@curiousdannii Thank you for admitting that the Bible trumps science in your mind.

@curiousdannii That isn't "uncontroversial among Christians throughout history" because science as we know it today has existed only for a few hundred years now. There was no conflict between religion and science earlier than that because science didn't exist as a discipline.

@LeeWoofenden But there have always been conflicts between the scriptures and human reasoning

@curiousdannii Perhaps. But what's new in the past few centuries is a conflict between religion and science.

@curiousdannii And this isn't a conflict between scripture and science. It's a conflict between human interpretations of scripture and science. Many people read the scriptures and see no conflict at all between scripture and science because they (including I) don't believe that the scriptures are meant to tell us anything about science.

@curiousdannii That, as I've said several times, is a fundamental difference between your view and mine. You believe that the scriptures are meant to tell us something about science. I don't. It's really as simple as that.

@curiousdannii Believing that the Bible trumps science is a philosophically defensible viewpoint. Just don't try to pretend that this view doesn't invalidate science as a discipline. It does invalidate science. And Creationists should just admit that rather than trying to pretend that they're just engaging in some sort of different science.

I hasten do add that although I say that position is philosophically defensible, I still think it's wrong.

@curiousdannii If Creationists (including you) would just admit that they reject science as a reliable tool for studying the physical universe, I'd have a lot more respect for them (even while still believing they're dead wrong) than with this silly pretense that they do believe in science, they just think any science that conflicts with their interpretation of scripture is wrong, and they've got better science that agrees with scripture.

Their "science" is pure bunk, as anyone who actually studies science knows.

@curiousdannii "Well the point of the gospel miracles is to witness to Jesus' divinity" I absolutely disagree with this. Miracles are not included in the Bible as evidence for Christ's divinity. If they were, they failed utterly. First, at the time, miracles were considered a fact of life. Miracles happened. Some were done by good actors, some by bad actors (there is Biblical evidence of this cultural attitude).

All that doing a miracle would prove to someone at the time was that Jesus, like many others, had the power to perform miracles.

@Flimzy Coming back for more, eh? ;-) And incidentally, good point!

@LeeWoofenden It seems that some people are theological masochists.

@El'endiaStarman I resemble that remark!!!

And here I am writing an article titled "The Faulty Foundations of Faith Alone." What could be more theologically masochistic than that?!? ;-)

@LeeWoofenden Sleep avoidance, I guess :P