Ask Ubuntu General Room - 2017-03-01 (page 3 of 4)

« first day (2345 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (2620 days later) »

8:00 PM

#3, while I admire you @Zanna , it has been brought up multiple times in chat that your editing is excessive, especially for old posts which don't carry much value. I personally don't mind it and it doesn't get in my way, but it seems like it gets in the way of others. Maybe it's something to think about. Again, I personally don't care , am not attacking you, am not caring about whatever other users do with their time

@cl-netbox let's forget that part about me - request from the rest of the mod team

if you get my meaning

@ThomasWard sorry no ... unfortunately not ...

hence asking if you had Discord so we could communicate about that outside this room.

@cl-netbox hmm I was grateful to them for doing what I find very difficult to do myself. Maybe I shouldn't have said anything at all. I don't think their action was about me personally, just like my delete vote was not about you personally in any way. I guess I should keep quiet, I don't want to cause any more trouble

thankfully Kaz has discord :P

8:02 PM

Final thought:**get over it** , it's an old question, not worth a while. I don't know how much you lost there, @cl-netbox , but it's internet unicorn dollars.

@Serg I totally disagree, crap is crap. Whoever answers crap should expect deletion if the Q & A combination is of no use. 2. We all love Zanna and she deserves a medal for here efforts here. End of story @Zanna Would love to close the subject.

@Serg already done ... :)

@JacobVlijm Crap can be subjective. You have some of answers that are highly voted and accepted. How would you feel when someone deleted the question where your answer is accepted and you lost around 53 upvotes, that's 530 rep essentially ?

If there's an accept, don't touch it

@Serg That can't really work. To take an obvious case, it is relatively common to see sock puppets accepting answers of the master account and vice versa. I've also often seen really crappy accepted answers, and everything else you can imagine. The OP can't delete their question if it has answers and that seems reasonable, but if 3 high rep members of the community consider it worthy of deletion, the fact that the OP happened to have accepted it shouldn't make a difference.

@Serg exactly ... @JacobVlijm would care a lot ! if not more ...

8:04 PM

@Serg That doesn't follow. The accept is just 15 rep, no matter how many upvotes the question might have.

@JacobVlijm <3

@Zanna That's kind of stingy, innit? Less than three?

@terdon didn't calculate math there, 53 upvotes, 530+15, should be 545 then.

In case it's of interest, if a post has +3 or more, and has been on the site for 60 days, no rep is lost when it's deleted

@Serg No, I mean that while you have a point about deleting questions whose answers have many upvotes (which is something we tend to avoid, for precisely the reasons you state; you may remember some pretty serious fights with some overly delete-happy users and old—bad—questions), the accept isn't something that makes a difference.

Ah, yes, and there's what Zanna just mentioned which was implemented for precisely this sort of thing. I think I remember that it's relatively new.

8:07 PM

@Serg If an answer has 53 upvotes, it is highly unlikely an answer to a crap question.

@JacobVlijm Point isn't in whether question is crap. My argument is that when there is accepted answer, it should not be deleted.

@JacobVlijm Let's better not search for a proof ...

@Zanna any link to this info ?

@JacobVlijm You'd think so wouldn't you? And yet:

675

Q: What Application Indicators are available?

I installed Ubuntu 11.04 on one of my systems and I am using the Unity interface. Unity is working quite well so far but I really miss panel applets for net speed, cpu temp, and system monitor. These applets are useful for viewing quick info. Unlike 10.10, there is no other way to get this info...

software-recommendation indicator

142

Q: Which PDF Viewer would you recommend?

Which PDF-Viewer would you recommend to use in Ubuntu? At the moment I use the standard document viewer (Evince) but I'm missing features like stageless continous zooming.

software-recommendation pdf

106

Q: What IDEs are available for Ubuntu?

This question exists because it has historical significance, but it is not considered a good, on-topic question for this site, so please do not use it as evidence that you can ask similar questions here. See the FAQ for more information. This is a community wiki for IDEs available on Ubuntu....

software-recommendation ide

The list type questions are classic examples of highly upvoted yet bad (as in not a good fit for SE) questions.

@terdon Whooops?

8:10 PM

:)

All of those would (and should) be deleted today. We kept those, and overruled a vocal minority of users who wanted to delete, because they were OK when they were posted and have useful answers. However, that doesn't mean we want new ones like them.

^ totally

user136984

@terdon: I don't know what you are talking about, but shouldn't those be closed as 'too broad' or 'primarily opinion-based'?

@ParanoidPanda today absolutely, but practice may change over time.

@terdon AHA !!! What is this ??? Please compare it with -> askubuntu.com/questions/887813/… Now you better understand what I said earlier - right ? cl-netbox answer got DVs within seconds ... and the question was closed immediately

The same on link only answers; on SO sometimes highly upvoted, here not done.

user136984

8:13 PM

I don't think that those questions should necessarily be deleted as they do list helpful things, but closed I do think to prevent new answers being posted to them as we're not a listing site.

@ParanoidPanda that's the whole point terdon is talking about

@Serg stackoverflow.blog/2012/03/06/…

@terdon Hah thanks I was hunting for it

@ParanoidPanda Yes. And they have been. The only reason they're not deleted is that they are very old and have been around for very long, people have bookmarked them etc. That's what historical locks are for. All of those would be deleted on sight today.

4 mins ago, by terdon

All of those would (and should) be deleted today. We kept those, and overruled a vocal minority of users who wanted to delete, because they were OK when they were posted and have useful answers. However, that doesn't mean we want new ones like them.

@terdon Another great example for showing that you are a totally fair moderator by the way ! :)

8:16 PM

@cl-netbox you are comparing a question that was asked today to one which was asked in 2010 when the rules were not as clear and the scope less well defined. As I said, those would have been deleted today and it has nothing to do with who answered (or, for that matter, with who asked: note that one was asked by a moderator).

@terdon thanks for the source, noted.

user136984

@terdon: How come all but one of those questions is closed?

user136984

There is a notice on it and it is protected, but why is it still open if the others are not?

user136984

I have cast a closed vote. I hope that that was the right thing to do.

@ParanoidPanda Because one slipped through the net. It's closed now.

user136984

8:18 PM

Oh good.

user136984

:)

@terdon you mentioned that 3 community members can vote for deletion of such question. Just to voice my opinion, this might be too much of power given to non-moderator users, and I much rather see questions with accepted answers be handled by moderators only.

@terdon Besides that ... can you give me a valid explanation why this question is off-topic ? I am curious to know the reason ...

@Serg Well, the general position of SE is that the community should do the majority of moderating actions and you need 20k rep to vote to delete. I don't see why I would necessarily trust a mod more than three >20k users.

@cl-netbox Which one?

@Serg that said, I still don't understand why you feel the accept is relevant? What difference does it make if there is an accepted answer?

I often wish SE would remove accepts altogether.

@terdon I have Ubuntu OS installed on my machine. Now I use vmware as a virtual machine in order to run Windows. I found that when vmware works, after ~1 hour, my computer is stuck and I have to restart it ... askubuntu.com/questions/887813/…

8:21 PM

@cl-netbox Because it is the very definition of primarily opinion based. There are no celar guidelines on what the OP requires, it is simply asking for "the best foo". Those are always off topic.

user136984

@terdon Actually, that might be a good idea. You should perhaps suggested it.

user136984

They probably wouldn't remove such a major feature.

user136984

But it does cause unnecessary trouble.

@terdon Accept signifies a working solution ( in general, non-sock puppet case) for OP. While it might not necessarily be 100% right, it is something that work for a particular person, and chances that it should work for someone else. Thus, we have a problem solved, solution found, and then all of a sudden someone decides "welp, this is in my godly opinion is crap, so lets delete it"

@terdon and the explanation for the downvotes for my answer ?

8:22 PM

ugh. chrome is using 4.5 GB of RAM. Nothing else is running!!

@ParanoidPanda Oh, I'm sure it's been suggested. If not, I will.

user136984

@Serg There is the issue though with a lot of users just never accepting an answer and the question remaining in that still unsolved state. There is also the issue which I have seen countless times of when a user accepts the worst answer possible.

@Serg OK, although I feel that upvotes are a far better indication of a working answer. However, to take an extreme example, if I were to ask "what is the best way to cook rice?" on AU, and somebody answered and then I accepted, why should that stop the question from being deleted?

This ^

Off topic questions are off topic, no matter whether they have an accepted answer or not.

8:25 PM

^ and that

user136984

@terdon: Haha! I should do that one day when I get drunk! ;P

@terdon there's a thin balance of power - giving community users power to delete questions that have accepted answer, opens up possibility for abuse, which is why I said such posts should be handled by moderators

Abuse by 3 20k+ users? ^

Accepts aren't magic and shouldn't be. Especially when some people leave comments on their answers asking for accepts from people who are new to Ubuntu and to the site, and hardly know what they are ticking :/

@Serg No more than giving people the right to delete anything else.

user136984

8:27 PM

Ah! My stars went mad! :D

user136984

I clicked and 2 more messages were posted so it stared them all. :P

@Serg I assume you've cast your share of delete votes, as you should, and that's great. That's the point of the reputation system and how we keep the site clean. You can't expect mods to go around deleting things all by ourselves.

Or, to put it another way, if that becomes what is expected of mods you'll need to find a new one :)

Allowing only mods to delete things is an invitation for abuse, not allowing all high rep members of the community.

@terdon not expecting moderators to delete everything. Some things should be handled by people with more powers and discretion

@terdon Don't you think what @Serg says is relevant ... also, if all members would act like (... no names ...) who shall write answers then ... ? When everyone would want to be the most important janitor here ... and cleaning the site is the main goal ... why not simply close AU ?

@JacobVlijm while 20k is respectable amount, it's still possible for people to make mistakes and yes, do abuse.

8:30 PM

....It also makes the position of mods more vulnerable. Help, a mod deleted my answer!

user136984

@Zanna Well, that's not necessarily bad, I do that sometimes if no answer is accepted for a while and they are new. Just to inform them, but if it's not just my answer there, then I do just explain how it works and to pick an answer which works for them, it doesn't have to be mine.

user136984

Users could abuse this.

user136984

But it really depends upon how you say it, and if you mean to trick them or to inform them.

@Serg And some are. I just don't see why "questions with accepted answers" should be among those things that the community can't delete.

@JacobVlijm Their position is already vulnerable enough. They can lock posts

8:32 PM

"Questions with many upvotes", I could understand. Even "questions with answers with many upvotes". But I just don't see why the accept is in any way relevant.

Deleted posts can be undeleted by the same process

If there is abuse, and you see it, then flag...

@terdon For the same reason I stated above: it's a working solution for OP.

@cl-netbox No idea what you mean. Who is acting like "no names"? What is acting like no names?

@Serg So? If the question is off topic, why should that make a difference?

No names is obviously me

Basically, I am trying to say that solved off topic questions and not solved off topic questions are all off topic questions and that's their only relevant characteristic.

8:35 PM

@ParanoidPanda yeah I agree it's generally done in a reasonable way and impartially. I'm just not a fan of it myself.

In other words:

> American components, Russian components, all made in Taiwan.

@terdon you're focusing on off-topic aspect of it. My point is that legitimate questions+accepted answers need protection. I don't want 3 20k users coming over to my answers and deleting my stuff, into which I put in blood, sweat, tears, and caffeine

sigh

@Serg Yes, because we are discussing off topic questions. If you see an on topic, valid question deleted by malicious users, flag!

Ubuntu Questions on U&L

0

Q: How to enable Disk Merge in fio in AWS Ubuntu 1604?

I am running Ubuntu 1604, with fio-2.1.10, libaio engine, on a VM on AWS. Its IO scheduler is "none". (I guess it will use "noop"). And, the disk's nomerge is 0, that means merge is enabled. But, when running fio, I see there is no merge happens (see the fio results: merge=0/0). I did the sam...

linux ubuntu disk aws amazon-linux

8:39 PM

cl-netbox objected to 3 people voting to delete a blatantly off topic ("what is the best VM on Ubuntu) question.

:35770734 the tricky part is, deleted posts can't be found.

Unless you know the exact URL they're good as gone.

@Seth indeed, good point. I think users should be notified when their posts are deleted

@terdon I simply mean that when the main reason to work here is to "clean the site" ... the logical result is : let's close AU ... generally ...

@Serg but again, having an accepted answer makes no difference at all. On topic, valid question shouldn't be deleted. Not when they have an accepted answer, not when they don't have an accepted answer and not when they have no answers at all.

@Zanna NO ! I heard this also from others before you joined !

8:41 PM

@cl-netbox Sorry you feel that way. I feel that cleaning up the site is the only way we can get the kind of quality we find on SE which is the reason I, at least, haven't posted on a single forum in 4 years or so.

@terdon And that's what I said earlier in my 3 points: I'm not defending cl-netbox, that question was indeed off-topic and deserved to be closed/deleted. I am objecting the fact that questions with accepted answer can be deleted by community members

@Serg Yes, and I'm pointing out that we're discussing off topic questions. But here, as in all other privilege levels afforded to high rep users, the assumption is that erep indicates the community trusts you.

@Zanna I'd also like a queue of >10k deletions for transparency's sake. There is a queue of recently deleted posts, but it's always full of moderator deletions, which is fine, but it also drowns out the posts users delete, which has 0 oversight by anyone.

And the highest level of trust accorded is the ability to vote to delete questions. So yes, we do assume that users with >20K rep will act decently.

Not always a correct assumption, mind you, but those are the exceptions and that's when the "human exception handlers", also known as mods, come in.

@terdon I agree an answer should be deleted if it has no question :)

8:43 PM

Whoops

@Seth yeah I agree, it's very frustrating that recently deleted is a useless section of the mod tools page

@Zanna I don't think it's useless, I'm sure it's nice to see what the moderators or /review has been deleting, but it causes other problems.

Because of all the spam and obvious junk that gets eaten instantly

I mean it moves too fast, you can't find anything there

that's true.

I've been intending to write a feature request about this for a while, but never got around to it.

It will be better if you do...

Hmm do you want me to do it?

8:47 PM

@terdon Although I understand that, I personally think there should be more "checks and balances" implemented. Ability to vote for deleting any question is too much power. Again, that's just my opinion

But I have more time maybe

@Serg we can't

@terdon I agree and also don't post on others forums (exception : redhat official ... not much though) ... nevertheless cleaning seems to get way more appreciation than helping (IMHO)

We can only vote to delete if the question has been closed for at least 3 days, or, at 20k, if it has been closed and has -3

Yes, especially as of recent ^

Recently cleaning/editing/deleting has been getting far too much focus than providing quality solutions to people with immediate issues.

sounds like a red herring to me.

8:49 PM

@Serg Fair enough. Personally, I don't see much of an issue there, and (in case I haven't made that clear :P ) even if more checks were needed, I wouldn't choose to use the presence of an accepted answer as one of them. I'd much rather limit by upvotes, say, or something like that. But do feel free to suggests something like this on meta if you like.

focus from who? (I believe strongly that cleaning is helping)

@Serg um, no one can just delete whatever they want. First, it has to be closed. 2 day wait for 10k users (iirc) and negative score for 20k. Then, the # of delete votes scales with numbers of upvotes, so the more upvotes, the more delete votes required. No one can just "delete any question".

A post has to be closed before a non-mod can vote to delete it,and it takes 5 non-mods to close

@cl-netbox Well, doesn't that seem reasonable to you? I usually respect people who work their asses of for no reward, doing thankless jobs that nobody even knows they do more than people who are doing useful but public jobs that everyone praises them for.

And if you guys are up in arms about an off-topic question, then we have other issues (I don't have the full backstory, so..)

We're not Yahoo! Answers people.

8:51 PM

^

@cl-netbox No, but even you seem to make the mistake we are running a helpdesk here. We are not, we are creating and maintaining a quality database, which is helping people.

4

Yes!

@Zanna Then please explain to me what the benefit of your edit was here when you closed the thing -> askubuntu.com/posts/887519/revisions Is changing can not to cannot a great improvement @terdon ?

Dupes aren't deleted, so I fix them before closing

@Seth OK, that's more like it.

8:52 PM

Because the site looks better with better grammar

^ such a relief to read

@JacobVlijm And what else am I doing ?

On the metro, back shortly

@Zanna it is, don't ever think otherwise. The only time it becomes a problem is if you start to miss the forest for the trees (haven't seen you do that yet).

@cl-netbox If you would realize that, you could possibly feel sorry for the 15 rep, but be delighted we got rid of crap at the same time.

8:54 PM

@Seth thanks :D

@Zanna While it sure does, grammar is irrelevant when OP has broken OP, apt dependency, network card. I personally value solutions more than grammar

Why can't we value both?

@Serg One is not the opposite of the other

basically that ^

@JacobVlijm Forget about the rep ... I didn't care a second ...

8:56 PM

again, not a helpdesk. A wiki. Editing is crazy important. This isn't a 1 person ticket that disappears as soon as it's solved.

^ exactly!

Yup

@JacobVlijm one is not opposite, but one is more important, at least IMHO. A plain wrong answer, no matter how grammatically sound, is useless compared to poorly written but working solution

I don't really think one needs to be "valued" more than the other. They're both important. Which one gets more brownie points is really irrelevant and could only serve to divide the community over irrelevant "issues".

@Serg But once the poorly written answer is delivered, please improve the language quality!

8:59 PM

@Zanna AFAIK can not and cannot are both correct ... right ? and I took it as an example for a "great and important improvement of the site"

@JacobVlijm Yeah, and that's why there's editing options.

user136984

This is a great song:

user136984

The Beatles - I Am The Walrus

@cl-netbox they're both correct but used in different circumstances, iirc.

user136984

:D

9:01 PM

@Seth Maybe, they're on different standards. But I don't think a company would hire a person who can write pretty papers but cannot deliver a project . . . just saying . . .

@Serg good thing we're not a company ;)

(although saying editors cannot deliver useful answers is honestly quite rude, because that's just outright wrong. no idea if that's what you actually meant though)

@Seth not what I actually meant

anyway ... this is getting too aggressive ... I wish answering questions would be as much appreciated and honored as the "housekeeping" @Seth @terdon @Zanna ... this is my main point. :)

@cl-netbox Well, yes. To a native speaker "can not" is just weird.

user136984

We aren't seriously still talking about what we were about 2 hours ago or at least that's how it feels?

9:04 PM

@cl-netbox it is appreciated. I dunno why you feel it's not. However you also get your own reward for it. Namely reputation and the occasional flattering comment. What do janitors get?

@Serg And you focus on answering and that's absolutely fine. Personally, I find bad grammar, spelling mistakes and similar issues to be very, very annoying. So I fix them. And I appreciate seeing others fix them. One of the main reasons I like SE so much is that it tends to have far better, clearer and more correct prose than any comparable site I have ever seen.

@cl-netbox Of course it is appreciated. The only problem here is that answering tends to be over appreciated and the basic janitorial work that keeps the answers here readable and easy to find is ignored or, as in this case, attacked!

@terdon Although I think AU is starting to have a problem with stuff becoming outdated. We need more people working on updating stuff :/

We have the whole reputation system which works through providing good questions and answers. That is the main show of appreciation an SE user gets. There's no internet points for janitorial work, there's no fame, no accolades.

@Seth True. We need all sorts of things and posting good answers is one of them. Just not the only one.

What would happen if nobody posted answers? An empty, useless site.

Site blogs are being shut down.

What would happen if nobody edited and improved? A full but crappy site.

@NathanOsman Again?

9:08 PM

Again?

What do you mean "again"?

Well the blogs were discontinued about a year ago or more. That's what I thought you were referring to.

hey, i'm offended. Helpdesks can actually help people.

@terdon they stopped making new ones, but now they're shutting the existing ones down.

@KazWolfe no one said that can't or don't.

Yeah, I've just been hearing about it for so long, I thought it had happened already.

We have 2buntu anyway :)

9:12 PM

@terdon Yup, i focus on answering , and it might sound rude, but i am looking at things through engineer point.of view. If an.answer doesnt deliver value or solve problem, prose is irrelevant to me. One think about Stephane i.sometimea see, he posts sed answers like a newbie on UL , no explanation, but you.know what ? you can always bet money on his answer being qualitu and delivering

@NathanOsman yeah, not really a part of AU though. (not that it isn't cool)

dont tell stephane though.lol

Qualitu? I don't understand... (kidding)

@Serg I agree : content comes first ! :)

hey... um... my machine has something weird on it.

9:14 PM

@Serg Sed, that's great. Everyone can use the site as they see fit. However, I am the son of an editor and clear, grammatically correct prose is very important to me. I am also a native speaker of English, unlike many regular users, so it is even harder to ignore bad grammar.

So you do your engineer thing (which is very appreciated) but let others do their grammar nerd thing. That also improves the quality of the site.

Unless you think that having engineers write user manuals is a good idea. . .

@terdon hahaha ... nice ! :D

user image

what is this calls/sms thing?

@terdon i let editors do their thing. I just dont want to have editing be.valued.more than problem solving

ooh that's cool. KDE connect maybe?

@Serg that's just petty.

@KazWolfe One of the many atrocities committed in the name of having one interface across different devices.

user136984

9:16 PM

Well.. This is interesting... :D

user136984

David Icke: Conspiracy of the Lizard Illuminati (Part 1/2)

@Serg I agree again ! :)

@Seth this is just regular unity

no kde ever installed

user136984

I just watch these things sometimes for fun.

@Serg If you've solved the problem but I can't understand your solution because it is so badly written, your solution is useless.

But if you think that editing is valued more than answers here, you must be visiting a completely different site.

9:18 PM

^ totally, I actually get the impression the opposite is true.

@terdon that's true but can not and cannot ? I think both versions are understandable ... I'm not talking about real bad grammar though ... there I completely agree with you terdon. :)

@JacobVlijm Me too. I always felt that the editors are the unsung heroes of the site. People toiling away in relative obscurity, getting no recognition and no thanks and yet whose efforts are absolutely essential to making the site what it is.

Again, totally true.

@cl-netbox You're asking the wrong person. I hate "can not". It can be used, but it means something slightly different ("you can not do it": you have the ability to not do it) and it really bugs me when I see it used to say cannot.

@terdon does it work?

9:20 PM

It is used sometimes, yes, and even by native speakers but I really don't like it.

By the way @terdon I am not a good typer ... I do it with two fingers and often hit the wrong key accidentally ... when I see what is written, I have to correct it ... :)

if so, is there a way to bind my phone to that? because that would be sweet

@KazWolfe No idea.

But @cl-netbox no matter what the edit is, no matter how trivial, if it improves the post, it is a good thing.

Maybe not if it has to go through the review queues, but after you have the rep to edit, any improvement is welcome.

@terdon unless it's changing six characters just to get that sweet sweet hit of +2 rep

@KazWolfe I know a great site you can ask about it on ;)

9:22 PM

@terdon okay ... then cannot :)

@Seth Ubuntuforums?

@KazWolfe Which is why I specified "after you have the rep to edit" :)

@KazWolfe -.-

@Seth ohhhhhh. you mean yahoo answers

ask debian, obviously.

9:22 PM

@Seth actually... let's see how mintforums likes it!

when you're telling someone to not do something, shouldn't you use "shall not"?

british english ?

@terdon I really get your point ... but then every non-native British English speaker shouldn't be allowed to edit something because most probably it won't be perfect - right ? :)

Ah, this sums it up nicely actually:

> These two spellings [cannot/can not] are largely interchangeable, but by far the most common is “cannot” and you should probably use it except when you want to be emphatic: “No, you can not wash the dog in the Maytag.”

How did you arrive at such a conclusion? @cl-netbox

@terdon See, I'd use "You shall not wash the dog in the Maytag" but that's just me.

9:27 PM

@cl-netbox Of course not! Everyone can edit, and then their edit can be edited and then edited again. That's the whole point of how SE works. It's the Wikipedia model.

@KazWolfe Huh. I almost never use shall. I'd have said you will not wash. . . instead.

@terdon Wikipedia: a terrible idea on paper, an excellent idea in the implementation.

Shall is normally only used in questions in modern British English, like "shall we get a takeaway?"

@terdon I blame reading too many RFCs

@KazWolfe Well duh! How would you edit so many times if it were on paper? :P

Lol, imagine British speaker and American speaker getting into a fight over correct spelling of.colour

9:29 PM

The paper would be a helluva mess

@Serg No need to imagine. happens all the time :)

@Serg We dropped the U like we dropped the monarchy!

sorry, did hit the wrong buddon

@KazWolfe Oh? So you're called the SA today?

:P

@KazWolfe sick burn

@Zanna well, when terdon says he hates when he sees "can not" ...

9:30 PM

I used to teach English in a language school in China, and the British and USian teachers confuses the students with their spelling wars lol

@terdon Well, with Trump, i'm pretty sure America isn't united anymore.

@cl-netbox Yes, but terdon is a pedantic language nerd, let's not forget that.

language or linguistics?

My point was that we have people like you and Serg who don't find such changes important but people like @Zanna and myself who do and are really bothered by language issues in AU posts.

@Zanna yeah, i kinda.was.confused at first when i came to the US, because they taught British spelling in my middle school in Ukraine

9:31 PM

@terdon or, option three, people who only sort of care when it's not an inconvenience.

@KazWolfe Language, I guess. I am nowhere near knowledgeable enough to be a linguistics nerd. I find it fascinating and have a basic grasp of the subject but that's about it. I do like to try and speak my languages as well as I can though.

and are instead far more worried about good formatting.

There you go. Yes, that too.

@cl-netbox but like terdon said, improving posts by editing can be iterative. Every editor can fix something, and finally it's polished. That way perfection is not required from anyone

seriously people. Stop using italics for code and monospace for emphasis!

9:32 PM

But that's the beauty of a collaborative system. If we all focus on the bits that are most important to us, the end result is a product where all of these facets have been improved.

@terdon hahaha ... then I have something for you : look at the last edit -> askubuntu.com/questions/888456/… Do I see some (many) mistakes still being left by a well-honored editor ? (joke) ... cc : @Zanna

@Zanna Edited that for you :P

@cl-netbox muru's more like me than terdon. he cares more about formatting and inlining i think.

Bad signal and bad phone keyboard grrr

@cl-netbox Yes. Which is precisely why it is important to have other editors come in and edit again.

9:34 PM

@terdon thanks haha

This morning I edited a post and missed something, and muru fixed it

@terdon the language.improvements are appreciated, dont.get.me.wrong. I am.just apathetic to language issues, and value.problem solving more, which is what people.come here expecting. English.SE is where you'd come for.grammar as priority, but here people want to find a fix for a technical issue

@KazWolfe arrgh

okay ladies and gentlemen ... believe it or not : was an interesting discussion for me and I don't feel offended @terdon @Zanna ! :) sudo shutdown -h now ... good night everybody ! :) See you tomorrow ... :)

@Serg That's how you feel and that's fine. But, for me, one of the first things that attracted me to SE was precisely the fact that the language tended to be clear and correct.

Good night @cl-netbox!

Goodnight @cl-netbox o/

9:37 PM

Hey @cl-netbox

hey @terdon, sorry but i'm going to challenge a mod.

Thank you @terdon @Zanna ! :)

@cl-netbox sleep tight

@KazWolfe To what? I play a mean game of ping pong. You have been warned.

Thanks @JacobVlijm @Serg ! :) Same to you ! :)

9:38 PM

regarding this question. Yes, it's too broad, but it's one of the exceptions to the rule (as even seen in the question itself, as placed there by a mod). The list is nowhere near complete, and as such there is still more valuable information to add there.

Goodbye @KazWolfe @Seth ! :)

bye

night!

Thanks :)

It's survived numerous close attempts in the past, very likely due to it's unique exception state (and the fact that it can be considered canonical in a sense)

9:40 PM

@KazWolfe That question had already been locked for several months (years?) so no new content could be added. That sort of question, useful as it may be, is not on topic here so I see no reason to have it open. I certainly don't want to delete it, mind you, but what's the point in keeping it open and protected?

@terdon wait, it was locked? I don't see that in the timeline...

@terdon Simply put, it already was, and it's still possible to add more information to it. As long as we don't allow other questions of that caliber, I see no reason to close this one as well.

@KazWolfe Neither do I, but that's what I remember. Won't swear to it now though.

user136984

Been a long day...

user136984

Need to get some shut eye now.

user136984

Goodnight! :)

9:43 PM

@KazWolfe Well, paranoid pointed out it was the only one of its ilk that wasn't closed.

And we don't want or need more information there, thank you. It really should never have been here in the first place. There are already three pages of answers!

The SE model sort of breaks down when you get so many answers anyway.

True... Still, it should speak to some level that it's gone up for review how many times it was marked as "leave open"

@KazWolfe It has also been discussed ad nauseum both here and on meta for many, many years. I closed after seeing that it already had another vote and because it is a blatantly off topic question that really has no business being open. It should absolutely not be deleted but what benefit is there to adding even more answers to that horrible bloated thing?

Completion, really.

well that was half the day wasted, and i planned so much today

If that's the case, though, @terdon, a mod should remove the historical significance notification on the post

9:47 PM

@KazWolfe Nah, a mod (me) just reopened it because he followed his own advice and actually read the discussion on meta. The consensus was to leave it open. I don't agree but meta has spoken. As has Kaz.

well... okay then, lol.

@KazWolfe I hope you learned your lesson though: it is absolutely fine to challenge a mod :)

As long as you do it politely and constructively, as you did, anyway.

@terdon If I knew it wasn't, I would never have :)

Wasting people's time is something that should be avoided.

If you don't mind, though, can I have the link to the meta discussion? I can't find it at the moment.

we should have an AU meetup and play ping pong.

7

I'm pretty bad but it'd be fun!

@Seth I'm up for that!

1

Q: Do you think these Questions need to be close/deleted because they are too broad?

These two Questions What Application Indicators are available?, and What different desktop environments and shells are available? Do they need to be closed? Even though they are popular and What Application Indicators are available? has 487 upvotes by the time that I wrote this, and 422 favourit...

discussion scope

9:52 PM

@Seth who is paying for the flights?

@terdon ty

One of them. But there are loads about the various old list questions and what to do with them.

@Seth that'd be awesome, except there's people here from all over the world

The main one being:

26

Q: Please do not delete closed questions with many views and many upvotes

Recently closed questions appear in the delete queue even though they had many upvotes and many views too. Some examples: What media (music and video) players are there? 52 upvotes 21k views 21 fav What's your recommendation on drive partitioning schemes for a desktop and home server? 57 up...

discussion deleted-questions

@KazWolfe I need Java help

@Seth Yes. I used to practice regularly.

9:53 PM

@Zacharee1 hm?

The first Ask Ubuntu meetup.

oh, thanks for reminding me.

@KazWolfe no idea. I'm broke.

These functions:

public void CopyAssets(String targetFile) {
        AssetManager assetManager = getAssets();
        String[] files = null;
        try {
            files = assetManager.list("Files");
        } catch (IOException e) {
            Log.e("tag", e.getMessage());
        }

        for(String filename : files) {
            if (filename.equals(targetFile)) {
                try {
                    InputStream in;
                    OutputStream out;
                    try {
                        in = assetManager.open("Files/" + filename);

~~We can hang up a picture of the moderators and throw darts at it.~~ No wait.

:P

9:54 PM

@NathanOsman Did you forget to clarify you meant the other moderators?

Just wait till I get my engineering degree and will be able to afford flights all over the place. We can do meet ups then

@Zacharee1 hang on, page me in discord so we don't clutter this chat, please.

kk

@Serg SIGGRAPH is coming here next year.

Also @Seth might be interested to know that.

@NathanOsman We do that to our CFO, lol.

He joins in on the fun.

9:55 PM

Lol.

@NathanOsman what's SIGGRAPH ?

@Serg siggraph.org

It's an annual conference for anyone involved with 3D graphics.

@NathanOsman sounds interesting, but I can't draw worth anything :p

Programmers, designers, vendors, artists, etc.

Nvidia and AMD usually have a set of talks there.

Last time I was there, one of the audience members called AMD out on their Linux support. That was right before amdgpu was announced.

I'm probably living under a rock, because I don't hear about any conferences going on here in Denver

9:58 PM

@Serg I'm sure there are some, Denver is a popular place for them.

actually, I am . . . Living under Rocky Mountains

I'm disappointed I missed debconf in Portland a few years ago. I even ended up driving through there 4 times that year (2 trips).

I live next to the Rocky Mountains too. Just on the other side :P

I live in between two mountain ranges :P

« first day (2345 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (2620 days later) »

Transcript for

Mar '171

Ask Ubuntu General Room

Normally: General discussion around Ask Ubuntu, Ubuntu & offic...

join this room
about this room

00:00

06:00

12:00

18:00

all times are UTC

site design / logo © 2024 Stack Exchange Inc; legal

mobile