It's the same check to hit a target; the mechanics for saves are kind of similar, but not quite the same. Instead of daily/encounter/at-will powers, some characters (like fighters) don't really have powers at all, they just have a ton of attacks and clobber monsters indefinitely over time. Other types (wizard, cleric) have spell slots which are daily use, typically 1 spell slot of 1/2 character level, 2 spell slots of the next level lower, and so on

So for example, a 5th level cleric would have one 3rd level spell, 2 2nd level spells, and 3 1st level spells per day, or something along those lines. Extra low-level spells and increased spell save DCs are granted by ability modifiers.

I've heard 3.5 was ridiculously more complex than 4.

I wouldn't say it's more complex, I would say rather that it's less standardized

in 3.5 every class or spell kind of has its own rules. certain things are standardized, like melee attacks, save checks, and spell ranges, so they are more or less in line, but each spell is unique and has a different kind of effect

In 4e there are only a small number of well-established, core game mechanics that are really standardized, and each class mixes and matches those effects in different ways

4e is more well-thought-out, as a rules system, and it has few "corner case" special rules

At least, that's my impression

@cr0m Welcome

@cr0m hey

@Iszi The balance is, some of those "corner case" rules are what add flavor, and make the game interesting

Welcome, cheetos are over there, mountain dew's in the fridge. Feel free to look around, or weigh in on the main site questions =)

Fair enough

Community Wiki is a flag that can be set on a question.

Community Wiki is a feature (checkbox) that can be enabled on any question. When you mark that, it lets other people edit your stuff

And it changes the way reputation works, so you don't get all the points for something that's really a collaborative effort

Let me find you an official explanation

More experienced people (with 2k+ rep) can always rephrase your question.

CW makes it so that the answer section is more of a wiki. Anyone can edit anyone's answer. Mostly made for questions seeking a list.

Also, FYI (no big deal just yet, as the game hasn't really gotten started) this room isn't really for general chat. For that, you're looking for the Game Table.

This room is for a chat-based D&D game we're trying to put together.

It's OK, we don't bite =)

It's ok.

We're both in the Game Table as well.

(Re-sets the bait for his newbie-trap.)

Since about two hours ago! We are still making characters

It's an experiment in collaborative party design

...among other things.

And welcome back to our DM.

@BrianBallsunStanton Welcome back

Howdy

oh gods, reading history

Feel free

@cr0m Nothing much happening now. We're kind of at a stall.

But of course, you're welcome to stay.

Yeah, I'm on the way to bed

The chat history here is persistent, if you like you can page back through it and read what we were doing earlier

Gonna bow out, live long & prosper guys

@RMorrisey And may the force be with you.

Iszi, we're not so much at a stall as we're taking a short rest :)

And also with you.

or maybe an extended rest even.

Yeah, that's what I was looking for.

Although I don't think I'd say "we" if I were you. Your next extended isn't for another 8 hours or so, right?

yeah.

::grin::

Good night.

cheers mate

@BrianBallsunStanton I'll try to check in with John and make sure he gets the character updates put in tomorrow. If not, we could probably just process his slot as a group and have one more spare character lying around. Sound good?

:4889 I'll deal with it when it happens :) I'm flexible in some areas.

But I do want his participation

Agreed

I think I am going to be firm on him earning his way into chat. It's not hard and this /is/ a playtest

If he doesn't think that way, I don't think this would be much fun for him, as we'll be going meta fairly frequently

I don't have a problem with that. I'm more aiming at getting the char-gen done so we can move on.

This type of character generation exercise is definitely more suited to a live, in-person environment.

Yes, it is.

Hm. Looks like SO's chat system allows for some permissions management of the rooms. Unexpected.

Yeah

I should go. It's 0137 here, I have work in the morning and still a shower to take before bed.

g'night

Cheers, mate.

BTW: I think every group background should by default start at a +1. Presumably, the person who suggested it is in favor.

Ah

Okay, I'm really signing off this time.

Um. Hi!

Hello... user792..

that's funky.

Ah

Does it still say that?

that'swhat we call a bug.

Nope

Welcome to the site.

I am... en-welcomed!

What's the proper response to that; I have no idea

no idea. (Wow, it's so hard to act sane in this chat right now...)

::cough:: Can I help you with anything? :)

I... suppose you could add me to the Google Doc?

Ah, you wish to join our little endeavour?

I suppose I do!

Wait, wait

What would be the time commitments?

some activity every day?

Depending, I'm thinking I'm going to have a few "group" characters and a few "individual" characters, depending on activity levels.

But I'll be running a round a day.

Sure. I can do that. Yes, I do wish to join your little endeavour.

Excellent. Do you agree to the social contract? (Must not ask the traditional three questions... must not... must....)

...::cough:: What. Is your name?

Sohum!

What. Is your quest?

To b̶e̶c̶o̶m̶e̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶e̶s̶t̶ ̶r̶o̶l̶e̶p̶l̶a̶y̶e̶r̶ ̶e̶v̶e̶r̶ playtest interesting ideas while playing interesting games!

(That was a hard one.)

well done....

What. Is the central game mechanic found in Ben Robbins' Microscope and how does it compare to more traditional role playing games? :)

Which are you referring to, fractal play or history-construction-lack-of-characters?

:4942 I don't know...

::screams over the cliff::

Either way, it compares by being a) uncomparable and b) Pretty Damn Awesome

Well done.

What race are you going to nominate?

I will tell you... soon.

(Boo, you can't reply to yourself.)

@iszi may I suggest that your quiet friend look at the new essentials books? It might be easier to select a character from them.

Changeling!

so mote it be.

Your next task... answer questions 3 and 3a

Hello, all.

Good day, mate. You have a unique name...

Also, how did you get 101 rep?

Good morning @CRoss

It gave me 100 because I imported my settings from StackOverflow it seems.

I'm not sure how it all works.

(Sorry for the delay -- had to eat supper.)

huh, that's... kinda novel.

No worries mate.

Aussie, I'm guessing?

Recently, yeah :)

What were you before?

From the states.

Ah.

I'm from Canuckistan myself, originally. Or Germany. Depending on how you look at it.

Sorry, not to be hugely fussy or anything, but can we continue this conversation in the general chat area?

(Mainly because the rest of my players will be forced to read this log as we're setting up a game here.)

Ah. Didn't realize this wasn't such an area. How do I get to that locale?

chat.rpg.stackexchange.com/rooms/3/the-game-table

Switching. What's this area for then?

I'm running a game to playtest certain questions.

It seems we lack a proper defender

@CRoss If the Wilden goes for Resilient Battlemind, and the Dragonborn takes Inspiring Warlord, we should probably be ok I think.

@BrianBallsunStanton I may have another player interested, in place of (or addition to) JRRodrig7. Are we still open?

@Iszi were you suggesting two changelings in the party?

Good morning.

'mornin.

@Sohum No, I was suggesting that the one changeling be secretive about his racial identity, to such extent that he doesn't even tell the other party members or display changeling abilities in front of them. (He waits for opportunities when the others aren't looking, if it's necessary.)

....

oh gods I'm going to scream when I open that doc

aren't I?

@BrianBallsunStanton Why would you do that?

I know Sohum?

and his... ways...

cool

we have our theme

5th regiment, expendables.

um, given that we have 5 actives now. I'm going to stop while the going is good.

@BrianBallsunStanton We have 5 confirmed actives, without John?

:5066 Correct. And we have 6 people voting for the 5th regiment

Oh, k.

:5055 So, why did you write "Closet Changeling" on the Tiefling's section?

hrmm

group management is going to be ... tricky

@Sohum He's "in the closet" about being a changeling.

@Sohum Oh, oops.

changling pretending to be wilden?

Nevermind.

My bad.

Wait... the Changeling was there.

look up?

Then, the characters got swapped when a new guy came in.

err...

Yea, Brian did some messing around

But, whoever swapped the characters didn't move over my notes.

no, I tried very hard to avoid that, actually

hrmmm, odd

@BrianBallsunStanton The changeling could pretend to be whatever he wants. I would presume though, that he'd rather be human since that requires no extraordinary abilities for him to maintain the illusion.

right

sorry, um

midunderstood your suggestoin

The point of it is, he for some reason or another would be so afraid to reveal his true self that he'd only do so in cases of extreme need, and only when the only witnesses would not be expected to survive.

hrmmmm

interesting

This is all, of course, if the theme is agreed upon.

everyone's supporting 5th regiment

I meant, the character's theme.

hrmmm, I'm running two seats now. Should we kill off one?

It all depends on how much the changeling trusts the group

Also, you know what is awesome?

@BrianBallsunStanton What two seats?

rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product_info.php?products_id=84741 is awesome

hrmm

it has DRYH

and Sufficiently Advanced!

and I've heard good things about Icons

never heard of it

hrmmm

okay

greywulf.net/2010/06/10-things-to-like-about-the-icons-rpg

let me see here...

@BrianBallsunStanton John said he e-mailed in his class suggestions. Not sure why he didn't do it in the Google Doc. Did you get anything from him?

hrmmm

eh?

haven't gotten anything

he's still with us?

And I'm actually going to be quite firm about chat participation.

But that's OK, I'll keep both chracters around for a while until he earns enough points to get in.

Like I said, if not him I do have another friend who's very interested. He's online right now, just needs help earning rep.

Well, if he asks a question or answers one of mine, I have 5 votes left today

Didn't know we hat a votes limit.

Aaand yeah, sure. I'll allow your new friend to sit in where JRR was. 6 is 5 effectively.

yup, 20.

I'm making some effort to spend them all

Aren't you supposed to get 10 rep just for confirming your e-mail?

you are?

nope

Maybe it was a thing for private beta

what's his name?

I'll add him to the doc.

Done

hrmmm

we have a /lot/ of people in our doc...

So, the Essentials classes

are they reskinned versions of their corresponding "normal" classes?

or are they actively different?

Both

As I understand it, both.

Essentials druid is a /leader/

So there are elements of reskinning, but there are some real changes made as well

@BrianBallsunStanton Where's the FAQ entry (is there one?) on what actions give what amounts of rep?

um

dunno, but +5 for being upvoted on a question, +10 for being upvoted on an answer +2 for marking a question answered and +!5 for being the selected answer to a question

"!5"?

er

15

Well, scrap... he might have gone offline :-( he's not answering my e-mails. How about we just say first one of those to chat gets the slot, unless someone else comes along?

Works.

Here's my formal ruling. We are currently doing phase 4

If one of them responds by this time tomorrow, they get the seat. The first one responding gets the seat. Otherwise the seat goes up in a puff of hellfire

@BrianBallsunStanton Fair enough.

@BrianBallsunStanton What do you mean "(or create)"?

And phase 4.... ::makes ironchef chairman hand motions:: Begin!

um

I thought part of the assignment was to work with what you were given?

:5154 that's... a good questoin

ooooh

lack of coffee error

Was referencing backgrounds, not classes.

Basically, if someone wants to make up a background, I won't stop them.

And, we may actually want to assign the classes before Phase 4 instead of leaving it to choice. To ensure party balance.

hrmmmm

Do we need to put that through a vote process as well?

Naah, but I'll break that and 4 proper up

and there we go.

Idea - Instead of re-creating the list every time, just shuffle the names around one list?

Eeeh,

it's not that much trouble to recreate, and leaves us breadcrumbs

Makes sense, I s'pose.

Just a relic from my wave gaming.

Yeah, 4a is the right step.

Aw, no Starlock.

Are you intending to break it into 4a (class) and 4b (backgrounds)?

If so, review your description of 4a please.

better?

Yeah, no starlock. we're depressingly strikerheavy

@BrianBallsunStanton Once we've solidified the final group, maybe we should lock the chat down to read-only except for the group?

If that's possible, it would help deter the "general chatters".

I can't do it. But yeah, that's a good idea.

John just bowed out of the race. Claims school schedule issues. We'll see if Kedearian makes it.

John may be interested sometime after graduation, though.

Drat.

:5184 works. This certainly isn't the only playtest that will be run

Would be nice to have a "regular" game table too, some time.

:5187 Yah. But a lot trickier.

Probably should have a more localized bunch for that, I guess.

:5189 It ... helps. I've done a wave based real-time game

it was... very tricky.

Hrmmm

I've got a feeling that we're going to be without leader.

?

:5194 I dunno. It's just my DM instincts kicking me.

Could very easily be wrong

/me totally wants to see a Bard in action

(boo, no /me)

Aye, same here.

A Gnomish, trickster bard no less.

You're /all/ dead, you know that right?

Oh... assign your tiefling a rank of some type...

It's either the bard or the ardent

A Rank?

military themed, man!

oh, right!