \l@ngrel@x \reserved@a 0##1##2##3##4##5##6##7##8##9###1%
}

@DavidCarlisle I recognize bits of xii.tex in that

@egreg No but you recognise what bit it is (and who wrote it:-)

@egreg I recognize only the @David typing theorem: Let's type David TeX code. Sooner or LaTeR, he'll type the whole LaTeX ;)

11:11 PM

!!/eightball Did @David write that code excerpt?

@PauloCereda Psmith, the TeX bot: The great 8-ball says: yes, definitely.

is there a version of \oalign that puts the boxes just atop each other? Like that \oalign{\rule{2ex}{1ex}\cr\rule{2ex}{1ex}} produces just a square?

!!/texdef oalign

Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode: Here's the output from texdef:

\oalign:
macro:#1->\leavevmode \vtop {\baselineskip \z@skip \lineskip .25ex\ialign {##\crcr #1\crcr }}

@tohecz Change the \vtop to \vbox so that the result will sit on the baseline of the bottom box.

@egreg ok, and \lineskip\z@skip

@tohecz Yes, too.

11:18 PM

and c'est ca

!!/texdef -t latex -p xcolor colorrgb

@tohecz Maybe \offinterlineskip is the best

Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode: Here's the output from texdef:

\rgbcolor:
undefined

Psmith, the TeX bot, in fixed font mode: Here's the output from texdef:

\colorrgb:
undefined

damn, can I input color directly by RGB coordinates?

@tohecz \color[RGB]{20,25,44}

@tohecz \color egreg got there

11:20 PM

@DavidCarlisle lol

thanks

@tohecz Two examples of that macro: tex.stackexchange.com/a/75229/4427 and tex.stackexchange.com/a/75229/4427

fakehacek ... nice language hybrid :P

@tohecz I didn't name the macro \fakeháček although with XeTeX one is allowed to. What would "fake" be?

@egreg falešný (having same roots as English "false" and of course coming from Latin, as you surely recognize)

11:35 PM

\falešnýháček? Next time.

@tohecz Possibly through the German "falsch"

@egreg of course. We use faleš for site rotation of cue ball in pot games

@tohecz "effetto" in Italian

A word with two double consonants: you surely can't pronounce it. :)

@egreg we can pronounce it, we just usually don't write it and when we write it, we do not pronounce both of them ;)

(with couple exceptions like trojjediný)

@tohecz There's "šš" in some words, IIRC. But they are pronounced separately.

there's "šs" quite often, but I cannot think out now any with "šš"

11:44 PM

@tohecz Well, "šs" would give hard times to Italians.

\documentclass{article}

\usepackage{xcolor}

\pagestyle{empty}

\begin{document}


\newlength{\liafalength}

\def\liafalogo{\begingroup\liafalength0.05ex
\def\X##1{\leavevmode\vbox{\baselineskip0pt\lineskip0pt\ialign {####\crcr##1\crcr}}}%
\def\C##1##2##3{{\color[RGB]{##1}\rule{##2\liafalength}{##3\liafalength}}}%
\def\R##1##2{{\color{black}\rule{##1\liafalength}{##2\liafalength}}}%
\X{\R{65}{1}\cr\R{1}{31}\C{23,121,255}{31}{31}\R{1}{31}\C{34,0,190}{31}{31}\R{1}{31}\cr\R{65}{1}\cr\R{1}{31}\C{67,181,255}{31}{31}\R{1}{31}\X{\C{140,188,255}{15}{15}\R{1}{15}\C{141,141,255}{15}{15}\cr\R{31}{1}\…

@tohecz Nice

@egreg and somehow "clear" :)

just FYI, orginal: liafa.jussieu.fr/~steiner/GroLogoLiafa.gif

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