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9:00 PM
@rahuldottech is it French?
 
@Mitch What's it say?
 
@rahuldottech One can use Google Translate, LOL.
 
@KitZ.Fox I... don't think so? :P
 
In mathematics, Zermelo–Fraenkel set theory, named after mathematicians Ernst Zermelo and Abraham Fraenkel, is one of several axiomatic systems that were proposed in the early twentieth century to formulate a theory of sets free of paradoxes such as Russell's paradox. Zermelo–Fraenkel set theory with the historically controversial axiom of choice included is commonly abbreviated ZFC, where C stands for choice. Many authors use ZF to refer to the axioms of Zermelo–Fraenkel set theory with the axiom of choice excluded. Today ZFC is the standard form of axiomatic set theory and as such is the most...
 
I can't check on my phone.
 
9:01 PM
@WillHunting oh. yeah. that. :P
 
And I don't remember what is there.
 
argh... but it links to the section on...
 
@KitZ.Fox Let me check for him.
 
Replacement
 
> Voici mon secret. Il est très simple. On ne voit bien qu'avec le coeur. L'essential est invisible pour les yeux.
 
9:01 PM
that's the one that people think is weird.
I know.
All the others seem weird too
 
@rahuldottech It is French!
 
It's probably "That which is essential is invisible to the eye."
 
Okay, got it, thanks to Google:
 
Oh. It's the whole quotation.
 
> Here is my secret. It is very simple. One sees clearly only with the heart. The essential is invisible to the eyes.
 
9:02 PM
Yeah, close enough.
 
Wait. Google spelt essential wrong.
 
That is quite a beautiful translation.
 
@Mitch Haha.
 
@KitZ.Fox Yep, intestinal bacteria
 
I didn't know about that one.
 
9:03 PM
@Mitch haha
 
Alternatively, @WillHunting would you tell me what the best mathematical dictionary is in your opinion?
 
@Tonepoet I've used this for school, although the website is not of the best design: mathematicsdictionary.com/math-vocabulary.htm
 
@Tonepoet Ah, I have never consulted a math dictionary in my entire life, so I don't know. But I would say that a term in math can mean different things because of different conventions, and different terms can mean the same things. Moreover, if they mean different things, they can be logically equivalent or not equivalent. So math definitions are complicated, LOL.
 
@Færd because it's .. it's like a fixup. everything else helps construct sets and manipulate them, but I think 'replacement' was suggested because it allowed proofs to go through. Was totally unmotivated other-wise.
supposedly
I'm just repeating what I've read.
 
@KitZ.Fox I like it!
 
9:06 PM
Usually, it is translated as "It is only with the heart that one can see clearly."
Which is a little more poetic.
 
@WillHunting English dictionaries have enough problems. Math dictionaries are that much worse.
 
@Tonepoet Also, you must know that math up to the high school level is very different from math beyond the high school level. It is a whole nother thing altogether.
 
@WillHunting I'm not interested in what things mean for that reason. I'm interested in how they should be interpreted.
 
They are really dumb
 
@KitZ.Fox Does it sound more heartfelt in French?
 
9:07 PM
@rahuldottech From that resource, we have "axiom (postulate) An initial proposition or statement that is generally accepted as true without proof (self-evident truth) and from which further statements, or theorems, can be derived by using logical deduction." So it's a mixture of the primary and secondary definition rolled into one.
 
"accepted as ..."
 
@KitZ.Fox Spock says "I don't get it". Uhura says "Oh Spock, you idiot"
 
@Tonepoet Well, I think that a math dictionary isn't really very useful to someone who wants to study math, and I am not sure who it will be useful for actually, IMAO.
 
@Færd "([S]elf evident-truth)" is still mentioned.
 
@Færd haha heartfelt
 
9:09 PM
@Færd yes? The construction "ne voit bien que" is difficult in English. It's roughly "can only see well".
 
@Tonepoet Maybe a math dictionary can help an author writing a book about math but not doing math himself, that's all. So it provides a little more technical details than the ordinary dictionary, but is not exactly a math textbook.
 
@WillHunting It's not at all useful. any definitions that are needed are made up on the spot, and then the word means what is defined and nothing else.
 
@Mitch You can define a cat as a dog and a dog as a cat, for example.
 
@KitZ.Fox Aha. OK.
 
@WillHunting Exactly or a point line plane as chair table beer
 
9:10 PM
But it also has the sense of "see true" like...I don't know, how we would say an arrow flies true? Like correct, straight, accurate.
 
or whatever the quote is
 
@KitZ.Fox Piercing?
 
@Mitch By the way, a very good lecturer said the cat dog example. He is really very good, but he smokes a few cigarettes every day.
 
@Mitch Sure. I believe that's an axiom of non-Euclidean geometry.
 
@Færd not really. I don't know how to define that English meaning of true.
If an arrow flies true, it goes directly to its target. No question that it will miss.
 
9:13 PM
Ah.
 
@WillHunting he should pet his cat like that
 
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
 
by which I mean cat = cigarettes and pet = smoke
 
@Mitch Ah, you must have just smoked a few today, LOL.
 
@MetaEd sure. One possible axiom (for one particular geometry).
 
9:14 PM
I wonder why there are so many disagreeing true-seeing hearts then.
@KitZ.Fox That's a beautiful sense of true, though.
 
@Færd yes, that's why it is more expressive in French and kind of hard to translate.
 
And if we think in terms of our language, and we use different languages, that makes us different.
 
I started to learn French a few weeks ago.
 
Although I think in terms of language, I also think in terms of other things, like pictures.
 
"Only the heart sees true." is probably the most accurate translation.
 
9:18 PM
@WillHunting argh...tpyos
 
@KitZ.Fox Do you have to deny what the eye sees?
 
@KitZ.Fox The heart sees a lot of falsehoods too
 
@Færd you'll be reading St Exupery in no time!
 
What is the heart anyway?
 
@Færd It's a boiling mass of plasma at such high density that it initiates atomic fusion producing radiation
 
9:21 PM
@KitZ.Fox That's what I was going to say. I want to start learning Le Petit Prince.
 
oops, sorry, that's the sun.
did you say 'heart'?
 
Aha..
 
@Færd he's one of my favorite authors.
Such a sense of kindness and humility.
 
So all his works are as easy as Le Petit Prince is famed to be?
 
Nope.
 
9:23 PM
@Mitch I do think there's more to us than just particles.
 
But he is a good writer, and you can tell that's true even if French is not your first language.
 
argh, I couldn't get the quote right:
>The sun is mass of incandescent gas, a gigantic nuclear furnace
Where hydrogen is built into helium at a temperature of millions of degrees
which, supposedly, is wrong
yay, science!
 
@KitZ.Fox I could tell it reading the translations.
 
@Mitch you need the reprise. The sun is a miasma of incandescent plasma.
 
That's the new corrected version
(I've only found out in the past five minutes)
 
9:26 PM
Plasma. Forget that song. Plasma. We got it wrong. That thesis has been rendered invalid!
 
@KitZ.Fox That's harder to sing along with
 
@Mitch it's jazzier.
Meet the Elements and I am a paleontologist are really excellent sing along songs.
Like a box of paints that you mix to make any shade, they either combine to form a chemical compound or stand alone as they are.
And yes, you can actually sing that.
 
I haven't read The Little Prince.
It seems so popular and translated into so many languages, I wonder why.
 
You may hear about the star-studded black bowl with a 360° sunset or even see pictures, but nothing in the world prepares you for the wrath-of-God–sized wall of darkness that comes rushing at you from out of the west at more than twice the speed of sound as if it were some silent shockwave from a dinosaur-extinction event, followed by an impossibly black sun that you can look at with your bare eye like some hole torn from space itself which leads to uttermost annihilation.
No wonder the ancients thought that the end had come.
 
That is a very long sentence.
 
9:38 PM
@tchrist I am looking forward to that in 2024!
 
Partial eclipse = hm getting a bit dim around here ain't it?
Total eclipse = this is the end of the world
 
@KitZ.Fox OMG, that is like so long from now, lol.
 
@tchrist Partial eclipse - if no one had mentioned anything, maybe as much as a passing cloud, if that.
even with a mention, hard to notice
 
Practically seven years.
 
Just enough for an itch.
 
9:40 PM
Dinner time! Ciao!
 
A total eclipse = you look to the west and are sure the asteroid has hit
And then it washes over you and the sun turns black. Doesn't go away. Turns black.
 
where did you see it from? home?
 
Casper
4h north of me
12h getting back
Something like that.
 
oh. so you had a view of the landscape to the west?
 
9:42 PM
I just saw two foxes jumping down from the row, another jumping down to the row and then vanishing from the row. That's how chat appears in my browser.
 
I was just about exactly at that point.
 
Before science "Holy crap! We're all gonna die!"
After science "Holy crap! This traffic is killing me!"
 
It's at 8,000 feet. You can see a long ways west.
 
'A long ways' is an interesting expression.
 
The road home that took forever was google.com/maps/dir/…
There is nothing there. No trees. No cell coverage. No towns. No internet. No bathrooms. Just a long, long road through the empty.
I-25 would have been much worse.
 
9:45 PM
Oh, so if your car breaks down, you are fucked?
 
I was in bed at midnight exactly.
@WillHunting Welcome to the American West, my child.
 
I guess you need to walk to the nearest town then, lol.
 
There are no nearest towns
 
I've got peace like a river, I've got joy like a fountain, I've got love like an ocean, I've got time flies like an arrow, I've got fruit flies like a banana, I've got ... I can't remember the other thing I've got.
 
You cannot walk to the nearest town. You die. Life is a do-it-yourself project. Those who fail to prepare for such emergencies do not pass along their weak genes.
 
9:46 PM
You can't get there from here, you have to go somewhere else first
 
I take that back. It's not empty.
 
rocks?
 
It has more pronghorns than you have seen in your entire life.
 
@tchrist I see. Well, if it were me, I wouldn't go there if I could help it.
 
You can't catch them.
@WillHunting It is awesome beyond compare.
It is beautiful. It reminds you of your place in creation.
 
9:49 PM
Hmm, like the ancient cave men.
 
Hardly.
 
I haven't really seen any extremely beautiful place in my life yet.
Well, I just need to come to ELU chat and see @MetaEd to see the eclipse, LOL.
 
@WillHunting Mine are numberless beyond measure.
 
@tchrist I've never seen any before ever, so I'm guessing they have at least one.
 
@tchrist Hmm, good for you!
 
9:55 PM
> As recounted by the worthy men of faith (but God knows more), in the
earliest days there was a king of the isles of Babylon who gathered
together his architects and mages and commanded them to build a
labyrinth so perplexing and subtle that the most prudent men would not
dare to enter it, and those who did enter would be lost. That work was a
scandal, for confusion and wonder are attributes peculiar to God, not to
men. Over time there came to his court a king of the Arabs, and the king
of Babylon (to make a fool of the simplicity of his guest) forced the
 
@tchrist I never realized how much flatland there is interspersed among the mt ranges. I thought once you hit Denver (or the longitude of Denver) it's all mountains until you hit the ocean.
I guess not.
 
> ...the Almighty has seen fit that I should show you mine, where there are no staircases to ascend, nor doors to force, nor wearisome galleries to traverse, nor walls to deny your passage. Then he untied his captive’’s bindings and abandoned him in the middle of the desert, where the King of Babylon died of hunger and of thirst. Glory be with That which does not die
@Mitch Not.
 
@tchrist wow. That's kind of petty.
can't take a joke?
Remind me not to play any practical jokes on that Arab dude
 
@Mitch It was nicer before I translated it.
> Cuentan los hombres dignos de fe (pero Alá sabe más)
que en los primeros días hubo un rey de las islas
de Babilonia que congregó a sus arquitectos y magos
y les mandó construir un laberinto tan perplejo y
sutil que los varones más prudentes no se aventuraban
a entrar, y los que entraban se perdían. Esa obra
era un escándalo, porque la confusión y la maravilla
son operaciones propias de Dios y no de los hombres.
Con el andar del tiempo vino a su corte un rey de
los árabes, y el rey de Babilonia (para hacer burla
When you travel that land, you do so with resources to allow you to easily survive three days without trouble and seven if pushed.
As any traveller from an antique land who lives to tell the tale will teach you.
 
> The Institute of Cybernetic Pedagogy at Paderborn (Germany) has compared the length of study time it takes natively French-speaking high-school students to obtain comparable 'standard' levels in Esperanto, English, German, and Italian.[73] The results were:
2000 hours studying German
1500 hours studying English
1000 hours studying Italian (or any other Romance language)
150 hours studying Esperanto.
 
10:05 PM
@Færd I am wondering why Esperanto? Is it really useful to learn?
@Mitch I thought you were talking about some chat user at first, LOL.
 
@WillHunting What do you mean by useful?
 
@Færd In any sense you wish.
 
Comparing the studying hours, it looks practical enough to have a super-easy international language that is not the native language of any countries.
 
Maybe we should all switch to Esperanto as the only language in the world? LOL.
 
You want to study physics abroad? You don't have to set aside two years learning something irrelevant.
@WillHunting No, it's not supposed to supplant other languages, but to supplement them.
 
10:25 PM
@WillHunting haha no that would be mean
Like that Arabic king
 
Hello :) Is this sentence sounds good?
When you keeping the button clicking, the scrolling up/down doesn't change the values, only movements of the mouse right/left (when you stop clicking) .
 
11:22 PM
@tchrist And so, we have the Darwin Awards to commend such people for not passing down their foolishness to the rest of us.
 
11:47 PM
@Tonepoet I don't like the tone of that website. It makes a mockery of these people who died. They have died and don't deserve that mockery. It's not like they did things to hurt other people...
That website is just so bad...
It is really very bad...
 
@WillHunting Perhaps, but it also serves as a medium for cautionary tales that emphasizes the fact that sometimes even the simplest of mistakes can cost you your very life.
 
"Named in honor of Charles Darwin, the father of evolution, the Darwin Awards commemorate those who improve our gene pool by removing themselves from it."
This line speaks for itself. QED.
Can you imagine if your loved one died and people talk about him or her like that?
I will give the author of that line a tight slap if I met him.
 

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