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1:01 AM
ok
 
 
4 hours later…
5:14 AM
I don't suppose there are any mods around?
 
6:07 AM
I finally started playing around with the 3d printers at work.
and now I want to make my own.
Since I'm already reasonably well-versed in using Blender for making 3d game assets, using it for doing CAD is not a huge step.
 
 
1 hour later…
7:10 AM
Morning!
@HexTitan they'llbe here soon, just left a message for them
 
7:21 AM
@kalina watcha' that was some sleep you had :op
@M'vy Morning
 
7:35 AM
Morning
 
yes, yes it is
 
glad we're all agreed on that then!
hey @AviD did you see scotthelme.co.uk/…
Interesting to see how little some/all of the HTTP security headers get used
and that's on the big sites too...
 
7:51 AM
@RоryMcCune may have seen it mentioned on the twatters, never actually bothered clicking though
@RоryMcCune not really surprising. Depressing, yes, but not surprising.
 
@AviD well more years of free finding for all my web app. reports :)
it's a good illustration of the fact that people won't even take basic steps to protect themselves, so you can see why security pros are cynical of people having security as "their top priority"
 
heh. And more years of explaining to devs / ops / devops what these BRAND NEW headers are and why they should use them.
@RоryMcCune yeah, true that...
 
@AviD well with things like HPKP there's the real risk of messing up access to your site big time
if you get it wrong
so that one may actually warrant some good guidance
 
I was just showing in training yesterday to some devs how to get a baseline of "security priority" via SSLLabs. Most banks in Israel are C or B....
 
@AviD heh, yeah I think some of ours are too. I do come across some a+ sites, but not that often.
 
7:54 AM
@RоryMcCune meh, thats a big IF. there are plenty of guidance on how not to mess it up...
@RоryMcCune I think it was Troy Hunt a while ago that was reviewing a whole bunch of banks... similar findings.
 
@AviD how long before someone lets the pinned key expire and loses the extra one they have lying around
I'm not sure what you even do when that happens
 
@RоryMcCune yes, it is easy to get wrong, but it is even easier to get right.
 
tell all your users to purge the cache I guess
 
also, there are plenty of packages that configure it automatically for you
 
@AviD I just go based on the number of companies who forget to renew certs...
which is just as obvious
 
7:56 AM
@RоryMcCune oh absolutely. if you're at that very very low level, then dont worry about the advanced stuff.
but going from that very very low level to getting the basics right, takes very little effort beyond "giving a shit"
 
@AviD hey all companies give a shit about security, it's their "top priority" their websites say so and everything!
 
yeah they even have a gif of a lock on their site, to prove they are secure!
 
 
2 hours later…
9:40 AM
2uo.de/myths-about-urandom/#experts <-- see Sec.SE and @ThomasPornin get a mention here
 
9:54 AM
Vote for @ScottPack : serverfault.com/election :))
6
 
lol. I have an easier time deciding who not to vote for
 
gotta admit "I've now been unbanned for at least a year." is a great opener for a nomination post
 
Then he totally channels trump. And well, if either of them gets elected, there may be hell toupee.
 
@JourneymanGeek I could easily see trump getting the republican nomination
 
yeah
 
9:59 AM
@JourneymanGeek many of their voters strike me as just that nuts
 
The system is also wierd, considering modern communication
 
 
1 hour later…
11:07 AM
AAARGGHHH
silly stupid consultants who dont understand their own damn words
drives me crazy
 
@RоryMcCune eh
I've increased my sleep debt by more than if I had been working this weekend
absolutely entirely broken
drank my body mass in water and still feel thirsty
you'd think that when people are designing a seating plan for a lan that they'd consider that pcs generate quite a bit of heat
 
@kalina ah you've been LAN partying?
they should design them like datacentres with cool isles and warm isles, to suit different temp. preferences that players have
 
@JourneymanGeek please, be original, you're stooping so low you're stealing stuff that I already stole...
Aug 23 at 13:24, by kalina
@ManishEarth "there will be hell toupee"
@RоryMcCune I doubt any of the people there liked "hotter than the surface of the sun"
it was fun, I played DOTA2 all weekend and thus achieved nothing
 
@kalina dunno, I've seen some fierce Aircon wars in offices before that went from arctic to saharan in preference
@kalina well DOTA kinda sounds like Dotto so you may have got some inspiration for your magnum opus
 
@RоryMcCune this was beyond saharan, this was water evaporating from open bottles
either that or we were pouring them all over the floor and forgetting
heat stroke for sure
my main problem with being in a room that hot is that's my preferred climate and I just pass out
anyway, back whenever
 
11:31 AM
o/
 
11:44 AM
Morning Errrbody
 
Yo
 
@M'vy what's shaken?
 
@JukEboX that's really a weird expression :))
 
@M'vy oh? Been using it for years.
 
Well I'm not a native English-speaker so it might explain this :)
But that's seems weird to me
Even if I must admit that I might be a bit shaken at times aahah.
 
11:51 AM
@M'vy What's shaken = What's happening, what's going on, What's shaking up your life ... Get it?
 
hey @RоryMcCune - re dem HTTP security headers, would you consider that to be a high risk vulnerability? (the lack of headers...)
 
Yeah. I guess I'm disturb by the "shaken" instead of a "shaking". Well, nvm :))
Like if you said "How are you done ?"
 
@M'vy oK I will say it the boring way. Good morning everyone. How are you all today?
 
@JukEboX Ahah
I'm fine thanks :))
 
@M'vy hahah. I will have to teach you some more "lingo"
 
12:03 PM
@AviD well depends on the company/App. Our standard finding reports as a low, but for me if it was something like a bank I might bump that to medium more for reputatational risk than anything else.
I generally reserve highs for "can be used on it's own to compromise the security of the system in a relatively fundamental way"
 
@M'vy no, you are correct - @JukEboX got it wrong, the saying IS "what's shaking". Or perhaps, "what's shakin', baby?"
 
@AviD sigh
 
@RоryMcCune yeah, that's what I was thinking. thanks.
@RоryMcCune one of my partner/clients asked me to review a report that some other consulting company gave them. Irrelevant of the quality of testing, the accuracy of reporting the risk levels kinda depressed me.
they were throwing out terminology they clearly didn't understand...
misusing DREAD (and STRIDE, not sure why they were even bothering) all over the place in various interesting ways
and one of the most elaborated findings was explaining how THIS is really DOM based XSS (welcome to a decade ago), and not "regular" XSS, and the difference between them... and oh yeah btw, this was actually regular reflected XSS and not DOM based at all.
I guess they thought it was DOM based because it happens on the client? Dunno.
I did learn one intersting thing, though - they pointed to a vulnerable jQuery version that surprised me.
 
@AviD burp passive scanner check if you use the retire.js plugin :)
I give that one out quite a bit now
 
@RоryMcCune ah, interesting
 
12:10 PM
people rarely think to upgrade JS libraries
and there are some vulns
 
@RоryMcCune yeah, or any libraries really
 
@AviD yeah DOM XSS mis-understandings are common ...
 
@RоryMcCune okay but why bother??
@RоryMcCune interesting though, where do they get the list of vulnerable versions? updated manually?
 
@AviD retirejs.github.io/retire.js <-- is where it comes from AFAIK
 
awesome. but where do they get that list from? Somebody sitting and researching vulnerabilities in these libs? tracking release notes / CVEs?
 
12:21 PM
@AviD you could ask erland :) probably easiest, I could guess but that's what it's be
 
Man, Evan Carroll is such a loser.
 
@Simon yeah, compared to him, even you seem like a productive member of society.
 
You're a productive member of society.
 
awww, gee... thanks :-)
 
1:21 PM
@AviD is it there any option to export transcript of the dmz room?
 
1:36 PM
@M'vy yeah, that oughta do it
 
2:02 PM
> As a feminist, I should probably get very annoyed at this patriarchal repression of my alcoholic freedom.
it saddens me that I can't tell if this is satire or them being serious
 
@Ohnana Am I a bad person for wanting to punch most of the feminists in the face?
 
@Simon so do you know the differences between a lot of the groups?
or are you attempting to punch them all?
 
@Ohnana All of those that speak up because those usually do hateful speeches.
 
@Simon yeah i'm not a fan either
i hope the movement goes back to second-wave ideologies a little more soon
 
@ScottPack I see you're still chasing the blue diamond, eh?
 
2:22 PM
@RоryMcCune The author actually asked me to review the text (and I found it fine).
 
Afternoon
 
@SilverlightFox another person with the correct timezone :)
@ThomasPornin yeah from the HN comments, it hopefully got some more people to understand the difference, which is a good thing !
 
@RоryMcCune The time zone all the cool kids use.
 
@SilverlightFox see that's what I keep saying to people in here, but there's some wacky people that seem to think US timezones could possibly compete
 
@Simon yes, yes you are a bad person.
 
2:31 PM
pls ovid
ohnuhnuh agreed with me.
 
It is +- Zero for a reason.... It's the main zone (although now technically we're +1).
 
@Simon of hateful speeches, not all humanists.
 
@SilverlightFox Inorite, it's obviously the canonical one
 
@AviD Humans in general suck anyway.
 
@AviD to be fair, the whiny ones are the only ones that get attention
 
2:33 PM
@Ohnana and the loud ones
 
i'm pretty sure a lot of people would find intersectional feminists and career feminists perfectly agreeable
 
I'm not sure what those terms mean.
 
intersectional -- don't glob people into big groups, look at specific characteristics that would influence people's lives
career -- personal liberation comes from confronting your problems and taking meaningful steps towards fixing them
 
j0h
is this a security channel?
 
Only when NOW() % 3 = 0.
 
j0h
2:38 PM
I want to learn about how to make secure SQL querries (not prone to sql injection)
 
j0h
cool thanks!
 
@j0h np
 
@j0h a lot of libraries will do it for you built in
 
And frameworks.
 
2:44 PM
@j0h Prepared statements. That is the proper way.
 
j0h
The thing I might be working on is a proprietary CMS wrote in cold fusion.
 
@j0h So, step #1 is rewrite to a proper, modern language. Step #2 is Prepared statements.
there are other things to consider, but those are the first.
 
j0h
Im positive, its both extremely dated, and not immediately compatible with anything. I thinkts CF MX or some non-sense
 
pls ovid, you should know that nothing ever gets rewritten in a modern language.
 
j0h
yeah, I plan to tell them that.
 
2:46 PM
Our life as coders is to support old ass shit.
 
j0h
yeah
lol
 
@Simon Hence why they need to teach punch card programming in kindergarten.
 
I wonder how Windows 10 decides when the best time to start my machine is
it's currently telling me that 19:45 is a good time to reboot my machine
 
j0h
I saw these ppl like 5 years ago and i told them I would work on it if they would let me rewrite it in php. They hired someone else. but, its been hacked so many times, they fired that guy.
 
even with them getting hacked they still made the right call avoiding PHP
 
j0h
2:49 PM
some one is going to say Perl in a minute I know it
 
@j0h heck no, in here it needs to be GoLang, Node.JS or nothing, we're hipsters
 
nobody said Perl, not a single Perl was spoken
 
especially @AviD , he's the hipster in chief
apart from @kalina she's a .NET appostate
 
I know nothing about programming
or computers
how did I even get here
what is this place
 
@kalina phhhbt you've had a job in tech support waaaay more recently than me
 
j0h
2:51 PM
halp!
 
who are you people
 
@j0h wait wait, we said "proper modern language", and you heard "PHP"?
what got lost in communication?
 
j0h
I ask myself who i am daily
 
@RоryMcCune that's hardly a fair comparison, I'm also significantly closer to being born than you
 
@kalina BTW did you see my MLP/Llamas in hats crossover link?
@kalina that is undeniably true
 
2:51 PM
@RоryMcCune no
you said I wouldn't like it, why would I click on it?
 
^ oh NSFW in case anyone didn't realise
 
in other news, making music in a LAN environment is far from ideal
and even though it resulted in a nearly acceptable end product it's so funny how different it sounds without the background noise
 
@kalina well you might find it amusing
 
the fuck did I just watch
 
@kalina someone re-doing a scene from llamas with hats, with MLP characters
 
3:00 PM
@Iszi Oh how my teachers loved to talk about dem punch cards.
 
Morning
 
@Simon fun punch card fact. Did you know that in IBM, after they stopped using Punch cards for coding, they kept making them as people liked using them for taking notes on in meetings (apparently they were a good size to fit into shirt pockets)
@DavidFreitag incorrect
 
@RоryMcCune That is so odd.
 
@Simon yeah weird, my uncle (who worked there) still had a stack of them after he retired in the 90's
 
my dad has punch cards from college
was there a punching machine? how did you get punches in the card?
 
3:06 PM
I hope so.
Imagine dem kids using their pencil to punch holes.
 
@RоryMcCune Nope, still right for about 54 minutes.
 
@Ohnana Punched them by hand.
 
whoa
 
ô_ô
 
that sounds annoying as all fuck
and i thought C was a bitch and a half
 
3:07 PM
@Iszi nope as @SilverlightFox and I pointed out earlier there's only one true timezone and that's GMT, by that reckoning morning ended a while back :)
 
@Ohnana You should take assembly for granted.
 
What if you've punched the wrong hole?
#rekt
 
@Simon i guess go fuck yourself and buy more cards
 
@RоryMcCune I thought the DMZ time zone correlated with U.S. Eastern?
 
@Simon what was worse was if you dropped the stack of cards your program was on and got them in the wrong order
 
3:08 PM
@RоryMcCune LOL
 
@Iszi ohh no, none of that, GMT or bust!
 
@RоryMcCune Yo momma's bust.
 
@RоryMcCune couldn't you just mark them with a pen
or did you only have wax tablets back then
 
I imagine that the other kids who bullied CS students loved to make them drop their card stacks.
 
@Ohnana yeah you still had to re-sort them (AFAIK large programs were several hundred cards long)
 
3:08 PM
@RоryMcCune o man
 
@Ohnana that's the elder rory :op
@Iszi are you confusing me with @Simon perchance?
 
@Simon i heard that since computer time was scarce, ppl would slap cards out of your hand so they could go first
 
@RоryMcCune Nah, nobody wants anything to do with @Simon's mom's bust.
 
@Ohnana lololol
oszi pls
 
@Ohnana that is how people learned to number the cards accordingly.
Can you imagine having a hundred card long program and dropped them all?
 
3:11 PM
you'd get really good at shuffle merge sort
 
Or spilling coffee on your pile.
Totally French'd that one.
 
@Simon You would only need to dry them, they were only paper...
 
dovid pls
Drying a stain usually doesn't make anything better.
 
@Simon TWSS
 
roro pls your missy wouldn't like to hear those words.
 
3:16 PM
@Simon TWSS
it occurred to me that TWSS could mean "That's what she said" or "That's what simon said" the latter just being a statement of the obvious :)
 
The latter is much more awesome.
 
3:45 PM
@ColinCassidy SUP MY MAN
 
@Simon he'll be living the superstar researcher life now
international travel (first class of course), limos everywhere... I'm sure that's how it is :)
 
ô_ô
pls colin don't forget about your family
 
sigh
 
@kalina sigh?
 
doing sanity check on a sample I'm using on a track I've had signed and the google results for said sample are a bunch of links to the original documentary and me talking about it in chat -.-
 
3:54 PM
@RоryMcCune sigh, v.: to take in and let out a long, loud breath in a way that shows you are bored, disappointed, relieved, etc.
 
@kalina oh noes OpSec fail (well if we happen to hear the track)
 
no it's opsec fail avoidance, I will just change the sample for... well, I don't know yet
I guess I'll go google for other shows to steal from
 
@Iszi that you just back from the sarcasmaholics meeting?
 
@RоryMcCune No, not at all.
 
@kalina Chorlton and the wheelies
@kalina Jamie and the Magic Torch
@kalina they would be awesome to sample
 
3:55 PM
...
 
@kalina don't tell me you're not a fan?
 
@Iszi they did that one at the live show I was at last week :D
 
that's the second time you've caused me minor brain damage today
 
@kalina score!
 
3:59 PM
@RоryMcCune Cool. I know it's been posted here before. Just figured it's been awhile, so worth the re-post. And damn, I'd forgotten how frickin' thick those accents are.
 
@Iszi aye I don't think they could've done the live show outside of Glasgow...
 
it's not nearly as tasteful as I pictured in my head
this was clearly the wrong way to go
what can I say, I expected them to be cooked more
raw face is just gross
 
@kalina kaaaaaaaaaalllllllllllinnnnnnnnnnna have you been eating faces again?
 
c'mon we haven't even got to be big surprise yet
well I totally didn't get that
 
4:14 PM
@kalina get what?
 
it
 
it
 
that
it
what
 
@kalina what's it (apart from a cheesy snack)?
 
thot
 
4:22 PM
Lunch lunch lunch lunch ;)
 
 
2 hours later…
6:02 PM
@kalina so what was it you didn't get then?
 
llamas with hats
it never ceases to disappoint me when I open up the mastered version of one of my tracks after some other... individual has decimated my beautiful arrangement
 
@RоryMcCune You guys are totally reminding me of quote in bash that had to do with a euphemism for female genitialia.
 
@kalina did you watch all 12 episodes?
 
yes
 
@kalina well it's a story of two friends who go through difficult times and then part company... and baby hands.... and meat dragons... and extraplanar rifts.... and the destruction of the world.
 
6:08 PM
my beautiful mix, with a dynamic range wider than @Simon's mom
now it's clipping every which way
 
@kalina I thought that the noise war was ending
didn't some major player start reducing the noise levels on tracks automatically
 
@RоryMcCune no it's not, it's about the first four episodes being shock comedy and then the community wanting more episodes and the writer making a point that beating a dead horse is ugly
 
which made it kind of pointless
 
@RоryMcCune nearly all of them (iTunes, YouTube, Soundcloud...)
 
@kalina pppphhhbbbttttttttt better not let @LucasKauffman hear you say that
 
6:09 PM
it doesn't really apply in a club setting though since everybody just destroys their tracks to get them as loud as possible
(something I don't subscribe to)
@RоryMcCune that's what the writer of the show said
 
@kalina yeah it seems pointless, ruins it as music
@kalina well not exactly
 
you can't listen to a "club master" in a normal setting and get the same enjoyment as you would a proper master
so I'm listening to this thing that's in its final form before appearing on a compilation mix cd of some kind and wondering... what the actual fuck
"final" form
another one of my tracks whose memory has been destroyed
 
@kalina DBZ style?
 
I've never watched DBZ
 
raz
@Polynomial Coding and debugging are inherent to StackOverflow — Begueradj 1 min ago
I just want to smush his face and take his lunch money
 
6:13 PM
@kalina you're not missing much... apart from 20 episode fight scenes
literally a fight scene that goes on for 20 half hour shows
@kalina can't you release "Kalina's mix" CDs where you do the un-smushed versions?
 
after and before
 
@kalina that's horrible!!
shame, I know that louder == better has been a thing but that's pretty extreme
 
this is why I hate mastering, I'd never willingly do that to my own music
it's like mutilating your own child so it fits in at the one eye no legs school
 
@kalina that's a .... colourful metaphor!
 
well, I try
 
6:22 PM
@kalina you should totally do a CD of "Un-smushed" "Club classics before they were ruined"
 
why, the louder = better is valid as far as the general public is concerned because of the way we perceive louder sounds
 
@kalina surely there might be a market for people who realise that ain't so
 
sure, thats the same market that owns a pono player
 
@kalina hey, they got a couple of mill on their crowdfunding campaign didn't they!
 
@kalina A device made to play lossless audio formats with <200 GB maximum storage capacity? Is it just me, or is something wrong there?
 
6:29 PM
well you can't have everything
but yes, it's a little bit of a... yeah
 
@Simon loves Roundellos?
 
@JukEboX he does indeed, he's all about the Roundellos
 
What is Roundellos?
 
^ @Simon prefers the British version
so Roundellos instead of Doughnuts
 
Qotd: "bread is a sad story of grain that couldn't become beer"
4
 
Adi
6:50 PM
Gaiz.. I have a PCI question
If my server isn't touching the CC info, but you're typing them in my page and when you click "Pay" they're submitted to the payment processor
How deep in PCI am I?
 
@Adi that is a very interesting questions (which is short-hand for " no idea guv")
for me if you're framing the content, if your server gets pwned they can replace the frame
so the web app should be in scope
but backend systems not (the CC don't go there)
this however is a logic based approach not a compliance one
 
Adi
@RоryMcCune I agree
I mean, if you have a PayPal button, what now?
 
I'm afraid unless anyone here is willing to confess the sin of being a QSA you may need to ask one of those types
 
Adi
Pwning your server can mean replacing the button and redirecting to a fake PayPal page
Seems like a rabbit-hole kind of argument
 
@Adi well if it redirects to another site (i.e. 302 not iframe) that's less bad as you can validate paypal when you get there
so the fake site presumably wouldn't have a valid cert.
iframing removes that possibility
but iframing is what stripe et al do
and get away with it
so I guess it must work :)
 
Adi
6:58 PM
Yeah, I think I'll have to annoy our QSA
Thanks, Rory
 
@Adi dooo it, QSAs love tricky questions :)
I mean why the hell else would you be a QSA!
 
7:18 PM
@Adi are you using an iFrame or are you processing the submitted data and passing on to the Payment Processor ?
how's the logging of your app?
SSL termination at the perimeter? Logs on Firewalls?
 
@Adi - you would need to demonstrate the protection on that front end. You don't need to worry about the encrypt at rest or in transit, but you have to be able to show appropriate protection of your web app
 
7:35 PM
@RоryMcCune SHUT TOP
 
7:53 PM
@Simon S'up Roundello-Man , had any good Roundellos today?
 
@Simon Haven't written that extension yet have you.
 
 
1 hour later…
8:57 PM
Zzzz
 
9:18 PM
gents
 
@LucasKauffman you missed and h and added an s
 
9:34 PM
what
 
@RоryMcCune wat
 
9:49 PM
Dear Bank: U2F is awesome. Please enable.
 
 
1 hour later…
11:05 PM
@Adi any sensible QSA would have to tell you that the front-end (HTML, Javascript, etc) is definitely in scope. If that is sufficiently isolated from the back-end / web application, you might be able to scope those out, but at the very least you would have to include delivery of the HTML / JS / etc (i.e. the webserver itself, SSL, etc.).
as @RоryMcCune said, if your app gets pwned, those files/code could be replaced.
also, paypal is not PCIable (at least, as far as I know, it didnt used to be...)
@RоryMcCune well, not any more. Really, it's been yeeeaaars since I was associated with that term.
 
11:18 PM
@Adi how far away is Gothenburg from you? The OWASP chapter there is looking for speakers for an OWASP day in November...
 

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