« first day (2318 days earlier)      last day (2708 days later) » 

12:25 AM
hi @Null
 
hi @adeek
 
Hi @KajHansen @meow-mix
 
Hey guys - Hope you can answer a quick question. Does it make sense to consider the tensor product of two Hilbert spaces with different scalar fields? Most Litterature considers both fields either real or complex, but as you can see in my latest question i seem to extend the procedure to the mixed case.
 
Anyone here know general relativity?
;-;
 
@SirCumference the math puns are unbearable
 
12:29 AM
@meow-mix They're pretty good, you just gotta look at them from the right angle
 
okay umm
did you have that one up your sleeve?
 
Nah
So, uh...anyone know GR?
@meow-mix Woah what
You're in middle school and you know calculus?
How?
 
There are middle schoolers here that know category theory, algebraic topology, etc
Pretty common in the chat lol
 
@SirCumference balarka knows algebraic topology and advanced math
 
@KajHansen .-.
 
12:34 AM
Hey all
 
balarka is high school age, though
very smart kid
 
Only recently. Not just Balarka
 
jesus
They teach this to middle schoolers these days?
 
no, they don't.
 
Balarka was telling me about $\text{Gal}(\overline{ \mathbb{Q}}/\mathbb{Q})$ like two years ago haha
 
12:35 AM
however, those who have a profound interest in math decide to study for themselves
 
dang, i tip my hat to you
if i had one
@KajHansen would you know GR by chance?
I'm seriously desperate
 
Not at all
 
hey @KajHansen want to discuss some cool question ?
 
@SirCumference try maybe physics stack exchange
 
12:40 AM
There is a very tiny chance I can help with a differential geometry aspect?
 
@Adeek No one there knows any
@KajHansen You know the Einstein field equations?
 
@KajHansen recently i've been trying to be more active in answering questions on MSE
 
my know knowledge only goes until advanced mechnics
 
Nope lol
 
12:40 AM
What's up @Adeek ? I haven't made any further progress into rep. theory yet today. Probably will in a little while
 
@KajHansen want to discuss my solution to something in rep theory.
 
Sure
 
Let $S_n$ act on the set $X = \{x_1,...,x_n\}$ in the usual way that is $\sigma . x_i = x_{\sigma(i)}$
 
Yep
 
hi chat
 
12:41 AM
Hey semi
 
Prove that $det(p(g)) = sgn(g)$ for each $g \in S_n$ where $sgn(g) = 1$ when g is even permutation and otherwise it is negative.
my idea is to prove it for transposition.
 
What is the notation?
 
Which definition of det are you using?
 
$p : S_n \rightarrow GLn(F)$
@Semiclassical remember $p(g)$ lives inside of $Gl_n(F)$ so it makes sense to talk about determinant.
 
The regular representation @Adeek ?
 
12:43 AM
Not what I asked.
 
math.stackexchange.com/questions/2048823/… am i wrong in believing this is a mapping from $R^2 \to R$, not $R^2 \to R^2$?
 
yes @KajHansen for example $(1 2 3)$ goes to $[0 1 0][0 0 1][1 0 0]$
 
You are not wrong @meow-mix
Got it
 
The Leibniz formula, for instance, gives that result automatically: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leibniz_formula_for_determinants
 
the way I solved it is as follows.
 
12:45 AM
Because exactly one of the terms in that formula will survive.
 
Notice that any permutation $\sigma$ is generated by product of transposition.
 
Yep
 
since $p$ is a homomorphism so those product will split inside of the determinant.
 
Yep
Column switching has a certain effect on determinant
you multiply by $-1$ for each column switch
 
Sorry. So yes I was going on the right line of reasoning. So first of all my claim is that it suffices to prove this for transposition. The reason it suffices to prove it for transposition is that given $g \in S_n$ it is a product of transposition denote them by $g_1 ... g_n$. Therefore we have $det(p(g_1 ... g_n))$ since $p$ is a homomorphism we have $p(g_1 ... g_n) = p(g_1) ...p(g_n)$.
determinant is multiplicative so we have $det(p(g)) = det(p(g_1)) ... det(p(g_n))$.
 
12:50 AM
Sure
 
so It suffices to see what is the effect we have a transposition.
 
I can't put a bounty on my question until tomorrow, why is there a minimal time period :(
 
Given a transposition $\lambda \in S_n$ we have it switches coloumns of identity matrix which is the same as multiplying 1 by (-1). Therefore $det(p(g)) = (-1)^n$
 
Yeah, that looks good :)
 
n is even when we have even permutation and odd otherwise.
yeah okay good :D
 
12:53 AM
I should look at some more stuff. It's going to take me a while to really internalize all this new terminology and ideas.
I learn really slow, but once I've learned something, it's pretty solid in my head
 
that is good @KajHansen as long as you learn it that what matters.
I haven't learned this in depth yet. We only had 3 lectures on representation theory and barely touched the surface.
 
Anyone know if there's an integration by substitution for contour integrals?
 
I learn better from books than from lectures @KajHansen.
 
or can anyone recommend a source that would talk about such things?
 
1:08 AM
math.stackexchange.com/questions/2047334/… okay added an example to my question, hopefully now it will get upboats
 
@KajHansen Prove that the span of $x_1 + ... x_n$ is a $1$ dimensional subrepresentation of permutation representation.
so I don't understand why is that a vector subspace of V ?
 
wow i actually understood a research paper
 
@meow-mix grats
 
anyone want to help me understand something?
 
depends what
 
1:18 AM
projective geometry
 
flashlights and shadows?
 
i guess :P
 
what's the question?
 
so you agree
that a pencil of lines $\lambda_P$ in $\mathbb{P}^2$ is a set of lines passing through a point in $\mathbb{P} \in \mathbb{P}^2$, right?
 
Oh this is already beyond what I know :( sorry
 
1:23 AM
it's ok
 
try getting a flashlight and pencil and see if you can draw it
 
@meow-mix I think that's the definition, yeah
 
1:43 AM
hey @KajHansen do you want to discuss a solution ?
 
Just got back @Adeek. What's up?
 
I am trying to prove that there is a correspondence between degree 1 presentation of G and degree 1 presentation of abelian group G/[G,G]
I proved it but I would like to discuss my solution.
 
What is the notation $[G,G]$?
 
the commutator subgroup.
 
So that's the subgroup generated by $ghg^{-1}h^{-1}$ for every pair $g, h \in G$?
 
1:47 AM
the subgroup generated by commutators i.e elements of the form $xyx^{-1}y^{-1}$.
yeah.
 
Ok cool
 
okay lets us do it. Degree 1 presentation is the same as maps $p : G \rightarrow F^{\times}$ and similiarly degree 1 presentation of $G/[G,G]$ is same as $\phi : G/[G,G] \rightarrow F^{\times}$.
 
Ok, so that's how the terms are defined?
 
@KajHansen degree 1 presentation are given by $f : G \rightarrow GL_1(F)$.
 
For deg > 1, is that a homomorphism into a deg-dimensional linear group?
Ok cool
 
1:50 AM
If we pick a basis for F we have $GL_1(F) = F^{\times}$.
 
I like em
yeaas
 
mhmm
 
I only have 10 minutes to present my results at this conference... very difficult
 
I hate such restrictive time limits @ForeverMozart
 
Given $p \in Hom(G,F^{\times})$ we construct $\phi_p : G/[G,G]$ as follows. For simplicity denote $[G,G] = G`$. $\phi_p(gG`) \mapsto p(g)$. We have to show this is well defined. First we prove that $[G,G] \subset Ker(p)$.
 
1:53 AM
15-20 is okay, but 10 is really pushing it
 
$p(xyx^{-1}y^{-1}) = p(x)p(y)p(x)^{-1}p(y)^{-1} = p(x)p(x)^{-1}p(y)p(y)^{-1} = 1$.
 
maybe too many people are talking
 
Suppose $g_1G` = g_2G`$.
 
we have a "5 minute thesis" thing at my school
 
Commutativity because we're in $F^\times$ ?
 
1:54 AM
I don't think any math students participate :)
 
That sounds horrible tbh @ForeverMozart
 
$g_1g_2^{-1} \in G` \rightarrow p(g_1g_2^{-1)) = 1 \rightarrow p(g_1) = p(g_2)$.
 
yeah I thought about doing it for fun but nah
 
***
yes @KajHansen stupid latex messing with me
$g_1g_2^{-1} \in G` \implies p(g_1g_2^{-1)) = 1 \implies p(g_1) = p(g_2)$.
 
$g_1g_2^{-1} \in G` \rightarrow p(g_1g_2^{-1}) = 1 \rightarrow p(g_1) = p(g_2)$.
 
1:56 AM
@KajHansen yes for the comment about commutativity of $F^{\times}$.
yesh
 
I will need lots of pictures, so firing up autocad...
 
Now given $\theta : G/G` \rightarrow F^{\times}$ this correspond to the map $\sigma = \theta \circ \pi$ where $\pi$ is the standard projection map.
so given $p \in Hom(G,F^{\times})$ we constructed $\theta \in Hom(G/G`,F^{\times})$ and in this construction the maps are inverses with each other.
So that construction is one to one correspodence. Proof done.
what do you think @KajHansen
 
Trying to reason through it @Adeek
 
okay
 
Elaborate on the $\sigma = \theta \circ \pi$ ?
Is $\theta$ an arbitrary map $G/G' \rightarrow F^\times$?
 
2:03 AM
yeah $\theta$ is arbitrarily. So we have constructed one way that is we have constructed given $p \in Hom(G,F^{\times})$ we constructed $\phi_p \in Hom(M,F^{\times})$ where $M = G/G`$.
now we need other direction.
Given $\theta \in Hom(M,F^{\times})$ we need to construct $\sigma \in Hom(G,F^{\times})$.
 
Ah, we're trying to find a bijection between $Hom(G, F^\times)$ and $Hom(G/G', F^\times)$
 
yes
$\sigma = \theta \circ \pi$.
we have to see now that given $p \in Hom(G,F^{\times})$ if we apply those maps twice we get back to the identity.
but that is trivial because $p \mapsto \phi_p \maptso p$ by construction.
 
So $\pi$ maps $G \rightarrow G/G'$
Oh ok yeah
I see now
 
cool argument right ?
 
Indeed it is :)
Is this for your algebra course?
 
2:07 AM
I want to discuss that question I really don't understand what does it mean.
Yeah it is my last assignment.
Want to make sure it is 100 %
 
haha
 
Our prof is brutal though assignment per week and it is like 7 questions + projects + hard midterms and finals
she is brutal
 
My algebra course went into homological stuff at the end. Was getting way too abstract too fast.
 
Yeah we covered a lot of stuff. We did like from basic group theory up to representation theory.
Last 3 lectures we rep theory.
I didn't concentrate last 3 lectures though was exhausted.
 
We did group theory built up from nothing, then Galois theory, then a massive thing at the end with module theory (structure theorem, jordan canonical form, etc) and homological algebra
 
2:11 AM
next semester I will try something different because I always tend to burn myself up by the end of the semester. Next semester I will wake up early like 6 am go to gym and study. I will go gym no matter how busy I am and also wake up early 6 am no matter what.
wow @KajHansen you guys covered a lot
 
Good luck @Adeek
 
I'm exactly the same way. I'd do wonderful all the way up to the last month or so. I got burned out at the end of every semester lol
 
yeah I always tend to do that !
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_K._Nakano
^My algebra professor for that course :P
 
thanks @GFauxPas
cool @KajHansen
my prof did her phd under some field medalist
 
2:13 AM
Wow
 
She got her phd from University of California, San Diego
 
My top. professor did Ph.D. with this guy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benedict_Gross
Pretty famous for his work with elliptic curves and Birch/Swinnerton Dyer
 
Efim Zelmanov
cool
 
And I had an Erdos 1 for combinatorics
 
cool
 
2:17 AM
Erdos stayed at my advisor's house one time
 
That's crazy cool
 
I am thinking from next semester what I will when I study I will completely shut down the internet.
 
Couldn't hurt haha
 
I believe Erdos traveled around and stayed with lots of people
 
mhm, you should read "The Man Who Loved Only Numbers"
Pretty good biography
 
2:21 AM
How can you possibly study math without the internet?
I'd be lost without s.e. / proofwiki / wikipedia / mathworld / khan academy
/Paul's math notes
/googling pdfs of questionable legality
 
I will read it
 
@GFauxPas a book and if you want to discuss stuff then maybe dedicate a time once a week or twice to come here and discuss.
I think that would be more productive.
 
If books weren't absurdly expensive that would be a better option
 
I hate when my calculus students talk about Khan academy
 
why @ForeverMozart?
But usually the books I use omit details and I have to go online for answers
 
2:24 AM
because they think it is a substitute for my class or something
 
@ForeverMozart I learned calculus from khan.
 
but self-study is very hard for most people
 
oh Forever do you know complex analysis
since you're a calc professor
 
not really
I'm just a TA
 
:( okay
TA's are p. awesome in my experience
 
2:27 AM
@Kaj are you busy?
 
koala bears are cute but they can kill you
 
actually
@Forever are you proficient a little bit in projective geometry?
 
hmm maybe
 
it's a question about pencils
just to prepare you
 
so you agree that a pencil of lines $\lambda_P$ is a set of lines in $\mathbb{P}^2$ passing through point $P$, right?
 
2:30 AM
what is a pencil?
 
hi
@ForeverMozart something you write with. jk
it's a set of lines all perpendicular to a common line.
 
umm
no
 
uuuh yes?
 
I think I understand
 
oh wait
thats the exact definition
a set of lines in $\mathbb{P}^{2*}$ passing through a point
 
2:32 AM
what's $\mathbb P$? An arbitary plane?
 
projective space
i.e., in $\mathbb{R}^3$, a pencil would be a set of planes intersecting a line through the origin
 
hey @KajHansen.
 
P^2?
 
so, you understand, right @ForeverMozart ?
 
what are you talking about?
 
2:33 AM
@KajHansen do you understand (c) ?
 
@TheGreatDuck dual projective space
 
ooooh
I thought you were talking about Euclidean Geometry
 
no lol
 
in that a pencil means a set of lines all perpendicular to a common line.
XD
 
ummm no
 
2:34 AM
all lines parallel to a common line then?
it's something to do with that I thought?
 
its a set of lines in $\mathbb{P}^{2*}$ (or, equivalently, points in dual projective $2$-space intersecting a point $P$ of projective $2$-space
so, as i said earlier, in $\mathbb{R}^3$, we can describe it as the set of planes intersecting a line through the origin
 
...
im talking about Euclidean Geometry
 
didn't realize
currently studying non-euclidean geometry :P
anyways, @Forever, so Ted, in his book, defined pencil $\lambda_P$ whose elements (lines) intersect $P$
note that the pencil is again, a set of planes (when you look at it in $\mathbb{R}^3$
 
then he states there exists $\zeta, \eta$ such that $\lambda_P = \{[s\zeta + t\eta: s,t \in \mathbb{R} \neq 0]\}$
i.e. the set of all non-zero linear combinations of $\zeta, \eta$ (note that these are vectors in $\mathbb{R}^3$
but wouldn't that form just a single $2$-dimensional subspace intersecting the origin? i.e. only one plane?
 
2:41 AM
it is span of 2 vector
 
yes
so wouldn't it be a single $2$-dimensional subspace of $\mathbb{R}^3$?
 
so then how is it a pencil?
 
but in $P^2$
 
because a pencil is a set of planes ($2$-dimensional subspaces of $\mathbb{R}^3$)
 
2:43 AM
it gives 2 planes right
 
what gives two?
 
Just need to confrm a problem I've done. If a group has order 1925 and more than one sylow 5-subgroup what is the number of sylow 5-subgroups? I got that there are 11 sylow 5-subgroups. we may write the order as 5^2 * 7 * 11. Hence, we must have that the number is a divisor of 77 and that the number = 1 mod 5 by Sylow's Third Theorem. Is this correct?
 
oh I see it can be more than one plane
cause of negative values
of s and t
 
??
 
see you can get lots of planes
 
2:49 AM
Whoa, the set of algebraic numbers is countable?!
 
it is easy to see @GFauxPas
 
because the set of polynomials with integer coefficients is countable?
 
:o
TIL
 
Anyone?
 
2:51 AM
huh
 
"today I learned"
and ":o" is a surprised face
internet slang :)
 
fluffy and meow mix
are cats taking over
 
I'm a cat
but "fluffy" could be a ferret
 
gateau
il faut gateau
 
what's that really obvious result about set cardinalities that's equivalent to the AoC? That a countable union of non empty sets something, or a cartesian product of something is something?
 
3:01 AM
why is one of the circles in a wedge of two circles not a deformation retract of the wedge?
 
cartesian product of nonempty sets is nonempty?
 
@Simeon why would it be? (or if you want a proof, use fundamental groups)
 
@ForeverMozart why would it make many planes?
 
Never mind, it's clear to me now :)
would the fundamental group of a figure eight with a circle attached to just one of the circles be the free group with three generators?
 
yes, @Simeon
i believe
 
3:15 AM
hey @arctictern would you like to discuss rep theory ?
 
sure
 
in fact that would be called a rose of 3 petals
 
Suppose G is a finite cyclic group. Find all representation over $\mathbb{C}$. Explain when two of these representations are isomorphic.
 
complex reps?
 
proof :
yeah
 
3:17 AM
no i mean when the third circle is attached to just one of the existing two circles (imagine an eight with three circles instead of two)
 
homos Z/nZ to S^1 in bijection with the group of nth roots of unity
 
Suppose G is cyclic. Then $G = <r>$ for some $r \in G$. Sice G is finite there exists $n \in \mathbb{N} \ : \ r^n = 1_G$.
Suppose $p$ is degree 1 presentation that is $p G : G \rightarrow \mathbb{C}^{\times}$ then $1 = p(r)^n$ so p(r) is nth root of unity.
so any representation of $G$ correspond to nth root of unity.
good proof ?
 
representation
 
@Simeon im not that proficient in algebraic topology
 
yeah
 
3:21 AM
you've shown degree 1 reps correspond to nth roots of unity. should mention the converse as well.
also if the original problem is for "all reps" then you should probably mention maschke's theorem, and mention the fact that irreps of abelian groups are degree 1
 
I forgot maschkee theorem statement
what is it ? Is it that any representation is direct sum of irreducible representation ?
 
yes
@Simeon does SvK help?
 
why any nth root of unity correspond to degree 1 representation ?
 
figure it out
fix the cyclic group to be Z/nZ btw
so there is a canonical generator
 
oh yeah I see.
 
3:26 AM
@arctictern ah yes, that's what I thought; thought there might be another way.
 
I don't understand @arctictern are we characterizing all representations on all finite cyclic group ?
 
sure
 
I think all presentation of degree 1 over $\mathbb{C}$ are isomorphic though right ?
if we fix a particular finite cyclic group.
 
Let's consider $\Bbb Z/3\Bbb Z$. Let $\alpha,\beta$ be representations with $\alpha(k)=\omega^k$ and $\beta(k)=\omega^{-k}$. What would the isomorphism $\Bbb C\to\Bbb C$ be?
First of all, it needs to be a linear map, so it's multiplication by some $c$.
 
yeah
 
3:32 AM
Then $\alpha(k)c=c\beta(k)$ for all $k$. But this implies $\alpha(k)=\beta(k)$ for all $k$..
 
yeah I see but that isn't the case.
so we have as much representation as $\phi(n)$ euler phi function
right ?
 
no
$\phi(n)$ counts the primitive $n$th roots. but there is a representation of $\Bbb Z/n\Bbb Z$ for every $n$th root, not just the primitive ones
 
oh
yes I see. But how many will be irreducibles ?
 
can a one-dimensional vector space have a proper nonzero subspace?
 
no so all of these representation are irreducible. Also, all of them aren't isomorphic ?
 
3:38 AM
correct
 
that is cool.
 
4:06 AM
Does anyone know about the Sylow subgroups?
 
what about them
 
Posted a question a while ago. I can repost if it's too far up.
 
your work looks fine
 
http://math.stackexchange.com/questions/2049092/clarification-about-hasses-theorem-for-elliptic-curve-over-finite-fields

^^Give this guy some upvotes. It's his first post on MSE, and it looks pretty well thought out.
 
4:22 AM
@KajHansen I did
@arctictern If I want to continue further and classify representation of dimension 1 for any finite abelian group I can do the following ?
If G is abelian then $G = C_1 \times ... \times C_n$ where each $C_i$ is cyclic of finite order.
 
representation
and yes you can do that
the number of representations of a finite abelian group G will in fact be |G|
 
Can I conclude that the representation of dimension 1 will be the representation for each of the $C_i$ ?
 
Write $G=\prod_{i=1}^k \Bbb Z/n_k\Bbb Z$ and use $e_i$ for the usual coordinate tuples. The homomorphisms $G\to S^1$ are in bijection with ordered tuples $(\zeta_1,\cdots,\zeta_k)$ where each $\zeta_i$ is an $n_i$th root of unity
 
Oh wait no the representation of order 1 will be the direct product of the irreducible representation for each of the $C_i$
this is Maschkee theorem.
 
no
maschke's says every rep of G is a direct product of irreps of G, and we know every irrep has degree 1
 
4:26 AM
oh
 
as a matter of fact irreps of $H\times K$ will be tensor products of irreps of $H$ and $K$. not so easy to prove when $H,K$ are not assumed abelian
 
I see
 
4:47 AM
Do the set of idempotents in a commutative ring (with unity) form an ideal? I know the set of nilpotents do.
 

« first day (2318 days earlier)      last day (2708 days later) »