« first day (444 days earlier)      last day (4594 days later) » 

2:01 PM
Writing long answers that hardly anyone is gonna read is fun :-)
2
 
Tell me about it :-)
 
Thankfully, Scholar remains fine. If they bring this JS nonsense to Scholar... yecch.
 
Now it's time to bathe the chickens!
 
I'm still trying to look for that episode where Curly was bathing a turkey...
 
@Asaf: nice answer. I like the p/q->2^p 3^q map.
It's a lot simpler than the usual back and forth in the corner of NxN
 
2:10 PM
@tb can you please take a look at my construction of an example derivation that's not tangent vector?
 
@AlexeiAverchenko where?
 
4
Q: An example of a derivation at a point on a $C^k$-manifold which is not a tangent vector

Alexei AverchenkoLet $M$ be a real $C^k$-manifold, $\mathscr{H}_x$ be the $\mathbb{R}$-algebra of germs of $C^k$-differentiable functions at $x \in M$. It is easy to show that $T_x M$ can be embedded into the space of derivations of the form $v: \mathscr{H}_x \to \mathbb{R}$. In his book on Lie groups and Lie alg...

in the comments
 
@robjohn Thanks!
@tb: Tuberculosis?
 
don't pick on him, his 10 times more useful than my advisor!
4
 
@rob: Did you read it whole, or just skimmed through it as though you were chased by a giant possum?
 
2:19 PM
@Alexei: Sorry, I missed those pings. That sounds about right to me, did you want to ask me something specific? (and thanks for the kind words :))
 
you're welcome ;)
i just wanted an affirmation
 
Okay, then :)
 
oh, i have another small question if you guys don't mind :)
 
shoot
 
what is the motivation for moduli space of a riemannian surface?
i mean, how do problems arise when we have to consider several complex structures on a surface?
or do we get topological insights in this way?
 
2:25 PM
I'd rather say geometric insights. It is a rather remarkable fact that there is (essentially) a one-to-one correspondence between hyperbolic metrics, complex structures and conjugacy classes of (good) representations of the fundamental group to PSL(2,R)
3
each of those gives a different way of looking at the same things with its own technical advantages and they can be combined to give much sharper tools
 
ok
way above my head, but worth looking into :)
 
It often happens that you get families of Riemann surfaces, which then correspond to paths in the moduli space, so it is of interest to understand the geometry of that moduli space, which is quite intricate
 
can you suggest some literature?
 
There's a french astérisque "Travaux de Thurston a propos des surfaces" or something, which I liked pretty much, but I seem to remember that you don't read french.
 
The "Thurston" there is Bill Thurston?
 
2:34 PM
thanks
 
@JM Yes
@Alexei: then look at the work by the master himself: Thurston, Three-Dimensional Geometry and Topology, that is easily found on the web...
"a propos" aargh, "sur"
Travaux de Thurston sur les surfaces, Astérisque, 66-67, Soc. Math. France, Paris, 1979
@Alexei: Thurston: First, though, we must be more precise about what we mean by two hyperbolic structures being the same. There are in fact two important notions of equivalence, giving rise to two spaces: moduli space and Teichmuller space. ...
... Informally, in Teichmuller space, we pay attention not just to what metric a surface is wearing, but also to how it is worn. In moduli space, all surfaces wearing the same metric are equivalent. The importance of the distinction will be clear to anybody who, after putting a pajama suit on an infant, has found one leg to be twisted.
 
lol :D
thanks a lot!
 
Nice! Stein & Shakarchi - Functional Analysis (Princeton Lectures in Analysis) is out!
But it is almost 80 EUR!
 
@Jonas: That's some good and some bad news. OTOH, if the Euro keeps going this way, I will soon be able to afford it :)
 
Hah. I will save a bit so I can buy it.
 
2:49 PM
One would think a university press would keep prices low...
 
Yeah... The other books are around 50 EUR.
 
Maybe they'll have a Christmas offer or something...
 
In post-soviet Russia, most books are under $30
under $20 even
probably because the demand is very low
 
SFAICT, even Soviet Russia had cheap, high-quality books.
 
2:51 PM
yes
 
Does PUB have Christmas offers?
 
and I'm not even counting the samizdats...
 
@Alexei: maybe they want to discourage the useful russian servers :/
 
'education for the masses' was a very important part of the communist doctrine
 
It contains a cute selection of topics.
 
2:52 PM
@tb useful russian what?
 
.djvu...
 
ah
well, guilty :) buying books from amazon is prohibitively expensive due to low currency exchange rates, unless they're published in russia
so whenever i have to read a book in english i essentially have to download it
 
I guess what everybody in Russia do to find a book but I tell no one
 
@JonasTeuwen Definitely. Looks rather great! They can continue their great series indefinitely, as far as I'm concerned.
 
I wonder if I'm allowed to buy some books as PhD student that can be useful for my field.
 
2:55 PM
Aw man, Mir's bankrupt already?
 
@tb If I understood correctly, this book is the last one in the series. I believe Stein is 83 now and Shakarchi is out of academia.
 
Oh no!
 
it's really sad, but there's no other option, because local libraries rarely have relevant books in stock, at least in my town
 
(The dust cover also only mentions four volumes)
 
@Jonas: ask your prof. Usually they have book funds. Or apply for a grant, they often include some bucks for books
 
2:56 PM
Okay, nice.
 
what's even more sad, the same is true for the journal articles
 
And how about the university libraries, @AlexeiAverchenko?
 
most local libraries in Russia lack subscription to springer and other major publishers
 
Those subscriptions are unreasonably expensive.
 
so when someone wants to read an article, one has to ask one's friends to download it
 
2:59 PM
@JonasTeuwen Which makes the existence of this deliciously ironic...
 
i mean, friends in Moscow :)
 
Oops, that was meant to link to Alexei's comment.
 
Hah!
 
there are even anonymous servers that facilitate sharing of such downloaded articles
i think there must be a p2p network too, but i'm not aware of one
 
Ah yes... but let's keep them anonymous, eh? ;)
@Alexei: I know of one, but it went kaput last year.
 
3:01 PM
@JonasTeuwen seen this?
 
No, but I know what the complaints about that system are.
 
It's simply ridiculous.
 
that's one reason why most major russian mathematicians now always mirror their works on arxiv
 
And then there are these nice guys from Elsevier...
 
Here they encourage to publish the papers in open access, but I believe that can be up to 100x as expensive.
 
3:04 PM
@t.b. Now that I haven't previously read...
 
I heard the Journal of Topology staff moved away from Elsevier
 
@JM It's always hard to tell seriousness from irony online. If the latter: I guess you're hanging out too much with mathematicians :p
 
No, really, I haven't seen that article before. Now my blood pressure has gone up...
 
Right. The chicken is soaking in pomegranate syrup.
 
I have to wonder if that withdrawal was for real or they're just saying what others want to hear. That sort of business is too lucrative to just let go of.
 
3:14 PM
Eh?
 
Pomegranate syrup??
Is that some kind of weird israeli recipe?
 
Nope...
 
He's trying out marinades...
 
You take a lot of pomegranate arils, add a shitload of sugar while heating and stirring, the arils let out their syrup.
This one is not a try, I did that a year ago. With vastly less pomegranates too!
Last year I had like one small one, now I used two big ones. I actually drowned the chicken in the syrup. If I had a sterilized container I might have saved a half for future cooking.
 
Mmm...
 
3:19 PM
@JM: Maybe you want to have a look at Bruno Kahn's page for further pointers
 
That is the same Elsevier as the Elsevier that publishes the ridiculously expensive book by Adams about Sobolev spaces I presume?
 
Ah, it's week-end again, so the chat becomes @Asaf's Kitchen Showâ„¢
@Jonas: yes, of course.
 
@tb: During weekdays too sometimes :P
 
@Jonas, Right, the SD guys.
 
@Asaf: yes, I noticed those unscheduled special shows by our favorite host.
 
3:23 PM
@tb It's not every weekend, too. Only the ones when I'm cooking some fancy dinner.
Sometimes we just eat sandwiches instead... :-)
 
or just go and miss the train :p
@JM: Did you notice that we changed our dresses about the same time, lil' bro?
 
Yeah... stupid university closing the exit carousel...
 
What does the fire police say to that?
 
@tb Shouldn't that be sister, if you both changed dresses?
 
I'm not really able to follow this conversation...
 
3:25 PM
@t.b. Apparently so.
 
What conversation? I thought everyone just randomly hitting their keys on the internet...
 
Ow crap, I have to finish my thesis within two weeks.
 
@Jonas: good luck!
 
Thanks :).
Asaf here said my spaces are too small.
 
Remember what Erdos taught us.
"Another roof, another proof."
 
3:26 PM
Oh, that.
 
I think that Henning is very correct in his comment on math.stackexchange.com/questions/74820 I wonder if I should have answered differently.
I'm not used to popular-mathematics questions in set theory :P
 
I prefer the quote "my brain is open".
 
Am I the only one who has the impression that the rotational symmetry of the Gravatar algorithm has the unfortunate side-effect of producing things reminiscent of the swastika and other ugly stuff?
 
Oh wow... you really got a swastika with an iron cross in the middle this time.
 
Hah :D.
Maybe I should switch to something different.
 
3:35 PM
The motif is always to have a 90° axis. I would suspect that the ones that cannot have reflection symmetry will invariably look like a swastika of some sort...
 
Axis of power?
 
Okay... I did not choose my words carefully there... :D
 
Well, if John Cleese drove around Minehead and shouted in German...
"I'm sorry, he's a bit on edge... He hasn't slept since 1945."
 
The German Python Shows are awesome!
 
I have a new gravatar.
(It is a about a caffeine rush...)
 
3:38 PM
The Oatmeal?
 
Yep.
Oh wait. Is that allowed?
 
@tb I bet that even more if you know German... :-)
 
Let me check...
No :(.
Back to the stars.
 
@Asaf: I guess so... Eric idle's German is pretty decent, the others though :D
 
@tb What is the funniest joke in the world?
 
3:42 PM
Does that even exist? I would presume that what is the funniest thing is quite subjective.
 
@Jonas: It's a Python thing. ;)
 
It's a Python sketch.
 
(@Asaf: that one is in YouTube, yes?)
 
@JM Of course. I'll find it in a moment.
 
3:44 PM
@Jonas: Enjoy. :)
 
Damn... :D.
 
"Wenn ist das Nunstück git und Slotermeyer? Ja! Beiherhund das Oder die Flipperwaldt gersput!"
Oh man, I just killed @tb
 
O noes!
 
@Asaf: Zere vere zwei peanuts valking down der Straße, and van vas a salted … peanut
 
Hmm, the Germans that I don't know speak better English than that, but this would be funnier.
 
4:00 PM
It's intended to be so horrible, it's hilarious. ;)
 
:P
THAT'S NOT FUNNY!
 
Then you aren't the intended audience. ;P
 
Or... I was quoting the Gestapo officer John Cleese.
 
I know; I was crafting a rejoinder to it anyway. :)
(speaking of which, Cleese's Twitter feed can be zany.)
 
4:13 PM
@Asaf: I think I read it quite thoroughly. Did you want me to proofread it?
 
@robjohn No, I doubt I need an actual proof reading for this sort of questions. I do it myself usually. Just wondered if you ruined my statement about long answers that no one is gonna read :-)
 
5:04 PM
@AsafKaragila I did ruin your statement. I read it fairly carefully.
 
Drats :-)
Thanks for the vote, I guess.
 
5:58 PM
hello all
 
i am an engineer
never met mathematicians b4....except that my dad was a math teacher
 
Tough luck.
:-)
 
i didn't get it
 
Tough luck for being an engineer.
 
6:01 PM
only recently i felt that i shud hve tried out at math !
 
Perhaps.
 
after seeing math.SE
i didn't even knew math was so rich in theory
 
Hi, can anybody tell me how POM can contribute to mathematics?
 
the engineering math was one heck of a thing.....i shud nver be taught to any students
 
I like Philosophy in that it questions everything, specially the main themes in life
 
6:04 PM
sorry it is 'it'
 
but as far as I see, POM isn't but about "what numbers are" i.e. it doesn't help in finding new stuff in mathematics, like new fields in mathematics. Am I right?
 
Philosophy of mathematics
 
Ah.
I'll be back in a few minutes. I need to reboot after a kernel update.
I'm back, baby!
 
I wonder why the engineers typically hate when someone talks about the math behind any of engineering task
 
6:18 PM
Because that math is ugly and mostly inaccurate?
 
nope.....they like the ugly calculations....only reaon is they do not know the basic concepts...thats why perhaps....thats my huch
 
Hm. Either way, I have to take a shower and finish cooking dinner. So I'll be seeing you later.
 
k
 
I can't wait to taste that chicken!
 
cool.....njoy
@Asaf : let me know wen u r back....i'd like to know ur views on research in signal processing and its applications....and also about AI tasks...
 
6:38 PM
hi @Andrew
 
hi
 
are you a mathematician ?
 
7:15 PM
@Rajesh: I am a set theorist. I really care little about such topics.
Also, chicken pomegranate? Awesome.
 
7:33 PM
is there a way to see your progress on a badge?
 
so i should have gotten the badge months ago, like i thought, ok.
thanks
 
Which badge?
 
sportsmanship
 
Ah.
Well, if you wanna complain about it I have opened a grand Badge Bugs thread on the meta...
 
7:41 PM
which one? i don't see. tried search and browsing the [bug] tag
 
1
Q: Missing Badges Thread

Asaf KaragilaSeeing how I think that I am missing a badge, and I don't think it is a good idea to open a thread for every time someone thinks he is missing a badge, I hereby post a thread so people could post answers whenever they think they are missing a badge. Answers can be given in comments, since they a...

 
thanks! :-)
it also makes me feel better that not everyone has this badge
 
Sure.
 
7:57 PM
how is the research in basic sciences supported in over there
 
I'm not sure I understand the question.
 
does the government in israel support basic sciences research is what i meant
 
Oh. I have no idea.
I think there is some support.
 
cool atleast it believes in math and science
 
Well, a government ought to support its scientists.
 
8:04 PM
well not all scientists are into basic sciences ?
 
And not all scientists get support.
 
i mean lot of funding goes into engineering and medical stuff
when i logged into data.stackexchange it shows my name as jon.doe6769 !
@Asaf : what is meant by userid that is asked in data.stackexchange.com
?
 
The number which appears in your profile link on the site.
math.stackexchange.com/users/2987/rajesh-d <- then your user id is 2987
 
ok
 
8:42 PM
@AsafKaragila Rebooting after a kernel update? What is this? 1991?
2
 
@JonasTeuwen No, THIS IS SPARTA!!!
 
9:09 PM
@quantumelixir Hi there. I am sorry. I hadn't seen yours before starting in on my answer. I am reading yours now.
I will comment when I am finished.
Oops, he is gone.
he thinks his answer is similar to mine. It looks so much more complicated, but I think it is simply the same idea of breaking things up in the sum of positive and negative numbers. He seemed upset that I didn't acknowledge his answer in mine.
Back to reading his answer...
 
The chicken was awesome.
 
Please help me understand a sentence, without doing anything actually
 
@Asaf: what kind of chicken?
 
"the discriminant is a symmetric function in the roots which reflects properties of the roots – it is zero if and only if the polynomial has a multiple root, and for quadratic and cubic polynomials it is positive if and only if all roots are real and distinct, and negative if and only if there is a pair of distinct complex conjugate roots."
 
Was it thoroughly showered?
 
9:18 PM
@robjohn: I can understand the disappointment. quantumelixir was working essentially the whole day on the answer (I saw it being bumped many times).
 
@robjohn I made pomegranate sauce.
It was left for three hours to soak in the marinade, it bathed real good this time :-)
 
@Gigili: What is unclear here?
(just asking)
 
Everything is clear, I just don't understand it
 
So your polynomial has roots z1,...,zn
The discriminant is a function of the roots D = f(z1,...,zn) (it depends only on the roots of the polynomial)
 
The discriminant means delta?
 
9:21 PM
Yes. For a quadratic polynomial it's b^2 - 4ac
 
I see
@tb Got it, thank you
 
Now to say that it is symmetric, is to say that it doesn't matter in which order you plug in the roots into f.
@Gigili: That's it, then? great!
 
@t.b.: I started mine at about 2 AM and didn't stop, except to walk the dog at 7:30, until it was finished around noon.
 
I worked on several answers for a full day.
 
@robjohn: I know about your habit of having editing windows open, so I don't doubt that.
 
9:24 PM
@Asaf: sounds good. We like pomegranates here, too. I don't think they are in season here since I haven't seen them in the store recently.
@t.b.: I understand his feelings, and I apologized in a comment. I am reading his answer to proofread.
 
It's just the season.
 
@tb Was a great help. I was thinking about every part of it for about five minutes! Thank you again.
 
We got two huge and ripe ones, extra juicy!
 
I will check when we go to the store tomorrow morning to see if there are some there.
 
@Gigili: You are welcome, of course :)
 
9:29 PM
@Jack: The point of the thread is not to delete the answer when the badge problem is fixed, but rather to add the solution into the answer so future people will be able to use this knowledge too.
 
My brain hurts.
 
Try wine.
 
I am trying to read the last bit of quantumelixir's proof, but he has written |x| as max(x,-x), which while correct, because the expressions for x are non-trivial, it makes for complicated reading.
 
9:49 PM
@Asaf: Huh? How did I manage that? robjohn is definitely missing here but he don't need no stinkin' badges, anyway :)
 
Holy crap!
That is quick!
Someone help me with a calculation.
14% of 700, is the same as 5% from?
 
2000?
 
Where are the numerical folks when you need them? :-)
 
14% is 1/7ish
 
1960 to be precise.
@Jacopo buona sera!
 
9:57 PM
@tb Guten Abend!
 
Dankeschön!
 
And good day, @everybodyElse
 
What's up in Pisa?
 
Not much, I'd say. Except I don't have internet at home anymore, which puzzingly meant that I studied much more, these days...
 
So drinking a bottle of wine is the same as drinking four beers, in terms of alcohol.
 
10:02 PM
@Jacopo: Can't hurt, I'd say :) Self-inflicted abstinence, or forced upon you?
@Asaf: I could've told you that directly without having to do a boring calculation
 
@tb Well, different wines have different alcohol volume :-)
 
yeah. 12-18 but so does beer
 
True dat.
 
I drank a beer called "Hell and damnation" some time ago.
 
Is this why you are doing analysis?
 
10:13 PM
Hmm, yes it is.
 
@AsafKaragila I can undelete if you want, but basically when I looked at the site again, I had the badge. No message from a human or anything, and I certainly didn't do anything.
 
@tb I have checked some of your papers and they suggest to me that you're not really an analyst. Or at least, it is analysis which I know nothing about. What field is that?
 
@Jack: Interesting. I think you should undelete it for at least a little bit, if no one comes forward as the one fixing the problem then perhaps you should delete it indeed.
 
@AsafKaragila done
Noone else got the badge. I would have figured a lot of other people would have it
 
Sportmanship? I got it...
 
10:19 PM
what's the issue here? you got a badge and you think it was for no reason?
 
@tb A little bit of both. The tenant suspended her contract, and I've thought about not subscribing one
 
@Jonas: hm. identity crisis in the morning, identity crisis in the evening, thanks guys!
 
@Jonas, @tb: I already claimed that tb is not a regular analyst. He's a topologist in disguise, methinks!
 
@Jonas: I don't know. I'm somewhere in the middle of abstract harmonic analysis, homological algebra and geometry. Use a lot of functional analysis (mainly for understanding group actions that arise from a geometric setting).
But also a lot of abstract nonsense (category theory)
But I'm trying to reduce that.
 
@anon: should have had a badge for a long time, mentioned it under a support thread on meta, it got fixed within 30 minutes
 
10:23 PM
oh
 
Ah, that would explain your knowledge of functional analysis.
I'm more into "real" harmonic analysis.
 
"real"
The real harmonic analysis is on abstract LCA groups.
Stone-von Neumann-Mackey theorem for the win!
 
Real as in real numbers.
 
Even worse :-D
 
@Jonas: My main work is on so-called bounded cohomology, a gadget introduced by Gromov for topological spaces that has many surprising applications in what is called rigidity theory. (Discrete subgroups of Lie groups, symmetric spaces, hyperbolic geometry, etc.)
I like functional analysis a lot, but I mainly use the soft, abstract stuff. A bit of structure theory of some special spaces, but no hard estimates.
 
10:30 PM
Okay. Nice. I'm doing less abstract things. For the next four years I will try to adapt/find a theory for harmonic analysis with a non-doubling measure.
Good night guys @AsafKaragila @tb.
 
Oh, interesting, I was just about to ask a bit about that, but another time, then. Good night, @Jonas!
 
Sure, I will tell some more about it another time.
 
Great, looking forward to it. Sleep well!
 
Thanks.
 
Someone engage in a stimulating discussion.
 
10:39 PM
What's your take on Stanford offering simplified versions of their courses on the internet for free? Could something like that be done for advanced mathematics?
 
I said stimulating! :-)
 
@Jacopo: what does simplified mean? Do you have a link?
 
I have never heard of that before, so I have yet to have a concrete opinion.
 
@Asaf: maybe this is very silly. So there is a model of ZF in which there is a non-separable set of reals. Can you say anything about its structure? In particular, can you sort of prescribe some of its properties (closed, or somewhere in the Borel hierarchy?) (I don't know much about the actual forcing argument, it's just idle curiosity).
 
I'm thinking of ai-class.com, but there are db-class.com and ml.class.com too. Those are simplified in the sense that less material is covered, and grading is totally internet-based
 
10:43 PM
@tb This model is the basic Cohen model, the original proof that ~AC is consistent relatively to ZF. The set itself is Dedekind finite, it has no countable subsets.
If one exists, then one exists which is unbounded.
Simply by taking a homeomorphism of (inf S,sup S) with R (given, of course, that S is the Dedekind finite set)
Note that if S is such set then every convergent sequence is converging within S, due to the fact that it is eventually constant.
Interestingly enough, the basic Cohen model is a model of the selection principle, thus the Prime Ideal Theorem and its equivalents, such as the ultrafilter lemma.
 
Oh, nice (I have never seriously thought about Dedekind finite sets and completely choice-free worlds). So S is closed in the sequence sense.
 
I am not sure whether or not such set is Borel, or even analytic. I'll see what I can find, though.
 
Silly question 2: so open are defined as usual, using intervals. Closed sets are complements of open and these closed sets are certainly sequence-closed. The converse is wrong, probably?
 
Converse?
Well, a Dedekind finite set of reals is an example of a set which is not closed, and in its closure lies a number that no sequence from S reaches.
 
Something like that is what I suspected.
The reason I'm asking is this question where countable choice came up
 
10:53 PM
By "nowhere else" what does he mean?
Oh right. I misread it for "nowhere dense" at first and thought it was a typo :-)
And yeah, you need some choice for that..
However I think that if C is closed then you can find such sequences without choice.
The example given in the aforementioned models is that of S such that cl(S) has points which are not the limit of any sequence from S.
 
Actually, I didn't see Didier's answer, which seems to get by without choice.
 
It is interesting, since S is non-separable, but cl(S) is.
 
Yes, that's funny.
 
I still owe you an answer about the choice-consistency strength of a canonical representative function for cardinals.
 

« first day (444 days earlier)      last day (4594 days later) »