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2:00 PM
I don't think there's any single legitimate online reference available for non-SRD D&D 3.5e spells. If there was, WotC would've made a fortune from it.
They're probably kicking themselves that they didn't do the Compendium thing before D&D 4e.
I'm thinking about starting a challenge campaign to beat adventure modules with a single player character. Any thoughts on the challenges this brings up from a GMing stand point?
@kviiri At least he gave us this gem. ^_^'
Q: Would it be suitable for Zhentarim to order PC member to find Arctus Simber in the Tomb of Annihilation adventure?

OharI am gonna to start D&D 5ed ToA adventure campaing for a group of 5th lvl PCs who just finished LMoP adventure. One of them (undead gnome wizard necromancer) is a member of Zhentarim (Halia invited him to). In ToA there is a plot hook about Zhentarim looking for an Arctus Simber. Question: wou...

(that said, I must admit that the recording quality of the English version of the song is somehow better - see here)
@kviiri anyway, I wouldn't say that the rest of the village is actually any better, so at least it isn't like he is the only "comic-relief" character in the bunch.
I mean, the defining characteristic of the fisherman there is that he sells old/smelly fish
Also... I think there is at least one story that may imply that there are also people that like his music, just none in the village he lives in.
True, but he at least gets a fair say about it. I mean, it's pretty ambiguous whether his fish is actually bad or is the smith just imagining it.
He's giving as much as taking, unlike Cacophonix who endures a rather one-sided persecution that's always played for laughs.
A peculiar note on localization: despite "cacophony" being borrowed to my language, the bard's name has been localized here as essentially "Troubadurix"
2:17 PM
@kviiri either the second or the Romans have no sense of smell, your choice. In Asterix: The Mansions of the Gods he actually manages to sell the fish to some Romans and they are actually happy with it
That said, in one of the Chose-your-adventure book, you can use one of the fish he sells to scare away a dog...
Yeah and the other villagers are often seen buying he fish aren't they? Anyway, I always interpreted the feud between the two being essentially irrational and the fish being bad is just an excuse to start fighting
(I think it's funnier that way)
Similar to earlier seasons of the Simpsons where Homer and Flanders were actually quite alike in terms of their interests and hobbies. Although Flanders, being more good-natured, somehow ticked Homer off, which had a subtler comedy to it than the actually annoying neighbor Flanders soon became.
@Someone_Evil thanks for that catch. I needed to read a few words further eh?
@Rubiksmoose I'm not entirly sure the new answer is correct either. You could argue the effect on the weapon is seperate from that of the attack, so you don't need to make the attack with said weapon..
@kviiri to be fair.... the original name was Assurancetourix => Assurance tous risques meaning "comprehensive insurance", which actually hasn't anything to do with music at all.
But that is starting to sound absurd
2:25 PM
@Someone_Evil you would still need a weapon though right?
Q: Do you need a weapon for Thunderous Smite, and the other 'Smite' spells?

guessSince unarmed strikes are considered melee weapon attacks, and the smite spells don't have the same restriction as booming blade or green flame blade (the part where it requires "a weapon" in material components) Would you be able to cast and trigger the 'smite' spells (like thunderous smite, se...

@Rubiksmoose Yes, but you could have it in your other hand, on your back, next door, sequestered somewhere. It just needs to be yours.
I'm putting this one down to 'we assumed people were gonna play sensibly, so we didn't remember to make the rules super rigorous'
> [A]n unarmed strike counts as a melee weapon attack, even though the attacker’s body isn’t considered a weapon.
@Someone_Evil Not another case of the holy weapon phenomenon...
so, does the body of someone else count as a weapon?
2:30 PM
@Someone_Evil Indeed. Combined with the super edge case that is unarmed strikes lol
Yes, improvised. 1d4.
@Derpy Sometimes. One of the examples of an improvised weapon is a dead goblin's body
@DavidCoffron ahhh I was trying to remember the other ruling that was like this
I was thinking more on the lines of the Sogeking Katana :P.....
@Derpy There is little so wrathful as hitting a goblin with another goblin
2:31 PM
@DavidCoffron Why do I feel like this is a problem with the Paladin spells..
@doppelgreener Cool. Welcome back! Hope you avoided sunburns =)
@nitsua60 I absolutely did not. But I do have a good tan.
@Someone_Evil might have something to do with the unspoken assumption that paladins are melee weapon combatants and they didn't even consider the possibility of USs
@Rubiksmoose I mean they're 'supposed' to be knights-in-shining-armour (almost literally) so it's not surprising
2:44 PM
oh for sure not.
Just interesting how that assumption probably clouded the wording of the abilities
You see it spell wording all the time (eg. that wall of fire question) that spell wording assumes certain cinematic scenes, but aren't worded rigorously enough to impossible to misconstrue.
@Someone_Evil had to live with an attack malus for some years on my UO server because as a paladin I dared to also include minor Magery skills in my build.
Still, was worth to see the reactions of people when they realize I had access to Blade Vortrex.
I also don't think they should. If you want wording that tries to be unambiguous, go read law text. It's awful to read and at being unambiguous.
@Derpy 'UO'?
@Someone_Evil I mostly agree. I think they could have gotten a better balance in some areas specifically though.
2:51 PM
@Rubiksmoose It's impossible to catch most of these. How many players have read these spells before someone found out how to 'break' them? So they're gonna be the subject of our Q's, SA, and Errata
@Derpy I know, although I don't see it really changing anything
@Someone_Evil Oh yeah, these particular spells are fine. I think the meaning is quite clear. However, it could have easily been caught by going through all spells that require attacks or melee weapon attack and making sure they make sense with unarmed strikes.
But since unarmed strikes themselves were not clear until errata I wonder if they even understood it well internally.
It might have been a bit of an afterthought. Not even Wizards are expected to ever be unarmed (monks are their own weapon) so no-one thought to check.
I find that most weapon spells "make sense" with unarmed strikes. I've never felt that allowing fists to count as weapons was an issue.
A Monk-Paladin multiclass is also a spot wield, at least on flavour
@goodguy5 I wouldn't be opposed to houserule that your hand (or other bodypart) counted as a weapon, but it might get you some wierd cases. (Avoid Black Puddings at all costs)
3:01 PM
@Someone_Evil I mean, you'd probably avoid black puddings even if your hands didn't count as weapons.
Oh wait, it would need to be made of metal or would for their corrosion ability, nvm you are still free to punch it (at least you only take the acid damage)
I have a feeling that that feeblemind question is going to get very messy
Dispel magic makes a lot of things messy
Well specifically the issue of spell effects lasting after spell durations makes things messy
To fix it to (assumed) design intent: It should read 'the spells effects ends'
3:08 PM
I think that would certainly help.
@Rubiksmoose There are always small changes to formulation that would help. Wall of fire could say 'each creature within 10 ft. on that side' and the question would be solved. The problem is identifying those tiny changes.
@Someone_Evil sorry, was afk for a while. UO -> Ultima Online. Sorry for the confusion, I am kinda used calling it simply UO and often forget that the acronym meaning may not be so evident to others.
Anyway, just to put the info into context, as I (probably) mentioned before, I played for a while on a private Ultima Online server, where I kinda helped the staff with role-playing related tasks (mostly involving keeping the paladins characters players busy)
it was a pretty weird experience, for a lot of mostly wrong reasons.
I'm gonna put down a guess that this querent found this homebrew and failed to identify it as such. The case could be made that DnD Beyond needs to identify homebrew material slightly better.
3:25 PM
for one, we undergo multiple changes in management - we had some pretty BAD fights between staff members and the actual players were struck in the middle.
@Someone_Evil Thanks for finding that. I've left a comment:
@EnderR Did you happen to come across a Mithral weapons homebrew entry, such as this one? — doppelgreener ♦ 11 secs ago
@doppelgreener np (first google result). I also didn't know if leaving that kind of comment would be appropriate, but I guess it is
there's a chance someone would flag it as answering in comments if someone else left that comment... but it would hopefully be declined
some folks have a too-sensitive detector for what counts as answers in comments, and I think the community as a whole might have tuned itself a bit oversensitively on that front
but!! it generally falls into the realm of trying to figure out what the issue is.
3:48 PM
@Someone_Evil I think we've had that discussion before
@doppelgreener the problem is that at the basis comments have always been "second-hand citizens" by actual staff own admission, so if even they couldn't really give a clear-cut purpose to commenting... it will be very cold in hell before discussion about comments will end
Oct 10 '18 at 20:34, by David Coffron
Dndbeyonds homebrew warning isn't all that much better imo. It's just a little blue house with no explanation. Granted it's harder to navigate to these pages without going through homebrew searches or something but if you're linked to it
it is even worse when you start discussing about comments deletion.
Well if you're going through the sites menus it's fairly clear, but something more on the page itself (because google will find it) would be nice. I think their homebrew side could needs some solid QC-style features to be worth while though
(and starts hearing about users who had their comments flagged as rude because they looked rude.... when following a different message from the one they were originally intended as a reply to :P)
3:53 PM
@Derpy That's another good argument for why extended discussion should occur in chat rather than comments
@Derpy that's not exactly a problem though?
i don't understand why that's related here
@Derpy fwiw I think comments' purpose is actually very well-defined.
@Rubiksmoose it is
it's not well communicated in the question page UI, but it's well defined.
all i'm saying is the community's assessment of what counts as an answer in comments has gotten slightly broader than it ought to be.
(and not well-followed in other sites which might exaggerate the impression that it isn't well-defined)
which is probably OK: we spent a few years working our way to expand to where it should be, then it expanded a bit more, so it's time to go back a bit and just stay walking the line.
4:02 PM
I think this is an interesting point to have. I'd love to hear maybe some specific examples of oversteps to see what aspect we are taking overzealously. I've seen a few instances of people commenting on comments that aren't answers.
If I had to take a stab a categorizing one area it might be the "trying to help by telling you the problem with your question, which involves telling you something approaching an answer-like vibe" comments
@doppelgreener It is in the sense that what I mentioned is also something that comes up a lot on the main meta site when talking about comments.
It's hard to dig up past examples, but basically it's something like this: people are flagging comments that are not actually making an effort to answer the question, but which may in the process of asking for clarification happen to mention information which the flagger recognises may contribute to a solution.
Users keep arguing about deleted comments and such, even when the comment weren't abut attempts at replying the question posted as comments.
@Rubiksmoose That's also a thing. "I don't understand, and I think you might be confused about something. What do you mean by XYZ? Here's some information that will help you understand stuff and be better able to answer that question."
Someone might identify that format as an answer in comments because the information they provide may count toward solving the problem in some sense.
@doppelgreener that is a good one as well.
4:08 PM
@doppelgreener on a more related notice, consider that the network doesn't really agree on the whole "frame challenge" thing either, so you find a lot of users that use comments when waiting to challenge the questions premises... and a lot of users that post answers to different questions they made up themselves because they cannot be removed by a "N-A-A flag" because an answer to another question is still an answer.
That came up in a recent flag from last week that I can only vaguely recall: someone asked about elf nightvision and wanted to better understand it, someone commented asking what they meant because they were sure elves only had low-light vision (and included a link to the rules for low-light vision), someone considered it an answer in comments and flagged it.
This may be kinda related. Keywords: may. Disclaimer: I posted it some years ago.
apparently, if you ask how to build a car and someone answers with how to bake a cake, that is still an answer and deleting it as noise is bad
but only on some subsites.
@doppelgreener To be perfectly honest though (without seeing the details) that sounds like a valid use of the flag: if they're trying to give information about how an Elf's Darkvision works, that should be part of an answer and subject to the rep system. Otherwise, if the source is bad, or if the information doesn't properly address the question's core conceit, then we can't vote on it, and the only way to hide/remove it is to get a mod involved.
So, I can (kinda) understand why some users may be confused
anyway, have to go for a while.
see you in some days (vacations and such)
@Derpy see ya!
4:13 PM
@Derpy o/
@Xirema Well, see, nightvision is actually a thing in the game: there's dark vision and stuff. But elves don't have it, they have low-light vision. So someone asking how an elf's nightvision works makes sense all on its own. Someone saying "sorry, did you mean nightvision or some other thing?" is a valid comment; so too would "sorry, I think elves only have low-light vision, did you mean that or nightvision?"
@Xirema It can be really tricky to toe the line between providing information to help the OP clarify the question and providing information that happens to solve the issue and sometimes they are the same thing. So I agree. It is tricky. It is worth noting that we don't actually need mods to delete comments. Enough user flags will do it automatically.
@Rubiksmoose Ah, fair enough. Wasn't aware of that.
@Xirema Yeah upvoting a comment means it takes more flags to remove. Some types of very short comments "thanks" seem to be able to be removed with fewer.
We do have some questions where the correct answer is 'you are actually wrong about X, which is why Y doesn't make sense' and to those Qs comments pointing out the error actually are the answer
4:21 PM
Indeed. In most of those cases it seems pretty clear when the line is crossed. Eg does the information provided in your comment provide a venue for improvement, or does it make the question moot?
(Part of) the problem might arise from users learning from interactions seen in one post, and applying it incorrectly on another because the subtleties have been clear enough
@Rubiksmoose There's some patterns that get insta-deleted. For example if a comment's calling someone an idiot, or just says "+1 thanks", a single flag would nuke it.
@Someone_Evil right, so there's a line to toe there
@Rubiksmoose You are starting to look a lot like right...
and I now officially despise that 'sageadvice.eu' site...
@Someone_Evil Sadly :(
@Someone_Evil I mean it is a nice site, especially for putting threads in nice readable fashion. There are some twitter convos that are very hard to put in one place on Twitter. But why do you say that?
@Rubiksmoose Because it looks like it a lot more official than it is, and it is confounding the name the actual Sage Advice with a collection of tweets
It least a link looks more official
4:35 PM
To be fair though, designer feedback has been called Sage Advice going back a long ways (IIRC). Though it is certainly confusing if you aren't aware it is official.
Though luckily it just reposts designer stuff, so it doesn't really have content on there that is that far off the mark.
+1 for your comment.
@Rubiksmoose but sage advice has typically at least been officially sanctioned (while not actual errata) whereas the advice they're collecting is officially very specifically non-sanctioned
fair point! Though up until recently at least all the JC stuff was "official"
completely true
But it is always the reason that I correct links or references to when someone calls a tweet Sage Advice or links to the site calling it "Sage Advice" to be more clear and specific. (usually I change links to redirect towards twitter instead and call them tweets).
@Rubiksmoose Let me be clear: I completely agree with your edit. I'm slightly angry with myself (and said site) for incorrectly referencing it in the first place
4:43 PM
No worries! I didn't think you were upset with me or anything. Funnily enough you actually made the edit while I was in the process of editing it myself.
@V2Blast survey completed.
@Rubiksmoose 'Welcome to RPG.SE! Editors are cramming in the door to edit your question!'
@kviiri Cooking food you like, and nobody else eats, lets you put the left overs in the fridge and you get to enjoy it again. I was a bachelor for years, and for me leftovers, and how to play around with them, became a thing. Revel in it! :)
@Someone_Evil XD
@Rubiksmoose back to dragon magazine, in the 70's.
@Someone_Evil You summoned me?
5:06 PM
This could be a calculation question based on the rollable tables. Someone particularly un-knowledgable about mathematics may be unsure how to convert those tables to ranges (also the tables are a bit unintuitive since you have to multiply the weight modifier by the height modifier to get the weight which is confusing)
5:17 PM
Ok, that makes sense...
See, I was thinking they were asking "hey, list to me all these values in the book."
potentially with some "... including all the ones I don't have"
@doppelgreener Yeah, I just created a spreadsheet for it and it isn't as simple as it could be
Ok, I'm going to give that one the benefit of the doubt and reopen. (cc @NautArch)
5:41 PM
@Someone_Evil I made an edit to your feeblemind answer and added the second JC tweet as well as both texts. I think it makes it better but feel free to revert as always if you had reasons for not including them.
@Someone_Evil stop being on the same editing wavelength as me lol
@Rubiksmoose It's fine. You seem to be good at adding little details I forget...
6:09 PM
Who here has played through or DMed the Iron Gods pathfinder adventure path?
@MikeQ I have a friend who did, does it count?
They didn't go past book 2, I think.
@Zachiel Sort of? I was hoping to get insight and advices from someone who experienced it and understands how its weird rules play out. Iron Gods seems a bit shadowrunny, where you have an already complicated magic combat and crafting system, and then you append another whole complicated technology combat and crafting system
Who is this @Someone_Evil guy? Their answers have been killing it recently.
Q: Does Feeblemind produce an ongoing magical effect that can be dispelled?

Ryan ThompsonFeeblemind has a duration of instantaneous. However, it also produces an ongoing effect, and the spell's text describes when this effect ends (emphasis added): At the end of every 30 days, the creature can repeat its saving throw against this spell. If it succeeds on its saving throw, the spe...

@MikeQ Weel, this friend of mine is good enough at the combat and crafting system that he wouldn't describe them as "complicated". I guess it's just going to be "more time consuming, but it's part of why we play Pathfinder and not one of the many other games I own".
Anyway, if you ask that question, link it to me here in chat and I will link it to him.
6:21 PM
@Zachiel I don't have a stackable question. Just concerns. Whenever I play a prewritten PF adventure path, I end up making a character that doesn't work for it, usually due to some obstacle or necessity that emerges midway through the campaign. So I'd like to avoid that situation again.
@MikeQ The only way to avoid that situation is to play with a DM that has read the whole campaign already, understands your concern and more importantly wants to do something about it. (To some DMs, having characters in need to adapt their strategies to what is happening is part of the story.)
@GcL Thank you. (I think?)
@Someone_Evil Sure. Still doesn't answer my question. Who is that person?
For example, have you played Rise of the Runelords or Curse of the Crimson Throne, @MikeQ? I guess I could also accept examples of your problem from Way of the Wicked, since I don't think I will play it before I need to DM it.
@GcL I think it's a chemist from Norway, if that's what you wanted to know ;)
6:26 PM
@Zachiel Been in ROTR for the past few years. Our party isn't prepared for what the AP needs (overspecialized martials, no prepared casters), we've had a lot of character deaths, and it feels like a slog. Meanwhile, another party was built with the "right" class selections (paladin, wizard, etc) and it's been a breeze for them.
@Zachiel Iron Gods apparently uses a lot of tech gear and arms. Which require their own feats to use. Which means a feat-starved character would be at a disadvantage.
@Rubiksmoose just assume all answers to requests for more information from me are, "No. Go away until I've had more coffee... then maybe."
@GcL lol
@MikeQ I know that the player's guide to RoTR talks about which characters to take (or at least it teels rangers whiich favored enemies to take). I also know that we were running Wrath of the Righteous without someone who had AoE damage spells and we got swarmed several times.
Actually I'm going to go downstairs and find my sword coast adventurers guide in as soon as I finish a commit.
@GcL Though just note that generally answers should be posted as complete. You might risk downvotes in the meantime.
Not that it is a huge deal.
6:30 PM
Also, I guess "no overspecialized martials, having prepared casters" is good for each and every adventure path. It's part of the Ivory Tower design of D&D and its ilk.
@HotRPGQuestions Does this mean you can stack Feeblemind?
I also guess that not having access to those techs will still be fine if the character is strong enough. In Pathfinder and similar games you usually start with a build you want to have and if you happen to have some extra feats to spend, well, maybe I will wear some tech items.
@Rubiksmoose It turns out I have a magic item that provides protection from internet points. I wear it to work everyday.
@Yuuki It shouldn't do anything
@Zachiel See, that's the intuitive idea from someone who's played in more traditional PF settings. But apparently Iron Gods is really heavy on the tech stuff, and it can trip up players who are accustomed to builds and strategies that otherwise work in sword & sorcery style. Which is why I was hoping to ask from someone with firsthand experience.
6:34 PM
@GcL and you just wear this legendary artifact around?!
@Yuuki I don't think so... I think the phrasing is such that it is the effects of the spells that cannot stack.
Beyond the damage, the two effects set ability scores or prevent certain actions so having multiple instances would only make it harder to get rid of more greater restorations or more successful saves (though you would get more of these).
@Rubiksmoose Yeah. It used to be negated by my caring face, but I left that in a desk drawer two careers ago.
@Zachiel Speaking of which, how's your CotCT campaign going? Are the PCs ridiculously superpowered yet?
@MikeQ Is it stuff like "so much power you need to use it or you're out"? I guess it still takes someone who knows if the items build upon existing features (à la Metamagic Rod) or if they are just things you want to be able to use regardless of the build. I will ask.
@Rubiksmoose You can't stack it, but you can upcast it to reset the 30 days timer.
@Someone_Evil For effects of equal magnitude it's the first one cast that has primacy, no?
6:46 PM
uhh... ' the most potent one while durations overlap', if they are the same it doesn't matter
Well, we have lost our cleric to real life. The investigator with a gun and the alchemist hit enemies on a 2, and they both have lots of buffs they can stealthily drink without alerting enemies. The Mystic is facing some enemies with evasion but as a debuffer and damage dealer he's doing great. Not letting one enemy move for a turn and stunning them for the next makes single-enemy encounters as easy as "I'll just blast the whole area" ones.
The swashbuckler is rarely with us because of his work and the same is true for the summoner, which is mostly going "melee eidolon buff, plus the occasi
I would guess an instance of the spell is applied, and each 'casting' gives a separate save whenever appropriate for that casting
@Someone_Evil I agree that the sageadvice.eu name causes confusion and makes it seem more official than it is. but I do like that it archives the original text of tweets even if they get deleted and tends to quote tweets more clearly than Twitter's own display does. so I occasionally link to it to quote whole conversations (instead of linking 5 separate tweets) or when the original tweet Crawford's replying to has been deleted. and yeah, I try to correct those descriptions too
@Someone_Evil what's the context of this conversation?
@Someone_Evil Thinking about feeblemind more, I'm inclined to agree.
@V2Blast feeblemind, today's source of mind rot
6:50 PM
"Instead, the most potent effect--such as the highest bonus--from those castings applies while their durations overlap, or the most recent effect applies if the castings are equally potent and their durations overlap."
the last part after the comma was added in errata
@V2Blast Oh ffs!
@Someone_Evil but you can't have two instantaneous spells overlap normally
Yeah, they both produce effects, so when the effects overlap, the most powerful or first applied are in effect
@GcL only while the durations overlap
6:54 PM
E.g. blindness/deafness cast twice a round apart. First the effect selected is blindness. The second casting selects deafness. Are they deaf for a round after the blindness ends? My reading is yes
The effects don't matter, only the duration of the spell
Except the errata says "effect"
the most recent "effect"
So, the deafness would supersede blindness
DMG Errata gives the rule for all 'Game Features' (but don't include the part about first)
> Instead, the most potent effect--such as the highest bonus--from those castings applies while their durations overlap, or the most recent effect applies if the castings are equally potent and their durations overlap."
"or the most recent effect"
for instantaneous, skip the duration part.
6:56 PM
So, who posts the Q?
Feeblemind does not have an Instantaneous duration, regardless of what the spell's tags say. It has an effect that persists beyond the moment of casting and ending the effect is described as "ending the spell". So be careful with it.
@GcL can you point me to the part that doesn't reference durations? are we looking at different things?
@Rubiksmoose durations of the "castings" have to overlap and there is no spell duration for Instanteous spells
@Rubiksmoose Since the durations can't overlap, that entire statement is invalid. So what happens?
@GcL they both take effect.
6:57 PM
@Rubiksmoose "while durations overlap or the most recent effect..."
@GcL the rest of that clause is "or the most recent effect applies if the castings are equally potent and their durations overlap."
@Zachiel APG summoner or unchained?
I'm not a fan of the compound conditionals separated the way they are. List requirement criteria up front for logic's sake!
@MikeQ unchained.
@GcL The most recent effect applying still is dependent on overlapping duration
6:59 PM
I know it's the only unchained debuff but if they felt the need for it, who am I to disagree?
@DavidCoffron yeah. I think the hanging part of that "equally potent and their durations" screw the pooch.
@Xirema Several other spells are instantaneous but have effects that last longer over time
@Someone_Evil Yes; but usually, those spells don't expressly describe the cessation of their effects as "the spell ends".
The first conditional can disregard duration if the effects overlap. The second conditional statement that seems to apply to the whole thing, albeit stated at the end, requires duration.
@Xirema I know, I tried to address some of that in my answer
7:01 PM
@Xirema I'm not convinced that this is correct personally.
@Xirema The spell does have an instantaneous duration. It states that explicitly under the duration section. The effects last longer that the spell.
> Different game features can affect a target at the same time. But when two or more game features have the same name, only the effects of one of them—the most potent one—apply while the durations of the effects overlap.
@Zachiel Unchained eidolons are still useful for control and support, and possibly debuffing
@MikeQ not for bashing things?
@DavidCoffron In this case, I think that supports the issue if feeblemind was cast twice at two different levels. If cast twice at the same level, does the first or second casting prevail ?
7:02 PM
@Zachiel Well sure. But they also can buff allies within their reach, and so you can give them absurd reach to apply a constant AOE buff. And with their high STR and decent CHA, you can give them Intimidating Prowess (add STR to intimidate) and Skilled evolution (+8 intimidate) to scare any non-fear-immune foe, which gets silly if you're using unchained intimidate rules too. And then there's the feat that lets you intimidate in a 30 foot AOE.
@GcL Whichever your GM decides is more potent (I'd say the one with the longest remaining duration)
Given equal potency?... or do you consider the one with the longer remaining duration to be more potent?
@DavidCoffron Don't answer my questions before I ask them! Psionics and divination aren't fair! /S
@GcL Haha. Just a simple augury my friend, you can barely even call the divination xD
I feel like augury should be the name of a beer or cocktail.
@GcL Yes, but the spell description explicitly says "the spell ends" when the target succeeds on the saving throw to end the effect.
The spell cannot end if it's already ended.
7:05 PM
@Xirema Oooo... good catch. Way to thicken the plot.
@Xirema I mean... Maybe it is future proofing for a magic item that changes the duration of Instantaneous spells, idk /S
@Xirema Probably needs to be errata'd "the spell effect ends"
@GcL I agree
@MikeQ Ah, there must be some evolutions to do that, I guess. The player is focusing on getting more natural attacks and more strenght, but since he's half-elf he has more evolution points, so maybe he will end up getting all the evolutions for bashing and getting some of the other ones.
I would like to re-open the prospect of having a formal ontology for 5e.
7:06 PM
@GcL Seconded.
@GcL And on the day they do that, I'm happy to revise my answer to that question. ;)
@Xirema I vote you write an owl parser in C++
I'll write the owl.
Q: Do humanoid undead or constructs have a soul for Magic Jar?

mzsMagic Jar states: You can attempt to possess any humanoid within 100 feet of you that you can see ... The target must make a Charisma saving throw. On a failure, your soul moves into the target's body, and the target's soul becomes trapped in the container. How does this apply to creatures ...

@GcL Are we talking about the avian that is commonly nocturnal and seen as a symbol of wisdom?
@Xirema That would be nice, but no. I'm asking for a library to parse w3.org/TR/owl-ref
7:08 PM
@Xirema flies.... symbol of wisdom.... awake at night.... Bahamut!?
@DavidCoffron Probably.
@DavidCoffron Flies. Surely burning things is something wise people do once in a while. It's night here when they're awake... I guess it's @trogdor.
@DavidCoffron seems legit
So, in 5e we have Wyrmling, Young, Adult, Ancient compared to older editions which have much more. If porting a great wyrm, do we use ancient dragon or do I buff the stat block?
I ask because I'm curious to know how strong Bahamut and his entourage of gold great wyrms would be:
> When Bahamut assumed the form of the old man, he was usually accompanied by seven gold great wyrms polymorphed into canaries or some other small animal form
Generically or for a particular story?
The particular story mechanic usually beats out all other needs, but generics are pretty useful when building a new story.... just to avoid having to define specifics.
7:21 PM
@GcL Just curious if anyone has thought about it. I'm glad they went more broad with the dragon age categories. I'd probably just use ancient gold dragons
I'd be inclined to do the same. I know there is a variant for making dragons spell casters as they were in previous editions, but have not run into the need to do so in 5e yet.
Also, I'm thinking about creating a modern era Forgotten Realms (a substantial undertaking, but could be very fun), and like picturing Bahamut as an old man running a bird shop
Ha! That's entertaining. I like the idea of a deity's take on the modern era being "F it. I'm opening a shop and enjoying retirement"
@GcL Now I want to convert all of the 5e deities into retired 21st century individuals
I eagerly await that homebrew pdf.
7:26 PM
@GcL Tyr is just Daredevil
I can see that.
A blind attorney that occasionally uses his power (or more likely his paladins) to stop the wrongdoers that curt the law
> Bahamut has also occasionally been seen flaying through the sky
Um, Wizards? I think we need to talk about "Lawful Good" again.
@BESW We never need to talk about alignment aside from how quickly it should be expunged altogether.
@DavidCoffron My friend wrote a Mother NPC class for 2nd edition in dragon magazine.
We were all very entertained.
Instead of turn undead they had a turn children ability.
@GcL The one in Dragon 238?
7:31 PM
Could cast "middle name" instead of command.
Compelling the target to do her bidding.
It says "By Lawrence R. Wenzel"; does that sound right
That's the one then.
> Turn Children: At 1st level, the
Mother can turn children of the same
species, effectively sending them off to
their rooms (Table 2). A turned child is
sent to their room for 1d6 turns or to
bed for the rest of the night; an automatic turning (T) means the child
departs without whining kicking, or
screaming; grounded (G) means the
child cannot leave his room for 1d4
days + 1 day per level of the Mother.
This is hilarious
I forgot about grounded! it's funnier now
Everyone knows that Middle Names are actually True Names.
7:33 PM
I concur.
Especially when a mom knows it.
Q: Can you stand up from being prone using movement provided outside of your turn?

Daniel ZastoupilUsing the Rogue Scout's Skirmisher feature, which states: You can move up to half your speed as a reaction when an enemy ends its turn within 5 feet of you. Additionally: Being Prone, PHB pg 190/191 Standing up takes more effort; doing so costs an amount of movement equal to half...

Yes. Rogues can totally do that cool spring to standing from laying prone that Jackie Chan can do.
(and Bruce Lee for those that remember that far back)
@BESW hahaha that is an amazing horrific picture
This is a Roman gaming board, photographed as it was being uncovered this afternoon. 3rd century context. A great find for our Period 2 team. #Vindolanda
7:53 PM
@Rubiksmoose They also got free divination per day by a gossip ability. Summon a demon? they'll get it's true name sometime within the week.
Also had a gaze attack that did paralytic damage.
8:10 PM
"(and Bruce Lee for those that remember that far back)"
quit makin' me feel old
Ha! Cultural references shoudn't make you feel old. Just good that you got to see and remember one of the greats!
What is that thing called that is not part of the main text but adds extra context?
Like the section about the Spellbook in the 5e Player's Handbook
Addendums? Asides? Vignettes?
8:17 PM
@GcL That's it!
I like this game.
yeah, they're sidebars
@BESW How do we know that's a gaming board, rather than low quality kitchen floor tile? 8^D
@KorvinStarmast They also found a number of ancient minifigures that aren't in the shot /S
@DavidCoffron Hmm, or little rocks like when you play Go. (I guess?)
8:26 PM
@KorvinStarmast Probably Warhammer -1K
@DavidCoffron Good friend of mine had a Go set that his dad picked up in Japan, looked a bit like this, but older/darker wood, circa 1970's.
@GcL Actually, Warhammer M. 8^D.
(Roman Numerals for the win!)
@GcL Doesn't 40k refer to the year? So it would be Warhammer 200 or CC.
@KorvinStarmast I played Go once. I was very bad at it (but so was my opponent so it was fun)
Bah. Calendar systems before ISO8601 and the linux epoch are heretical. The Emperor on the Golden Throne will purge the universe of all others.
8:45 PM
@DavidCoffron It's a tough game, and I for sure was never any good at it.
9:10 PM
Different games reward different things. Sometimes one game rewards many different things. Sometimes only one. Sometimes the table culture adds its own layer of rewards. This is a SUPER REASONABLE metric to use when deciding what game to play.
1 hour later…
10:35 PM
@BESW lulz

"Dungeons & Dragons company Wizards of the Coast announced today that it is opening a new studio in Austin, Texas, that will be headed up by former BioWare stalwart James Ohlen. Ohlen left BioWare last year after a 22-year career, during which he amassed design and writing credits including the Baldur's Gate series, Neverwinter Nights, Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic, Jade Empire, and Dragon Age: Origins.
new outfit, original IP
11:34 PM
@Zachiel lol
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