Game Development

"My biggest complaint is that these leak noise very bad (worse than my much cheaper over hear headphones). I had planned on using these when I fly, which is often. My roommate and I took turns listening to them last night while the other person listened to the sound leak. It was worse than just a little sound, you could actually hear the lyrics. I will be very self conscious using these in public." @AidanMueller

Aidan Mueller

6:43 AM

@AttackingHobo I think the white may look better, but yeah, the dirt and stuff, that is something I was thinking about :/

AttackingHobo

It will only look better for a small amount of time

Aidan Mueller

True.

AttackingHobo

@AidanMueller check out this bundle bundlestars.com/all-bundles/ballistic-bundle

Worth it just for wickland

Also just bought this game. store.steampowered.com/app/254440

Aidan Mueller

That's a lot for 3.50.

@AttackingHobo Those graphics.

Wow

Such graphic

AttackingHobo

the pool game?

yeah. crazy good looking

Aidan Mueller

6:50 AM

very high poly

Yes.

AttackingHobo

also check out the deformation on the bumpers when it hits

Aidan Mueller

@AttackingHobo LOL. At first I thought you were talking about a game. Sorry, but what are the bumpers?

AttackingHobo

the sides of the pool table

they are some kind of rubberish material covered in cloth

in real life they deform

in teh game they also deform

I've seen pool games before and they were entirely ridged in appearance

Aidan Mueller

@AttackingHobo Oh. Never mind. I thought we were talking about the headphones again.

AttackingHobo

0_0

@AidanMueller check it. made this the other night. gfycat.com/IllegalGreedyGoose

Aidan Mueller

7:01 AM

@AttackingHobo Wherever it says "Steams only pool game", they should change it to "Steams ~~best~~ only pool game".

AttackingHobo

ha

Aidan Mueller

The reflection getting blocked by the balls is cool.

OK house on fire must evacuate TTYL*

AttackingHobo

oh shit. hope you are alright!

Aidan Mueller

* house is not actually on fire

AttackingHobo

fuck you

Aidan Mueller

7:03 AM

No, it really is on fire, I'm just going to stay here and program!

Haha.

@AttackingHobo I really am going though, so bye.

AttackingHobo

later. get that bundle

so worth it

Aidan Mueller

I would, but...

Well.

It looks like only 3 games work on linux.

AttackingHobo

windows man, windows

Aidan Mueller

And I have some stuff to do if I want to do ludumdare.

AttackingHobo

buy it, and install it later

Aidan Mueller

7:06 AM

If I start playing games, I get stuck on them for a while.

AttackingHobo

buy it and forget about it

and then later later later play it

AttackingHobo

7:28 AM

@Almo it has begun.

@MartinSojka I'm making Minesweeper VR

user92578

8:51 AM

Friday, 11AM and school is over, I'm making coffee and I don't have to read to an exam, I can spend the day developing and I'll have pizza for lunch. Life is smiling :)

user92578

turns out I can't make coffee :(

user92578

doesn't matter :)

Wardy

9:21 AM

@AttackingHobo omg ... this could be hilarious :)

Martin Sojka

@AttackingHobo Needs more brown. And shotguns. ;)

SpicyWeenie

Anyone know how to "check out" repositories? I'm trying to get LLVM and Clang, and the instructions say to check them out (with a link provided)

Wardy

@MartinSojka and jquery?

@SpicyWeenie is this a git thing ?

SpicyWeenie

VisualSVN

Martin Sojka

@SpicyWeenie "svn checkout <LINK>", or "svn export <LINK>" if you don't care for SVN information, on the command line.

Wardy

9:35 AM

@SpicyWeenie wtf ... did that not die like 2 decades ago ?

SpicyWeenie

svn co llvm.org/svn/llvm-project/llvm/trunk llvm

Martin Sojka

Eh, I still prefer SVN for one-person projects. :)

SpicyWeenie

clang.llvm.org/get_started.html for VS2012 or later

Martin Sojka

Though for things which don't need actual versioning (say, pictures or music), BitTorrent Sync is pretty sweet.

... or for my "directory full of random useful Java library JARs"

SpicyWeenie

Nevermind. I'm just getting sick of all these hoops you have to jump through just to get something setup...

Figured it out. Didn't have my coffee

Almo

2:28 PM

@AttackingHobo In stating I have "a problem" you are telling me how I should behave, which is confrontational. I do not have a problem. You are assuming that other people do not have differing perspectives than you, or at the very least, that if they do, they are wrong.

@AttackingHobo MINESWEEPER! :D

Almo

2:40 PM

@AidanMueller personally, I would say black

user92578

wtf errors in a file that I have not ever touched

user92578

then mysterious text has appeared to a .cpp file of mine

Almo

where did this happen?

just on your puter?

in your git repository?

user92578

just suddenly

user92578

seems like I can't include both SDL.h and Windows.h in a same file

user92578

2:49 PM

so I need to include one in the header and the other in the source file

user92578

strange

user92578

the error was even something about a missing semicolon

user92578

really strange

user92578

now it works... with them both in the same file

user92578

Y U DO THIS, C++?

Almo

2:54 PM

very confusing dude

user92578

if it works, I'm just happy

user92578

I'm not going to try to understand this random stuff

user92578

compiler: this dude hasn't broken his code oddly in a while, let's see what I'll do to him now...

user92578

picks two cards from a hat

user92578

"Random Error in a header file he hasn't touched"

Lasse

2:56 PM

I was so damn annoyed that unity failed to batch correctly, so I made my own mesh combiner and performance increased a damn lot

from 300 draw calls to 80 draw calls

user92578

"Random text in a random header file he has touched"

user92578

@Lasse Sometimes is nice that something breaks, since you can make it better by making it yourself

Lasse

it's not nice when there's a deadline to catch

user92578

I suppose so

user92578

Are you running late for the deadline?

Lasse

3:00 PM

no, I'm just doing some R&D now based on the feedback we got, but it would have been nice if unity worked in the first place before the deadline

user92578

I'm looking at this really horrible method of mine but I just can't see a way to make it better... it's really frustrating

user92578

I'm probably just going to close the file for forever

Almo

refactor that shit :)

user92578

Do you guys find confirming an exit command annoying?

user92578

like is asking "are you sure?" annoying?

SpartanDonut

3:08 PM

Nah

Almo

I don't mind; I don't like non-confirmation of potentially data-losing operations

SpartanDonut

Yeah they're especially good if you have unsaved data or something

Almo

yeah

user92578

is "exiting" similar to "read -> reading" to "exit"?

user92578

doesn't sound right

Almo

3:14 PM

exiting is right

user92578

okay, thanks

SpartanDonut

In the context of game dev, I think Quit is probably more commonly used

Quit / Quitting

I could be wrong

That or leave...

I dunno

user92578

268

A: Do we “exit”, “quit” or "close" an application?

If you are developing a Windows application, the correct term to use is "Exit". This is spelt out in Microsoft's Design apps for the Windows desktop guide, under the "Standard Menu Bars" section. If you are developing a Mac application, the correct term to use is "Quit". (Your menu item must rea...

Almo

OBLITERATE

user92578

Visual Assist doesn't allow me to specify if I want the method I'm extracting to be private, procted or public :(

SpartanDonut

3:18 PM

PSA: Smash Brothers Wii U is out now

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Getting good reviews as well

SpartanDonut

I'm watching a stream. Even the single player content looks interesting with challenges and whatnot

Almo

funny how badly they botched that name/release (the console)

I really thought it was just the ipad controller for a normal Wii

SpartanDonut

Yeah Sony is really the only one winning points in the naming department

Almo

(and others I know made the same mistake)

yeah with their BORING but UNDERSTANDABLE structure :)

only weird thing in there is the PSX

AttackingHobo

3:28 PM

@Almo The first step towards windows gaming is admitting you have a problem. :P

Almo

when I referred to the Xbox ONE to Trena the first time, she knew there was the 360, and thought I was clarifying refering to the Xbox

hahaha

I'd like to know who thought at MS that was a good name, and how many people said "but people will think you're referring to the original xbox"

AttackingHobo

@Almo yeah. their naming is fucking retarded

Almo

hahah

AttackingHobo

PS3 is coming out. we need a 3 in the name so people know its not old. cause xbox 2 vs playstation 3.

so xbox 360

360 > 3

Almo

MegaTokyo thought the same thing I did: the new one would be Xbox 720.

AttackingHobo

3:31 PM

yeah. Thats what I though

but then they were like, how do we make a logo for that?

fuck

Almo

hahaha

AttackingHobo

and all these products with ONE were coming out

so they were like, yeah. That. One

I don't know how they didn't see people calling it xbone

Almo

hahaha

AttackingHobo

thats what a lot of people call it, and it pisses ms off

Almo

yeah I heard that a lot at Z-Man

with emphasis on the bone part "ecks BONE"

AttackingHobo

3:32 PM

yeahup

Almo

:D

AttackingHobo

oh, did you like the minesweeper stuff so far?

Almo

heheh :D

SpartanDonut

It just occurred to me how small my Wii U HDD is :(

AttackingHobo

@SpartanDonut get an sd card

or usb disk

SpartanDonut

3:34 PM

Oh totally forgot it took SD

That's the route I'll go... I don't need more clutter of a USB drive :(

AttackingHobo

@Almo I baked the lighting inside blender. Prob just gonna have the game be unlit baked textures

@SpartanDonut do you live in a shoebox?

wow. awesome.

SpartanDonut

No but I have a very simple TV stand that already has a Wii U, PS4 (with headset and controller charger), an Xbox 360, and the TV all sitting on top of it

Got a miracast receiver sitting behind getting lost in the forest of cords

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

My new TV is sort of weird.

AttackingHobo

@William'MindWorX'Mariager how so?

SpartanDonut

Seems the SD slot is only for original Wii content and not Wii U content

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

3:42 PM

It was input latency when on the desktop. But if I go to fullscreen with a youtube video, the input lag goes away.

AttackingHobo

@William'MindWorX'Mariager turn on gaming mode

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I'll see if it has anything like that.

Almo

gaming mode on our sony still leaves it at 70ms :(

AttackingHobo

owwww

Almo

haven't played Tekken in years :(

you would think Sony, making TVs and PSs, would get this shit right

AttackingHobo

3:45 PM

I always do research before buying a display

Almo

I did too

took the PS3 around testing TVs

but it also had to look great for movies, or my wife wouldn't be happy

my computer monitor, however, has 10 ms latency

so I use it for anything really time sensitive

unfortunately, I also don't have anyone to play Tekken with anymore since my wife stopped playing video games after Dead Nation. (which we really had fun with)

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

@AttackingHobo Funky behavior.

I turn on game-mode, and while in the menu, the latency drops considerably. When I hit OK, the latency goes back up.

If I check the menu, it's still set to game-mode. Toggling game-mode on and off will result in the lower latency again, but hitting OK reverts it.

I think I'll hit up customer service and see what they can do.

AttackingHobo

@William'MindWorX'Mariager wierd as hell :/

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Yeah

AttackingHobo

what tv model is it?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

3:54 PM

Thomson 55UZ8766

AttackingHobo

@William'MindWorX'Mariager what res you running 4k?

What are you connecting it with?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Yeah. 2160p30 with an HDMI 1.4 cable.

AttackingHobo

yeah you are going to lag with 30fps

no fixing that

Joe

@SpartanDonut so what was that great idea??

im still dying to know

SpartanDonut

it was really just solidifying an idea you already had

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

3:57 PM

@AttackingHobo Oh I know. But having ~1 second without gamemode on seems a bit excessive. :P

AttackingHobo

hahahaha

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

It's fine for watching movies really. And I don't use it for gaming. I'm just curious if it could be improved.

And perhaps get a replacement set if it turns out the gamemode feature is buggy. :P

Joe

@SpartanDonut ok cool! so im planning on hitting this hard after work going to work late with a pot of coffee

and ive got the house to myself 10am -6pm tommorow EST

so no distractions

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

I've noticed the model I got is an older version of the same model. The newer one has a HDMI 2.0 port that supports 2160p60.

SpartanDonut

In your mockup you had the parts dispenser 5000 - well the general gameplay could be that as more bodies come in the parts dispenser fills up and the player has to manually activate a button or something to release parts from it. As it fills up it starts to bloat under the pressure and will eventually explode losing the player the game

Joe

4:01 PM

yea that could work!

i was thinking space could play an important role

and considering sidestepping

adding a left right camera scroll to the scene possibly

also had a funny thought about strength and actually having to carry this stuff around

AttackingHobo

@Joe hmm what are you working on?

SpartanDonut

I'm still not sure what the actual gameplay looks like :P

Joe

@SpartanDonut haha well get the core and move on from there

@AttackingHobo Donut & I are trying to team up for a jam this weekend

working on some ridiculous weird game lol

its just an idea right now - in the next 48 hours it should start becoming a prototype

Almo

i hate this moment a few weeks before I release a game where I get serious doubts that anyone will play it

I have proof from the group at ubi playing it for months that some people really like it.

The main trick is just to be sure that doubt doesn't prevent the release

good track:

milieu.bandcamp.com/track/cherrycoke

this guy did the Eufloria soundtrack

which was a very nice looking game

decent as far as load-balancing RTSs go, but those can only go so far :)

Mushroom Wars being one of the better ones I've played

Joe

4:22 PM

You can do it! @Almo

Almo

:D

Getting close; adding the ability to play numbers and auto-generate accounts this weekend

and maybe the thing that lets you add your email address and set your Display Name

The eternal question when making a new project in any IDE: "Select location for project" Does it put "ProjName" folder there and put the project in it? Or are you selecting the root folder for all the files?

In unity's case, it puts the files where you select

which is not what i wanted so i'll just make a new one :)

SpartanDonut

And then there is VS's "Would you like to create a folder for the solution?"

or something like that

Almo

yeah that's smart

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Does Visual Studio Community support external debugging?

Almo

Unity Beta UI Button:

zoomed in

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

4:35 PM

It's really annoying that it's missing in Express. Really put a halt to my great plugin development tutorial :P

Almo

THAT is crappy

user92578

@William'MindWorX'Mariager How do I check it?

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

user92578

Yes I have that, so I suppose the Community edition can do that

William 'MindWorX' Mariager

Nice

Lasse

4:57 PM

Here's a tool I quickly made for combining static meshes in unity, since unity is doing very bad job with it sometimes: pastebin.com/aZKTtYVG

it makes meshes on a grid from the currently selected static object(s), great for foliage etc

hmm now I started to wonder if unity is actually able to save those meshes since they are generated on fly

yep, seems to be working nicely

MLM

@Lasse Not using a CombineInstance? I forgot why to do so but I think some things are a bit messed up if you don't. I used it in my CombineMesh method: github.com/MadLittleMods/Radius/blob/master/Radius/Assets/…

I am not sure if it is actually better even performance wise. It looks like you aren't using Mesh.CombineMeshes which is where it is used

AttackingHobo

5:15 PM

Free google cardboard. You may need to delete your recent history/cookies and try with a different email address a few times for it to go through. volvocars.com/us/about/our-stories/google-cardboard

2

If anyone could star that ^ it would be great.

@William'MindWorX'Mariager @MLM @Lasse @Almo @Jon @Joe @SpartanDonut ^

MLM

I'm not sure it is good yet. Whether it is worth it?, legit, etc

AttackingHobo

@MLM hmm?

Yes. its from volvo. its part of an advertising thing. Its worth it cause its free.

They want to show you a 360 vr video of their car

Joe

@AttackingHobo is this really free or is this a contest

"Request Your Google Cardboard - Google Cardboard is a headset that brings full virtual reality to your smartphone. Enter for a chance to receive a custom Google Cardboard headset – and see what it's like to experience the all-new Volvo XC90. Your information may be shared with our dealers."

AttackingHobo

@joe its a "contest" thats why you might need to clear your history/cookies and try a new email address. I tried 3 times before it worked

It tells you instantly if you will get it or not

Joe

OOOOo

thats different now

hmm im "On my way"

think its legit?

AttackingHobo

5:25 PM

@Joe why are you guys so suspicious, lol. Yes. It's a legit advertisment from Volvo.

Joe

@AttackingHobo trust is foolishness

ill beleive when i get the package

id be more inclined to beleive if i got a confirmation email

SpartanDonut

You'll also be flooded with Volvo marketing materials

Lasse

@MLM I made it more low-level, I am not sure why combineinstance would be any better than my implementation, and I also have very little confidence nowdays that unity can do anything right

MLM

5:43 PM

@Lasse It might use pointers, etc so you don't have to copy each vertex, normal, etc

Lasse

that's completly irrelevant since it's done offline

MLM

@Lasse what? Do you mean it is only done only once? I am just speculating on what it actually does but performance matters.

Lasse

yes it's only done once, whenever the developer pushes a button

it just takes several seconds to go thru our current project's foliage container object and generate the meshes out from that

it's even configurable

I made it because unity failed to batch draw the static foliage objects, and I couldn't find out why

AttackingHobo

6:10 PM

Amazon is Amazing. Got a screen protector that didn't fit right, and they straight just refunded me the money with no questions asked.

Almo

6:26 PM

on the new Unity UI, the scroll rect's Deceleration Rate is goofy. 1 = never slow down 0 = stop immediately

SpartanDonut

Seems backwards if thats the actual term used

Almo

that's the actual term

AttackingHobo

6:42 PM

@Almo yeah. thats strange

Almo

:D

the Unity tutorial videos for the new UI stuff are VERY good

the narrator never says "um" and the language is super-precise

Lasse

Yet, the new UI still lacks some great features that would make it actually performant. Batching elements for example, every single thing on screen are separate draw calls and that slows things down a lot on mobile

Almo

outch

Lasse

We used the new gui in our 3 week demo project I pasted screenshots of earlier, and most of the performance went away because of the amount of draw calls combined from gui and non batching static objects :(

Also some minor things like when you made a prefab out of an element, the anchors would still point to the gameobject the prefab was made from and not to the prefab object itself

Almo

argh

AttackingHobo

6:53 PM

@Almo I love well produced tutorial videos

Almo

they are a rare thing

Lasse

Also, it's a lot cheaper to just move the element off screen than just disable them, because when they come back on screen there is some weird font caching going on

causes lag spikes

AttackingHobo

Fuck lag

Almo

thanks for all these tips, Lasse

Mr.777

Greetings all

Almo

6:58 PM

I get it, Mr. Lucky. :)

Lasse

@Almo no problem :) I also might sound a bit cynical, but that's only because I've implemented such things myself in my own engines in less time than how long unity has been under development :P

Almo

hahaha :)

AttackingHobo

sup @Mr.777

Mr.777

@AttackingHobo I am interested in learning game development, don't know where to start from, so is there any guide for the person who can just play games, can do programming stuff but knows nothing about game development?

AttackingHobo

There sure are. What kind of programming do you do? What lang and stuff? How experienced are you?

Lasse

7:05 PM

@Mr.777 this depends on what you want to do, if you just want to make games, you might want to try out Unity or Unreal engine, but if you are more interested in the lower-level stuff like outputting some triangles on screen then you might want to learn OpenGL or DirectX

Mr.777

I have been working as java dev since 4 years, I also have knowledge of C,C++ Mostly I work as web developer

@Lasse Yes I want to learn the actual concepts so yea openGL & DirectX seems to be a good start.

Lasse

I can recommend learning OpenGL, and since you already know your way around Java, LWJGL or LibGDX might be your thing

AttackingHobo

@Mr.777 Do you know why you want to learn GL and DX? Because if you want to have stuff moving on the screen in a short time. check out Unity.

Mr.777

I want to learn GL & DX because that will help me writing my own gaming engine if i made so far :D??? Unity itself is a gaming engine, right?

Almo

I do not recommend by starting writing a game engine

AttackingHobo

7:10 PM

Gaming engine is the wrong term. Game Engine is the right term.

Almo

if you've not written a game, how do you know what should be in your engine?

AttackingHobo

^^^^

Almo

write a game (or a few) first using an existing engine

Lasse

Yes, Unity is a game engine, but it's a lot hard work to get such thing made

Mr.777

@Almo Ofcourse, I won't start writing my own engine :P @AttackingHobo Thanks

Almo

7:10 PM

then you can see what deficiencies you see in them, and address them in your own

SpartanDonut

You don't even need an engine to write a game

Almo

many people do try to start by making their own engine

AttackingHobo

In my experience, people who set out to create game engines, never write games.

Almo

^

Lasse

I ended up making games, AND engines

Mr.777

7:11 PM

@AttackingHobo Oh, is that so :O well, I should definitely not write engine then :P

AttackingHobo

There is literally never ending work to improve or make the engine better or faster

Mr.777

Well guys, I really appreciate your advices, I would love to be a game dev but I suck in designing

AttackingHobo

@Mr.777 start with pong

Its a great game to start with. simple. but teaches a lot.

Mr.777

@AttackingHobo Yep, I once started working on pong, created a bat and a ball. Ball never seemed to reflect at the right angle though :D

AttackingHobo

Player input. Physics. AI. Sound. GUI.

Lasse

7:14 PM

I made breakout instead of pong, it's a bit simpler since it has no AI

Mr.777

@Lasse What's breakout?

Lasse

it's a game

AttackingHobo

brick breaker game

like pong but you hit a bunch of bricks up top to break them

Lasse

sandbox.yoyogames.com/games/129590-breakout-game

AttackingHobo

basic pong ai is easier than breakout

just move towards the ball at a certain speed for a super basic ai

Mr.777

7:15 PM

Breakout seems to be more tough than a pong

AttackingHobo

Yeah it can get super complicated

but it doens't need to be

@Mr.777 you can probably find a pong tutorial for unity

Yup.

Mr.777

@AttackingHobo So, do you suggest, I should start working on unity or directly with opengl or directx?

AttackingHobo

awesomeincu.com/tutorials/unity-pong

Start with Unity

Make a few things in there and if you are comfortable start working on some ogl or dx

Lasse

unity might seem more scary when you first open it up, but it's actually a lot easier than just coding up your own engine

AttackingHobo

It will give you a better and quicker understanding of actual game design.

Mr.777

7:18 PM

Okay that sounds great and fun

AttackingHobo

Starting with OGL or DX will give you game programming experience but not game dev experience until you start working on the actual gaming part of it

With unity you can plop some blocks down. plop a camera down. give it a collider and attach an fps script and click play and move around and aim

you can go from a new file to a basic fps movement in minutes not days/weeks/months

Mr.777

@AttackingHobo Thanks a lot :)

AttackingHobo

You're welcome. Stick around here and show us what you are working on. If you get stuck we can help

Mr.777

@AttackingHobo Yes, sure I will

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