The Nineteenth Byte

Quine without a character Write a program in any language that takes as input any character, and outputs a quine in the same language, that does not contain that character. For instance (for some made up language): Input: b Output: s(fg;fg) Run "s(fg;fg)" Output: s(fg;fg) Input: ( Output: s[f...

totallyhuman

@NewSandboxedPosts do x without y

Erik the Outgolfer

at first I thought it would be more trivial

like output a quine but without the char

user165474

are x w/o y challenges discouraged?

Erik the Outgolfer

1:42 PM

yes

totallyhuman

most of the time

user165474

ok

Adám

@EriktheOutgolfer Unfortunately, ⍵⍴⍺⍳∊ is a syntax error in APL, except as a snippet.

Erik the Outgolfer

well it wasn't required for it to be syntactically valid in APL

Beta Decay

@Adám How do you write APL programs? Do you have a special keyboard?

Jan Dvorak

1:49 PM

Those exist indeed

Beta Decay

Nice, I just found one sold by Dyalog

dyalog.com/apl-font-keyboard.htm

Jan Dvorak

Not my favorite price tag, but still reasonable

Poke

@NewSandboxedPosts I'm not sure I see how this is possible

Adám

@BetaDecay I personally have made my own keyboard layout (which mostly happens to match my physical keyboard). You can also download layouts and utils for all platforms.

Beta Decay

@JanDvorak Wow, I just saw that... :P

user165474

1:52 PM

@Poke Make two quines which share no characters, then output the first if it doesn't contain characters from it and the second if it does

Poke

@HyperNeutrino I think a lot of (most?) languages will find that difficult if it's even possible

user165474

I agree.

Adám

@BetaDecay I use this

My layout is basically a super(-duper)set of the traditional APL layout.

Beta Decay

Nice

Erik the Outgolfer

@mbomb007 the username is what I was constantly thinking about (also it was a joke)

Adám

1:57 PM

@BetaDecay We've been contacted by Unicomp as they want to produce a keyboard matching Dyalog's layout (a subset of mine).

totallyhuman

2:17 PM

hey i have two messages on the starboard

throws dart at starboard hoping to hit bulls-eye

Riker

@betseg why lol

Adám

@BetaDecay :

Riker

9

A: Show me the nearest demon

JavaScript (ES6), 31 29 bytes f=(x,s='6')=>x<3+s?s:f(x,s+6) f=(x,s='6')=>x<3+s?s:f(x,s+6) ;[1,2,3,6,35,36,37,100,365,366,666,999,1000].forEach(x=>console.log(x,f(x))) “That is why, I delight in weaknesses […] For when I am weak, then I am strong.”

tfw js being dumb as a brick actually saves you bytes

Jan Dvorak

I love the quote

Riker

yes

Jan Dvorak

2:26 PM

“That is why, I delight in weaknesses […] For when I am weak, then I am strong.” ~~ 2 Corinthians 12:10 — Jan Dvorak 14 secs ago

mbomb007

2:44 PM

@EriktheOutgolfer Don't joke about things that can cause questions to be downvoted or closed, like that a user is posting about homework.

Erik the Outgolfer

I don't think it would get closed as long as it's a good challenge

mbomb007

It doesn't matter what you think. It's similar to the "be nice" policy, and you shouldn't put forth false accusations.

Especially if you don't believe them.

Erik the Outgolfer

it was based on a TNB starred message basically

although I don't get why would someone VTC a valid question

and it wasn't intended to violate be nice anyways

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Program Equilibrium Iterated Prisoner's Dilemma Tournament This is an iterated prisoners dilemma tournament with a twist- you can perfectly simulate your opponent! Iterated Prisoner's Dilemma The prisoner's dilemma is a two-player game in which players can choose to either "Cooperate" or "Def...

Christopher

@Riker I am good with that

Nathan Merrill

2:56 PM

@HyperNeutrino You are really lucky for two reasons: Your top answers aren't using random, and the top answer isn't tied

Adám

Hm, 250 special symbol assignments on my keyboard layout. Works beautifully.

Christopher

Lol my first job I just got pays 9.50 an hour. MW is like 7.50... I get a 50 cent raise in six months

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Select the best candidate You are hiring and want to find the best candidate for a job position. You're interviewing some amount of candidates, and the candidates want to know immediately after the interview if you hire them or not, otherwise they won't be available. Of course, most of this is ...

Riker

@Christopher cool

muddyfish

Anyone else get an email from SO asking if you want to do some research on designs for SO?

Riker

3:04 PM

@Christopher you're also what 15? :p

@muddyfish no :/

I don't have much more than like 200 rep though

nvm

muddyfish

I have 2k rep on SO

Erik the Outgolfer

I have 300something rep on SO

totallyhuman

i have 0.1k

heh

Mayube

@totallyhuman hah! I have 0.13k!

totallyhuman

D:

betseg

3:28 PM

i have 1/4k

betseg

3:39 PM

codereview.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/apl ;_;

DJMcMayhem

I have 9/4k

Beta Decay

~1/2k

Christopher

@Riker Age ++

.303k

Riker

1/5k

Christopher

My rep is 1024 :D

betseg

3:54 PM

you mean 10000000000?

Christopher

Yep

Downgoat

@Adám are you saying APL is readable?

Adám

@Downgoat I'm saying that APL is an executable mathematical notation. If you don't know math, you can't read math.

Jan Dvorak

@Adám that would be Haskell

Downgoat

4:13 PM

@Adám ok this explains why Greek letters scare me

Arjun

Hmm..

A new update has just dropped today. It introduces a new mode to the game.

Mayube

what is this, 2014?

Clash Royale's where it's at my dude

Arjun

A new update has just dropped today. It introduces a new mode to the game.

Trust me, the update's made the game a lot better! @Mayube

Mayube

I dobn't play mobile games anyway

that requires me to own a mobile

totallyhuman

4:32 PM

... Not necessarily...

Adám

@JanDvorak IMHO, Haskell doesn't look much like math.

@Downgoat I don't get it. There aren't too many Greek letters in math. Just δ∆⊖π∏σ∑, no?

Arjun

Self Advertisement:

7

Q: It's Anagram Quine, not just Quine!

The Task In this challenge, your task is to write a program, which takes in no input, with as many anagrams that are quine of themselves as possible. Your score will be the number of anagrams of your program's source code that are valid quines divided by the total number of anagrams possible, i...

It hasn't got much attention, but I think it's a good one.

Downgoat

@Adám what about alpha beta and all other scary letter

Arjun

Zeta

Eta

Adám

@Downgoat I have not seen alpha and beta in math.

Arjun

4:43 PM

Epsilon

@Adám Haven't you? Really?!

Adám

@Arjun No, wait, that's not true, beta and gamma are in statistics.

Wheat Wizard

@Arjun It hasn't gotten much attention because it is virtually impossible and any valid solution would be boring.

betseg

@Adám they're used to represent angles

Adám

@betseg Right, but you can really use any letter to represent any entity. They are not really symbols as in operators or pre-defined sets, etc.

Arjun

Theta is the one which is mostly used to represent angles, at least India where I live.

DJMcMayhem

4:45 PM

@Adám Also Phi and Tau

Adám

@Arjun Yes, but you can as well use A B C.

Arjun

@Adám Yeah, of course. True.

@WheatWizard Impossible? Still?

Wheat Wizard

@Arjun Oh wait you changed it

Arjun

@Adám But using Greek letters makes you cool!

Adám

π is 3.14… That's set. No-body would rename that. ∆x is the change in x. That's pretty set. ∏ is the product.

Mistah Figgins

4:47 PM

alpha is used in physics too

Adám

@Arjun And scares off Downgoat.

Mistah Figgins

alpha radiation and angular acceleration

Adám

@MistahFiggins Again, they are just names. I'm talking notation; functions, operators, etc.

Wheat Wizard

@Arjun I am now very confused. The output section doesn't seem to be about output. They are quines no?

Adám

@Downgoat But yes, APL is pretty readable. You just need to get started. (Almost) all the symbols are very mnemonic.

DJMcMayhem

4:52 PM

Random question: How many anagrams of 2i2i are there? I'm counting 5: 2i2i, 22ii, i22i, i2i2, ii22

Arjun

@WheatWizard You have to write some code. Your score will be the (total number of anagrams of your source code that are quines) divided by the (total number of anagrams of your source code possible) multiplied by 100. The anagrams that are quine can output in any way except hardcoding it in a variable. Higher Score wins! Does that make sense? I'm terrible at explaining stuff! :P

betseg

@DJMcMayhem 2ii2

Wheat Wizard

@Arjun Why multiply by 100? it doesn't change anything

Adám

We have the familiar ones you know from math: +-×÷!∩∪∊<≤=≥>≠≡≢

Wheat Wizard

And why is that section labeled Output

Arjun

4:53 PM

@WheatWizard Converts it into a percentage.

Adám

@Downgoat ○ circular functions ⊥ base ⊤ inverse of base ↑ take ↓ drop ⌹ matrix division ? random ∧ AND ∨ OR, etc.

Arjun

@WheatWizard Because it says that Your quine-anagrams can output in any way except writing output to variable.

Wait, someone just down voted. Care to explain why? @downvoter

Wheat Wizard

That whole section is beyond confusing

Christopher

Hello. It's me. I was bored and decided to say hi.

Arjun

@DJMcMayhem I think it can be calculated by 4!/2!2!

@Christopher Hello. It's me. I was bored and decided to say hi.

DJMcMayhem

5:02 PM

@Arjun One thing I will say is that the current scoring method highly encourages short programs over lots of quine anagrams. If I could choose between a 5-6 byte solution that has only one quine anagram, this would score waaaaaaay higher than a 15 byte solution with hundrends of anagrams. So it's mostly about golfing a quine which isn't any different from our existing challenge.

Arjun

@WheatWizard That's why the down vote?

Wheat Wizard

No I was just saying that

Arjun

Oh, okay, sorry.

DJMcMayhem

For example, the current shortest jelly quine is ”ṘṘ. This would get an incredibly good score of 33.333...%

That's basically unbeatable

Arjun

@DJMcMayhem At least 3 chars required.

DJMcMayhem

5:03 PM

My recent submission has a good score only because it reuses characters a lot, keeping the number of anagrams down significantly.

@Arjun It has 3 chars.

Do you mean 3 distinct characters? 3 ASCII characters? You'll need to clarify

Arjun

ABC -> 3 chars, ABB -> still 3 chars @DJMcMayhem

Battery draining....1%

DJMcMayhem

OK? I'm not sure what your point is. The Jelly submission I mentioned has 3 characters

Arjun

So, if I don't reply for long...Battery is dead.

Mistah Figgins

RIP battery

Arjun

@DJMcMayhem Okay, sorry.

Wheat Wizard

5:06 PM

OK well I'm voting to close as unclear

Arjun

Unclear?

Is it unclear?

Wheat Wizard

Yes the entire "output" section is very unclear.

Arjun

Okay, will update when I have a full battery... But if you want to close, go ahead

DJMcMayhem

0

A: It's Anagram Quine, not just Quine!

Jelly, 33.333...% ”ṘṘ Try it online! Community wiki because I did not write this. If you like this solution, or want an explanation, see Dennis's original post here.

Correct use of CW?

Mistah Figgins

CW?

DJMcMayhem

5:09 PM

Community wiki. It means I won't get rep if you upvote it

Wheat Wizard

@DJMcMayhem Yeah

Mistah Figgins

ah

DJMcMayhem

And editing is encouraged (more than usual)

Mistah Figgins

I just didn't know the abbreviation

DJMcMayhem

Oic

Riker

5:11 PM

@DJMcMayhem iirc you don't have to

but yea that's a valid use of it

Wheat Wizard

He should though

DJMcMayhem

@Riker I know I don't really need to, but since I couldn't have figure it out ever, I think it's worth doing in this case.

It's weird to say that CW should be done for dupe answers, cause if it really is optimal, multiple people could come up with it

But I'm not one of them, haha

New Main Posts

2

Q: Roses in the Garden

Byteman owns the most beautiful garden in Bytetown. He planted n roses in his garden. Summer has come and the flowers have grown big and beautiful. Byteman has realized that he is not able to take care of all the roses on his own. He has decided to employ two gardeners to help him. He wants to se...

code-golf array-manipulation

Christopher

@Arjun Hi

Mistah Figgins

5:34 PM

Whats the word or when a function has an inverse? looking for an adjective

Wheat Wizard

invertible?

bijective?

Mistah Figgins

bijective is it

ty

Erik the Outgolfer

strawpoll.me/13020811

(What's the best golfing language?)

Jan Dvorak

Java

DJMcMayhem

5:51 PM

I'm pretty sure you all know what my answer would be if it were on the list

Adnan

@DJMcMayhem brainflak?

Christopher

@Adnan My vote

totallyhuman

go

it's absolutely wonderful

for any additional function, you need another import

it's great

Anonymous

@EriktheOutgolfer Mu. The best golfing language is the one that solves the task at hand.

Erik the Outgolfer

link please? I think I remember this although I don't remember where the online interpreter was

ok why does Jelly tie with C?

@Mego

Anonymous

6:04 PM

Not sure if trolling...

Erik the Outgolfer

no not trolling I want the link to Mu

if you have it that is

Christopher

@Downgoat You should play Escape Goat

Anonymous

Mu (negative)

The Japanese and Korean term mu (Japanese: 無; Korean: 무) or Chinese wú (traditional Chinese: 無; simplified Chinese: 无) meaning "not have; without" is a key word in Buddhism, especially Zen traditions. == The word == The Chinese word wú 無 "not; nothing" was borrowed by East Asian languages, particularly the Sino-Xenic "CJKV" languages of Chinese, Japanese, Korean, and Vietnamese. === Pronunciations === The Standard Chinese pronunciation wú historically derives from (c. 7th century CE) Middle Chinese mju, (c. 3rd century CE) Late Han Chinese muɑ, and reconstructed (c. 6th century BCE) Old Chinese ...

Anonymous

> The term is often used or translated to mean that the question itself must be "unasked": no answer can exist in the terms provided.

Erik the Outgolfer

oh I thought you were referring to μ

Anonymous

6:06 PM

Nope

Erik the Outgolfer

I see

Downgoat

@Christopher wait what

totallyhuman

Gigglingly

That's a word

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

code-golf quine Output a program that outputs a program that outputs your program You must make to programs, program A and program B. A must output B. B must output A. A must be different from B. Standard quine rules apply. Your score is A's bytes + B's bytes.

Christopher

@Downgoat It is a game. Escape Goat. Fun game (cuz goat)

user165474

6:16 PM

@NathanMerrill Yes having that otherwise would suck because then I'd need to keep doing runs and averaging scores and that takes time.

user165474

Also if we're bragging about SO rep I have about 10/3 k rep

Christopher

@HyperNeutrino Late to the meme -1

user165474

:(

DJMcMayhem

@ConorO'Brien Welcome to the 20k club!

You certainly deserve it. :)

Oh, and I just noticed something else interesting

I recently passed 500 consecutive days on PPCG.

Not sure if I'm proud or embarassed

Christopher

@DJMcMayhem But but, but. I have 1024 rep. Much better.

@DJMcMayhem Proud

DJMcMayhem

6:22 PM

Emproudassed

Erik the Outgolfer

@DJMcMayhem that's not a permanent accomplishment

although total days is

Wheat Wizard

Can other people view your consecutive days?

Erik the Outgolfer

no

Wheat Wizard

Thats too bad

Erik the Outgolfer

but other people can view your consecutive starred messages

DJMcMayhem

6:30 PM

@EriktheOutgolfer Now that you mention it, I'm slightly hesitant to post messages in here to ruin my current streak. :P

Erik the Outgolfer

it's already ruined but whatever

(joke fail)

Wheat Wizard

CMC no code required, find a long streak of messages by a user with stars.

score is number of messages

Erik the Outgolfer

it'll take a while until you get an answer at all

that's because we have 23818 starred messages currently

DJMcMayhem

@WheatWizard I was just about to say that, haha

Erik the Outgolfer

AKA FGITW

Christopher

6:41 PM

Parent logic: Can play Borderlands 2-Pre, can't play Halo 4

New Meta Posts

0

Q: Are kernel-mode functions and kernel modules valid code-golf answers?

In general, user-mode processes have a much richer API environment available (through stdlib, and other libraries you can possibly import), than does (Linux) kernel-mode code. However there are some situations I can think of where it would conceivably be shorter to give a kernel-mode c answer th...

discussion code-golf

DJMcMayhem

@Christopher Just FYI, complaining about your family in a random chat room on the internet doesn't really get you anywhere or contribute to anything positive.

5

Jan Dvorak

It could spawn a discussion

Conor O'Brien

@DJMcMayhem :D thanks

I didn't even realize it

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