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8:17 AM
Yay, holiday!
 
@PauloCereda The Queen's birthday is a holiday in Brazil?
 
@egreg Oh I meant another holiday. :)
Joaquim José da Silva Xavier ([ʒwaˈkĩ ʒuˈzɛ dɐ ˈsiwvɐ ʃɐviˈɛʁ]),(November 12, 1746 – April 21, 1792), known as Tiradentes (IPA: [tʃiɾɐˈdẽtʃis]), was a leading member of the Brazilian revolutionary movement known as the Inconfidência Mineira whose aim was full independence from the Portuguese colonial power and to create a Brazilian republic. When the plan was discovered, Tiradentes was arrested, tried and publicly hanged. Since the 19th century he has been considered a national hero of Brazil and patron of the Military Police. == Family and early occupation == Born to a poor family in a farm in...
 
@PauloCereda Our National Holiday will be on Monday. :)
 
@egreg ooh! :)
Festa della Liberazione! :)
Also, why am I awake so early in a holiday? :)
 
8:37 AM
@PauloCereda In honor of Tiradentes
 
@egreg ooh
Are LuaTeX bugs fixed too? :)
 
yo'
9:02 AM
Do you really write a comma in front of "Jr." in names such as "John Smith, Jr"?
oh yes, you do :)
I would really use if gather ignored all & inside
@egreg Another jewel!
Define  3rd order commutator $R$ by $ R=[L_1,L_2]$. Then
\begin{small}
\[[L_j,R]=
A_1^{(j)}L_1^2+A_2^{(j)}L_2^2+A_3^{(j)}H^2+A_4^{(j)}\{L_1,L_2\}+A_5^{(j)}HL_1\]
\[+A_6^{(j)}HL_2 {+A_7^{(j)}L_1+A_8^{(j)}L_2+A_9^{(j)}H+A_{10}^{(j)}},\]
\[ R^2 = b_1 L_1^3 + b_2 L_2^3 + b_3 H^3 + b_4 \{L_1^2,L_2\} + b_5 \{L_1,L_2^2\}\]
\[ + b_6
L_1 L_2 L_1 + b_7 L_2 L_1 L_2
 + b_8 H\{L_1,L_2\} +b_9 H L_1^2 + b_{10} H L_2^2 \]
\[+ b_{11} H^2
L_1 + b_{12} H^2 L_2 + b_{13} L_1^2 + b_{14} L_2^2 + b_{15} \{L_1,L_2\} \]
What do I do wrong here?
\documentclass{article}

\usepackage{mathtools}

\begin{document}

\begin{gather*}
\begin{multlined}\relax
[L_j,R]=A_1^{(j)}L_1^2+A_2^{(j)}L_2^2+A_3^{(j)}H^2
\\+A_4^{(j)}\{L_1,L_2\}+A_5^{(j)}HL_1+A_6^{(j)}HL_2 +A_7^{(j)}L_1
\\+A_8^{(j)}L_2+A_9^{(j)}H+A_{10}^{(j)},
\end{multlined}
\\
\begin{multlined}
R^2 = b_1 L_1^3 + b_2 L_2^3 + b_3 H^3 + b_4 \{L_1^2,L_2\} + b_5 \{L_1,L_2^2\}
\\ + b_6 L_1 L_2 L_1 + b_7 L_2 L_1 L_2 + b_8 H\{L_1,L_2\}
\\ + b_9 H L_1^2 + b_{10} H L_2^2 + b_{11} H^2 L_1 + b_{12} H^2 L_2
(do you see the missing lineskip between the first and second line of the multlined envs?)
@JosephWright @DavidCarlisle @barbarabeeton ^^
 
9:25 AM
@yo' I suspect it is this:
Comment added
2014/05/11 Bug 1: If used inside an array or a derivative (say, a matrix variant), multlined does
not work as expected. The implementation contains an `invisible' line after the first
multline row, inside an array this line is no longer `invisible' because array sets
\baselineskip to zero. Currently we have no general workaround for this.
@yo' put perhaps not that exactly but anyway it looks like mathtools rather than amsmath...
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle so I should ... not use it at all?
 
@yo' sorry no time to investigate at present, just a pointer to the mathtools manual comment
 
@DavidCarlisle Frank's paper to read :-)
 
yo'
@JosephWright which paper?
 
@yo' Team list only ATM: came up yesterday in the team meeting
 
10:07 AM
@JosephWright ooh
 
@DavidCarlisle has anything changed in amsmath regarding the spaces between lines. That invisible line cited in the bug, runs
\crcr
\global\MH_set_boolean_F:n {mult_firstline}
\hbox to \l_MT_multwidth_dim{}\crcr
\noalign{\vskip-\baselineskip \vskip-\jot \vskip-\normallineskip}
thus the might be something wrong with the \noalign line
It seems to be the \jot, but without it something like spreadlines will not work
 
10:23 AM
@yo' You're using the wrong tool
\begin{align*}
[L_j,R]&=
A_1^{(j)}L_1^2+A_2^{(j)}L_2^2+A_3^{(j)}H^2 \\
&\qquad+A_4^{(j)}\{L_1,L_2\}+A_5^{(j)}HL_1+A_6^{(j)}HL_2 +A_7^{(j)}L_1 \\
&\qquad+A_8^{(j)}L_2+A_9^{(j)}H+A_{10}^{(j)}, \\[1ex]
R^2 &=
b_1 L_1^3 + b_2 L_2^3 + b_3 H^3 + b_4 \{L_1^2,L_2\} + b_5 \{L_1,L_2^2\} \\
&\qquad+ b_6 L_1 L_2 L_1 + b_7 L_2 L_1 L_2 + b_8 H\{L_1,L_2\} \\
&\qquad+ b_9 H L_1^2 + b_{10} H L_2^2 + b_{11} H^2 L_1 + b_{12} H^2 L_2 \\
&\qquad+ b_{13} L_1^2 + b_{14} L_2^2 + b_{15} \{L_1,L_2\} + b_{16} H L_1 \\
&\qquad+ b_{17} H L_2 + b_{18} H^2 + b_{19} L_1 + b_{20} L_2 + b_{21} H + b_{22},
 
yo'
@egreg I prefer multline alignment
 
@yo' It's confusing and messy
 
@yo' try this
 
 
It is not a super good solition, \origjot is the value of \jot at mathtools load time
Nope, that was wrong, does not work properly with spreadlines
\MHInternalSyntaxOn
\def\MT_mult_invisible_line: {
\crcr
\global\MH_set_boolean_F:n {mult_firstline}
\hbox to \l_MT_multwidth_dim{}\crcr
\noalign{%
\vskip-\baselineskip
\vskip-\normallineskip
}
}
\MHInternalSyntaxOff
Now, I do not remember why \jot was even in that \noalign
 
yo'
10:38 AM
@daleif @egreg I'm happy with \begin{multline*}...\end{multline*}\vspace*{-4.5ex}\begin{multline*}...\end{mul‌​tline*}
 
@daleif no nothing changed in amsmath alignment code other than some of the setup, and \dots handling made luatex-aware.
 
yo'
@egreg vv
The results  follow and generalize to all Laplace systems.
\begin{center}
\begin{figure}[H]
\centering
\includegraphics[scale=0.66]{commutingdiagram.png}
\caption{Relationship between conformal St\"ackel transforms and B\^ocher contractions}
\end{figure}

\end{center}
\begin{figure}[H]
\centering
\includegraphics[scale=0.107]{SchematicLaplaceHelmholtz2616.jpg}
\caption{The bigger picture}
\end{figure}
 
@DavidCarlisle stange, the DTX just mentions that I added \vskip-\jot in 2014, and I cannot find any explanation as to why I added it in the DTX or my emails. Think I'm going to remove it again, and wait until someone complains again ;-)
@yo' is someone compiling an archive of these. Someone should.
 
yo'
@daleif @egreg has some. I've met plenty, but actually I shouldn't probably publish thhem this way
 
@yo' @egreg I tend to use this beauty as a bad example
\begin{framed}
\begin{df} (Jordan dekompositionen)
\textnormal{\\ For et reelt mål $\mu$ defineres for $E \in \E$}
$$
\mu^+(E) = \frac{1}{2} \big( \abs (E) + \mu (E) \big) \textnormal{ og } \mu^-(E) = \frac{1}{2} \big( \abs (E) - \mu (E) \big)
$$
\textnormal{kaldet hhv.} positiv- \textnormal{og} negativdelen
\textnormal{af} $\mu$.
...
\end{df}
\end{framed}
so they wanted a framed theorem, with non italics text and a linebreak
50 pages of those
took me quite a while to fix that as it was hard to automate
 
10:54 AM
@daleif Yeah, LaTeX is difficult!
 
Hi all
 
@Danu Hi! :)
 
Small tikz-cd question: I'd like to make one arrow in a diagram longer than the other ones.
I went through the package documentation, but couldn't find how to do it.
 
yo'
@daleif Have you seen Schr$\ddot{o}$dinger?
Ok, gotta go. See you later!
 
@yo' lol, no that is a first. I have a user that lets for example \1 be an alias for \ae because it is easier. I've been trying to explain that when compose key exists exists in linux, then there is no reason to not just write in uttf8
 
11:05 AM
@daleif Well LICR is more portable (will work even if not saved as UTF8), and for the odd char it's easier
 
 
2 hours later…
12:37 PM
The Queen, who was accompanied by the Duke of Edinburgh during her walkabout in Windsor, was presented with a birthday cake at the Guildhall by the Great British Bake Off champion Nadiya Hussain, who had created an orange drizzle cake with a butter cream and marmalade filling.

The monarch unveiled a plaque marking The Queen's Walkway - a 6.3km trail that links 63 significant points in Windsor.

The trail was designed to recognise the moment the monarch broke the record on 9 September 2015 held by her great-great-grandmother Queen Victoria by being on the throne for 63 years and seven months.
I read bacon in the last sentence. I am very disappointed. :)
 
@PauloCereda She ate bacon for breakfast, though.
 
@egreg ooh with eggs? :)
 
@PauloCereda Can you do without them? ;-)
 
@egreg It's not my typical breakfast, to be honest. :)
I've never had them for breakfast.
 
@PauloCereda I do when I'm in Austria or Germany
 
12:53 PM
@egreg Cool! It's not a common breakfast in Brazil.
 
@PauloCereda Should I upgrade to Ubuntu 16.04?
 
@egreg Definitely. :) No version should be left behind, even if it is... ugh ... Ubuntu. :)
@DavidCarlisle: How are you feeling today?
 
1:33 PM
@DavidCarlisle Are you in Freiberg today? A man asked me to change a bill for parking and he looked like you.
 
@Johannes_B Perhaps I'm in many places at once.
@PauloCereda don't ask:-)
 
@Johannes_B ooh was he wearing a monocle, a top hat and a pocket watch? :)
 
@Johannes_B did he speak fluent German?
 
@PauloCereda No, he was just looking like David. Jeans, casual shirt.
@DavidCarlisle I am not sure, but i guess.
 
@Johannes_B ooh
 
1:40 PM
@DavidCarlisle Do you have bright blue eyes?
 
@Johannes_B oh could have been me then, I speak into my phone and the google translate app produces perfect German
@Johannes_B see my picture, eyes are grey (to match skin colour)
 
@DavidCarlisle Oh. :-)
 
I just clicked the sound button in the Italian part and heard emoticon triste a lot of times. :D
 
2:30 PM
@PauloCereda Actually it's time for the Royal Episode ;-)
 
@ChristianHupfer ooh :)
 
@egreg Indeed. <3
@ChristianHupfer and now, a man with \prg_replicate:nn { 3 } { \buttock }. :)
 
@PauloCereda Naughty word, naughty word : \prg_replicate:nn :-P
 
2:36 PM
@ChristianHupfer LOLOLOL
 
yo'
2:50 PM
I love teaching, it assures me my headache sensors still exist :(
 
@yo' Stupid students? ;-)
 
yo'
@ChristianHupfer no, not really, these are fine. But still it's tough.
 
3:07 PM
@ChristianHupfer Students are good, especially when you aren't teaching them. ;-)
 
@egreg I have to teach my 'students' up to 25 hours a week, that's too much.
 
3:45 PM
@egreg: our English friends might be at the birthday party. :)
 
@PauloCereda The last party before the Brexit party ;-) And after that no parties any longer ;-)
 
@ChristianHupfer Oh I actually don't know the context. :( What's Brexit?
 
@PauloCereda Great Britain's referendum on Jun 24 to leave the EU -- Britain's Exit ...
 
@ChristianHupfer Oh!
I thought it was only a matter of \end{eu} et voilà. :)
 
@PauloCereda That's the French way ;-)
 
3:51 PM
@PauloCereda \begin{common market} ... \end{eu} doesn't work.
3
 
@DavidCarlisle Oh.
 
@DavidCarlisle @PauloCereda: According to German Media the result of the poll is on the edge
@JosephWright: There's a user on an edit spree -- I've approved some of his edits, but I think it's enough by now
 
 
4 hours later…
8:14 PM
RIP Prince. :(
 
@PauloCereda This year is quite strange -- a lot of musicians and actors dying -- (but of course other people too -- we just forget to mention them )
 
yo'
@PauloCereda yeah
 
@ChristianHupfer Indeed.
 
yo'
@ChristianHupfer well, I had to quickly do my black laundry last week; the black shirt was still dirty after one funeral and there was another one to come :(
 
@yo' Black shirt?
 
yo'
8:20 PM
@JosephWright I always wear a black shirt for funerals. Since I play the organ, I can't wear a jacket so I don't wear a tie. A black shirt is the easiest option.
 
@yo' Ah
 
yo'
@JosephWright I know the standard thing is a white shirt and a black tie. I own both of course, but playing the organ in a jacket is a no-no for me. (Some people manage, I don't know how)
 
@ChristianHupfer Erm, you'll be disappointed if you try to vote on the 24th
@ChristianHupfer It's not a Thursday so clearly not tenable for a vote
@DavidCarlisle Current polls suggest it might
 
8:42 PM
@JosephWright Is it June the 23rd?
Another (small) palindrome, not worthy to mention according to @DavidCarlisle ;-)
user image
2
 
@ChristianHupfer Mind the gap comma. :D
 
@PauloCereda What have commas ever done for us /sob
 
@ChristianHupfer \let\comma\bye
Does that even work?!
 
@PauloCereda In my dreams ;-) <3
 
9:08 PM
@ChristianHupfer The \machine macro:
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{xparse}

\ExplSyntaxOn
\NewDocumentCommand{\machine}{m}
 {
  \patrick_machine:n { #1 }
 }

\seq_new:N \l_patrick_machine_body_seq

\cs_new_protected:Nn \patrick_machine:n
 {
  \seq_set_from_clist:Nn \l_patrick_machine_body_seq { #1 }
  \begin{array}{|c|}
  \hline
  \seq_use:Nn \l_patrick_machine_body_seq { \\ \hline }
  \\ \hline
  \end{array}
}
\ExplSyntaxOff

\begin{document}

$\machine{a_1, a_2, \vdots, a_n} \neq
\machine{a_1, a_2, a_3, a_4, a_5, a_6, \vdots, a_n}$
@ChristianHupfer You can do it also with a clist, but with a sequence it's more efficient.
 
@egreg I know about the \clist and \seq issue, but I think, I could have dropped \prg_replicate due to the special requirements
 
@ChristianHupfer You should drop \prg_replicate:nn ;-)
@ChristianHupfer Please, do change your answer: we want good programming, don't we?
 
@egreg I can remember other occasions with tabular and loops where you frowned on me not having used \prg_replicate:nn
 
@ChristianHupfer \seq_use:Nn delivers the token list it produces in one single chunk, so no worry of ending a cell prematurely.
@ChristianHupfer In case you have to build rows from an array input like {a,b,c;d,e,f;g,h,i} then something else is needed.
But this is a single column
 
@egreg: I posted a shorter version, with \seq_use:Nn
 
Anonymous
9:22 PM
I am thinking about posting 2 new questions, but they are all a bit meta:

- Why don't we get rid of \end{document}? Let just automatically paste it to the bottom of the document, and don't spend time typing it?
- When using `code` on Stackexchange-Tex, why can we not easily paste the code from a code block? A copy button should be added, right?
 
@egreg Yes, at least I had that in mind (although it's too much for this particular problem)
 
@ChristianHupfer To the contrary! Why manually extracting items when you can do it automatically?
 
@egreg I referred to the grouping issue due to tabular cells
 
@ChristianHupfer Ah, OK
 
@egreg In fact I remember that I have used it with \seq_use:Nn already in the past, but I was too blind here
Any Physicist will cry out in despair :D
 
9:42 PM
@ChristianHupfer One of the few physical formulas I remember…
 
@egreg Mixing energy and force /sob
 
@ChristianHupfer Should I use \frac{GmM}{r}, perhaps? :)
 
@egreg From a dimension point of view: Yes
 
@VincentVerheyen there was a question about the document environment just the other day (and a copy code button has been requested often, there are some user scripts that add such a button but the network doesn't seem keen to add it by default
 
@ChristianHupfer Well, I'll leave it as is, so as to show I know almost nothing about physics.
 
9:48 PM
7
Q: Why is the \bye command not used by LaTeX?

A FeldmanIs there a technical reason why the \bye TeX command was replaced in LaTeX by \begin{document} and \end{document}? I suspect there must be a good technical reason behind this, as otherwise it would be just window dressing. I cannot imagine otherwise replacing a 4 character command placed at th...

 
Anonymous
10:14 PM
@DavidCarlisle Thanks David, whatever definitions, I think \end{document} could be made quicker to type.
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen and why in the world?!
 
Anonymous
@yo' Life is short and full of mistakes.
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen yeah, most mistakes come from code with too short identifiers.
 
@VincentVerheyen Somelinke \bd and \ed ? ;-)
 
yo'
@ChristianHupfer Just now, in front of me :)
\newcommand{\be}{\begin{equation}}
\newcommand{\ee}{\end{equation}}
\newcommand{\ben}{\begin{equation*}}
\newcommand{\een}{\end{equation*}}
\newcommand{\ba}{\begin{array}}
\newcommand{\ea}{\end{array}}
 
Anonymous
10:17 PM
@ChristianHupfer Maybe, but I still don't understand why that shouldn't just be added automatically, without any input from the user. Anything without it wouldn't compile, right? So, you always need it.
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen because it would cause syntactic mess.
 
@yo' There should be a \penalty10000000 for this ;-)
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen Well, you can enter the console and add code dynamically. I do that from time to time. There are other reasons. This is for instance the safest way to make sure proper groups and environment nesting is in place
 
@VincentVerheyen Those 'editors' like LyX etc do that for the lazy user
 
Anonymous
@yo' I am too much of a noob for that, but thanks for letting me know. How about (to start):

- \document

And to end:

- \documend
 
yo'
10:19 PM
@VincentVerheyen sorry, what problem exactly are you trying to solve? This discussion is already longer than all \end{document} you'll ever type in your life ;-)
 
Anonymous
I can see \document is not perfect.
 
Anonymous
@yo' Here is some scheme about saving time by looking for more efficient ways (I must say I didn't really interpret it yet) imgs.xkcd.com/comics/is_it_worth_the_time.png
 
Anonymous
The scheme is wrong, as it doesn't show how long you do something per time.
 
@VincentVerheyen There's a reason for the \begin{...} .... \end{...} syntax element called 'environments' in LaTeX: Grouping
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen ok, so unless you write more than 1 document a day, spending more than 2 hours on the issue is pointless.
 
Anonymous
10:22 PM
@ChristianHupfer I can see the reasoning of that. So, how about \begin{doc} \end{doc}
 
yo'
but more importantly, you're solving one problem (code length) and introducing other problems (readability, error proneness, etc. -- remember that reading code and debugging takes a lot of time too)
 
Anonymous
@yo' I have understood that due to your comments. That's a useful addition to the discussion, which I hadn't given enough consideration. Thanks.
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen because you use it once only -- why block a short name for it? Also, is doc clearer to you than document in this context?
 
@VincentVerheyen why?
 
yo'
I mean, when you see \begin{document} SOMETHING \end{document}, you immediately know what's going on, and that's always nice :)
 
Anonymous
10:24 PM
@yo' That's true. But it's like the first thing everybody learns about the language, right? So no need to be SUPER clear about it, I would say.
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle Save time (+ ink when printed), more elegant. Still very understandable.
 
@VincentVerheyen LaTeX was 'invented' to simply the use of TeX, which can be cryptic -- the core of LaTeX's user commands consists of human readable words, easy to understand
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen Note that new users of LaTeX tend to use \be and \ee for \begin{equation} and \end{equation}. The mature users realized that it's not worth it. Similarly, I'd never again declare thm environment; it's always theorem.
 
@VincentVerheyen I can't see what the problem is, why complain about document rather than \documentclass (which is \input) or equation (which is $$) or any other part of the syntax?
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle Well, we have to start somewhere hé ;)
 
10:26 PM
@VincentVerheyen ink? how often do you print a latex source file? I've done it maybe a couple of times in 30 years of latex use.
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen MORE ELEGANT?!?!?!?!?!?!
 
@VincentVerheyen I've never printed LaTeX source so far
 
I don't even print stuff I should. :)
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle I don't know how many thousands of users would have printed documents, but to me it seems like worth it ;)
 
@PauloCereda like your finished thesis for example?
 
10:28 PM
@DavidCarlisle Will that be ever printed? ;-)
 
@DavidCarlisle Oh no, I should run again! :D
 
Anonymous
@yo' yo' It could have also been \begin{LaTeXdocument}, right? But one could argue that the extensive length is not so elegant, as everybody more or less understands (some not very technical, like me) the use of the environment.
 
@egreg Someday next year. :)
 
@PauloCereda It's duckemented you don't do so ;-)
 
@PauloCereda Provided you finish it!
 
10:29 PM
@VincentVerheyen no really it is absolutely a non issue, it's like telling Java programmers they should call variables x rather than someDescriptivecamelCaseName
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen well, "LaTeX" is redundant here, but "begin" and "document" are not.
 
@egreg Aye aye captain!
@egreg: so I heard Juve is interested in Gabriel Jesus.
 
Anonymous
@yo' All I suggested, in the end (after the useful reactions received), was to abbreviate document to something which can only be confused with a doctor.
 
@PauloCereda obviously something you saw while researching for your thesis ?
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen or a ".doc" file or ...
 
10:31 PM
@DavidCarlisle In my defense, I was studying semiotics. :)
 
Anonymous
@yo' :D And {document}, is that some sort of a documentation, or ... ? Then where does the code start? ;D
 
@VincentVerheyen You have a file opened and you don't know what is going on? That's why I have the dream of exploding compilers. :)
 
\dcmtcls{bk}

\uspkg{lngtbl}

\bg{dcmt}
\tblcnts
\chptr{Foo}
\ed{dcmt}
2
 
@PauloCereda you should study "English as used in England" spelling as well:-)
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen no, documentation would be \begin{documentation}. Actually, there is a similar thing: \begin{macro} and \begin{macrocode}
 
10:32 PM
@DavidCarlisle ooh
 
Anonymous
@yo' I think \begin{latex} or \begin{tex) could be better than \begin{document}, as it would learn me whether I'm actually coding in latex, or in tex (which I still don't understand the difference between).
 
yo'
@ChristianHupfer I vote for \b{d} and \e{d} and \toc oh sorry, \toc is too clear
 
The new LaTeX format ;-)
 
@VincentVerheyen \begin{tex} is almost herectic. :)
 
@VincentVerheyen no that would be a misunderstanding, as the distinction has no meaning:-)
 
10:33 PM
@yo' Yes, \toc is way to clear ;-)
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen that's confusing. LaTeX is loaded even before \documentclass
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle So Tex is actually to LaTeX, as doc is to document?
 
@VincentVerheyen I have proposed an alternative, more compact syntax than that usually used in latex, look up xii.tex (on ctan or in texlive etc)
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen which TeX? TeX core or plain TeX?
 
@VincentVerheyen LaTeX defines \documentclass -- it must be there before \documentclass is read ;-)
 
10:34 PM
@VincentVerheyen latex is written in tex
 
Anonymous
@yo' I have no clue, I'm a beginner. I don't know the difference between TeX and LaTeX, nor TeX core and plain TeX.
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen ok, then TeX core is the assembler of the whole world, with plain TeX being the C, LaTeX being Java and ConTeXt being Python :)
 
@PauloCereda Seems like a very interesting player! A good partner for Dybala
 
If you have trouble with the xii syntax @yo' and @PauloCereda would be happy to explain it!
 
@yo': Java? Oh no... C++, but not Java
 
Anonymous
10:36 PM
@yo' I hope to learn more about coding and programming in the remainder of my life, haven't done that yet. ;) One day I will understand.
 
yo'
@DavidCarlisle I've heard you saying @egreg
 
@egreg He would fit perfectly in the team indeed. :)
 
yo'
@ChristianHupfer well, it's buggy, so it's Java :)
 
@PauloCereda In any team, from the video I just saw
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle Who pays for hosting of CTAN?
 
10:36 PM
@egreg :)
 
@yo' I prefer any LaTeX bug over Java ...
 
@egreg latex team?
 
@DavidCarlisle If you need a scorer…
 
yo'
@ChristianHupfer well, I've never coded in Java, I only blame the language for all the bug out there :)
 
Anonymous
Actually, \begin{document} doesn't start a new document right? (as in start a new "file")? Or does it?
 
10:37 PM
C: You shoot yourself in the foot and then nobody else can figure out what you did.
 
@VincentVerheyen tex user groups, (dante mostly I'd guess) for the central core and then sites that run mirrors do it at their cost
 
yo'
@VincentVerheyen it starts a new document as in "collection of pages"
 
C++: You accidentally create a dozen instances of yourself and shoot them all in the foot. Providing emergency medical assistance is impossible since you can't tell which are bitwise copies and which are just pointing at others and saying, "That's me, over there."
 
@yo' What have Java ever done for us... Mozilla Firefox, Thunderbird, Geogebra, LibreOffice ...
 
Java: You write a program to shoot yourself in the foot and put it on the Internet. People all over the world shoot themselves in the foot, and everyone leaves your website hobbling and cursing. You amputate your foot at the ankle with a fourteen-pound hacksaw, but you can do it on any platform.
@ChristianHupfer arara...
 
yo'
10:38 PM
@ChristianHupfer well, as I say, buggy :)
ok guys, gotta go home.
 
@PauloCereda Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo‌​ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo (Really? --- Yes???? → Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo)
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer I imagine your class in the Schwarze Wald is just a projector, where kids can see you typing in this chat? :D just a joke (not meant offensive: I think it could be useful for the kids even). P.S.: Did you see my comment to you about the crazy company which has its head office in Baden Baden, near you? http://vincentverheyen.com/node/4
 
@yo' See ya, Tom! :)
@ChristianHupfer Oh my!
 
yo'
@PauloCereda see you. Btw, I forgot to ask you how's your draft going... :)
 
@yo' Oh the examination was fine, I survived. Now it's time to work on the final version (for the thesis defence). :)
 
10:40 PM
@VincentVerheyen My class has no idea of my Dark Side Alter Ego being here ;-) The Dark Side is strong in me -- it forces (!!!) me to come here ;-)
 
yo'
@PauloCereda :)
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer You must be part of Texaholics Anonymous, I imagine you must have tried to stop frequently. Welcome to the support chat for people with a similar history of disease.
 
@PauloCereda: I've got something for you ;-) You will be pleased ;-)
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle There is no documentation of ctan.org/pkg/xii?lang=en, I am scared to open it as it might be made by an experienced coder (maybe even you! Anybody with such big reputation must certainly become an evil hacker, blinded by power): who knows how malicious it is!
 
I should stop this ;-)
 
10:45 PM
@ChristianHupfer YES
@ChristianHupfer How was I supposed to write about that particular subject? The book is proof of my failure. :D
 
@VincentVerheyen Here it is:
\let~\catcode~`76~`A13~`F1~`j00~`P2jdefA71F~`7113jdefPALLF
PA''FwPA;;FPAZZFLaLPA//71F71iPAHHFLPAzzFenPASSFthP;A$$FevP
A@@FfPARR717273F737271P;ADDFRgniPAWW71FPATTFvePA**FstRsamP
AGGFRruoPAqq71.72.F717271PAYY7172F727171PA??Fi*LmPA&&71jfi
Fjfi71PAVVFjbigskipRPWGAUU71727374 75,76Fjpar71727375Djifx
:76jelse&U76jfiPLAKK7172F71l7271PAXX71FVLnOSeL71SLRyadR@oL
RrhC?yLRurtKFeLPFovPgaTLtReRomL;PABB71 72,73:Fjif.73.jelse
B73:jfiXF71PU71 72,73:PWs;AMM71F71diPAJJFRdriPAQQFRsreLPAI
I71Fo71dPA!!FRgiePBt'el@ lTLqdrYmu.Q.,Ke;vz vzLqpip.Q.,tz;
 
Anonymous
Anbody knows of a PhD thesis on why NOT to write a PhD thesis?
 
@VincentVerheyen It's easy to analyze: no malicious code.
 
@VincentVerheyen you are aware that xii.tex is a joke ? ;-)
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer It's written in my mother tongue, so I can understand it completely.
 
10:48 PM
@PauloCereda You failed for the last time ;-)
 
@ChristianHupfer :)
 
Anonymous
@yo' So, Microsoft shouldn't have chosen .doc (or are abbreviations in file extensions allowed)? Wait: I understand: Word Documents aren't (usually) written in code (by the document creator), right?
 
@VincentVerheyen you can find answers on site explaining the code step by step (although I find it prefectly readable as it is) just typeset it with pdftex xii
 
Welcome to TeX.SX - Chat -- we talk about Cricket, Procrastination, Star Wars, Football, Ducks, Black Forests, Monty Python, Fawlty Towers and only on special holidays about TeX ;-)
 
QUAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACK
I did that to restore balance. :)
 
10:51 PM
@ChristianHupfer queen's birthday even if it isn't a holiday must be OK to use xii (perhaps I should code "happy birthday to you" in the same style....
 
@DavidCarlisle qii.tex :)
 
@DavidCarlisle Of course ...
@PauloCereda :D :D
 
@PauloCereda xc.tex perhaps in honour of her age
 
@DavidCarlisle ooh :)
 
Anonymous
Could somebody have a look at tex.stackexchange.com/a/305372/67761, I think the \columnbreak is not working as usually in Multicols, in the provided answer.
 
Anonymous
10:54 PM
In the comments, I wrote:

But that \columnbreak isn't working as expected. Whatever is inside the TwoColumnBox, before the \columnbreak, already gets spread across the 2 columns, instead of keeping in the left side of the TwoColumnBox.
 
@JosephWright see discussion on texlive list re @egreg's charclass package thing....
 
@VincentVerheyen tcolorbox with multicols inside is no good idea
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer It seems like it, but I need to use a tcolorbox. Then, what could I use for 2 column (side-by-side lines, per line) passages inside them?
 
@VincentVerheyen: Like in a translation, say, of a song?
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer For example, or to preserve the lay-out of a poem, or in a (what's it called: like, when you re-create an old document digitally, in exactly the same lay-out -> my brain forgot now)?
 
10:59 PM
@VincentVerheyen: A facsimile?
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer Thanks!
 
@VincentVerheyen It's quite possible the tcolorbox documentation has an example of a two column text...
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer I was thinking maybe to put each line-by-line line inside a seperate multicol, and then maybe regulate the width of all the columns of the multicol?
 
Anonymous
@PauloCereda Is it line-by-line? Or is it just a continuous passage, continued on the next column?
 
Anonymous
Off-topic. Anybody present in the chat has ever heard of the country where I have been living for the past 6 months? S o l o m o n _ I s l a n d s?
 
11:07 PM
@VincentVerheyen sorry I couldn't really see what you were trying to do from the question.
 
@VincentVerheyen I just mentioned the documentation might have something along these lines, I don't know how it works...
 
Anonymous
@PauloCereda Thanks, I'll take a look.
 
@VincentVerheyen My pleasure. :)
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle In the MWE, please have a look at page 3: that's what I mean with line-by-line (in 2 columns). The problems are 2-fold. 1) It overflows the tcolorbox 2) the multicol also doesn't start after the 2 lines on the previous page, but is sent to the page below.
 
@VincentVerheyen but your question doesn't say what you are trying to achieve, perhaps the answer doesn't involve tcolorbox or multicol, but hard to say as you just ask about some detail of them not working together rather than asking for some document layout
 
Anonymous
11:12 PM
@DavidCarlisle Ok, sorry. I need the tcolorbox, as I used that to create quote-environment and figure's- environment (like here tex.stackexchange.com/questions/305462/…) As for the line-by-line 2 column lay-out, it doesn't matter which package would be used. I was perhaps not clear on what I wanted to achieve, as I had thought I had found a bug of compatibility ...
 
@PauloCereda I don't think so, unfortunately
 
@VincentVerheyen multicol is all about automatic column balancing it doesn't sound like the thing you want at all if you are trying to force two parallel texts
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle I do it with a lot of \\s, do you see in the example? It does what I want outside of Tcolorboxes ... But, I acknowledge your expertise. What other package would you suggest?
 
@VincentVerheyen the \\ at the end of the paragraph are bad of course and generate underfull hbox warnings) It looks like you just want two parboxes, or a two column table
@VincentVerheyen but John's answer uses free text (lipsum) balanced by multicol so is a completely different situation (which comes back to your question being unclear)
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle Thank's for that, as I don't know how to explain to him why I think the \columnbreak isn't working as I had intended in OP's MWE.
 
11:21 PM
\documentclass{article}

\usepackage{paracol}
\usepackage[a4paper, total={7in, 2in}]{geometry}
\usepackage[most]{tcolorbox}

\begin{document}

\begin{paracol}{2}
\begin{leftcolumn}
\begin{tcolorbox}[breakable]
First line (inside multicol)\par
Second line (inside multicol)\par
Third line (inside multicol)\par
Fourth line (inside multicol)\par
Fifth line (inside multicol)\par
Sixth line (inside multicol)\par
Seventh line (inside multicol)\par
Eighth line (inside multicol)\par
Tenth line (inside multicol)\par
@VincentVerheyen: Try this please
@Kurt: Soon you will be a 20k user -- I can finally trust you then ;-)
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer @ChristianHupfer Can't compile it. It sais: \relax l.2097 ...expand\tcbuselibrary{\tcb@optionlist}}\x.
 
@VincentVerheyen Hm, works for me out of the box
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer Sorry, found it. Had an updated tcolorbox.sty in the folder.
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer Is it possible to make 1 tcolorbox span across both columns instead? The tcolorbox will be an environment which I will use to indicate that the passage is quoted.
 
@VincentVerheyen Not without screwing up tcolorbox code, I think. In the end we'll at the start again: You want it vice versa
 
Anonymous
11:30 PM
@ChristianHupfer I am looking for this (not compiled, Photoshopped from yours):
 
Anonymous
 
@VincentVerheyen Nine simple rules: 1st one: Don't use PhotoShop on my output screen shots ;-)
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer Take me to court. Even my Photoshop is c r a c k e d! ;)
 
@VincentVerheyen: I've got an idea ...
@VincentVerheyen I don't use even Windows :-P
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer That is an idea indeed. ;)
 
11:35 PM
@VincentVerheyen: Must the box have rounded edges?, is white background ok?
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer Oops, wait a little bit ... Sorry
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer In the end, it seems like I want to use mdframed instead of tcolorbox, like in OP tex.stackexchange.com/questions/305462/…, so we can just jointly think on how to come up with a useful solution. I don't have special requirements. But, I think that it would be good if the top part of the tcolorbox could have rounded edges, whereas the middle not, and the bottom rounded again.
 
@VincentVerheyen I don't think that it will be easier with mdframed
 
Anonymous
Such is also the case in OP tex.stackexchange.com/questions/305462/…. (round on top and bottom).
 
\documentclass{article}

\usepackage{multicol}
\usepackage[a4paper, total={7in, 2in}]{geometry}
\usepackage[breakable]{tcolorbox}
\newcommand\tbox[1]{\begin{tcolorbox}[breakable]#1\end{tcolorbox}}
\newcommand\x[2]{%
\noindent\makebox[.5\textwidth][l]{#1}%
\makebox[.5\textwidth][l]{#2}%
}
\begin{document}

\tbox{

\x{%
First line (inside multicol)}{%
Next to first line (inside multicol)}

\x{%
Second line (inside multicol)}{%
Next to second line (inside multicol)}

\x{%
Third line (inside multicol)}{%
@VincentVerheyen ^^
 
11:40 PM
@VincentVerheyen: Also, check the parallel package.
 
@ChristianHupfer :-) Last time I often answered question of users not returning ... Bad luck ...
 
Anonymous
@DavidCarlisle Wow, that's very impressive, very elegant code. Please answer in tex.stackexchange.com/questions/304722/… and I will accept.
 
@Kurt We've got more and more of such users, in my impression
@DavidCarlisle That's a dirty trick ;-)
 
@ChristianHupfer Yes, I think so too.
 
Anonymous
Pff .. my neighbour burning the plastic from his shop again, in open air, in my courtyard ... Third- / second-world problems.
 
Anonymous
11:49 PM
@DavidCarlisle @DavidCarlisle Can you make the top of the tcolorbox rounded, as well as its bottom; but not the middle segments? in tex.stackexchange.com/a/305661/67761?
 
@ChristianHupfer Saw you the answer to this question? tex.stackexchange.com/questions/238016/… I commented, I think the answerer did not understand what I ment ...
 
@Kurt Seems so -- 'lernresistent' ;-)
@Kurt Shall we flag?
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer No, Please don't flag that.
 
@VincentVerheyen I've got fun with flags ;-)
Oh my, it's late ... I must sleep
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer Ok, well, I can't really advice, just my first intuition. Please sleep enough, I care about your (and everybody's) health!
 
11:57 PM
@VincentVerheyen I only flag if I have a clear impression that the post isn't kosher -- I know nothing about Pylatex, so won't take any action
 
Anonymous
@ChristianHupfer Yes, you should only flag if the post is either 'meshugga' or 'treif'.
 
@VincentVerheyen Speaking of which: There's this post about multicols inside tcolorbox :-P
Have a nice time
 

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