The Nineteenth Byte

1:00 PM

@orlp Is that a challenge accepted?

@Qwerp-Derp That is the truth. Originally, Iverson was a mathematician frustrated with math's oddities. He set out to make something better to replace it...

Leaky Nun

Come on guys, if you guys are still not answer this, I'll answer it in every possible language.

CMC: median

Erik the Outgolfer

Jelly, 8 bytes: LHịṢµS÷L

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer doesn't work

Erik the Outgolfer

Yeah I think I must do something else.

Leaky Nun

1:14 PM

@EriktheOutgolfer All you need is ‘ (increment)

Erik the Outgolfer

Yeah I thought of it, although I'm still thinking of it...

Leaky Nun

because the index is (1+n)/2

Erik the Outgolfer

Hmm... it seems overcomplicated.

Adám

1:32 PM

TuxCopter

Yesterday the world population passed 7.5 billions

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Make this Language Turing Complete! I am trying to develop an esolang (not really), but have not gotten very far. All this esolang can do so far is increment and decrement a single register, . So your task is to add one command that makes this language Turing-complete. popularity-contest

user165474

@LeakyNun @EriktheOutgolfer 1+¡0 is the best I can do for the Jelly fibonacci code thingy. I can't seem to figure out how to do it starting from 0 like the built-in does it.

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino just interchange the two numbers

Downgoat

@TuxCopter idk if good thing bad thing

user165474

1:43 PM

Oh huh

user165474

ohhhhhhhhhhh

user165474

that makes sense now

user165474

:D

Erik the Outgolfer

Remember the explanation I gave for <dyad>¡<nilad> yesterday. It looks much like fibonacci.

user165474

Yes. I remember the f(k-1) + f(k-2) thing; I realized later that day that the fibonacci sequence is defined that way with f(0) = 0 and f(1) = 1.

user165474

1:45 PM

Wait so I can make any Lucas sequence with coefficients of 1 using this template?

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino I believe so

New Main Posts

0

Q: Get rid of empty lines

Ah, yet another of my selfish uses of this Stack. Being a Chromebook owner, I'm a frequent user of the Ace IDE, the editor used by Cloud9. It has lots of tools for dealing with excess whitespace, but it notably lacks one: clearing empty lines. Your mission today is, given an input from a place ...

user165474

Cool. Alright. So that makes sense now; [dyad][repetition/implicit]¡[nilad] chains.

user165474

Yay.

user165474

Do you have any more coding exercises that I might be able to do?

Leaky Nun

1:50 PM

1 hour ago, by Leaky Nun

Brachylog-biased CMC: given string s, find maximal subsequence (not necessarily contiguous) which is a palindrome. E.g. "abcbda" gives "abcba"

@HyperNeutrino I think this is a good challenge for Jelly

user165474

Alright.

user165474

Ooh this may be tricky.

user165474

Let me write it in Python first to see if I can even get it there.

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino Jelly and Python have drastically different mindsets.

And I don't think I have a Jelly mindset either

user165474

@LeakyNun That is true. So do you think writing a Python solution first would even help at all?

Leaky Nun

1:53 PM

I think my mindset is more inclined to Pyth.

@HyperNeutrino slightly.

user165474

Alright. I don't see an easy straightforward way to do it but I might just be missing something.

user165474

Hm. I can't seem to figure out how I should go about this.

user165474

Let me try naming the critical components again like with yesterday.

Erik the Outgolfer

You're missing "Brachylog-biased", so this might actually be too difficult for non-Brachylog languages.

user165474

Does Brachylog have an easy way to do this?

user165474

1:57 PM

Probably an easier code task would be better cuz I'm an early-beginner at Jelly :)

Erik the Outgolfer

1 hour ago, by Fatalize

3 bytes: well…

Yes it's too easy in Brachylog AFAICT.

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer I beg to differ.

I thought before giving this to @HyperNeutrino as a challenge.

It's not really difficult, in the sense that it is rather straightforward.

@HyperNeutrino do you want a framework?

user165474

Yeah, sure. Thanks.

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino framework: generate all possible solutions → filter for suitable solutions → find maximum

user165474

Oh right, I don't need to make this optimized...

user165474

2:13 PM

@LeakyNun Is there a built-in in Jelly to get all possible arbitrary length contiguous or non-contiguous slices from a string?

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino yes

Erik the Outgolfer

Contiguous yes, non-contiguous I don't think so.

user165474

Oh okay.

Downgoat

@Downgoat no you silly goat... use git reflog >_<

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer yes, even for non-contiguous.

@HyperNeutrino what do you call the collection of the slices?

ETHproductions

2:15 PM

reflog <-> golfer? :P

Erik the Outgolfer

@LeakyNun Huh? I couldn't find anything.

Downgoat

@ETHproductions :O Linus Torvalds is Dennis confirmed??

user165474

@LeakyNun I'm not sure I understand your question.

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer they are not called slices. what do you call them?

@HyperNeutrino can you list what you would like to find, for "abc"?

@Downgoat did you see my message in the Cheddar chatroom?

user165474

"a", "b", "c", "ab", "bc", "ac", "abc"

Erik the Outgolfer

2:16 PM

@LeakyNun I generally call them "slices" or "sublists".

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino and what do you call this?

user165474

Subsequences?

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer think harder

ETHproductions

@HyperNeutrino That would be some sort of combinations builtin I think

user165474

Or no, permutations?

user165474

2:17 PM

(Combinations)

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino fill in the blank: ["", "a", "b", "c", "ab", "bc", "ac", "abc"] is the _ of "abc".

Thomas Ward

@LeakyNun if that is what i think it is, then the first item is invalid.

Leaky Nun

you can just remove the first term

Erik the Outgolfer

@LeakyNun Oh I found it.

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer good

Emigna

2:19 PM

How do you fix output so that it's not joined as a string in Jelly?

so you can view it as a list

Erik the Outgolfer

ŒṘ

Leaky Nun

@Emigna for example?

@EriktheOutgolfer ŒṘ vectorizes too much

@Emigna you might want to join by newline (Y IIRC).

Emigna

@LeakyNun Wanted to see the list output from powerset

Downgoat

@ASCII-only have you seen super-cool cheddar debugger? should I add to VSL?

Emigna

Yeah that works, thanks!

user165474

2:21 PM

Hm. This is tricky; I can't seem to get the term for it.

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino again hint: fill in the blank: {{}, {1}, {2}, {3}, {1,2}, {2,3}, {1,3}, {1,2,3}} is the _ of {1,2,3} (in Jelly strings are considered as list of characters)

user165474

subsets?

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino maybe you really don't know the term.

It's called "powerset".

user165474

Oh hm. No, I didn't know the term.

Leaky Nun

you know now then

user165474

2:23 PM

Yep :)

Erik the Outgolfer

Jelly terms can be really confusing even to experts sometimes.

user165474

Well now I know what to Ctrl-F on the Jelly git page

user165474

ŒP

user165474

generate all possible solutions → filter for suitable solutions → find maximum

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino that's a nice step

Erik the Outgolfer

2:27 PM

Yes it's ŒP at first.

You can do it in 7 bytes.

user165474

I need to essentially filter to only have elements that are their own inverse

Erik the Outgolfer

Easy peasy!

user165474

ŒḂ to check for palindromeness

Erik the Outgolfer

Yep!

user165474

Ðf for filtering

Erik the Outgolfer

2:28 PM

Yep again!

user165474

One more byte to find the maximum.

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer I can do it in 6 bytes

user165474

Hm. Ṁ doesn't seem to work.

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino use Y to check the current output

You don't need a maximum

user165474

It gives d for abcbda so I suspect it's doing element-wise comparison of lists, not by length.

user165474

2:30 PM

@LeakyNun ŒPŒḂÐfY?

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino yes that's how you check them

user165474

That gives all palindromic powersets.

Leaky Nun

so you can see which one to use

user165474

The last one. Oh wait.

user165474

@LeakyNun ŒPŒḂÐfṪ

Leaky Nun

2:32 PM

@HyperNeutrino congratulations

Erik the Outgolfer

Yeah that's what I did too.

user165474

Yay :D

user165474

That was faster than yesterday :P

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino the challenge is easier than yesterday's

user165474

Yes.

Erik the Outgolfer

2:32 PM

@LeakyNun Can you really do it in 6? ŒPŒḂÐf is already 6.

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer so you would have to not use those two

user165474

I feel like the two 2-byte ones need to be swapped with 3 one-byte ones.

Erik the Outgolfer

There are no 3-byte ones.

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer read what he said carefully

user165474

3 one-byte not 1 three-byte

Erik the Outgolfer

2:36 PM

Yeah... it's the the effect of ignoring duplicate words again...

ETHproductions

>> "👩‍👩‍👧‍👦".length
> 11

Emoji are strange...

user165474

How does that work >_>

user165474

Oh wait they're not the same character?

user165474

They render as the same box for me rip

ETHproductions

It's four separate emoji, with zero-width joiners inserted between them to make it appear as one emoji

Leaky Nun

2:39 PM

The four emojis are 👩‍ 👩‍ 👧‍ 👦

Downgoat

Solution: Cheddar which has built-in emoji support :D

Leaky Nun

When combined, they look like one emoji

ETHproductions

In addition, each emoji is two UTF-16 characters, so JavaScript sees 11 chars

user165474

Oh hm.

ETHproductions

@Downgoat Awesome :D

user165474

2:40 PM

I'd need to use my chromebook; my laptop can't render them

Leaky Nun

👩👩👧👦 without the zero-width separators

user165474

Are those people emojis?

Leaky Nun

ya

user165474

like I think it's woman+woman+girl+boy

Downgoat

Question: because in Australia they say "Battery is flat", do they say "Tire is dead"?

user165474

2:42 PM

But it doesn't render so I have to look it up.

ETHproductions

Original source for this emoji

Downgoat

cheddar> "👩‍👩‍👧‍👦".length
7

Should it be one?

Leaky Nun

@HyperNeutrino @EriktheOutgolfer are you still thinking about it?

Erik the Outgolfer

yep

although œ& will not work.

ETHproductions

That's how it looks for me in Firefox/Windows 7

Erik the Outgolfer

2:44 PM

I don't think it renders in Linux at all.

user165474

Still thinking about it, but I have to go in about 5 minutes.

user165474

@EriktheOutgolfer I'm using Linux. Also, I'm on school WiFi, so I can't load the image either :P

Downgoat

Java Question: Would List<?> a = new ArrayList<Integer> make a a List<Integer>?

user165474

Because imgur.com is blocked.

ETHproductions

@Downgoat idk, if it's a single character then you can't really manipulate it

Erik the Outgolfer

2:45 PM

@HyperNeutrino School WiFi doesn't allow images? o_O

user165474

Nope. Not from imgur.

ETHproductions

Would Dropbox work? (specifically dl.dropboxusercontent.com, I guess)

Erik the Outgolfer

Also, I think that *.imgur.com is what's blocked, not just imgur.com, since the image is in i.stack.imgur.com.

Poke

@Downgoat sort of i guess? generics are weird in java. with that definition you wouldn't actually be able to add anything to that list

user165474

@EriktheOutgolfer Yes, probably.

New Meta Posts

2:47 PM

0

Q: In code-golf is it always ok to print ASCII digits when an integer is asked for?

When the question clearly asks for an integer is it always OK to just print the ASCII digits of the integer without actually generating the integer value?

discussion rules

Leaky Nun

@Downgoat I thought you need new ArrayList<Integer>().

Downgoat

ah yes sorry

Question: why do List<? extends A> instead of just List<A>?

Poke

You could do List<Integer> a = new ArrayList<>();

Downgoat

user165474

Anyway, I have to go now. See you all later! (I'll keep thinking about a 6-byte solution for the palindrom problem)

Downgoat

2:49 PM

TIL goats are Navy mascot

@Poke oh, would that implicitly deduct the ArrayList type?

Business Cat

You generally don't need to specify the type in the new part

Poke

@Downgoat yes

remember that in Java there is no runtime difference between a List<String> and a List<Integer> etc

Downgoat

Question: have any of you hand-traced arbitrary unnamed for loops before?

ETHproductions

Um... sort of, I guess? Only in JS though

I had to do that with my Japt code after I left it alone for a year :P

Erik the Outgolfer

3:08 PM

@LeakyNun I made it!

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer congratulations!

Erik the Outgolfer

ŒPµfUṪ

Was that your code?

Leaky Nun

similar

my code was ŒPfU$Ṫ

we have different styles :p

Erik the Outgolfer

That's what I meant when I said I could guess Jelly code ;)

ETHproductions

@EriktheOutgolfer What does µ accomplish there?

Leaky Nun

3:09 PM

but one can change styles

@ETHproductions start a new monad

use current output as input (instead of input to the whole link)

ETHproductions

Ah, so you can use the current output on both sides

Erik the Outgolfer

Yeah, both regular ŒP and when you later apply U to it (it seems you're a newb in Jelly).

@LeakyNun Also, the $ is clever.

ETHproductions

I know a decent amount about Jelly actually, but I didn't realize you needed the result on both sides

Erik the Outgolfer

If it was just ŒPfUṪ, then the U wouldn't apply to ŒP, but ⁸.

ETHproductions

So that takes the powerset of the input array, filters to only the items that have all unique items, and then takes the last (largest) item

Leaky Nun

3:14 PM

because fU is a [dyad][monad] pair

Erik the Outgolfer

That or because ŒPf is a [monad][dyad] pair?

Leaky Nun

there isn't [monad][dyad]

ETHproductions

yeah, dyads always "attach themselves" to the link to the right I believe

Erik the Outgolfer

Not always.

Wheat Wizard

Does anyone know the specific meta post where we say that new languages for old challenges are non-competing?

Leaky Nun

3:17 PM

@ETHproductions there is also [dyad][dyad] pair in a dyadic chain

ETHproductions

oh, OK

The one question I've always had is, does µ force the chain to the left or the right to be monadic?

Erik the Outgolfer

There is also [nilad][dyad] pair.

To the right.

ETHproductions

Gotcha

Downgoat

3:35 PM

Question: func f(): ReturnType vs func f() -> ReturnType

Leaky Nun

@Downgoat language?

you're asking us which is better?

Downgoat

yeah which you prefer

Leaky Nun

the latter because I'm a math enthusiast

Kritixi Lithos

3:58 PM

@betseg Because you haven't been in the APL room for some time, you might be interested in: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/36965876#36965876

Adám

@KritixiLithos Oh, you noticed. Have fun.

Kritixi Lithos

:) the first questions seem doable with my skill

Adám

@KritixiLithos I am considering posting Problems 6, 8 , and 10 as code-golfs. What do you think?

Kritixi Lithos

you mean here on PPCG?

Adám

@KritixiLithos Yes. I have permission.

Kritixi Lithos

4:03 PM

6 feels like a dupe (but I'm not sure), but 8 and 10 seem nice

Adám

@KritixiLithos I expected 6 to exist, but it doesn't seem to exist: codegolf.stackexchange.com/search?q=n-gram and codegolf.stackexchange.com/search?q=k-mer

New Main Posts

-1

Q: Displaying n with n

What I want: Quite simply, I want a text based display, that asks for an input, n, then shows that value on the display! But there's a catch. Each of the 'true' 'pixels' (the ones filled in) has to be represented by that number n. Also, if n is not a single digit number, then it has to loop back...

code-golf

New Meta Posts

1

Q: Reviving a lost language

A while ago I did something rather stupid. After I added a Brain-Flueue flag to the ruby implementation of Brain-Flak I went ahead and deleted the old Brain-Flueue repository. This made sense at the time because the new Brain-Flueue was better in every possible way, and the old one was preventi...

discussion

Geobits

Seems more like a dupe of Golf me an ASCII alphabet than anything.

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Excel NORMSINV function Implement the excel NORMSINV function in your favourite language, shortest code wins Build in functions and standard loopholes are not allowed Loss of precision is also not allowed Reference C Implementation /* * Original C++ implementation found at http://www.wilmot...

Emigna

4:11 PM

There was one for the whole ascii character set a few days ago as well, but I think that got closed

Leaky Nun

4:23 PM

@WheatWizard BF!

New Main Posts

4:36 PM

4

Q: Brainflak Multiplication Metagolf

This question is the first of several Brain-flak Birthday challenges designed to celebrate Brain-Flak's first Birthday! You can find more information about Brain-Flak's Birthday here Last summer we had the Brain-flak Integer Metagolf, and the answers it generated have been very useful to the...

metagolf brain-flak

Leaky Nun

5:03 PM

CMC: input a character/single-character-string, output a 5x5 block with only that letter (separated by newlines)

trailing newline optional

Kritixi Lithos

example?

Leaky Nun

ccccc
ccccc
ccccc
ccccc
ccccc

Mistah Figgins

@ATaco I'm sad that you can't use your chatJax hosting service to upload pictures to PPCG's main site :(

Kritixi Lithos

Dyalog APL, 5 bytes: 5 5∘⍴

It's a train

Leaky Nun

Can you give me a TIO link?

Kritixi Lithos

5:06 PM

Try it online!

Leaky Nun

thanks

Kritixi Lithos

The A← assigns the train to a variable

so it isn't counted in the bytecount

DJMcMayhem

@LeakyNun 5 bytes in V: 5äl5Ä

Leaky Nun

@DJMcMayhem TIO?

DJMcMayhem

@LeakyNun Try it online!

Leaky Nun

5:10 PM

that's nice

can you explain the code?

Kritixi Lithos

For the Dyalog answer, 5 5⍴ shapes the argument into a 5 by 5 vector

DJMcMayhem

@LeakyNun Sure. 5äl means make 5 copies of the character under the cursor and 5Ä means make 5 copies of this current line

Leaky Nun

what is the l for?

Kritixi Lithos

Carrot, 9 bytes

#^*4^
^*4

Leaky Nun

TIO?

Kritixi Lithos

5:14 PM

Try it here (no permalink)

Leaky Nun

I like the background color

extremely reminiscent of carrot

Kritixi Lithos

:) it was based off the meme

Leaky Nun

what meme?

Kritixi Lithos

Carrots

DJMcMayhem

@LeakyNun Basically, in V a lot of functions are operators, which means they are called like <operator><motion> where motion is a movement that specifies which text to operate on. l is a movement that means one character to the right

Leaky Nun

5:16 PM

here did you confuse monad with dyad?

Erik the Outgolfer

@LeakyNun Jelly, 5 bytes: ẋ5Ṅ4¡

Leaky Nun

@DJMcMayhem I see

why do people not like to link to TIO?

Kritixi Lithos

@LeakyNun technically, the operator takes in one argument, whatever comes after it, but the type of the "stack" also matters

DJMcMayhem

So the same duplicate function works with arbitrary movements. For example, w is word, so äw will duplicate one word Try it online!

Leaky Nun

@KritixiLithos I see

Kritixi Lithos

5:17 PM

I thought it was a Monad because it took in one argument, but I wasn't sure

So is it still technically a dyad?

DJMcMayhem

And technically Ä is just a shortcut for á_, since _ is a movement that means this current line.

Leaky Nun

@KritixiLithos where is # documented?

Kritixi Lithos

@LeakyNun Here: github.com/kritixilithos/Carrot/wiki/The-Language#input

Leaky Nun

alright

user165474

Python 2, 20 bytes: lambda x:(x*5+'\n')*5 TIO!

Kritixi Lithos

5:21 PM

@LeakyNun Do you understand how the code works?

Leaky Nun

@KritixiLithos still reading the docs

Erik the Outgolfer

@LeakyNun Charcoal, 6 bytes: ＵＯ⁵¦⁵Ｓ

Kritixi Lithos

I could have also used $ instead of #, but it doesn't really matter in this case

Leaky Nun

@KritixiLithos what is ^?

Kritixi Lithos

It prepends the text onto the stack

Leaky Nun

5:23 PM

and where is it documented?

Kritixi Lithos

For example, Hello, World!^ is a Hello, World! program

It probably isn't a datatype, but here: github.com/kritixilithos/Carrot/wiki/The-Language#data-types

Erik the Outgolfer

Golfscript, 8 bytes + trailing newline: 5[*]5*n*

Kritixi Lithos

ooh, beats my lang by 1 byte

user165474

@LeakyNun Can you share your 6-byte Jelly code for the palindrome problem? I thought about it but I can't figure out which 3 monads/dyads to use.

Erik the Outgolfer

Yeah, since yours prints a trailing newline too.

Leaky Nun

5:27 PM

@HyperNeutrino here

DJMcMayhem

@LeakyNun (()()()()()){({}<(((((({}<((()()()()()){})>))))))>[()])}{}{}

user165474

Hm.

DJMcMayhem

Are those trailing newlines OK?

Erik the Outgolfer

05AB1E, 6 bytes + trailing newline: 5×S5×»

Leaky Nun

Trailing newlines ok

Kritixi Lithos

5:32 PM

@LeakyNun To help you out, the program starts with the stack as a string. The # adds the input to this stack string (which starts empty). Then the ^ marks the end of the string pushing. The *4 appends 4 duplicates of the stack to the itself. Then ^\n^ appends a newline to the stack. And finally, you duplicate it 4 times

Leaky Nun

I see

user165474

Powerset -> Filter Not In Reversed Array -> Change that to a monad -> Last Element

user165474

Oh hm.

user165474

The syntax kind of confuses me, because you have the filter before the reversed array.

user165474

Can you explain that syntax to me? So it's [monad][dyad][monad]$[monad]?

Kritixi Lithos

5:33 PM

The reasona^*1 becomes aa instead of a is that Carrot was supposed to be a golfing lang

Leaky Nun

@EriktheOutgolfer would you explain to @HyperNeutrino ?

Brainfuck, 31 bytes: ++++++++++>,>+++++[-<.....<.>>]

Kritixi Lithos

I quite like the hyperlink for a code block

Leaky Nun

@DJMcMayhem take it Brain-Flak

DJMcMayhem

I already did

user165474

Python, alternate solution, 26 bytes: lambda x:'\n'.join([x*5]*5)

Leaky Nun

5:42 PM

@HyperNeutrino is it longer or shorter?

user165474

Longer.

Leaky Nun

@DJMcMayhem that wasn't what I meant

DJMcMayhem

What did you mean?

Leaky Nun

I mean, take that, Brain-flak

DJMcMayhem

Oh, I see

Yeah, overall, flak tends to be longer than fuck

Leaky Nun

5:43 PM

@HyperNeutrino are you still here?

user165474

Hi.

Leaky Nun

The segments are:

ŒP
ŒPfU$
ŒPfU$Ṫ

DJMcMayhem

Except for some things that flak is better at, like large numbers or adding

Leaky Nun

try each of them to get a brief idea

@DJMcMayhem adding is just [->+<]

user165474

So I know that the first segment takes the powerset.

DJMcMayhem

5:44 PM

Oh

Kritixi Lithos

@DJMcMayhem yeah, because brainflak requires matched brackets

user165474

The second one takes the fU part and turns it into a monad, which filters an array so that it only keeps elements that have their reverse in the same array (not necessarily meaning that it's its own inverse, but that doesn't matter here because false-palindromes won't be long enough to be the longest anyway; only true palindromes will be the longest)

user165474

And the last one just takes the tail.

user165474

Oh hey, that makes sense. :D

Leaky Nun

that's a good analysis

user165474

5:46 PM

thanks

user165474

Yeah that makes a lot of sense now.

user165474