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10:00 PM
@GnomeSliceツ Desire Z.
 
@ArdaXi Yes, but what happens if you don't remember your thoughts?
 
@GraceNote That gif is shockingly and awesomely subtle.
 
You'll end up like that guy in Memento ;p
 
There are worse guys to be. Memento was awesome.
 
Yeah. Imagine making yourself kill someone without feeling guilt.
 
10:03 PM
Yes, but he's also ceaselessly driven forward in ignorance of his own actions and motivations and the long term consequences they have
 
Endlessly seeking one's goals sounds like a better "worst case" than mistaking false memories for reality.
 
@RavenDreamer [snark]Don't we already do this for ITG?[/snark]
 
user30
@GnomeSlice Yah, Desire Z has a hardware keyboard
 
@FallenAngelEyes That's one reason why I've come over to the "ITG Needs to Go" camp.
 
(Dreaming, a loud voice is heard)
Who are you? What do you want?

I don't understand

Who are you? What do you want?

- - - -

You were dreaming.

Yes.

About what? You're thinking about escape again, aren't you. Don't. There's no way off Z'Ha'Dum. Might as well give up. Reconcile yourself, as I did.

The first obligation of a prisoner is to escape.

Ah. So, if one is a prisoner of love, one must escape to solitude? If one is a prisoner to joy, must one escape to sadness? I see you're still upset that I won't tell you my name. But what does it matter? If I tell you my name is
All this talk about thought/memory reminded me of this excerpt from an episode of Babylon 5.
 
10:10 PM
@RavenDreamer Seriously though, going on the notion that you believe in consensual reality, things change based on how many people perceive them. If 6 people say the car that just sped by was green and 1 says it was blue, the person who says it was blue is considered "wrong" and the car thusly becomes green by virtue of having a larger consensus.
 
@RavenDreamer Why does everyone hate ITG?
 
@GnomeSlice because human memory is infinitely fallible.
 
@RavenDreamer S...so?
 
@FallenAngelEyes Yeah, it's crazy. The human brain does all sorts of crazy, messed up things. See: Inattention blindness / Change blindness.
 
@RavenDreamer Yeah, it all kind of breaks my head to think about sometimes.
 
10:12 PM
@GnomeSlice So if you have a faulty cornerstone, you can't build a stable wall.
@GnomeSlice Except that Questions are the Wall, and ITG is the mire of @#$* you're trying to build a cornerstone from.
 
If you have mossy cobblestone however, you can pick it up and place it later.
 
@RavenDreamer Wh...what? Isn't the point of ITG to help with faulty memory?
@badp You can pick up clean cobblestones, too.
 
@RavenDreamer I've honestly had a really tough time convincing people who aren't regular users of the site that ITG is a bad idea. Most people I talk to think it's awesome because of human fallibility.
 
@FallenAngelEyes I think they're neat questions, but they don't fit the format of the site.
 
I think that I wouldn't mind if they remained here
 
10:14 PM
People tend to say to me "Wow, that's great, there's no other resource for that!"
and I'm hard pressed to recommend something better
 
@GnomeSlice - All we have to go on for ITG questions is the author's memory. If the author has unknowingly misattributed memories of the game, there is no one who can tell him that he's wrong.
 
@RavenDreamer So?
 
@RavenDreamer Aaaahhh, reality! flails
 
Playing Deus Ex, just found the Dragons Tooth Sword..
and so every other weapon in the game become useless.
 
@GnomeSlice directly from the FAQ
"You should only ask practical, answerable questions based on actual problems that you face."
ITG are not guaranteed to be answerable, nor are they practical questions with relevance outside the scope of the asker.
 
10:17 PM
@RavenDreamer ITG questions are practical, answerable, and based on problems the askers are facing.
 
@GnomeSlice I'm sorry, but you're wrong.
"I can't remember this game" is not a problem one faces.
 
@RavenDreamer Well, you're the mod.
@RavenDreamer Sure it is...
 
Unless you're in a hostage situation, where the kidnappers are demanding a copy of the game if you want to see your pet Dog again.
 
@RavenDreamer Yes it is. The problem is that you can' remember the game.
I dislike ITG this game, and think it should go, but it is a problem.
 
@Wipqozn That's not a problem that relates to gaming.
 
10:19 PM
@RavenDreamer That's a ridiculous analogy.
 
Yes. I was going for Hyperbole.
 
Any Gaming question about "HOW TO BEET BOSS", comes down to "I want to figure this out, so I can get more enjoyment from this game" (i.e. progress)
Any ITG question is basically the same thing.
At least in my opinion.
 
ITG questions are like "there's this boss in this game, but I don't know which one exactly, but how do I beat it anyways"
 
@RavenDreamer So? That's happened before.
 
@badp Why?
Genuinely curious about your reasoning, not being snarky or anything.
 
10:21 PM
How do I beat Gannondorf in Super Metroid
actually that one is too specific relative to the average ITG
 
@FallenAngelEyes Mostly, it's because I see that many such questions, for everything that might be wrong with those questions, do get the answer the asker was looking for
despite everything they do work.
 
@badp Accepted answer rate was somewhere around 69% or something last time someone ran numbers?
 
There are issues of deduplications and effort that need to be tackled
@FallenAngelEyes More than 2 in 3? That's so much better than one'd guess just from reading the discussions
 
We could make it 100% by closing all the non-accepted questions
 
I was considering adding the requirement of a doodle or something, but it might be too drastic
 
10:24 PM
@badp +1
 
do like that thought, but hard to implement
 
@badp According to Oak's comment, it's 74%
12
Q: Do we still like 'Identify This Game' questions?

Nick TAs time has worn on since last-year-ish, and various identify-this-game (ITG) questions worn on GSE denizens, has the community position on them changed? Half the time they seem ridiculously vague, and how answers are voted on seems totally random, which seems to distort the point of reps (thoug...

 
3
Q: Cold themed top-down shooter game with constant freezing damage

badpI'm trying to remember the name of a certain game with a few peculiarities. The game's theme is cold. You start from a warm safe spot and have to move from safe spot to safe spot to the end of each level. In the middle there is cold, which damages you, and baddies, which you have to kill. The H...

↑ I took a few details wrong, I never even played the game, and yet I got the right answer :D
 
Frozen Synapse is actually quite similar to Flotilla.
 
Wasn't there some ITG question about snakes or whatever? I can't find it
 
10:26 PM
Hey wait a minute, where have I heard the name Blendo Games before..?
 
thought it was recent....
 
0
Q: Age of Mythology: best opening strategy?

JohnMy brother and I are getting back into playing the original Age of Mythology together, with our favorite map being Jotunheim. He always kicks my butt though, and I think part of it has to do with him being the first to build walls and gates at the holes. I've tried rushing to build the walls, m...

 
@FallenAngelEyes but consider @LessPop's response to that: "@oak: That answer rate is actually substantially lower than our answer rate site-wide. More to the point, as tzenes has shown, users who come to the site via ITG roughly 40% more likely than other users to never cast more than one up vote, or to put it another way, to fire their question into the void and then disappear forever"
@NickT Identify the Identify the Game?
 
@RavenDreamer So?
 
2
Q: What is the name of this 2D vertical shooter?

grieverThe game I'm looking for is a 2D vertical shooting game. The graphics were better than Raptor and I think it's a Windows game. I remember it had an upgrade system (weapons for ships like missiles). It wasn't set in space, and consisted of multiple levels. It was released before 2000, and was lik...

 
10:28 PM
The site is still helping that user.
Isn't that the point?
 
OP's final comment: "thanks for comments,I will try some games you gave."
lol
 
@NickT ...lol.
 
@NickT +1
 
This question seems to have very specific criteria but was downvoted a bunch/closed
 
10:30 PM
@GnomeSlice I don't think "it has a good chance to help one person" is enough reason to allow questions on the site.
 
@NickT I agree, that question is perfectly fine.
@RavenDreamer ...Why not?
Isn't the point of the network to answer questions?
 
Answer questions for many people, yes.
It's supposed to serve as reference material.
That's the reason we have the promo grant in the first place.
 
Which gif, @Raven?
 
@GnomeSliceツ We want to retain users though so we can grow as a site
We need a healthy userbase
 
@RavenDreamer recommend me games, that will help me
me me me me me
 
10:33 PM
@FallenAngelEyes Well... you can let the people ask their ITG questions, and probably not retain most of them, or you can ban ITG altogether, and not retain any of them. No?
 
Ah, that one
 
@GnomeSliceツ That is another way to look at it, yes. I'm admittedly still on the fence about this.
 
@GnomeSliceツ I say the latter.
 
How many of the ITG questions are marked as "answered" but not really?
0
Q: What's this multiplayer game with falling blocks of color and hypnotic rhythms?

KatieK Are you a swiftly falling block of four colors? Do you generate hypnotic rhythms in sync with player actions? This is the teaser for PAX Prime's Omegathon Round 3. What game will it be? This game will probably have a strong multi-player component, with short rounds and a clear winner....

was checked off, but not really answered. Some people probably just think they should check some answer after so long (because the site reminds you?)
 
ITG questions suffer from limited scope (only the OP can determine the correctness of the given answers), the SE format (why upvote an answer when we cannot determine if it's right or even helpful?), and use as reference material (not only is the question only likely to help the OP, it is entirely likely that even people trying to remember the same game will remember different parts of it).
 
10:35 PM
Now I annoyed myself with that throbber.
 
@NickT Wh...huh?
 
> I had not seen this comic! I'd thought about Lumines but discarded it since each block has only two colors
but marks it answered anyways
 
We had a meta discussion about that question.
 
@NickT Admittedly that question had its own issues
 
-1
Q: Why was identify-this-game question closed?

KatieKThis question was closed as not constructive. It's about identifying which game will be played at an upcoming competition, based on some teaser information and similar previous competitions. Why was it closed? Could someone please explain why this was not constructive? While I probably won'...

 
10:37 PM
7
A: Why was identify-this-game question closed?

Matthew Read I probably won't be able to select an answer (for sure) until the end of the month In other words, all the answers are guesses. Only the answerer with magical powers to see the future, or with luck on their side, can accurately answer the question. When put that way, can you see why it's u...

That's a pretty good answer against ITG in general.
 
Yes, it is.
 
@ArdaXi I... "handled" it for you.
 
@FallenAngelEyes yeah, but people coming up with stats for how useful ITG questions use the (flawed, imho) assumption that "accepted answer = useful"
 
@RavenDreamer It had already left my screen.
 
@ArdaXi I have more lines on my screen then, apparently.
 
10:39 PM
@RavenDreamer frowns What's your resolution?
 
In fact, I'm going to go upvote that answer right now.
1900 x 1200
 
Ooh, @Raven, you're still on campus?
 
I think.
 
I'm 1920x1200.
 
@NickT My main concern is, if we decide to come up with a policy regarding outright banning ITG, that we are holding all question up to the same standard of scrutiny and not just ITG because of the nature of the question.
 
10:39 PM
@GraceNote Nah, I'm home for now. About to go hunt down some dinner, though.
 
Ahha
I'll get you one of these days...
 
@FallenAngelEyes - All questions should be held to the same standards.
 
I don't believe that we can cherrypick when and when not to apply site standards to questions.
2
@RavenDreamer I should hope so, hence why I asked tzenes to clarify what he meant about answers being "authoritative"
 
Banning ITG should be a side-effect of policy, not the policy itself.
3
 
@ArdaXi I agree, hence why I don't think that using reasons like "too localized" or "too vague" should be the defining point of any new take we come up with the deal with ITG. We should be cracking down on all questions that have those problems, not criticizing only ITG questions for it when say, there's a StarCraft II question left open with the same problems that we're not holding under the same scrutiny.
 
10:43 PM
Okay, anyway, as mentioned. I retreat for now. To the food repository!
 
Eat well, @Raven!
 
For tonight we fight in hell! Wait. I think I crossed my metaphors again.
 
@FallenAngelEyes The issue of ITG is that they do not help anyone but the asker.
@RavenDreamer Don't cross the metaphors!
 
@ArdaXi I don't believe that that is true and even tzenes agrees that we shouldn't be closing questions based on a supposition of how few people it may or may not help.
 
@FallenAngelEyes So you think there may be someone else who knows exactly as little about a game they're looking for as you do?
 
10:45 PM
@ArdaXi You know what they say - Too many chefs look a gift horse in the mouth.
 
@RavenDreamer Never give a chef a horse.
 
@ArdaXi And how many people are going to have the exact same troubleshooting issue you have or the exact same build that you're running and want advice on?
 
@ArdaXi Questions should solicit definitive answers
 
@FallenAngelEyes Plenty.
As someone who's searched for troubleshooting issues and was helped by the answers, I can attest to that.
I've yet to see anyone stumble on someone else's ITG and be helped by it, though.
 
@ArdaXi I know that Oak has
I've also been helped by some ITG's
 
10:49 PM
Example?
I mean actively searched for, not stumbled upon.
 
user30
@GnomeSlice Wunderlist is a lot better than I remember it being when I tried out the Mac beta.
 
So as in tried to use the googlejuice and come here or what?
 
@FallenAngelEyes For example.
 
I don't google for them anymore, so that in particular hasn't happened for me
and given the community's divided stance on them, I don't ask them here
 
@FallenAngelEyes Exactly.
I doubt it will ever happen, beyond maybe one or two odd cases.
 
10:54 PM
I don't think that's a good enough reason for banning them
See @badp's answer here
 
@FallenAngelEyes I realise. That's why I'm not participating on meta about it.
 
I am not disagreeing that ITG questions are problematic and that we need to take steps, whether it be policy changes or whatever, in order to address them. But I do disagree that banning them on the grounds of perceived usefulness to others would be a poor decision.
@ArdaXi Then there is nothing more to say on the matter, and we can agree to disagree. :)
And on that note, I think I'll kick back back and relax and play some Touhou
 
0
Q: How can I run this game in window mode?

mordi2kI've been poking around in the options menu, trying to find a option for window mode. But, I can't seem to find any. So, is there any way to get this game running in window mode?

 
0
A: How can I run this game in window mode?

user12116No. (Apparently answers must be thirty characters, so there's this)

Maybe there's a reason for that.
 
11:13 PM
Anyone have the game? You could verify this works and post it
need to modify reg key then bar the game from changing it back with permissions
does shift-launching things run them as admin or something?
 
I think so, yes.
 
Huh, there's really no option for running Deus Ex in windowed mode?
 
Who wrote the current incarnation of the Bridge description? Either use the gerund or don't, don't mix it up.
Registry hack does not work.
 
@ArdaXi what users did you deny access to the key?
it seems odd that you should deny the current user but then launch the game with shift (assuming that is admin rights it should negate what you just did)
 
Err, none. I don't use UAC, so if I did that I would deny myself access forever.
 
11:20 PM
So you didn't even follow the protocol but said it doesn't work?
 
@NickT I followed the instructions to the point where they would have any effect without screwing up my system.
 
Umm, you could just give yourself the permissions back afaik
 
I am not going to completely deny myself access to a registry key. That would mean I could no longer change any graphics setting in DX:HR ever.
@NickT Not if I don't have permission to.
 
You're the owner of it, you can modify the permissions all you want
 
@NickT Unless I take away my permission to.
 
11:23 PM
what's more, if you're an admin you can take ownership of whatever you want then reassign the rights
 
If I select Owner -> No rights, then nobody is going to be able to touch it.
 
Unless you give yourself the rights back
 
@NickT If nobody has any rights to it, no rights can be assigned.
I've done that before.
Had to resort to booting in safe mode and modifying the rights.
 
The owner can always modify rights to a file
you cannot remove that ability
 
@NickT I did something I cannot. How interesting.
 
11:25 PM
and even if you somehow disown the file, you can reclaim ownership if you're an admin
you probably removed yourself as owner somehow, but didn't know how to reclaim
 
@NickT Don't make assumptions on my knowledge.
I did know how to reclaim. I was owner of the file.
 
guys, would you be so kind and join 'Starcraft II' room as well? :) I'm trying to make it more popular...
 
Or, well, one of them.
@mission I don't play.
 
0
Q: does it matter to the story whether you use lethal or non lethal in deus ex?

markDoes it matter to the story whether you use lethal or non lethal in deus ex? Does it make a difference in the gameplay? eg with exp or whatnot

 
@ArdaXi So you claim that if I modify a registry key to deny the current user "Set Value" permissions, I will be irrevocably unable to give myself those rights back
 
11:28 PM
@NickT Nope.
I claim that it's happened to me before and I'm not risking it.
 
Walk me through how to make a file unaccessable to me
 
I seriously don't care enough.
 
Then I'll make all the assumptions I want about your knowledge
 
Well that's just plain ignorant.
But fine by me. I'm going to bed. Good night.
 
you make wild claims then when asked to somehow prove them you just balk
 
11:30 PM
@NickT I did not make wild claims. I answered your question.
You're telling me what to do based on what you assume I know. I don't like that.
 
I'm asking you to demonstrate what you know because I don't
 
@NickT Yes, and I don't care enough about being right to bother and demonstrate it to you.
 
lol
 
You asked a question, I answered it, and now you're insulting me.
 
you're citing nothing else besides your own experience as proof you're right
but why is my experience that I'm right invalid
 
11:32 PM
This is the problem
I wasn't trying to prove anything.
I was explaining to you why I did not do it.
 
user30
lol
 
@ArdaXi Hm? What do you mean?
 
"will result in termination by lazer and increase of the topic length."
Oh, not a gerund, my bad.
 
room topic changed to The Bridge: of Gaming's StackExchange™ AlienOverlord AskQuestion™ mothership, wherein any attempt to play or discuss unapproved games will result in termination by lazer and an increase in the topic's length. [wipqozn-gravitation-law]
 
So are you talking about registry keys or files now
 
11:36 PM
@NickT I don't care enough to continue this. Go find someone else to bother.
 
so "la-la-la I'm right"?
lol
 
No, I don't care who's right.
 
whatever floats your boat
 
user30
Nick, have I got you on Steam?
 
user30
did I gift you a game?
 
11:37 PM
I dunno
I'm in the GSE group
 
If it makes you feel any better, I'm perfectly willing to assert you are completely right and know everything about NTFS and Windows.
 
@ThomasMcDonald Defense Grid?
 
user30
@NickT Possibly.
 
@FallenAngelEyes you're playing through deus ex?
 
user30
Yah, found you
 
11:39 PM
@ArdaXi now you've moved onto "screw it I don't care", but still harboring this knowledge that you refuse to even discuss
which I'm actually interested in, but refuse to share
 
@Wipqozn No, was wondering about the question asked there
 
user30
I remembered there was someone I had from here who's Steam name varied wildly from their SE name
 
@ThomasMcDonald Think there's a couple like that, I know @Ivo's is quite different
 
user30
@FallenAngelEyes Yeah, but I know Ivo's. :)
 
user30
11:41 PM
Also, who's getting these gaming.se shirts?
 
user30
I doubt Jeff will want one
 
I got a t-shirt and hoodie
hoodie wasn't really GSE though
so I'm kinda clueless about it
 
@NickT If you were genuinely interested, then you shouldn't have gone into the defensive immediately.
 
user30
aaaah my god how have I not been on Serious Eats before
 
I was being incredulous
 
11:43 PM
You were strawmanning.
It's very annoying.
 
I'm trying right now to somehow lock up a file and throw away the key but I can't figure it out
 
Anyway, it's really late now, I'm really going to bed.
 
user30
@Nick: get box, lock padlock, ingest key
 
but it shall pass
 
The way you came off was that all you cared about is being right, and not about what I had to say.
 
user30
11:45 PM
alternatively, dissolve key, put epoxy in the lock and throw it in the foundations of a new skyscraper while they're setting
 
I denied everything to my user then made the owner some other user, so I can't access the file at all, but whenever I go to the permissions window, Windows constantly tells me that "you can't see the permissions but click here to take ownership so you can"
 
user30
@Arda As we all do
 
I'm not perfect. All I know is I once had to sacrifice an entire day trying to regain access to a file after messing with permissions, and I do not wish to repeat that, so I'm not going to risk it.
 
@ArdaXi Because I genuinely thought I was right? I still am looking for proof that I'm not
Aren't you british?
 
@NickT See, that's my point. I'm not looking for proof. I never stated that I am sure. It's anecdotal evidence.
@NickT I'm Dutch.
 
11:46 PM
Ah, figured you were all about ascerbic criticism
don't know the stereotypes of the mainland
 
I never meant to attack your knowledge. I was defending my actions, not my knowledge.
 
@NickT Making assumptions on people's character based on stereotypes is not usually a great way to go about having a civil conversation >_>
 
@ArdaXi I was trying to figure out if you remembered incompletely or I was
@FallenAngelEyes neither is taking anything said on the internet to closely to heart
 
@NickT true enough
 
37 mins ago, by Nick T
Anyone have the game? You could verify this works and post it
no 4th tri-force piece?
 

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