@BESW I get what you're saying, but if I write an answer saying that I've used D&D 5e to teach completely new players roleplaying (note: I would not leave this answer, although it's true), there's not all that much to differentiate my answer from anyone else's.
It's a game-rec question: it needs experts who can speak to the game's effectiveness from a position of experience.
So, while I've introduced people to role-playing with D&D 3.5, 4e, Fate, RFS, and Cthulhu Dark, the only game I have experience with people learning purely from the system material is D&D 3.5--and even that's a bit iffy, as I had friends who held my hand a little bit.
@BESW Which is difficult... an "expert" in this instance would be a (relatively) new player who learnt from a currently available book. Or maybe someone who has played with someone like that.
Yes. It's a very hard question to answer from experience, because most gamers start under the tutelage (awesome word) of other gamers.
That makes it no less awesome a question, nor does it put the question out of the Stack Exchange scope. In fact, it makes it MORE awesome and MORE worthy of Stack attention: it's a hard, challenging question that will draw directly on the experience of our citizens.
My roleplaying introduction came from Fighting Fantasy-type solo gamebooks, then Dragon Warriors (direct from the books, along with one other friend who was learning it at the same time as me), and then D&D/AD&D (with a group). All this alongside CRPGs.
I was mostly self-taught from the D&D 3.0 and 3.5 core books, with a couple friends (who had a very small amount of experience in OTHER systems but none in 3.x) answering my confused questions as best they could (which wasn't much).
I'm wondering if I should put my "starter set" comment in as either a comment or answer on that question... it might help the querent, but it wouldn't be a high quality answer... and if I put it as a comment it might be seen as "answering in comments"...
I'd be inclined to say something like, "Stack doesn't always give fast turn-around on answers, so if you need recommendations fast but sloppy to get something before Christmas, the [chat] could probably help puzzle something out (though it likely won't be as solid an answer as the main site can provide)."
And if he comes to chat, talk about starter sets.
...heh. Thinking back, it took me at least a year to make the connection between tabletop D&D and the one CRPG I'd ever played (Wizardry 8).
@BESW And it'd be almost impossible to have played with someone learning purely from a book if you hadn't, since you'd have had to have sit there and not helped them.
Considering the amount my experienced friends were helpful, I think I would be supported in giving an answer about D&D 3.x. But I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
Yeah the odd thing about this is a lot of peoples' first RPGs is D&D, except I'm on the side of things where D&D should probably not be anyone's first RPG
(I am really glad I got into other games before D&D's ethos took grip of me)
Heh. On an individual basis, D&D can work. It's the system's ubiquity as an introduction that makes it problematic, I think, and the same would be true of ANY system gaining that kind of first-exposure dominance.
Bundle of Holding has five different bundles right now! One of which is Razor Coast... anyone had experience playing that? And, how hard would it be to adapt from Pathfinder to 3.5e?
For whatever reason, I'm more okay with "world's greatest RPG" than with the system doesn't matter implications that they're trying to imply with the phrase.
After all, "world's greatest" at least says there are other options.
It's the notion that D&D is sufficient for all RPG experiences that rubs me the wrong way up a tree.
Yeah, I mean, I love D&D, but I would never try to use it for anything other than "Heroic adventurers fight monsters and villains." That's what it does, and it does it well, but it doesn't do much of anything else.
@Miniman yeah, and new players won't know better. when i learned there were games that actually dealt with social interaction with high levels of mechanics, and weren't about fighting, that was kinda amazing to me.
context: i started learning about tabletop RPGs in University, in... 2010. had a lot of on-and-off experience, never got to do more than a few sessions of anything, experienced D&D 3.5e, AD&D 2e, basic D&D where you picked a race not a class, then D&D 4e, then started learning about non-D&D RPGs through this site and its community.
i am decently aware of the effects D&D itself was having on me, and a lot of the D&D questions on this site are like a reflection of possible situations and struggles alternate-reality me would have been in if I had not found this site.
@doppelgreener -- here's my problem: what I see is that either you get combat-centric RPGs like D&D, or social-centric RPGs, but I haven't seen much at all that explores the use of metaphysics mastery to solve problems -- and that approach fits into neither combat-centric play (because it causes issues of the 'potato tea' variety) nor social-centric play (because it tends to bypass the limitations of other characters as information/assistance/... sources)
@BraddSzonye I believe every RPG is a manifesto. The rules and mechanics are a declaration of what creates interesting play. Some are just better at conveying their beliefs.
@BESW Ah. Yes. Reading the rest of that paragraph, I don't think they mean it quite how they wrote it. My reading is, they meant "our tool is useful even if you're using unsupported rulesets". Which may or may not be an accurate claim either.
@BraddSzonye Now, that I'll disagree with: new players aren't blank slates, they bring their culture with them. Not having played other games doesn't mean they won't bring ideas--conscious or subconscious--about how games are played.
It's important for everyone to have similar notions about what the game's gonna be like.
@BESW -- yeah, or else you wind up as me -- someone who has a habit of redefining every game he walks into in ways that people simply aren't expecting to deal with
That's the sort of thing I'm thinking about when I say a good RPG is a manifesto: it's clear about its terms and goals and tools and probably is good at showing you why they're good.
\o Also, gonna chime in here, as a new and learning player, Fate explaining its philosophy and talking about its own rules was really really helpful in understanding how to play. This was before I started seriously looking at the game from a designer perspective.
I find I still don't quite have the Fate Accelerated rules and philosophy matched up yet -- then again, my game hasn't gotten into really any sort of conflict scene, yet
D&D didn't talk so much about its own rules, just said how things were and then said go, and that was okay, but a very different experience. (But then again it's also D&D, so that was a different experience on its own.)
@doppelgreener I was actually suckered in by some bits in the 3.5 DMG which told me that all I had to do to play a political or psychological game was apply Oberoni.
I'd probably still have 3.5 in my game rotation if I hadn't spent all those years trying to make it do things it really wasn't built for. It's got a sweet spot that I can value.
@JohnP :P just wait until you try to force-fit a natural lycanthrope paladin into any D&D edition other than 3.5 -- fantastic system-breaker character concept if I ever saw one
> ...it takes sandbox games to the level only found in Ed Greenwood's basement. Not the one full of redheads. The other basement. - from a review of Razor Coast
Hague Mermaid has been ordered. We will see in a couple of days whether it is the source of nightmare fuel sea witch (assuming they actually send me the right edition).
It's a good candidate. Post-1989 is likely enough; Disney's film would have increased interest in the story, and recent picture books would have been more likely to end up on my shelf. Due to the earliness of the memory, it can't be later than... I'd say '96 or '97 probably, but likely before then. Amazon has a list of editions, and while it's unlikely to be complete, there aren't a lot of other candidates in the proper date range.
Also, debating buying the M&M 2e bundle before it's over. I'm not sure. I'll have to compare the editions.
The Dungeon World bundle is a good deal as well. I'm only vaguely interested in DW, but you really can't go wrong with the core and several expansions for $7.
i have a question what is it Simpsons Tapped out , Family Guy: The Quest for Stuff , SpongeBob Moves In , Clash of Clans , Boom beach , ... game engine? i believe someone say they have own engine but i think they use specified engine and customize that engine.is very important to know.i have a ar...
I have a problem understanding votings again.
This is a question basically asking how to run an epic campaign.
This is a question basically asking how to run an evil campaign.
One was downvoted and closed. The other has 23 upvotes, not a single downvote and not a single close vote.
One of t...
Obi Wan was a horrible teacher but not a bad guy. He just expected more from his apprentice than he should have. Right? (I have only seen movies once.)
@Aaron depends on which series you're watching. He was a quick father figure/mentor/quest giver to Luke. He was a young and brash head strong student, cocky teacher to Anakin
Browsing thru Amazon for gift ideas - saw that the 5e DM Guide is #70 top seller (updated hourly - not sure what the exact time period is). I'm impressed - who knew that a 40 year old roleplaying game could still make the top 100 list?
@waxeagle sigh, I search the tags I would use, cleric/DnD 5E, don't see the question, ask it and turns out it's a duplicate of a question with no class specific tags. It's annoying.
all that said, if you're searching for something and you can't find it, ask it. If it's closed as a dupe, no problem, you've just improved the site for the next guy with the same question.
Thinking about making a stout halfling totem (bear/wolf) barbarian 7 and assassin rogue 13. Just seems like I'll need 3 stat rolls of 17 or higher to make it exactly how I'll want it.
What is the optimal way to fight hand to hand in PF/3.5, BTW? Between humanoids I mean. I've read that tripping is a handy action to pull off, but lots of people don't think much of grappling.
The Dominant Life Form in the Cosmos Is Probably Superintelligent Robots http://motherboard.vice.com/read/the-dominant-life-form-in-the-cosmos-is-probably-superintelligent-robots Well, duh.