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12:12 AM
@egreg www.benicetodavid.co.uk
:)
 
12:28 AM
Mac people: do you guys use Keka?
 
12:38 AM
@PauloCereda every time I need zip on the mac, that's what I use.
 
 
4 hours later…
4:43 AM
Have any one seen Dimension too large error when using breqn package? I keep getting these error due to large \begin{dmath}....\end{dmath}
! Dimension too large.
<recently read> \calc@B
l.393 \end{dmath*}
?
I posted a question on this tex.stackexchange.com/questions/219037/… but no answers. Thought to check here is someone seen it. may be there is a way to increase some configuration parameter or such to help with this.
 
 
2 hours later…
6:23 AM
hello...
i need to append code to my report appendix...
but its getting out of the page...
how can i apply a margin in right side...
 
 
1 hour later…
7:35 AM
@quidstone Please have a look at a short discussion from last night -> chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/19407827#19407827
With the information provided, it is nearly impossible to give good advice.
@ChristianHupfer 3 exact same private messages saying »I cannot figure out how to upload a blg file«.
 
 
1 hour later…
8:46 AM
@DavidCarlisle :)
 
8:58 AM
@DavidCarlisle From c.t.t., what do you make of unicode.org/notes/tn28/UTN28-PlainTextMath.pdf as the 'MathML' (etc.) person here? I worry, as one often does, that a simple syntax of 'obvious' cases might run into issues with more complex situations. (I'm not even sure how they end up handling \sin(x) or similar.)
I'm sure @egreg will have a view too :-)
 
9:11 AM
@Nasser no that means you really exceeded \maxdimen somewhere (5.7 metres) which is a hard limit in tex not configurable
@JosephWright oh that's Murray, it is the MS Word input form. It was (as I recall) originally drafted as part of TR25 but moved to its own TR28 as being somewhat specialised.
 
@DavidCarlisle I see. Ok, currently I delete these long equations from the CAS output. I thought there might be a way to configure around it. thanks.
 
@Nasser you can always avoid the error by (manually or automatically) breaking things into smaller chunks, but you can't actually increase the maximum dimension as all tex registers are fixed sized registers holding at most 2^{30}sp
 
@DavidCarlisle I can't do manual edits, it is all automated code generation. I use breqn package. The test that generates long result, I just mark it down, and do not save its latex output. I can't edit by hand, since I run the program many times, and will lost any edits done. Maple is the worst, 99% of the long results come from Maple :)
 
@DavidCarlisle He's not so keen on MathML, is he (it makes TeX look very compact!)
@DavidCarlisle I wonder really how workable you think this is in general: is it a direction people in the TeX world should be thinking in (reusable input and so on)
 
@JosephWright He's a member of the W3C Math Working Group:-) See blogs.msdn.com/b/murrays/archive/2010/08/31/…
@JosephWright I think it depends a lot on the input mechanism. If viewed as a texlike syntax for math (but with less explicit markup) it's a bit of a disaster as its grammar is internally very complex and if the obvious input doesn't do the right thing then parsing it and working out any other input is pretty much impossible. however viewed as a formalised linear input syntax for a math editor it seems to work well enough, in Word you just view it as extended "keyboard shortcuts" and ...
... just fix up any errors in the built up display as it appears.
 
9:29 AM
Latex is amazing. The latex file now is about 1 millions lines long! and pdflatex compiles it to over 5,000 pages pdf file in only few minutes. That is why I use Latex and not word.
 
@JosephWright I arrived at a_b_c to be interpreted by “left associativity” as a^{b^c} which clearly means the author doesn't know what he's talking about.
 
yo'
10:19 AM
@Nasser oh yeah, try even pressing PgDn in W@#$ with this long document :D
Barbara in an official tone :)
There's a little added variation this year. If a new member declares that an existing member was responsible for their joining, that (existing) member will receive a small thank-you token from TUG, and his/her name will be placed into a pool from which, at the end of 2015, one name will be selected as recipient of an original drawing by Duane Bibby, the artist whose illustrations grace the pages of the TeXbook, the LaTeX manual, and many other TeX-related venues. For more details, see this web site. (Don't use my name; I'm not eligible.) — barbara beeton yesterday
 
10:38 AM
Hi guys, I've got a short question that I'm sure has been asked before: Is it possible to refer to an object (an equation in my case) before it is defined? Or is that just a dumb request? :P
 
yo'
@Danu Hi! Yep, it is. Just refer to it in a standard way (\label and \ref), and compile twice :)
 
@Danu yes just use \label and \ref as normal
 
Hmm, that doesn't seem to be working for me
 
yo'
@Danu then we need an MWE ...
 
@Danu as always best to ask questions on the main site where you can format code blocks etc, with a full example...
 
yo'
10:42 AM
Oh, have you compiled twice? Doesn't your text editor delete the auxiliary files after a compilation?
 
Hmm, never mind it, I just reshuffled my document instead :P
It may be because I'm using some custom commands
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's it; consider it solved! :P
 
yo'
@Danu I'm not convinced that this is a good idea.
 
@Danu \label and \ref always work via information input at the beginning of the document so forwards and backwards references work (or not work) the same way.
@Danu If forwards references work but back not then one of your "custom commands" has severely broken latex, and you should probably fix that first.
 
@yo' I did find out what was causing it; one of my custom commands. I then restored the document to its original state ;)
@DavidCarlisle It was indeed both not working properly ;)
Sorry for wasting your time
 
@Danu consistency is good
@Danu That is the main purpose of this chatroom
 
yo'
11:11 AM
@Danu I don't think it was a waste of time since you got your very specific problem solved :)
 
11:22 AM
@Danu Please, do not say such thing! It is always a pleasure for us to gather around and help our friends. :)
 
11:55 AM
@JosephWright: around? :)
 
@DavidCarlisle @PauloCereda thanks for the friendly response, guys :)
 
12:14 PM
\documentclass{standalone}
\usepackage[utf8]{inputenc}
\usepackage{tikz}

\definecolor{c3d7465}{RGB}{61,116,101}
\definecolor{c7cb964}{RGB}{124,185,100}
\definecolor{cdaeb7f}{RGB}{218,235,127}
\definecolor{c366b59}{RGB}{54,107,89}
\definecolor{c6dc49f}{RGB}{109,196,159}
\definecolor{cffffff}{RGB}{255,255,255}

\newcommand{\mrdinosaur}{\begin{tikzpicture}[y=0.80pt,x=0.80pt,yscale=-1, inner sep=0pt, outer sep=0pt]
  \path[color=black,fill=c3d7465,nonzero rule,line width=0.800pt]
    (337.2188,310.7500) .. controls (336.6306,310.7083) and (336.0787,310.7112) ..
 
wow, the dvi file is so big compared to a pdf file! look at this:
 
@JosephWright ^^
 
220 MB for the DVI file, while the pdf is only 24 MB
 
12:29 PM
@PauloCereda Grr
 
@JosephWright <3
@JosephWright: make sure to print it and give it to your nephew. :)
 
@Nasser conceptually the pdf has more stuff in it, as it includes all the font data and images but the dvi file does not, but it includes flate (zip) compression of its internal streams.....
 
yo'
@PauloCereda the good'ol day when the only output device was a printer and a one-line lamp display :)
 
@JosephWright I was too tired last night, I guess there be another iteration of \includeinrelease today:-)
 
@DavidCarlisle Great!
 
12:35 PM
@JosephWright and another tomorrow, and the day after....
 
@DavidCarlisle Indeed
 
@yo' :)
@DavidCarlisle grrrrrr :)
 
12:53 PM
Good maen
 
@ChristianHupfer Hi!
 
@ChristianHupfer Good \ifnum\time<720 Morning\else\ifnum\time<1080 Afternoon\else Evening\fi\fi
Oh you had n as well, hmm what cutoffs should it be....
@ChristianHupfer Good \ifnum\time<720 Morning\else\ifnum\time<1080 Afternoon\else\ifnum\time<1320 Evening\else Night\fi\fi\fi
4
 
1:11 PM
@DavidCarlisle gooood night ding ding!
 
@yo' The duck sleeps tonight! :)
 
yo'
@PauloCereda LOL, in the peaceful village the duck sleeps tonight -- São Paulo, what a peaceful village!
 
1:29 PM
if folks here buy books from amazon, watch out for book dates. Amazon put wrong dates to make the book appear new, when it is many years old. I noticed this many times before. Here is a book on Maple I just saw at amazon, it says it is published in 2012, when it is actually 1995 book. amazon.com/Maple-Handbook-Release/dp/1468402307/…
Here is the real date of the book bookdepository.com/Maple-Handbook-Darren-Redfern/9781468402308 this is not the first time amazon does this.
 
yo'
@Nasser they're naughty.
 
they just want to sell books and they lie on the date to trick people to buy it, thinking it is new.
 
@Nasser You can't blame amazon for that: springer republished it in 2012 with a new isbn lookupbyisbn.com/Search/Book/978-1468402308/1 amazon is just no doubt using the publication date that the isbn returns.
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle this. (I was just looking for the reference)
 
@DavidCarlisle well, ok, but someone is trying to trick us. May be it is springer then. But this is not right. Old material, with just new date stamped on it.
 
1:35 PM
@PauloCereda: Did you have a job interview? 5 4 3 2 1 zero :-P
 
@Nasser the maple V release 3 title is a bit of a hint:-)
 
the book is about Maple V, which is over 20 years old.
 
@Nasser quite new compared to latex then
 
yo'
@Nasser obviously springer had some copies deep in the cellars and decided to re-release them.
 
The magic ball refuses to work once again
 
1:41 PM
@Johannes_B mine is cloudy but shows \setlength\mathsurround{2pt}
 
@david Incredible. Got a hint even here :-)
 
@Johannes_B you need this:
@Johannes_B really, he's still using textures?
 
@DavidCarlisle To be honest, what is textures?
27
Q: What happened to Textures and Bluesky Research?

Reinhard DiestelA few weeks ago, the Bluesky website vanished. I have been unable to find any recent traces on the Internet of either Gordon Lee, who seems to have been the only person left at Bluesky (or, at any rate, its only interface with the public), or of its founder, Barry Smith. Although Textures had lo...

 
@Johannes_B commercial tex release (very swish) for the mac pre osX
 
@DavidCarlisle I see that tex.stackexchange.com/questions/220939/… is gone as well ...
 
1:51 PM
@Johannes_B what a surprise:-)
 
@yo' <3
 
2:28 PM
Hi everyone. I have a question about file sizes and the relationship between EPS and PDF.
 
@AndrewCashner and?
 
Just pretend it's not a question about lilypond.
If I produce a PDF with lilypond via the normal manner, a single page document comes out to 160K. If I run it through a script that uses pdftops -eps to turn it into eps, then uses epstopdf to turn it back into a PDF, I get a cropped PDF that is only 19K! Any idea why?
This is necessary because lilypond has a bug where it can't accurately detect its own bounding box to crop an image.
I'm guessing this has to do with font embedding?
 
yo'
@AndrewCashner this is quite possible, and quite possibly the resulting PDF file won't be so portable.
 
@AndrewCashner could be any one of thousands of reasons (it would be helpful iif I knew lilypond's output but I don't) it could be font embedding (pdffonts or acrobat font menu will tell you about that) it could simply be the compression level is higher or no compression at all in the lilypond output (pdf has zip style compression that can be set 0-9) or it could be something else or ...
 
yo'
Well, my LilyPond PDF files have commonly <100kB, actually one very recent one has 60kB, and after pdfcropping it, it drops down to 40kB.
 
2:37 PM
@yo' @DavidCarlisle Thanks. I am including these images in a LaTeX document with \includegraphics, and there are a lot of them, so I need the file sizes to be small. This might be related: say I include 10 such files, and the text font for each is Linux Libertine O. In the pdffonts output for the LaTeX file made with pdflatex, it lists LinLibertineO 10 times. Is that normal?
 
yo'
@AndrewCashner in that case, you really want to un-embed the fonts somehow and embed the full font in the final document. However, with 20kB files, very likely only used subset of the fonts gets embedded.
 
@DavidCarlisle lilypond relies on Pango + Ghostscript for its font processing and printing. So perhaps its native settings for ghostcript are different than those used by epstopdf?
 
@AndrewCashner ah presumably your small images have the font subsetted, pdftex can sometimes but not always spot that two subset fonts are from the same font and merge them but sometimes it can't. So it can be that using the big images with full fonts results in a smaller final document because then the font can be loaded just once and subsetted to the combined set of characters used.
@AndrewCashner epstopdf is ghostscript as well as far as I know
 
@DavidCarlisle If you would have given me filll chances, i would have never guessed that. latex-community.org/forum/…
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle it's magic :)
 
2:44 PM
@Johannes_B oh that was the other thing that my crystal ball suggested other than \mathsurround but I forgot to mention it. It had all the hallmarks of a user not saying what was actually happening.
 
@DavidCarlisle Here is the output of `pdffonts` for the cropped PDF. The only difference between this and the original PDF is that for the original, Emmentaler-16 has "no" under "uni":
`name type emb sub uni object ID
------------------------------------ ----------------- --- --- --- ---------
QYKHSR+Emmentaler-11 Type 1C yes yes no 14 0
YACNJQ+Emmentaler-16 Type 1C yes yes yes 10 0
EGIYSZ+Emmentaler-18 Type 1C yes yes no 12 0
 
3:03 PM
@yo' Any idea how I could un-embed the fonts? I tried running lilypond with the EPS backend, but then epstopdf --noembed still tried to embed the fonts.
 
yo'
@AndrewCashner ummm not really?
 
@DavidCarlisle Do I understand correctly that each PDF is subsetting a different portion of the font, so that for n included images there are n subsets of the font included in the final LaTeX PDF?
 
yo'
@AndrewCashner yes, this is possible. It means that the glyph for the flag of the 8th note will be n times in the resulting PDF
 
3:23 PM
@AndrewCashner oh so they were already subsetted in the original
@AndrewCashner yes although as I say sometimes (depending on technicalities I don't really know) pdftex can detect that is happening and make one new susbet font with the union of the characters but in general if it can't do that it has to include the font with each image
 
3:57 PM
@David @yo' Thanks. Supposedly lilypond's eps backend produces an EPS file without fonts embedded. So I tried including two such .eps files with \includegraphics. The result was the same; multiple embedded subsets of the same fonts. If you think this is a legitimate TeX question I'll post it on the main site.
 
@Johannes_B: That guy is a pain in the... neck
 
4:49 PM
@David Now I am trying ps2pdf -dEmbedAllFonts=false file.ps but it still gives the message "Cannot embed the font as it is too large, embedding a subset"
 
@AndrewCashner ah that's probably going to be a problem then, and may also be one of the underlying reasons why it can't merge the fonts anyway. Fonts are tricky things:-) You could try telling it not to embed the fonts at all when making the individual images and then (somehow) making sure it is available when all combined. Or give up, always a possibility:-)
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle yep. If the images are 20kB, you likely won't save that much anyways.
 
@David @yo' Thanks. I'm going to solve this problem with the venerable TeX strategy \relax.
 
yo'
@AndrewCashner :) and I'm going to solve another problem: lack of caffeine :)
 
5:09 PM
More Word users without a sense of humour:-)
 
@David +1, doing my part
 
@AndrewCashner I'm not sure the answer actually merits an upvote:-)
 
@David I appreciated your literal take on a tiresome question. It's also more even-handed than the other answers, since the output on each program would be difficult to achieve on the other one.
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle I think that if you have made it cw, it would have been better accepted...
 
@David If you had demonstrated the powers of picture mode you really would have persuaded them.
 
 
1 hour later…
yo'
6:33 PM
@JosephWright multiple accounts suspect:
0
A: How to print character backwards?

uthus2000Thanks! I hadn't thought to look at unicode but tried Masroor's fix first. I only wanted to change the direction of E one time so I didn't use a \def. I had found the \kern-x statement somewhere sometime ago. \textrm{\normalsize \rotatebox[origin=c]{180}{E}\kern-0.3em H\kern-0.4em P} \\ \textr...

 
7:12 PM
@yo' And certain poor answer. :(
 
yo'
@egreg don't judge or you'll be judged :D
 
@yo' Damn! Already flagged! :)
 
yo'
@egreg :)
 
@yo' Well, I got a downvote today.
 
yo'
@egreg on some of your questions? :D
 
7:25 PM
@yo' Well, I checked all of them and I can say that each one of my question received at least a downvote and at least 1000 upvotes.
 
@egreg I'm sure it was well deserved. (unlike mine)
 
7:40 PM
Debugging nested TeX ifs are creepy: All I see is fi fi fi fi fi, look but you don't see, fi fi fi fi (to be read with a clown face and a 4 years old girl voice)
 
8:09 PM
@percusse like a nursery rhyme?
 
Hey all
Ok, so I was expecting lots of answers to the previous question I asked:
7
Q: I'm supposed to load some packages BEFORE the document class?

CanageekSo I was reading Fixing LaTeX2e and it has several examples of the form \RequirePackage{fixltx2e} \documentclass... What? I thought documentclass always went right at the top. Are there other situations I should require a package before documentclass?

and I get almost nothing
Then I ask what I think is a very simple question
3
Q: Should I load eTeX and/or fixltx2e by default

CanageekSo, inspired by Fixing LaTeX2e I've been wondering: Should I be loading fixltx2e and/or eTeX by default? Typically I start my documents as %Page layout here \documentclass[letterpaper, 11pt]{article} Should this be changed to \RequirePackage{etex} \RequirePackage{fixltx2e} %Page layout he...

I get 0 answers, but an argument in the comments
 
yo'
@Canageek the first one is much more open-ended.
 
@Canageek Answer coming up
 
8:25 PM
@JosephWright Well, I guess you'd be the expert
 
8:48 PM
@egreg: What might fail if babel for Spanish is used in your \@Alph - way?
 
9:16 PM
@ChristianHupfer The fifteenth letter of the Spanish alphabet is Ñ; in this case \csname foo\@Alph{15}\endcsname (or the same using the counter) would balk.
 
@egreg: Oh, I see --> in this sense my counter style is (somewhat) balk-safe ;-)
 
can i advertisemy question here tex.stackexchange.com/questions/221042/…
 
@ChristianHupfer No, it's just the same
 
@egreg: Yes, I just thought about it... \@Alph is the backend of \Alph... I hope, the OP does not use Babel or does not need more than 14 boxes this way.
 
@ChristianHupfer With Czech it goes wrong at 4.
 
yo'
9:36 PM
@egreg with Czech it goes wrong at 2 (depending on which alphabet you consider)
 
@yo' What would be used in an alphabetic style enumerate?
 
yo'
@egreg English alphabet, probably ;)
certainly the metro lines are not gonna be A, B, C, Č, D, Ď nor A, Á, B, C, Č, D, but rather A, B, C, D, E, F
 
9:54 PM
I am finding the idea of writing a program, that process input and generate Latex is amazing. This way, one can generate new updated documents, web pages, all in Latex, by running a program, which does all the work. This should work for any field, not just computer algebra. But if it is done from a computer algebra program, like I do, one can mix the computation with code generation.
 
10:42 PM
@JosephWright what answer are you going to give:-)
 
yo'
10:54 PM
@DavidCarlisle he's already given one ;)
 
@yo' I even voted
@yo' meanwhile I'm supposed to be making it happen...
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle I know :)
 
@yo' I have a streaming cold and literally fell asleep at keyboard last night. For some reason it was easier to do 24hr tex coding sessions in 1994:-)
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle lol
 
Where's @PauloCereda when you need him? I have an arara question...
 
11:12 PM
@AlanMunn Quack! :)
 
@PauloCereda Hi Paulo. So I have a file Main.tex that \inputs one of two different versions of another file File1.tex or File2.tex. Right now I compile Main.tex with File1 and then change the name of the resulting PDF, then run it again with File2 and change the name. Could I automate this with arara?
 
@AlanMunn Hi Alan! :) Yes, I think we can automate it. :) Just a question: would you like a solution for the current TL version (3.0) or the new release (4.0)? :)
 
@PauloCereda If tlmgr doesn't install it, I don't want it... (yet).
:)
 
@AlanMunn Got it. :) Do you have a MWE for me? :)
 
% This is the main file
\documentclass{article}
\begin{filecontents}{\jobname File1}
Hello world from File 1
\end{filecontents}
\begin{filecontents}{\jobname File2}
Hello world from File 2
\end{filecontents}

\begin{document}
This is the main file.
\input{\jobname File1}
%\input{\jobname File2}
\end{document}
 
11:21 PM
@AlanMunn Thank you! :)
@AlanMunn: is it for you?
 
@PauloCereda Yes, do I get a discount? :)
 
@AlanMunn Of course. :)
@AlanMunn: first things first: arara 3.0 is way more restricted than my new version, so we will have to improvise. :) But it works. This is what I did so far:
% arara: magic: { items: [ foo, bar ] }
\documentclass{article}

\begin{document}
\input{\myfilename}
\end{document}
^^ main document
And this is the magic.yaml rule:
!config
identifier: magic
name: magic
commands:
- <arara> @{engine} "\def\myfilename{@{item}}\input{@{getBasename(file)}}"
- <arara> mv "@{getBasename(file)}.pdf" "@{getBasename(file).concat('-').concat(item)}.pdf"
arguments:
- identifier: engine
  flag: <arara> {parameters.engine}
  default: pdflatex
 
nks
I have to say, stackexchange is an interesting microcosm of its own kind.
 
In order to have this rule recognized, you have to have araraconfig.yaml in your home folder, /Users/alan:
[paulo@satyagraha ~] $ cat araraconfig.yaml
!config
paths:
- /home/paulo/
This is where my magic.yaml lives. :)
@nks Hello! :) TeX.sx is even cooler. :)
 
nks
:) so my experience is already spoiled cause I started my journey at the coolest place. g
*g*
hey escaping * with \ works. What a guess.
 
11:40 PM
@PauloCereda Perfect, that's what I wanted to do, but I didn't really know how. I'll give this a try. Thanks!
 
@AlanMunn My pleasure. :) Note that this is a humble v3 solution. I'll come up with a v4 version (which is way more fluent and consistent) just for the record (I might release it in March). :)
 
@PauloCereda If you don't hit March you may miss TL2015
 
@DavidCarlisle Exactly. :(
 
I have a table that's a bit too wide with the normal font size and I'd like to shrink the font just enough for the table to fit the same margins as the rest of the page. Is there an easy way to do this?
 
@Gregory changing fontsize should be a last resort (there are dozens of question on site with this question) it's almost always better to adjust \tabcolsep or reformat the table a bit or use a predetermined size such as \small, but people anyway go \resizebox{\textwidth}{!}{\begin{tabular....\end{tabular}
http://tex.stackexchange.com/search?q=fit+table+\textwidth
 
nks
11:50 PM
bye
/quit
 
@nks you can't leave that easily
 
@DavidCarlisle. \footnotesize is a touch smaller than needed, but it'll work fine. What's the difference between "changing font size" and "use a predetermined size"?
 
@Gregory some notion of document consistency and obeying the typographic style as laid out by the class. It's odd: no one suggests randomly scaling text in a paragraph to avoid overfull boxes in line breaking, but put the same text in a paragraph and you see it suggested most weeks.
 
@DavidCarlisle Thanks, as always!
 

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