TRPG General Chat

6:00 AM

Reading Our Cancer Year, which is about a year in a cancer patient's life with neither beginning nor ending except "that was a year," my brain made a very strong click noise about what comics and graphic novels could be or do.

Maus and Persepolis didn't do that for me--they're still stories, with rising action and conclusions, with themes and ready dialogue and symbolism.

And the difference between Maus and Our Cancer Year is exactly what you just said: Protagonists with Big Goals.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@Magician Yep.

BESW

The goal of the main characters in Maus was personal, but framed in a grand context: escape Nazi Germany! That's got running and hiding and starving and shooting and blowing up.

The goal of the main characters in Our Cancer Year was "survive a year with cancer."

It was quiet, it was often boring--often for the characters as well as the reader--but it was no less tense, no less fraught with hope and betrayal, no less vital for the people involved.

Alex P

The thing is, it's not so much that she wants to play Our Cancer Year or the equivalent. But her natural impulse is very much not to create characters who want outsized things.

I think it would be less of a noticeable thing in a bigger-group context, other than kinda pushing her more into a "bass player" role.

user61230

Evenin'.

BESW

@Emrakul hi.

Alex P

6:04 AM

In one-on-one it's very hard to get rolling from that starting point, though.

@Emrakul Evenin'.

BESW

What if her character's goals were very small, but the CHALLENGES needed to overcome in order to reach the goals are immense?

@Templestalker Hi!

Templestalker

@BESW Hi

@BESW did I do that correctly?

Alex P

@BESW Sounds doable, but throw examples at me!

BESW

Indeed you did.

@AlexP Give me a small goal.

Alex P

@BESW Secure a suitable marriage for your heir.

BESW

6:09 AM

@AlexP ...who happens to be a dabbler in the Dark Arts and accidentally turned himself into a werewolf.

Alex P

@BESW Have a good crop this year.

BESW

@AlexP Despite the draught, and the local taxes being doubled (but the governor says he'll waive your taxes if your village beats his team in a sport you've never played?)

Alex P

@BESW That's kinda saying "make someone else the raging-storm-of-Byronic-BS protagonist." ;)

BESW

@AlexP Which is totally what Buffy sometimes does.

Alex P

@BESW True!

BESW

6:11 AM

It can be fun to play someone with ordinary goals who is caught up in someone else's mad plot.

@AlexP Alternately, maybe you're one of the Hounds of God who is an ordinary old farmer, except for the times when you're turned into a divine werewolf who has to battle witches in hell in order to get a good crop?

user61230

Hey, @Magician, you're the 1000th star of the chat! You win three elephants! But, unfortunately still need 7/10 elephants.

BESW

Remember, one of the most famous epic fantasy stories of the modern era started out with a protagonist whose goal was "Have a nice quiet life unbothered by weirdos."

user61230

(Actually you're the 1001st, but the 1000th is kind of depressing. Thanks a lot, @waxeagle.)

Magician

Hahaha, I don't even get fictional self-pick-up elephants.

BESW

@Emrakul Keep in mind, those aren't in chronological order.

Magician

6:16 AM

...all in favor of changing the star icon into a tiny elephant icon?

7

BESW

@Magician All the Yes.

user61230

@BESW I was looking through the full star log.

BESW

This? Still not in order, I'm pretty sure.

Alex P

@BESW This got me thinking about a thing. Thanks!

user61230

Looks like it, actually.

BESW

6:17 AM

@AlexP No problem.

user61230

Look through the times. At the very least, the first ten or so are chronological, and that's all that counts.

Magician

And now 2 of my starred quotes are about elephants. What have you done, @BESW?!

user61230

Don't make me star that ironically.

BESW

I'd also suggest "despite having to deal with the worst in-laws ever" as a traditional, easily adaptable, always-available complication.

user61230

I've done it before, and I'll do it again.

Alex P

6:19 AM

@BESW I think what it boils down to is that I should avoid one of my favorite things, which is "Let's have a character grow into a new role."

BESW

@Magician You are becoming relephant.

@AlexP Ah, yeah.

Alex P

And instead do "Here is your giant pile of roles you have. You totally own them but they are in conflict!"

BESW

@AlexP Sounds excellent!

Magician

@Emrakul This could be @BESW's secret plot. We know if he achieves star dominance over chat, the world will end. I suspect quotes about elephants count as quotes by him, too.

user61230

@Magician We should start a Cult of Relephancy.

Magician

6:21 AM

A community's maturity is measured by the memes it has generated.

BESW

@Magician Inversely proportional, right?

Alex P

@BrianBallsun-Stanton So, was the fight-avoiding thing trying to subvert the system on purpose? (It sounds like you were aware of the incongruity going into it.) What did you expect to happen?

Magician

@BESW Different meaning of maturity ;)

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AlexP no, it's... I'm very much an iconoclast when it comes to characters, as well as not actually liking conflict.

user61230

The new logo for RPG.SE

Alex P

6:22 AM

@Emrakul Why does it have cloven hooves?

user61230

@AlexP Better mobility. They're mechanized hooves.

BESW

It's hard for a solid metal appendage to splay, which in turn reduces balance and traction.

user61230

They're mechanized.

user61230

It's not like they're freely moving hinges, they're on tiny servos.

Alex P

@BrianBallsun-Stanton Re: not liking conflict -- What's your AM play like? More of a day-in-the-life kind of experience, or closer to characters turning dramatic conflicts into compromises?

Magician

6:24 AM

brb, caffeinating.

BESW

@Emrakul Yes, which doesn't work in a solid piece of metal.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AlexP paperwork, punctuated by problems in the environment

user61230

@BESW You realize that this basically sums up this entire conversation at this point, right?

BESW

Doesn't matter if they're servo-run or gravity-run, splaying feet are better.

user61230

You actually can have curved hinges, btw.

user61230

6:25 AM

The hinges are flat, but they're bound by tangential screws.

Alex P

@BrianBallsun-Stanton Paperwork?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AlexP character sheets in my game run to 20 pages

per character

plus associated appendicies

BESW

@Emrakul [cough]

Alex P

@BrianBallsun-Stanton Oh, that's right. It's one of the reasons Ars Magica has a huge tendency to "decay" into freeform.

user61230

I.... I can't. I'm sorry.

user61230

6:28 AM

Please, no more. I concede!

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AlexP not for me?

my game celebrates paperwork

because I celebrate it

Alex P

What are you writing down on the sheets?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

hehhehehe

season yb season xp logs, experiment logs

Alex P

Oh, that's not character sheets

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

yes it is

BESW

6:30 AM

He really does have a whole log that's nothing but "hehhehehe hehhehehe hehhehehe hehhehehe."

Alex P

I write down every roll I make in BW. It all becomes trash after two days.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AlexP like I said, this isn't trash

this is all a record, season by season, of what every character does

Alex P

Where does it go?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

because around once a month, someone gets out of sync and people go "wait, what were you doing in 1234 summer?"

google docs

Alex P

Like, what does the information do?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

6:31 AM

we have many many google docs

Alex P

Ahhh.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AlexP audit and reconsturction trail

Alex P

So the purpose is to create a meticulous history?

BESW

"Hey, how's Random Farmer Number Two doing since we turned his barley field into sheep five years ago?"

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AlexP audit trail for reconstruction because numbers do come out wrong, or a character interacts with something in the past.

BESW

6:33 AM

("It was necessary! The elemental balance of the barley was all wrong for what we needed to do three counties over.")

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

"what did you do last summer?" is not an idle question

Also "what's the current state and expenses of your lab?"

"what doohickeies are hanging off your talisman?"

"What bonuses does it give to casting?"

etc. etc. etc.

most of it is summarized in the first 3 or so pages

but...

Magician

I don't know how people played Ars Magica without programmable spreadsheets.

Alex P

Okay, everyone. Enjoy your day/evening/whatever.

BESW

ttfn

user61230

See ya!

Templestalker

6:39 AM

Later!

user61230

Good afterbeforevening, @Templestalker!

user61230

So apparently my animal companion is now a unicorn.

user61230

A unicorn. Live the unicorn.

BESW

3.5, right?

Unicorns are kinda the healing animal companion.

user61230

Yeah. And detect evil.

user61230

6:44 AM

Plus it's just a generally powerful animal companion.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

Yo.

BESW

I suspect they were channeling at least a little bit of The Last Battle when they statted up unicorns.

user61230

@Avner Oy!

user61230

@BESW Probably. It's stats are pretty insane compared to what I'd normally get at this level. It's not on the normal companion list.

BESW

Usually you need a feat to get it.

user61230

6:47 AM

And I don't think it was even in this world until I asked for it.

user61230

Hm, feat?

Magician

I recall a conversation I've had with a player in an old 3.5 game of mine. His high-level paladin got a feat for extra-shiny mounts, and picked, er, a sphinx or something. Point being, it was both smarter and wiser than him. We've pondered for a while how to resolve that, and who was a mount to whom, really, and finally settled on Jeeves and Wooster as the template for their relationship.

user61230

Ah, Exalted Companion.

user61230

It seems an exception has been made, though xD

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@Magician I used to play Ars Magica with a sort of a power-player.

BESW

6:49 AM

I always felt that a krenshar would be awesome, if they hadn't been statted so miserably.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

He managed to construct a familiar for his character, an air-breathing, water-spouting invisible flying dolphin who was smarter than the Magus he was attached to.

user61230

That looks pretty awesome, yeah, @BESW

BESW

@Emrakul But I think they were statted to only be effective in packs.

Magician

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Oh, my familiar has higher Magic Theory than the rest of the party, with the possible exception of another familiar.

2

BESW

The save DC is low enough that it's only useful if you can spam it.

Magician

6:51 AM

It's the upside of having nothing better to do for years than sit there and read tractii.

user61230

Yeah, point.

user61230

I can see that.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@Magician Sure beats the OotS solution of just forgetting your familiar exists until you need him. giantitp.com/comics/oots0674.html

user61230

I wonder if my unicorn gets to choose more spells as it levels.

Magician

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Yup. But now I have to keep track of familiar's xp as well. Spreadsheets!

BESW

6:56 AM

@Emrakul Not unless its levels are class levels in a spellcasting class.

Unicorns don't have spellcasting as if they were casters; they have spell-like abilities.

As it's a ranger animal companion, its advanced HD are just racial.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@Magician Well, we already have a spreadsheet for covenant maintenance, including a research-per-season sheet with columns for all magi. Just adding one for the beastie isn't too bad.

BESW

@Emrakul If your unicorn gains levels from its own XP advancement instead of because it's the animal companion of an up-leveling ranger (which it shouldn't except in VERY unusual circumstances), then it could choose to gain levels in a spellcasting class.

Magician

Tardis!

(do wander inside)

BESW

@Magician You could fit an elephant in there.

[is suddenly interested]

BESW

7:16 AM

...I just ran across someone calling the monsters in Pitch Black "bioraptors."

Magician

...as opposed to?..

BESW

I was going to complain, but then I realized that this implies most raptors are robots, and I just can't be upset about that.

Magician

He knowsssss.

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

I've missed something here about elephants, haven't I?

BESW

shopping & dinner time, bbl

trogdor

7:38 AM

lol

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

7:52 AM

My company's web filtering blocks rpg.stackexchange.com, but not the chat room.

doppelgreener

@Brian Are you there?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@JonathanHobbs da?

doppelgreener

None of that Magic Item Level and Rarity stuff seems to say anything about the usage limits on magic items :(

Did they simply cease to have daily and encounter powers?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@JonathanHobbs as any kind of thing other than "yeah, it's a daily"

so dailys and encounters are simply that.

there's no "fuss" with extra rules

because item rarity means someone won't have 15 salves of power

doppelgreener

so if I have ten Swords of Making A Giant Thunderbolt Come Out Of Nowhere, I can cackle madly summoning thunderbolts for ten rounds?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

8:00 AM

yes

doppelgreener

Wow okay. :)

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

because the GM gave you those 10 swords

doppelgreener

XD

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

basically the game went look, you can't start with these things, and you can't craft these things

so... go for it?

which, of course, makes enchanting competely pointless

doppelgreener

Good. I like that. I never knew about these rules for "only one ite daily per day even if you have five!" until just now actually.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

8:01 AM

@JonathanHobbs yeah, that's why they were taken out and shot

doppelgreener

\o/ Good thing too

I must go out now. If another answerer beats me to it I'll be very interested to see what the rules actually say about it xD

Off I go!

And thanks Brian

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

@JonathanHobbs That's one of the first things that made me dislike 4e.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

wizards.com/dnd/article.aspx?x=dnd/drfe/20100824

Magic Item Usage

Before we bring this discussion to a close, it’s worth mentioning that the limits on using daily magic item powers are no longer part of the game. They existed to prevent the characters from stockpiling items that were far below their level but still had useful, daily powers. Under this scheme, such items are uncommon. Stockpiling a number of them is impossible without house rules or a Dungeon Master who willingly awards multiple copies of such items as treasure. With our new rarity scheme in place, we no longer need such rules.

there you go

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

(Original link is blocked here, so I can only comment on your excerpt)

So they decided to go for an in-world limit rather than an out-of-character mechanical limit?

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

finally being years ago, yes?

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

8:06 AM

Yes, yes.

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

2010

Avner Shahar-Kashtan

I've been ignoring 4e for a while, now. :)

Brian Ballsun-Stanton

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan as you will.

wax eagle

10:46 AM

he lives

BESW

"He's ALIVE!"

BESW

12:27 PM

Tonight's Phrase Stuck In BESW's Head comes from Brows Held High's review of Dead Man: "We have learned mystical diddily-squat."

BESW

1:19 PM

Today we learned that Bluetooth technology is named for a Danish king.

Harald Bluetooth

Harald "Bluetooth" Gormsson (, ) (probably born c. 935) was a King of Denmark and Norway. He was the son of King Gorm the Old and of Thyra Dannebod. He died in 985 or 986 having ruled as King of Denmark from c. 958 and King of Norway for a few years probably around 970. Some sources say his son Sweyn Forkbeard forcibly deposed him as King. The Jellinge stones Harald had the Jelling stones erected to honour his parents. The Encyclopædia Britannica considers the runic inscriptions as the most well known in Denmark. The biography of Harald Bluetooth is summed up by this runic inscription ...

wax eagle

3:00 PM

@BESW ooh I knew that at one point

MadMAxJr

3:29 PM

Harald Bluetooth... He's that guy in Civ5 who likes to start a war with me, then 20 years later go, "Remember that war we had? Good times."

wax eagle

@MadMAxJr is that before or after you crush his hopes and dreams?

BESW

@waxeagle He's a king of Denmark and Norway in the late 900s. Crushing each others' hopes and dreams is, like, their version of chest-bumping.

wax eagle

@BESW lol good point.

MadMAxJr

Well in the last game I had a fight with him, I called up Germany, gave him a good payoff to go keep Harald busy....

Zachiel

@BESW lol

Metool

5:59 PM

Beep.

wax eagle

boop

hehe got to cast the last offensive flag :)

just a note, don't forget to post posts in need of offensive/spam flags in here so we can pile on and get rid of them quicker

Metool

oh?

wax eagle

@Metool a specific number of normal user spam/offensive flags will automatically delete and lock a post

BESW

8:29 PM

Shan't be around much the next 13 or 14 hours. Got a teach job and then a Ruhi circle back to back. May log on during breaks at work, may collapse into naps.

BESW

9:37 PM

@Emrakul This is a friendly reminder to beware discussion in comments, mate. The issue of whether PbP Fate can sustain the expected social repartee, or whether it must, would be a great thing to invite Wraith to chat to talk about, but I fail to see how it's going to help improve the question.

user61230

@BESW Ah, yeah, thanks. I'm still meta-minded, and it's a bad habit to get into.

user61230

If the discussion continues, I'll bring it in here.

BESW

Wraith's time is limited and so he doesn't come to chat often, but he's very interesting to pin down about Fate because he's got a quite different approach to it than this chat's usual gestalt interpretation.

Drives me up a wall sometimes, but truth is found in the clash of opinions.

user61230

Hm! I'll have to talk with him, then. Sounds interesting!

user61230

For now, though, unfortunately I must go.

user61230

9:41 PM

Thanks for the reminder, and we shall meet again!

BESW

@Emrakul Try this room and its associated question some time:

FATE conflict finales

Concessions, taken out and other means of ending a conflict

user61230

(Also, unfortunately I had a rundown of the FAE session, but it was lost in the aether, so I now don't. My bad!)

user61230

Will do, thanks!

BESW

Oh, man, I'd forgotten that I'd compared Rule 0 to Ellidyr's black Beast.

Alex P

@Emrakul I'm curious why you brought up GNS in response to this question.

BESW

9:47 PM

@AlexP My guess is that it's because GNS is a good place to start thinking about how to define playstyles.

and his answer is all about the idea that the conflict might be a playstyle conflict.

Unfortunately, it's a poor place to end thinking about how to define playstyles, and the way he's presenting it makes it sound like he's fallen into the common misconception that GNS's three categories are definitionally antagonistic to each other.

Alex P

@BESW They largely are "definitionally" antagonistic to each other. Though that depends on which version of the essays you're looking at, also.

The reason I try to avoid bringing up GNS is because the labels themselves are very difficult for people to understand in the context of any discussion that's trying to introduce the concept of diverging play goals. The terms are rather opaque so people just fit them into "roleplayers vs. rollplayers" or whatever other mental framework they have already.

BESW

I'm leaving a comment to that effect.

@AlexP May I plagiarize this a bit?

Alex P

@BESW Plagiarize away.

I take it that means you agree with me?

Also I can just go post that comment.

BESW

I think this would be a much better answer without the GNS. GNS is a simple place to start thinking about these things, but it's also simplistic and implies needless antagonism between playstyles, partly because the labels aren't used in ways intuitive to those new to the concept of diverging play goals. — BESW 5 secs ago

Alex P

I left a comment also.

BESW

10:02 PM

Link to the chat discussion in your comment.

Alex P

Done

So, I think the creative agendas largely are antagonistic.

BESW

Maybe I don't understand GNS very well, but I'm not seeing it within the agendas as defined by GNS.

Simulation is about recreating source material (not necessarily realism), which is often hand-in-hand with narrativism if the source material is a particular genre.

Alex P

Well, it's what the agendas are supposed to represent. They're goals and motivations.

Narrativism isn't genre.

It's "thematic storytelling."

BESW

Yes.

I'm saying Simulation can be genre.

Alex P

Yes.

BESW

10:06 PM

Which often dovetails nicely with storytelling goals.

Alex P

Counterpoint: simulation as simulation of genre is often hostile to thematic exploration, in the sense that there is one true genre answer to the question and it's ruining the mood not to choose that answer.

I.e. there are certain ways a story is "supposed to" end.

BESW

Which is where gamism can actually unify the other two agendas.

Alex P

How so?

BESW

Well, Gamism is about setting clear achievable goals, right?

Alex P

It's about challenges.

BESW

10:08 PM

That also predefines how the story is "supposed to" end.

Alex P

Well, if you don't overcome the challenge, though, it's fine. I mean, it means you lost. But the game still worked.

BESW

So, if we're simulating film noir and find ourselves in a Casablanca plot, there are multiple endings which satisfy the genre, are justified by the characters' motive and the overall narrative, and which involve meeting or failing to meet clearly set and achievable goals.

Alex P

That's saying that "the story" as an artifact of play could be the result of any CA. What does that look like in play, though?

BESW

Work just started, shall mull it over while teacing.

Alex P

Ok.

No worries.

It's not a discussion we necessarily need to have.

But, if you wish to: my challenge is to you is to express how the process in that game satisfies all three, either for one player at once or for different players doing different things simultaneously. (I'll just blanket accept that switching GNS-ish stance from scene to scene is reasonable.)

Metool

10:18 PM

teacing?

Metool

10:32 PM

Ah well.

Alex P

I know this is just podcast listeners, but holy crap Apocalypse Engine.

(Good job Fate, also, I suppose.)

Phil

10:53 PM

I'm off to bed in a sec, but this question seriously needs some TLC

0

Q: What can I use for sci-fi ambient music?

Another DM I know recently taught me to use ambient music, especially during combat, to keep players more focused on the game and for general atmosphere. That's all fine and simple for fantasy, plenty of sources. But I'm at a loss for my Shadowrun and Dark Heresy games. Any ideas?

user61230

I return!

user61230

@AlexP Leaving a comment, one sec...

user61230

> I agree that GNS is not the be-all end-all of playstyles, but it is a key place to start thinking about it.

user61230

(@BESW)

user61230

The reason I brought GNS up in the answer was that the question was largely about conflicting playstyles. The difficulty for the OP I believe does stem from an almost stereotypical Gamist and stereotypical Narrativist.

user61230

10:58 PM

While it may not be entirely appropriate of me to gauge the OP and their player this way, it seems to me like it is a highly representational model in this case. I brought it up as an association; I should, perhaps, have put less focus on it.

Alex P

@Emrakul I disagree on that. The PC player has real trouble actually dealing with challenges and real opportunities to win or lose the game, for instance.

That's my main reason for thinking the answer would be stronger without GNS: I think it has the potential to be a serious red herring.

user61230

Hmm. The way I'm thinking to edit the answer currently involves starting with GNS, but indicating that it's only a starting point for considering playstyles, and is not indicative of individual natures.

Alex P

For all I know this might be "I want to experience my guy being the bestest coolest badass always!" 'Simulationism' crossed with "I like genre norms that say Evil gets shafted in the end!" 'Simulationism'.

user61230

In other words, replacing the second paragraph with:

user61230

> From your description, it sounds like you fall strongly towards Narrativism, and your player falls strongly towards Gamism. While the individual details of Gamism and Narrativism are not as important (as they form broad classifications which are not indicative of unique playstyles), it is a good place to begin thinking about the relationship between the players and GM.

Alex P

11:01 PM

I mean, you don't have to make changes just because I expressed an opinion. ;)

user61230

Well, I agree that the model is a bit simplistic.

Alex P

My game designer friend just said this wonderful, withering thing:

user61230

I think that GNS is important and helpful to bring up, but I think I overemphasized it a bit.

Alex P

> Anyway, yeah, the GNS model, in that context [Vincent's objects and tools], is a set of three object[ive]s for play, nothing more. They apply in the case of the failure of the game to communicate its [player-level] object[ive]s.

user61230

Having some markdown trouble? :P

user61230

11:04 PM

But yeah, I understand what you're saying.

user61230

It's made more relevant, I think, in this case, since the OP doesn't indicate that they're placing mental emphasis on the varied playstyles between them and their player.

Alex P

@Emrakul That's a good point.

user61230

Hmm.

user61230

Now I'm questioning whether the GNS trichotomy is even relevant in this case.

Alex P

Well, I agree that you need something there to explain the playstyle gaps.

I'll let you know if I find a thing I think is actually better.

I see how it's a part of your overall point, though.

user61230

11:08 PM

> From your description, it sounds like you fall strongly towards Narrativism, and your player falls strongly towards Gamism and Simulationism (though, granted, the trichotomy GNS presents may not be a perfect fit for you).

Alex P

Maybe it's simpler to express it in Same Page terms somehow?

But even that isn't ideal for describing one-on-one playstyle...

user61230

Mind taking a look at the answer now? I've made a couple edits to (hopefully) de-emphasize GNS while keeping the point that playstyles are important.

Alex P

I think that's a good direction. The kind of "Here's an example of how your playstyles might not match" approach. :)

user61230

I'm happier with this answer now.

Alex P

@Emrakul You know what, I think you may have been right about the "Gamist" thing earlier.

> And that’s not to say gamism is a simple thing, either. Within it, not only do you have a lot of variation, much along the lines of the Timmy, Johnny, Spike preferences from Magic the Gathering, but also players love to get specific about what -kinds- of challenges and tactics are interesting to them – which is where you see divides – D&D gamist players talking about the choices and strategies in AD&D 1st Edition vs. 3rd. Edition vs. 4th edition is a good example.

I forgot that it's possible to be "Gamist" but also a sore loser. ;)

(Quote source)

(Not that this really matters. Just sayin'.)

user61230

11:17 PM

Hmm. I'm not sure, though. The failing point of GNS is in the breadth of its categorization. It's like the Meyers-Briggs test.

Alex P

I try to publicly articulate when I think I am wrong so I might actually remember it later.

user61230

A good policy, and one which is appreciated more than you'd think.

user61230

Still, to the point, while yes, you can classify peoples' identities into 16 groups, and you can make general statements about their behavior, there are no two identical people, which means their personalities will differ.

Alex P

Yeah, true.

user61230

Since RP is a derivative of personality, one can make the same statement: that no two peoples' playstyles will be the same.

Alex P

11:20 PM

I think just saying "Here, here is an example of how people might disagree on a thing fundamentally!" is fine for your answer's overall purpose.

Without having to get our GNS ducks all in a row.

There are so many goddamn GNS ducks.

user61230

Ha!

user61230

This, I think, is the primary use of GNS.

user61230

Or, rather, should be.

user61230

Hm. Thank you (and @BESW and @SevenSidedDie) for pointing this out! Much improved.

FATE conflict finales

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