English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room - 2012-01-19 (page 5 of 6)

« first day (434 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (4492 days later) »

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

6:00 PM

So unless the client-side refresh is designed to respect the REAL server-side session timeout, it's harmful. And it's still harmful because I could have typed that essay, NOT extended my session, got up to get a coffee, come back, and now the essay is gone and I can't even copy/paste it

Hey, I don't disagree with you. I am doing what the boss said he wanted done.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Kitḫ oh, I know, I'm trying to give you some ammo for shooting this feature down altogether. The app probably already handles timeouts just fine, on the server side; doing nothing is probably better than doing something.

The more I tinker with it, the more I am inclined to agree.

Anyway, I think I am thoroughly convinced that if someone wants to implement this, they can figure it out. I don't think it is important enough for my priority list.

Let's see what else I've got.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I'm working on integrating google adwords into our application so that the app responds to the ads you've clicked on. It's interesting, because google's api has a per-request $ cost

That is interesting.

Oh! I know what I can do. I wanted to include the values of some of the Session variables in the email notification that sends me the stack trace.

Now to break it on purpose. gets sledgehammer

Hello? iz brokn. y u no tell me?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

6:18 PM

@Kitḫ yeah, that's a good idea

our system sends all the HTTP headers, all the http variables, the ip address, some decoded cookie data, the data-layer command's name and parameters, the SQL that was being executed if it was an sql exception, and the stack trace

Oh. feels small and amateurish

user19161

One can write the Kit and Shiny Q&A book on programming using the stuff here.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@WillHunting hardly

@Kitḫ well, it's taken years to get it so sophisticated

honestly, when I started working here, I was pleased that the stack trace and request parameters were being logged, my old company didn't log anything like that.

Some days I just feel like I will never be able to do this stuff properly.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Kitḫ what, coding? sure, you're doing fine, as long as you're learning

constantly seeking to improve is what makes for a good programmer.

6:27 PM

My boss hadn't thought of collecting anything but the stack trace, and I think that's just because he stumbled across an email notification thingy.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Kitḫ Just ask yourself: what will I need when the app has hundreds of users in deployments that I can't access

And right now, I am apparently confounded by the String.Format function.

Oh FFS.

I was trying to catch up on the transcript a little but I am stuck crying-laughing here

15 hours ago, by Cerberus

I only have 20 icons in my tray now.

And hi.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

hey @aedia, I saw this today and thought of you (for the rover, not the choking) sci-ence.org/tomato

user19161

@aediaλ The morning thing must have happened again.

6:31 PM

Hi!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

drat, I typed @aedia and now I have a Sarah McLachlan song in my head again

@MrShinyandNew安宇 swoons It's Curiosity!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@aediaλ it's damn big, is what it is. I had no idea!

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Hey stop that! Now I have it half formed in my head too!

@WillHunting It's unfortunate that that keeps occurring. It should pick a side and quit fighting.

@Kitḫ Heya!

@aediaλ I'm empty since you left me. Tried to find a way to carry on.

user19161

6:34 PM

@aediaλ I'm glad you spelled occurring correctly with two r's.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Aedia, I do believe I failed you
Aedia, I know I let you down
Don't you know I tried so hard

...to love you in my way?

It's easy. Let it go.

A thousand curses! mumbles to self it's easy, let it go...

Here, I'll find a cure.

I'm going to be stuck with this all day now, aren't I.

6:38 PM

Try that.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 :3056085 We have some of the others at Nat'l Air and Space here but I haven't been up to see life size Curiosity! She is big :)

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

♪what is love? baby don't hurt me, don't hurt me, no more♫♬

Weird interlude in that video.

user19161

Baby baby baby oh

Indeed, I recommend just listening to it.

Well, some of the pictures are really interesting.

6:42 PM

It's making me think of Cornflake Girl but I just checked and they're like, really not the same.

Not at all.

I was looking for this one originally:

They are similar.

Although if you are into Tori, I get this one in my head sometimes:

Or for something a little more ass-kicking:

perks up

Ohh that first one makes me think of Past the Mission (from the same album).

@aediaλ Oh yeah. I love Tori. I know most of her older stuff.

I saw her in concert a while back and man, that was something else.

@Kitḫ I don't know Elastica, but I like this.

@aediaλ Really? That was their big hit.

They had a few others that I liked too. Vaseline, The Car Song.

Do you like the Donnas or PJ Harvey?

6:50 PM

@Kitḫ I've seen her... twice, I think. Definitely awesome.

This is a better version.

user19161

@Kitḫ I don't think she is sexy though there are many comments there that say so.

@Kitḫ Names sound vaguely familiar, so I might know the songs a bit. I just know I never owned anything by them...

I don't recognize the PJ Harvey stuff right away either.

You must know the Donnas, though?

Hi!

PJ Harvey, I think I like that.

6:58 PM

She's uh. Something else.

Oh. I almost forgot my favorite. Let me see if I can find it.

@Kitḫ I recognize the song. I didn't own any of their albums either.

I used to cover this.

Also, sing it in my hard. It's on my Full-On Atomic Chick Mix tape.

user19161

0

Q: Word for the point where you can feel the music throughout your body

When you are listening to music and you continue to turn the volume up, there is a certain point where you just sorta feel "full" of the music. It is a fabulous feeling. Is there a specific word for this? I thought nirvana may apply but I wasn't sure.

single-word-requests

user19161

NARQ

Maybe synesthesia.

user19161

7:02 PM

@Kitḫ You can answer if you want.

Is my voodoo working?

God, orthodox Jews suck.

What?

user19161

@Kitḫ On who?

Sorry, commenting on a news item.

user19161

7:04 PM

@Cerberus Why?

@Kit Hmm. Tori's To Venus and Back would have been out by the time I was really buying much music, and most of my first purchases were probably Indigo Girls or Tom Petty. But I guess I had an eclectic early music life because I remember that someone gave me Kate Bush's Hounds of Love, which apparently was from more than ten years earlier, and I am not that familiar with the Donnas yet I listened to all the artists listed there as their influences...

@WillHunting The rabbi of the Amsterdam orthodox congregation has said that homosexuality can and should be "cured". That went too far even for the orthodox Jews: they were outraged and sacked him. But the international organization of orthodox Jews says that is wrong and impossible, and they're trying to force the Amsterdam congregation to take their rabbi back.

Which they won't.

Not at least until he cures himself of homosinuality.

Hmm how does that work? Is there porn for it?

And I can't believe you think orthodox Jews suck for sacking their misguided rabbi.

@Cerberus No, silly. You pray it out.

user19161

7:08 PM

@Cerberus What is wrong and impossible there?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus You know what's even more hilarious? when I was young we had Mormon neighbours, one of whom often tried to discuss religion with my (catholic) mother. He said that God punished the natives (American Indians) for sinning, and that if they repented and converted to Mormonism their skin would turn white as a sign.

(i.e. their skin wasn't white, because they were sinners).

user19161

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Cheese and rice!

Well, duh.

I though everyone knew that.

@Kitḫ Ohh on one's knees?

user19161

@Kitḫ thought

7:09 PM

@Cerberus And prepared to receive the holy spirit, yes.

That's not just Mormons. There is the racist idea that dark skin is the mark of Cain, etc.

user image

@WillHunting The congregation doesn't have the right to sack or appoint their rabbi: only the international thingie can do that.

Right. Because Cain is Abel's brother from another mother, right?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

This guy claimed to know a native who had converted and whose skin HAD changed.

7:10 PM

pathfinder/spirit-oppy/curiosity wheels

user19161

People with dark skin don't need to get a tan. I wonder how that feels.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Haha, that is lovely.

(To go back to something much more pleasant to think about than how people are mean to each other for no good reason)

@Kitḫ Ahh now we're talking.

7:11 PM

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Was it by any chance Michael Jackson?

@aediaλ Cut!

user19161

@Cerberus I thought he converted to Islam?

You can't resist the laughing babies!

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus well, he was black, not native

He was so natively black!

@Kitḫ Wow. That is so cute it hurts. It will haunt my dreams forever.

user19161

7:13 PM

There seems to be a lot of conversion between Islam and Christianity.

@WillHunting Oh, bummer.

Vitiligo is the Holy Spirit?

4

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Native African, what's the difference?

@aediaλ snort

@WillHunting Really? I never see it. Then again, I don't really know any religious people.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

7:15 PM

@Cerberus that must be nice

@aediaλ Haha yes.

@aediaλ That's a keeper.

I would star that, but I won't.

Oh, too late...

@Cerberus I did for you.

@Cerberus you both know me. HA. i have ruined your streak.

7:16 PM

Then +*.

@JSBᾶngs Wha—?

You used to be Muslim?

@MetaEd How...devious.

@Kitḫ what? no... i'm just a religious person

@Kitḫ Wait, I didn't think there was a "used to be".

@JSBᾶngs Oh. I got confused.

user19161

7:17 PM

For an interesting debate between Christian and Muslim, see the youtube videos on William Campbell vs Zakir Naik.

I thought we were talking about Muslim converts to Christianity.

@JSBᾶngs Right! Well, it's a cultural thing: I probably do know religious foreigners.

At least you're not shy about it!

user19161

user19161

Part 1 of 10.

Blah.

Argh! stomps on naughty codes

7:18 PM

I'll watch that some other time.

user19161

You will be amazed at least by the memory of Zakir Naik. He memorized the entire Bible and Koran and can quote them freely.

Ehhh yes.

Sure sure.

user19161

He also tries to reconcile science and Koran.

Why on Earth would he do that?

user19161

7:20 PM

For example, he mentions how the Koran talks about the Big Bang.

Yeah, that's impossible.

user19161

cloved the heavens asunder

user19161

@Kitḫ To show that Islam is the truth.

Muslims can be scientists, everybody knows that. Just as gays can't be in the army.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@MetaEd, wow, I wasn't aware of that Mark of Cain thing. Well, add that to the list of things I despise about the Bible.

@Kitḫ Some Muslims are trying to prove that the Koran is divine revelation, by interpreting passages in ways that show that they describe scientific facts which were not known at the time.

7:22 PM

Well, that's silly.

It's hardly divine if it's something that science can explain.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

So, by their reasoning, if the Koran describes the Big Bang, then the Big Bang proves that the Koran was revealed by Allah and not just written by Mohammed.

user19161

I must say Zakir Naik really shakes me when I hear him.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

No, it's divine because it was revealed instead of discovered. The REVELATION of it is divine. not the thing itself.

looks dubious

user19161

I thought about converting to Islam after hearing him.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

7:24 PM

If Mohammed, living in the 7th century, or whenever, knew some fact that he couldn't possibly know, but that God told him, then God must have told him, right? And if God told him ONE thing, why wouldn't God tell him all of it.

@WillHunting Before you convert to Islam, please read the Skeptics Annotated Koran.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Sure. That's the same logic I rely on people using when I am writing a persuasive article.

Islam is nice, but I like Judaism better.

Of the Judeochristian faiths, anyway.

user19161

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Yeah. But maybe you will feel the same after hearing him? :-)

user19161

So really, check this guy out. In the very least, you will say that he is a great speaker.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Well, it's not entirely ridiculous, in that there might not be a better explanation for how he got his knowledge. until you look at what they claim as their divine revelations, and find out that it's pretty crappy.

@WillHunting Oh, I know how persuasive a religious speaker can be. Go to a pentecostal church or a baptist church, one with a good pastor, and you'll be amazed, or frightened, at how effective the speaker is. That doesn't make him RIGHT though.

Didn't Mohammed marry a prepubescent girl?

user19161

7:28 PM

@Cerberus Yes, but that is not relevant.

Then again, who didn't in those days.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus Alia, or something like that.

He had four wives.

Right.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@WillHunting Really? not relevant how?

7:28 PM

Not all at the same time though.

Too bad.

Oh, well.

user19161

@MrShinyandNew安宇 To the truth or falsity of Islam.

And traditions were different back then.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@WillHunting why not?

Let's not get too far into this.

@Kitḫ Exactly. But it is still a fun fact, what with this century's exaggerated paedophilia craze...but I think we already talked about this.

7:30 PM

Yeah, not a topic that I am particularly fond of.

user19161

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Well, God can use all kinds of people to reveal stuff, for one.

user19161

But I understand where you are coming from.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@WillHunting But you're begging the question, by assuming that God exists and indeed CAN reveal stuff to people

Maybe he does.

user19161

@Cerberus What do you mean by paedophilia craze, that there are many paedophiles or that there is much attention on them?

7:32 PM

Besides, it's much more important for us to be arguing about what color the invisible unicorn in the sky is!

2

Maybe he only reveals things to shepherds who meditate in caves.

Of more immediate concern to me is why is my effing error notification suddenly not working at all?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Kitḫ Mohammed was a trader

user19161

But note that I have not ascertained the truth or falsity of him marrying a young girl or the rightness or wrongness of that.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 He was a merchant and a shepherd.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 actually don't do that. if you actually care, you owe it to yourself to read a sympathetic account first.

user19161

7:35 PM

@Kitḫ Yes that is certainly more important.

@Kitḫ There aren't any errors. You can go home now.

@aediaλ I wish that were true. I broke it earlier though, so I know it is broken.

user19161

@JSBᾶngs Using actually like I did yesterday! We infect each other with words in this room!

@Kitḫ Spontaneous reassembly? looks hopeful or time reversal?

And I forgot. Muhammad had about twelve wives, but not more than four at a time, which is why most Muslims won't take more than four.

@aediaλ snaps fingers

user19161

7:38 PM

@aediaλ But those who Believe can see them everywhere, it's true!

@WillHunting Eww I don't want your infected words! stops gnawing on chat room

user19161

@aediaλ I learned yay from you.

Yay!

FFS. You got it, @aedia. I fixed it.

I mean, um, don't eat that it might have germs!

@Kitḫ Double yay!

7:40 PM

I see this room is crawling with memetic life. sprays

ducks

giggles That tickles!

yawns and shrugs

hides in sack

Is it pkay too oben my eiyes?

user19161

On the other hand, I hate listening to the Dalai Lama. I feel he is very not Buddhist.

7:42 PM

Hi people.

user19161

People treat him as an authority on the religion or even a deity, but I do otherwise.

user19161

@Mahnax Hi! How is your studying?

And @Will so far with TeX, I like TeXShop more than the other one.

Who are you calling people?

@WillHunting Boring. Blegh.

7:42 PM

@MetaEd Them.

user19161

@Mahnax I have not tried TeXshop since I never use Mac.

@MetaEd What would you like me to refer to you all as?

@WillHunting Too much attention, too much of a witch hunt.

@WillHunting It's better IMO.

user19161

The greatest Buddhist speaker for me is Thich Nhat Hanh.

user19161

7:45 PM

@Mahnax TeXworks was inspired by TeXshop actually. Kew wanted to make something simple and cross-platform, and he did.

@WillHunting I like him.

@WillHunting Hmm, I see.

@Mahnax Memetic life forms.

@MetaEd Sorry.

Well, I'm going now. Bye memetic life forms!

user19161

@Mahnax Also try TeXmaker.

7:48 PM

Bai!

OK, it stopped working again. WTF?

Ugh, Megaupload has been taken down.

And this is even before Sopa.

user19161

@Cerberus Because of the act?

@aediaλ It's in my garage, actually.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@JSBᾶngs Why would it be better to read a sympathetic Koran first?

@WillHunting No, neither SOPA nor PIPA will be passed any time soon.

user19161

7:50 PM

4shared.com has lots of scanned books for booklovers.

@Cerberus Megaporn, Megarotic, and Sexuploader?

How do you know about those?

user19161

@Kitḫ Er, how did you know about those?

It's expected of me.

user19161

I have never used megauploader, seriously.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

well, meeting time. Hopefully you guys can decide the truth about religion, porn, and censorship before I get back.

7:52 PM

@Kitḫ Oh?

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Bai!

@MetaEd No, no, I'm sure that's just a pile of teapots! Check again. Don't get burned by any dragons.

user19161

Is bai the new way of saying bye? We need higher standards here!

Doorbell, bye!

user19161

If we keep saying bai here, soon all the ESL people will use that too when they read the transcript!

Good.

Why, why, why is this not working!?

7:55 PM

@WillHunting See, @Cerb has the right idea. He says bye only to his doorbell, and then doesn't have to worry about what you think of his spelling.

(Hasta pronto, @MrShinyandNew and @Cerberus ;) )

@Kitḫ u doed it rong?

wuz werkn

hits wif chezburgr

check nau

iz it wurk agin?

mebbe all teh emals r in teh spam fitr

@aediaλ i chek

nou

@aediaλ I keep teapots at Lagrange points so I won't forget where they are.

That's a great idea!

Argh! Stoop[id emali wer r u?

7:59 PM

There's always /bī/

@Kitḫ shuldn let emails eet so meny cans uf spapmm. dey wont fit in the fitr no mour.

… which brings us back to Björk.

D'oh.

user19161

@MetaEd I can only read IPA and not the other transcriptions or whatever you call them, so when I get a dictionary I make sure it uses IPA and not something else.

@MetaEd Brilliant!

8:02 PM

@WillHunting The one I posted is from Google Dictionary. I haven't inspected their phonetic alphabet carefully, but it seems to resemble what I remember from paper dictionaries all my life.

There were paper dictionaries?

giggles

user19161

@aediaλ Paper has been in existence for very long.

They made excellent booster seats.

Which is why I loved them as a child.

user19161

0

Q: Adjective to replace "small" in "small part"

I am looking for the replacement for the adjective "small" as in "small part", e.g: I am dedicating the small part of my article to.... which would not over-emphasize the fact of being small, but at the same time keeping it clear that it is not the major and most significant part.

adjectives expressions synonyms vocabulary

High time I learned IPA though. So what's the IPA equivalent to /bī/ and more importantly, how would I figure it out myself?

user19161

8:04 PM

Is there ever a dedication of only a part of an article as described above?

user19161

I've not seen that.

user19161

Well, actually I've only seen dedications in books, not articles.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 if you're interested in something, begin with a source that will present it sympathetically, before you go to the debunkers. what do you say to someone who learned everything they know about darwinism from creationist books?

user19161

@JSBᾶngs Good point.

@WillHunting I actually had a dream the other day in which a paper Roget's Thesaurus appeared. I just couldn't resist. I think I was about the youngest one here for a moment... and I ain't that young no more.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

8:07 PM

@WillHunting Thesaurus.

I'd move it to Writers.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

That, too.

user19161

@RegDwightѬſ道 Except that I still don't know how he can dedicate a part of an article.

@MetaEd I suggest starting with an IPA chart that has audio examples. This is a good 'un as I recall if you have an audio player that does .aiff files

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Kitḫ Except that they don't have the gen-ref close reason.

user19161

8:09 PM

@MetaEd You can see a dictionary that uses IPA. Look up simple words and soon you will know the associations.

Based on this, I'd say the IPA would be /baɪ/. The linked article has the phonetic alphabet that I know.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@WillHunting One more reason why the question is unclear.

And provides IPA equivalents so that's going to be a great starting point.

However I am now going to bookmark that phonetic course, thank you!

user19161

@MetaEd Of course I would recommend my favourite dictionaries to you for that purpose: CALD and OALD for this purpose.

user19161

dictionary.cambridge.org and oxfordadvancedlearnersdictionary.com

8:11 PM

@MetaEd there are a lot of others, here's the Paul Meier one that's in Flash - I like this set because it's got the diphthongs and because the examples are all the same speaker, which isn't true in some recordings

I love the OALD and (I'm sure this sounds insanely geeky) I like the Oxford 3000 wordlist for practice. If you go to a section of the wordlist, you can hear the words in BrE/AmE and practice transcribing them without seeing the transcription. It's good if you don't have exercises from a book handy.

user19161

By the way I don't like the online Merriam Webster because of the ads and how it does not give you access to everything.

user19161

And the online Longman does not let you hear the sound with a click.

user19161

Another good choice is macmillandictionary.com

I also have Ohio State Language Files and some of the recordings, etc. are available online whether or not you own the book

@aediaλ Is that the one that shows the shape of the mouth for many different sounds?

8:17 PM

I'm sure there are lots that do, but it has really good line drawings, yeah

Thanks for all the great bookmarks.

Holy crap. I've been in the middle of a battle for three or four hours. Whoops.

Battle?

user19161

0

Q: Why is Tesco often pronounced Tesco's?

I have often heard members of the British public pronounce the name of the supermarket chain Tesco as "Tesco's" or "Tescos". Thinking that it was formerly called "Tesco's", as many old British companies are, I looked up its history and learnt that it is a concatenation of the initials of its ear...

pronunciation names common-pronunciation trademarks brands

user19161

Dup as FF notes.

8:26 PM

I disagree that it is a dupe.

Especially it is not a dupe of the ear doctor question.

user19161

Hmm, I would think that different pronunciation is essentially because it is a different word.

/ˈhaʊ.diː/

user19161

Howdy

Apparently this thing is on.

OK. If you put a null value in a String.Format token, does it return the whole thing as a null value?

8:34 PM

@Kitḫ it returns as an empty string

String.Format("<{0}>", null) == <>

So not String.Format("<{0}>",null) == null

So why in the hell is this not working when I put the session variable in there?

OH. Shit.

so you figured it out?

I can't access the session object for the kind of break I made.

I don't know how to...some days I think I should just stay in bed.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@JSBᾶngs There's a difference between reading a book that's annotated by a skeptic, and a book that simply argues a different point of view. The annotations don't remove any material from the original, but "creationist books" don't present Darwin's arguments and then try to refute them, they just make their refutations.

@Kitḫ You shouldn't put up with objections from those naughty sessions! Teach 'em a lesson!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

8:51 PM

0

A: Adjective to replace "small" in "small part"

You may use modest: limited in size or scope.

Yeah right. "I am dedicating the modest part of my article to..."

I am modestly dedicating one word of my article to my mother.

OK, now we're cooking with gas.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 i see your point, but i don't know if the difference is that great. if you read a book with someone constantly scribbling in the margins to counter-argue, you haven't really read the book for yourself, have you?

Oh but used books with notes in the margins are my favorite!

I always hope there'll be something surprising and revelatory, but the bookmarks are usually someone's grocery lists and the notes usually just reveal that other people didn't understand the author either.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@JSBᾶngs Well, we're talking about the Koran, which, like the Bible, is basically impossible to "read for yourself" without years of study, because it's so damn hard to read.

makes note to write very dense book

« first day (434 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (4492 days later) »

Transcript for

Jan '1219

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…

Not for the faint of heart or those easily triggered by Englis...

phrase-requests pronunciation single-word-requests synonyms

join this room
about this room

00:00

06:00

12:00

18:00

all times are UTC

site design / logo © 2024 Stack Exchange Inc; legal

mobile