TRPG General Chat

Adeptus

12:00 AM

@doppelgreener Depends where in WA. I think South WA would be further than North QLD.

FrancisJohn

12:13 AM

Heyyo

doppelgreener

12:45 AM

@Adeptus yeah, that's a point, though we only got to pick whole states

@FrancisJohn they all seem nice depending on what you're keen on doing a lot of and what you value. Some people like going early (evey bit helps), I'd be inclined toward the middle two, maybe prestidigitation depending on how much I expect I'd use it (I have a friend who loves it - once broke a magical circle with it and he and his party members almost died in the resulting explosion)

FrancisJohn

1:09 AM

Well let me tell you what I have stuff up to.

Initiative +10

perception +7

,

concentration +10

and well prestidigitation

she is a level 4 human witch. Playing her as a nihilist, so prestidigitation might be too silly for her.

Joel Harmon

1:23 AM

@FrancisJohn depends on what you want to do with the character, how much you care about the character vs. the stats, etc.

I tend to have story-driven DMs, which IMHO makes 3.5's Hand of the Mage probably the best item for the money in the game.

(it grants Mage Hand at will for 900 gp)

nihilism can be very well supported by prestidigitation, by the way

just use it to cause things to fade, make gourmet food bland, and poor illusions of the way your party mates are likely to die (probably soon)

FrancisJohn

1:41 AM

@JoelHarmon Hahahahahaha that's funny

I'm definitely leaning towards the initiative. Going first seems super important, especially as the character levels.

@JoelHarmon then it comes down to making sure spells go off vs. perceiving threats before they happen vs. prestidigitation.

She's more of the category of nothing matters and just accepting life in its beautiful bleakness

Joel Harmon

this gets back to my 'bag of numbers vs. character' thing; you could say that she goes later in combat because she's too distracted by the ennui and fleeting nature of peace to respond quickly

or you could say she's always expecting the worse, and unpleasantly surprised when it doesn't happen, thus she's more prepared and gets +init

Miniman

2:11 AM

@FrancisJohn I find roleplaying easier with characters that are alive, so I'd pick initiative.

Joel Harmon

@Miniman do you often find that if you don't go first in combat, you've died before you get a chance to play?

Miniman

@JoelHarmon D&D 3.5 is very much a "fastest gun in the west" game. I don't know too much about Pathfinder, but I get the impression it didn't change in that respect.

FrancisJohn

I think initiative is in, now can you help me frame the following?

Joel Harmon

my 3.5 experience is most often if a creature is KO'd in the first round, it's a mook. Perhaps we simply play at either different character levels, or different optimization levels

FrancisJohn

she accepts the world is as it is, and that we don't have any control over it.

Joel Harmon

2:20 AM

(I can say my typical group's optimization level is pretty low)

FrancisJohn

The witch's worldview is pretty bleak, and that predetermination rules over self determination

Joel Harmon

are you looking to refine a core belief of the character?

FrancisJohn

would she get +2 concentration +2 perception, or the random effects of prestidigitaikn

Joel Harmon

you could make an argument for or against any of those three

FrancisJohn

i get her core belief I think, just trying to reflect it between those three traits.

Joel Harmon

2:22 AM

as people tend to be orthogonal to their particular abilities

FrancisJohn

I really like her initiative at +12

Miniman

@JoelHarmon This is a first level spell (from the PHB, no splat required). If it hits you, you are to all intents and purposes dead for [caster level] rounds.

I'm not talking about high-end optimization stuff here.

Actually, Sleep is a much better example, since you're highly likely to be actually dead, not just effectively dead.

Against a 1st-level party of four characters, it's a TPK.

Joel Harmon

potentially; it could also just flop entirely

Miniman

Of course! But going first means that you get the chance to TPK the enemies before they get the chance to do it to you.

Joel Harmon

(but yes, I am generally aware of how broken magic can be in 3.5)

FrancisJohn

2:29 AM

Many 3.5 spells are nerfed in pathfinder, but typically that same principle remains the same.

Joel Harmon

another way of looking at it is the +2 when compared to a d20 is 10%. Roughly speaking, it would put you above the enemies 10% of the time (yes, I'm aware it's more of a bell curve, so my napkin numbers may be wrong).

you'd have to crunch those numbers against any expected need for concentration checks, perception checks, or the very nebulous but flexible use of a cantrip

FrancisJohn

That's true, but for this quick evaluation I'm content with that %10

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