The Whiteboard

rolfl

12:02 AM

Aug 6 '13 at 22:53, by Stack Exchange

World Engineer has unfrozen this room.

Simon André Forsberg

there we go

rolfl

It was an experiment ... ;-)

Simon André Forsberg

@maple_shaft Any decision on narrowing the search/spam and stuff? I've been watching the meta question and I see some nice suggestions there

Duga

Your question seems overly broad, and as far as asking for recommendation of software packages / libraries / surveys is concerned, is considered off-topic here. After consulting the help center for Programmers SE it seems your question would also be off-topic there, so I have no recommendation as to where to ask. — njuffa 1 min ago

Simon André Forsberg

Hmm... perhaps I should make @Duga search for comments involving "off-topic" and post them somewhere *evil laugh*

user55340

1:13 AM

user55340

Interesting

user41796

1:26 AM

@rolfl No, I hope that one day we can beat down the hordes from SO who use Progs as a toilet bowl. Okay, we'll still be talking about booze at that point, but Duga's usefulness will be done then.

user41796

@SimonAndréForsberg Some of those might be useful, yes. The false positive rate isn't high enough to be annoying (yet).

user41796

@Ampt is there any easy way to resolve plugin permissions issues except to back them out one by one until the problem is fixed? Spigot on 1.8 doesn't play nicely with the full multiverse set. :-(

user41796

2:03 AM

Burn please:

user41796

-3

Q: code a feedback loop for reverse architecture

feedback loop how to code one so I don't have to troll this space manually. can robots make mistakes...if not what is the point letting them solve mathematical calculations in first place.

maple_shaft

2:25 AM

@SimonAndréForsberg Hi, I like the ideas in the one answer that was posted on our meta. I think that will help reduce some of the clutter.

That should be pretty easy to code but again I hate to bother you with this unless you are looking for something to code

As far as the posting to a special chat room... I think that we should wait to see if this comes for a vote on our meta. I will let you know about that

@GlenH7 sigh

He is using Tor yes

and it looks like a botnet too

based on the email address

tricky bastard

I will ask the cm's to look into it

@GlenH7 Well he is probably just bored then. THe best way to deal with trolls like this is to just ignore them. They thrive on attention

user55340

@enderland is it possible to tweak this into a worthy Workplace.SE question?

user55340

-1

Q: I got fired 3 weeks after suggesting "Death March" by Yourdon to my Project Manager

As the title says I got fired around 3 weeks after suggesting "Death March" by Edward Yourdon to my project manager. I also voiced my opinion on how he (the pm) handled the project and was single-handedly the reason why a project failed. Was I completely wrong? Or can I sue for wrongful termin...

project-management work-environment law

maple_shaft

not much else we can do anyway if he is using Tor then he is effectively untraceable

user41796

@maple_shaft Possibly. But if you look at the question I linked, it may be "personal" at this point.

user55340

@maple_shaft Wikipedia tends to block the tor exit nodes. Those are public...

maple_shaft

2:37 AM

@MichaelT I don't like the idea of blocking all Tor

many people use it for legitimate privacy reasons

user55340

Wikipedia talk:Blocking policy/Tor nodes

== Tor nodes == I currently have a list of Tor exit nodes, amassing about 24 pages in Microsoft Word at the moment. I am prepared to parse through this list and use a script to hardblock these IPs such that the TOR nodes will be rendered useless on the English Wikipedia. Should I proceed, and if so, how long should the blocks be?—Ryūlóng (竜龍) 02:49, 8 January 2008 (UTC) How complicated would it be to check back, and see if the IPs are still Tor exit nodes? <eleland/talkedits> 02:50, 8 January 2008 (UTC) I don't know. Presumably, once the blocks are in fact done, a review of my block log of the IPs...

enderland

@MichaelT thinking no, it looks like a rant

or a "tell me I'm awesome/wonderful"

user41796

@MichaelT it's just a rant

user55340

@enderland Just making sure.

maple_shaft

> User: feedbackloop (--) (Account.Id=--) deleted by Shog9 (63)
Reason: This user was created to post spam or nonsense and has no other positive participation
Detail: This user shocks the conscience

enderland

2:38 AM

nothing there is relevant basically

maple_shaft

LOL

user41796

:-)

user55340

And for the record... I got Death March for my manager, director, diagonal director and CIO... several months before I decided to leave Employer^^.

user41796

@Pyraminx Didn't you claim you needed to go? :-P

maple_shaft

oops

Pyraminx

2:39 AM

from that site

lolol

fine I lied

maple_shaft

> shocks the conscience

user41796

@MichaelT It's a good book, no doubt. Delivery of the message is important too

user55340

Manager and director thought so too...

user55340

incidently, the director was demoted to manager (and eventually left). The diagonal director that didn't understand it was put in his place.

Pyraminx

I don't know why, but I always come into chat rooms in the middle of a complicated discussion

user41796

2:41 AM

@Pyraminx psssh, this is nada

user41796

Survey: Scotch or Tequila for the final round tonight?

user55340

the ginger beer was ok... not great. Interesting, but... then I'm not a big ginger beer fan.

user55340

Was more after a "this is a new flavor"

user55340

next time, I'll probably go for the lambic.

user41796

The voting is tied at 1:1 (Thomas's default and Yannis' default)

Pyraminx

2:42 AM

What are you talking about

user55340

Lambic

Lambic is a type of beer traditionally brewed in the Pajottenland region of Belgium (southwest of Brussels) and in Brussels itself at the Cantillon Brewery and museum. Lambic is now mainly consumed after refermentation, resulting in derived beers such as Gueuze or Kriek lambic. Unlike conventional beers, which are fermented by carefully cultivated strains of brewer's yeasts, lambic is produced by spontaneous fermentation: it is exposed to the wild yeasts and bacteria that are said to be native to the Zenne valley, in which Brussels lies. It is this unusual process which gives the beer its distinctive...

user55340

Hmm... peach lambic bottle from Lindemans is not safe for work.

Pyraminx

Oh...

user41796

@MichaelT I was at the store with the new Lindeman's bottle and I forgot to look up what the new one is. Sorry about that.

maple_shaft

Bleh... I hate lambics

just drink a damn wine

lol

user55340

2:43 AM

@GlenH7 Search google for Pêcheresse

user55340

@maple_shaft I enjoy a good wine too... especially country wines.

user55340

Pyraminx

It's funny how the logo for programmers is a coffee mug and we're talking about alcoholic drinks

user55340

For any philosophers that wish to groan.

user55340

@Pyraminx Look at the room tags...

user41796

2:45 AM

I think this is the new one I saw: merchantduvin.com/brew-lindemans-kriek-lambic.php

user55340

Need that jinx bot.

user41796

No kidding

maple_shaft

Coffee fuels our programming, alcohol fuels our downtime

user55340

user41796

s/coffee/alcohol; s/programming/best programming;

maple_shaft

2:46 AM

damn

beat me to it!

user15026

@MichaelT Yes, lambics are wonderful I vote that.

user15026

I wish I could get more lambics locally

Pyraminx

@MichaelT Lol saw that one

user55340

There was a study recently that validated it...

user15026

@MichaelT I like their raspberry one best.

user55340

2:47 AM

cbsnews.com/news/…

user55340

64

Q: Is the Ballmer Peak real?

There is a myth saying that having a BAC in the 0.129% - 0.138% range can improve your cognitive abilities. This effect is called the Ballmer Peak (a reference to Steve Ballmer, CEO of Microsoft) and is pictured nicely in this xkcd. Is there any truth in this myth?

alcohol cognitive-fitness

maple_shaft

When I was in college I never verified the Ballmers peak but I definitely verified the Pot peak

user41796

@maple_shaft Never heard of that distillery. ;-) Must be a local variant?

maple_shaft

Half a joint actually calmed my nerves enough to pass advanced object oriented with C++ without any of the prereqs

and be recommended as a tutor for the next year

user55340

Heh: ballmerpeak.com

maple_shaft

2:49 AM

a whole joint made me sleepy and I made stupid mistakes

its a balancing act. Sacrificing a little intelligence for a lot less anxiety

helped me focus and drown out distractions too

then I grew up

Duga

@Andrew Thompson: sorry i answered MadProgrammers comment about static.. please see my updated code. MadProgrammer i have a few static methods and variables, which one do you mean exactly? — muni 1 min ago

maple_shaft

Oh Duga

user55340

Guy in knew in college... he was a bit harder than just herbal (might have been fungal or chemical)... did some rather funky cellular automata visualizations.

maple_shaft

you so dumb

user15026

@maple_shaft yeah, there's always that line between "I am calmer and less anxious" and "suddenly you are making the PERFECT pancakes in fancy shapes because you are now paranoid and hungry"

user55340

2:52 AM

I need to name myself Programmer on SO and comment all over the place!

rolfl

It really does need to match on \bprogrammers\b case insensitive ... that's a good start.

maple_shaft

@AshleyNunn never had the paranoia side effect. And I am always hungry so I never noticed being any more or less so

but food tasted more awesome

and music was sublime

user15026

@maple_shaft I only ever had it once.

maple_shaft

@AshleyNunn Meh... it was a bad habit

user55340

@maple_shaft amazon.com/Sen-Yuh-Farm-Science-Co/dp/B001JH93BU

user55340

2:54 AM

Sublime (band)

Sublime was an American ska punk and alternative rock band from Long Beach, California, formed in 1988. The band's line-up, unchanged until their breakup, consisted of Bradley Nowell (vocals and guitar), Eric Wilson (bass) and Bud Gaugh (drums). Lou Dog, Nowell's dalmatian was the mascot of the band. Michael 'Miguel' Happoldt and Marshall Goodman "Ras MG" contributed to and co-wrote several Sublime songs. Nowell died of a heroin overdose in 1996. In 1997, posthumous songs such as "Santeria", "Wrong Way", "Doin' Time", and "April 29, 1992 (Miami)" were released to U.S. radio. Sublime released three...

rolfl

Meh, I was in a serious bus crash in Paris. 2-weeks later, in Lucene, I got talked in to a 'joint'. I don't know if it ever affected me at all. I certainly don't recall a 'high'. But, as a consequence, i can honestly claim to have smoked more 'doobie' than tobacco.

user15026

@maple_shaft Yeah, I don't really miss it myself

maple_shaft

The f--- is a Miracle Fruit tablet?

user15026

@MichaelT I have always wanted to try these

user55340

thinkgeek.com/product/ab3f

user55340

2:55 AM

>
Miracle Fruits (sometimes called Miracle Berries) have been a secret wonder of the world for centuries. Though they were first documented by a French dude in 1725, they'd been consumed for many generations prior. They were eaten before meals to make the meals taste better. "How?" you ask. By making sour and bitter foods taste sweet. "But how?" you scream. The truth is, science doesn't completely know (it has something to do with the protein miraculin that bonds to your taste buds). Science Update! Scientists are getting closer to knowing exactly what miraculin does. It bonds to your sweet…

user55340

click here for science

maple_shaft

That reminds me of this old 4chan pasta

user55340

That looks more like pasta.

maple_shaft

Activated almonds

> cultured vegetables

user15026

2:59 AM

I like that it took me a moment to think about the wtf-ery because like...thats how weight watcher stuff talks

user15026

like it is all a fuckload of meaningless words attached to food names

rolfl

No, I tried WW, it's not meaningless words, it's meaninless numbers.... points

user55340

Do you get +5 rep for upvoting breakfast?

rolfl

Pleased to say, I lost 20% of my body weight through other more sensible means.

user15026

@rolfl oh god, did you ever try figuring out like the points for your own recipes? its MADDENING. I gave up because it was too much nitpicking crap

maple_shaft

3:02 AM

No activated almonds... enjoy your nogainz

rolfl

^^^ that, except my wife did most of the calculations...

maple_shaft

just give up.

user15026

@rolfl I used all of their tool things and it still made no sense

user15026

I have lost more weight on my own than I ever did with their stuff

rolfl

Their stuff is caalorie-reduced, but extra processing and other crap.

user15026

3:03 AM

@rolfl yeah, it doesn't taste good when you are used to making all your own food

user15026

(it really doesnt allow for that unless you follow their recipes exactly)

rolfl

Did not mean to divert the conversation, but, yeah, most diets are like that

trick is to not get fat ;-)

user55340

@rolfl its after hours... all conversations are diverted.

user55340

I'm playing with radical compression... or a disproof of it.

rolfl

Technically, I am still obese, but now I am only normal on a North-American scale... ;-)

I fit in a large Tshirt, sometimes a medium... yet I am 210lb.

user15026

3:05 AM

@rolfl Oh, I am...bigger than you :P

rolfl

what does that say about people in North America?

A year ago I was 260 ;-)

user15026

@rolfl I was 300 at my heaviest, am 275 or so now, and am going to keep going on it as best I can

user55340

( penduin.blogspot.com/2006/10/pi-compression.html - though I'm going to play with 2^.5)

user15026

I am not ashamed of my size. It is what it is :)

rolfl

For me it was the medications....

HIgh blood pressure, and thyroid.

Still take thyroid, but no longer need the hypertension meds.

user15026

3:07 AM

@MichaelT This is fascinating as heck

user15026

And I like that I understand a lot of it

user15026

@rolfl I am lucky, I am relatively healthy

user15026

more of my issues are from being born 3 months premature than they are from my weight :P

user55340

Even got the arbitrary sized sqrt(2) in binary calculator code...

user55340

44

A: Can you use Pi as a crude random number generator?

Digging from http://www.befria.nu/elias/pi/binpi.html to get the binary value of pi (so that it was easier to convert into bytes rather than trying to use decimal digits) and then running it through ent I get the following for an analysis of the random distribution of the bytes: Entropy = 7.9...

user55340

3:08 AM

mathworld.wolfram.com/WolframsIteration.html

user55340

rolfl

@AshleyNunn - my real issue is my age ;-)

the far side of 40 .... :(

user55340

Meh, that bit doesn't copy as well.

user15026

@rolfl Ah, I am 27, so I suspect that helps some

maple_shaft

3:26 AM

@AshleyNunn My wife used to be about 270 at her heaviest. We met when we were freshmen in college

Duga

@Trilarion I cannot believe they made an entire site for that topic. Looks like programmers.stackexchange.com threw them out of the door as well. — ivan_pozdeev 1 min ago

maple_shaft

She started watching her calories and exercising, stayed almost completely away from sugar and high fat foods. In just 1.5 years she went down to 160

Another year and she went down to 140

you can do it too

rolfl

Back. Don't do it... I have had to replace 2.5 wardrobes.... 1.5 new summer wardrobes, and a winter one....

though I am still using my really really good winter coat even though it is 2 sizes too big.

I have even gone down about a size in my shoes.

I used to wear 10.5 / 11 shoes depending, now I wear 10's

Duga

3:47 AM

Appears to belong at programmers.stackexchange.com since it's about software design. — ivan_pozdeev 1 min ago

user15026

Thanks guys, that helps me feel better. I am working on this - I know it is going to take a while. The encouragement is much appreciated

maple_shaft

@AshleyNunn yeah just try to stay disciplined, keep yourself busy and occupied with things. Boredom is the mind killer

Duga

@ivan_pozdeev I am not sure I agree. This question really is too much about code and implementation to be a good fit at Programmers. — maple_shaft 1 min ago

maple_shaft

drink lots of water... limit yourself to a single sweet a day. Eat fruit if you must have sugar.

Also another thing that helped her is that she would purposely stop herself from eating her whole meal. If we went to a restaurant, when she got the entree she would eat half or less, take the rest home for dinner tomorrow. Sometimes we focus so much on sugar that we forget we are still eating after we are already full. Listen to your bodies signals.

you will feel hungry from time to time but try to stop eating 4 hours before bed. Feel hungry at night, embrace that feeling and it will encourage you to go to bed earlier and get more and better sleep

better sleep helps you lose weight too

speaking of sleep

time to turn in

Simon André Forsberg

11:26 AM

@maple_shaft If I get a clear instruction on how you folks want to change @Duga, implementing it should not be much of a problem

maple_shaft

1:27 PM

Shameless self bump!

1

Q: Functional Requirements, Non-behavioral specifications, Acceptance Criteria and the gap

I am struggling in my brain about what the right answer is here and where the gap in our requirements gathering process is on this team. Non-technical BA - their role is to write Business and User requirements in the form of User Stories. When there is a compelling business reason for defining...

user-story business-analysis functional-requirements

Duga

1:51 PM

this question fits better at programmers.SE — DrKoch 1 min ago

user55340

2:37 PM

It's Friday for me.

user55340

2:57 PM

-6

Q: Upvotes and downvotes should be disabled completely

There are many discussions regarding the intricacies of the upvoting and downvoting process. To put an end to such discussions and concentrate more on the actual questions I propose to disable up- and downvoting completely.

discussion

Duga

3:17 PM

I was just trying to explain this more clearly? Is it not clear? Your response is pretty rude and unhelpful. I thought this site was for programmers to help each other ? Am I wrong? — Lateralus 18 secs ago

Duga

3:47 PM

Maybe ask this in programmers.stackexchange.com? — Christian 59 secs ago

This is not appropriate for programmers.stackexchange as is — enderland 18 secs ago

enderland

oh boy. got the "what happens if you are still doing rotations and don't find a perm position" question in my 1/1 today

user41796

4:13 PM

@enderland As in you got to ask them about that? :-)

enderland

@GlenH7 I'm going to have quite some interesting conversations the next week

user41796

Sometimes we gotta stir the pot....

Duga

I agree Pattern matching is an important concept in Scala. I am just talking about mixing of multiple concepts making the code elegant, idiomatic but cryptic to new programmers. — Sarvesh Kumar Singh 29 secs ago

user55340

I could mention various state agencies that need programmers...

user55340

And I'm not annoyed by @Duga false positives. They are often interesting.

enderland

4:19 PM

@MichaelT the wife and I do want to live by lakes :P

user55340

I drive by two lakes on the way in.

enderland

We just can't relocate till end of this year when she's done with school

user41796

Trying to hunt down 12-13 year old emails is.... a challenge

enderland

makes all this so dang hard :(

user55340

I even know the meaning of isthmus

enderland

4:23 PM

:)

user55340

Jimmy Hoffa

@maple_shaft apples when you're trying to cut out sugar are the best. Go two weeks with no sweets and an apple suddenly tastes sweeter than oreos

enderland

@MichaelT yeah... who knows, maybe I will after 2015 :)

Madison IS pretty

user55340

Epic isn't bad if you are young enough and know what you are getting into - and that you may need to get out at some point.

enderland

Probably be a nice pay boost too...

user55340

4:32 PM

State is great if you want benefits.

enderland

Yeah, I imagine so

Realistically I like my current place, if they offered me FT I'd jump on it really quickly (most likely)

Jimmy Hoffa

@MichaelT Epic?

@enderland Do they know that?

user41796

@JimmyHoffa Consultancy up his way

Jimmy Hoffa

eesh

enderland

@JimmyHoffa yes absolutely

@GlenH7 they aren't really consultancy afaik, they are just a health services company doing software for electronic records/etc

Jimmy Hoffa

4:36 PM

@enderland Then treat it like a courtship, you have to woo them. Try sending them flowers every week and the occasional cellist to sing of the adventures the 2 of you will share if they hire you.

user41796

So my first mis-characterization was better then

Jimmy Hoffa

@enderland professional services then? Close enough to consultancy.

enderland

Who knows

Jimmy Hoffa

@enderland when it get's near time for your rotation to roll up, just start sending growlers to your boss, keep him nice and drunk and he'll be in no mood to not hire you full time

enderland

@JimmyHoffa it's near time, now :\

Duga

4:49 PM

Likely your example is for a different version of the tool or not compatible with the part you have chosen so you may want to contact the vendor for upgrades; of course if the idea itself is practical you can always rework things by hand using information from the data sheet/programmers manual, perhaps to modify an nrf51822 configuration. — Chris Stratton 31 secs ago

Jimmy Hoffa

4:59 PM

@enderland my advice to you: Make it rain.

enderland

lol

psr

@JimmyHoffa I hear this MUMPS thing really has legs.

(Epic is basically in the business of selling a giant EMR system that Kaiser has spent 9 figures of $ on. It's pretty much MUMPS and VB6.)

Robert Harvey

5:15 PM

VB6. Now there's a cutting-edge language I can get behind.

whatsisname

ugh VB6

it's amazing that companies are writing new applications in VB6 still

ratchet freak

I'm fairly certain people are still making spreadsheets for their computing needs

whatsisname

@enderland: Minnesota > Wisconsin

enderland

@whatsisname oh yeah. our honeymoon was to the north shore and there were quite a few billboard ads looking to hire people (wtf - has this always been a thing?)

I really just wish my company would have layoffs or something with severance pay. is that bad. lol

Ilya_Gazman

5:34 PM

Hello

whatsisname

where are you now

Ilya_Gazman

Is it ok to ask questions here?

user41796

@ratchetfreak don't get me started.

whatsisname

ah

user55340

@whatsisname packers >> vikings

user41796

5:35 PM

@Ilya_Gazman yes, just ask. Don't need to ask if you can ask. :-)

whatsisname

well the twin cities has lots of stuff

Ilya_Gazman

1

Q: Find sequences in a big data set of integers

I am working on algorithm for solving the integer factorization problem. My goal is to be able to recognize sequence in a big data set of integers. This is my premise, it based on experiments. The sum of integers in range of n to n+k will be bigger than n to n+k-j, where k,j are positive inte...

algorithms genetic-algorithms

@GlenH7 some how, it did not get enough views to craft an answer, I hope you can help me with it

whatsisname

@MichaelT: because a sportsball team has such a consequential influence on people's live

user55340

Either twin cities, Madison or Milwaukee.

whatsisname

good reason to move to a particular state

enderland

5:37 PM

@MichaelT +1000000

user41796

@Ilya_Gazman You asked only 2 hours ago. Programmers is much different than SO. It can take a day or two before a solid answer comes in. I'd recommend being patient. It looks to be a reasonable enough question.

Ilya_Gazman

@GlenH7 Thank you! I will wait.

user55340

6

Q: We need more close votes!

I run out of close votes a lot. In fact, in almost any given day in which I actively participate, I use up all of my close votes! And I am really, in the grand scheme of things, not a very active user on this site. Here is a graph of the number of unclosed questions with close votes per month: ...

discussion feature-request vote-to-close

user55340

@GlenH7 I mentioned your meta post there.

user41796

And Shog still hasn't rolled out the promised changes to the close queues... :-(

Jimmy Hoffa

5:44 PM

@JimmyHoffa Not according to the authors of The Pragmatic Programmer: "Most people take DRY to mean you shouldn't duplicate code. That's not its intention. The idea behind DRY is far grander than that. DRY says that every piece of system knowledge should have one authoritative, unambiguous representation. (...) A system's knowledge is far broader than just its code. It refers to database schemas, test plans, the build system, even documentation." Note that my web browser isn't part of SE's system. — Doval 33 mins ago

@Doval that's interesting and new to me, also I couldn't disagree more with it. That's either poorly explained or totally irrational because everyone has data duplicated, the only thing you can not duplicate is the code that accesses the data, but data must be duplicated both for redundancy and communication. The idea of not having data in multiple places makes no sense at all. As soon as you read a piece of data you've duplicated it into wherever you read it to. — Jimmy Hoffa 8 mins ago

Single source of truth is something I'm familiar with but it means something different than don't duplicate - single source of truth means all replicas come from the same source. Mixing that concept into something named don't repeat yourself is totally confusing as it sounds like you should have a single source of truth and you should never replicate it anywhere- which makes zero sense. — Jimmy Hoffa 6 mins ago

Yes I do realize arguing with The Pragmatic Programmer is like calling Turing an idiot. In this instance though I can't say that makes the slightest bit of sense to me. The presumption being then I'm the idiot for this, but really...don't replicate your single source of truth? What??

Can someone explain to me how that meaning of DRY makes any sense at all??

user41796

@JimmyHoffa I usually wrap that under the banner of "referential integrity" as opposed to DRY. But they are related to a degree, I suppose

Jimmy Hoffa

@GlenH7 I completely understand that stuff - I'm referring to the quote from the pragmatic programmer above

That quote has me at a loss for how such a well respected piece of literature could make a statement like that which in my only understanding - seems like unbelievably terrible advice or rather, irrational advice

So my assumption is I'm not understanding it? Care to explain it anyone?

user41796

@JimmyHoffa I'm thinking through rationally what's trying to be expressed there

user41796

And can we get a few more downvotes on that non-answer so we can delete it off?

user41796

6:02 PM

@JimmyHoffa I think the challenge is that you're looking at the quote from the perspective of setting up multiple environments (dev, test, prod, whatever). But I think the quote is getting at how you setup those environments

user41796

For example, if you had an identical schema for the three environments then you would want 1 setup script. You wouldn't make 3 copies of the setup script just because there were 3 environments. Doing so would increase your maintenance work when the schema changes

user41796

But you would most certainly have 3 copies of the data across those 3 environments

Duga

Lutz, I believe it is, I am asking fellow Python Programmers if there is a script where my program will change into a bootstrap?... — jamiecalver 53 secs ago

Jimmy Hoffa

@GlenH7 So you're syaing you wouldn't duplicate the code in the script, just the data. They are all expressing it has nothing to do with duplicating code ... I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THEM.

user41796

Yeah, I'm not going to engage in that particular comment thread. A few more VTDs on the answer and the problem would be solved. :-)

Jimmy Hoffa

6:08 PM

I give up. I'm sticking with my understanding, it makes sense, I know it's a good practice to not duplicate code and to maintain a single source of truth, and any attempts at combining these entirely orthogonal concepts apparently makes sense to other people, but it may result in some 3rd rational good principle to follow but I'm just not getting it and not going to get it.

I guess it relies on some 3rd utterly fungible concept called "System Knowledge" which people probably bandy about to mean any damn thing they want, or if they don't knwo what they're talking about, nothing at all.

user41796

Drop a monad on them and be done with it. :-)

Jimmy Hoffa

hahaha

software transactional memory anyone? Nobody?

user41796

When in rome... :-)

enderland

wear clothes?

hehe I see that my pension appears to be vested (three months earlier than I thought it should) which might be useful in the next few months....

user41796

@enderland some plans use a "need to work 1000 hours within the year" to count as a year of qualifying service

enderland

6:17 PM

@GlenH7 yeah ours is 500 - so a bunch of internships i did count (for everything, pension years, 401k vesting, vaca, etc)

user41796

So you can actually vest earlier than what the "year" range would imply

enderland

yeah

but I'm still - afaik - 3 months short?

user41796

Most companies always have a review clause to where they can claw things back, so I'd check with HR to be sure

enderland

that only matters if I quit or get fired in the next 3 months though

user41796

true

psr

6:30 PM

@JimmyHoffa I doubt it was intended as literally never duplicating data. I think it means avoiding redundancy in things other than code - like don't have a Word doc, a PDF doc, and an HTML doc about the same thing, and then keep the docs in synch manually. Don't have 6 overlapping requirements docs. Don't cut and paste test scripts. It's pretty vague though. A little silly in regard to data, since normalization is a very similar concept and this doesn't add much.

Jimmy Hoffa

@psr yeah, but bundling that concept under DRY is...weird... because DRY in terms of code is very literal, but in the sense of other things you're saying it's only sort of applicable...

The whole idea of a principle is that it's....principled. It isn't a sort of rule, it's not a "guideline"...

They shouldn't be open for interpretation

whatever. I'm grumbly. Almost time for free lunch though

Duga

6:57 PM

So, if we're on the Team page, should the parent <li> have a colour added, or a class-name? Don't give us 'options,' explain what you want/need. And please, please, show us your best efforts or evidence that you know what you're talking about: this is a site for professional and enthusiast programmers, not a free code-writing service. — David Thomas 29 secs ago

masfenix

Hi, guys first time in chat for this SE. I have a question that I'd like to post here but not sure if it fits here, can I ask you guys to see if it fits here or not?

enderland

sure

masfenix

okay, so I have an idea that i'd like to work on. I'd like to know what technologies exist out there for me to make this happen (I am a programmer, but I usually do matlab/R for my research in mathematics, last time I played with .net was the 2.0 days).

The idea is that I'd like to setup a calendar.. in which multiple people can add entries. Up to 50 - 60 entries per day.

user41796

@masfenix language recommendation questions don't work on the main site, but someone here in chat may be willing to offer up an opinion

masfenix

People/public should be able to subscribe to this calendar (on their tablets, phones, email software) BUT still be able filter some of the entries out.

@GlenH7 sorry, I was still typing.. the language is not the problem. I'll choose the right tool and learn that, but I am just looking for protocols or technologies that exist out there, or even how to begin.

user55340

7:00 PM

Tangent tech - .ics

masfenix

Tangent tech?

user55340

ICalendar

Not to be confused with the Calendar application (previously named iCal). iCalendar is a computer file format which allows Internet users to send meeting requests and tasks to other Internet users, via email, or sharing files with an extension of .ics. Recipients of the iCalendar data file (with supporting software, such as an email client or calendar application) can respond to the sender easily or counter-propose another meeting date/time. iCalendar is used and supported by a large number of products, including Google Calendar, Apple Calendar (formerly iCal), IBM Lotus Notes, Yahoo! Calendar...

masfenix

Will google it now.

Ahh, I see. I was reading about that, but would it be easier to say use Google Calendar ?

user55340

Creating custom ics files hooks into many existing apps

user55340

Google cal uses ics

Duga

7:03 PM

If people complaining about PHP, i's because they really don't know how to programming with it. PHP is the third most language programming used for programmers. — bcesars 2 mins ago

masfenix

Okay, so as a very basic workflow. Users enter my site. They'd like to add an entry. When they add the entry, would it be easier to use Google's API to add an entry on a google account for this particular website?

user55340

support.google.com/calendar/answer/37100?hl=en

user55340

Ics is a file format that many calendar apps understand

masfenix

Ahh, I see. So when users "add an event", I will just create a .ICS file (with the proper formatting/protocol) and make that public.

user55340

You publish the ics file and those apps pick up changes in it.

masfenix

7:04 PM

I see.

user55340

support.google.com/calendar/answer/45664

masfenix

@MichaelT Thank you. This clears up some confusion. Now, is ics a relatively standard format?

Jimmy Hoffa

@Duga that is hilarious

masfenix

I know its hard to sync google calendar on my Windows 8 app because of CalDav protocols..and so on..

user55340

Very. Look at apps that support it on that wiki page from earlier.

Jimmy Hoffa

7:06 PM

That looks like a No true scotsman statement emphatically proclaimed by somebody while speaking in tongues

masfenix

@MichaelT thanks. one last question I guess (although I should do my own homework
), would I create 1 ics file per event ?

user55340

List of applications with iCalendar support

The following is a list of applications which support iCalendar: == Free software/Open source == Balsa a lightweight email client for GNOME California a calendar application for GNOME 3 Chandler Citadel CiviCRM With its CiviEvent module Claws Mail (the vCalendar plugin is required to handle iCalendar in Claws Mail) Darwin Calendar Server DAViCal server for calendar sharing Dolibarr ERP & CRM for calendar module Drupal with its event module eXo Platform and Open Source Enterprise Social Platform with Group Calendars Evolution the Gnome email/calendar client Hippo CMS Horde Joomla there are several...

user55340

Database, profiles, and per user files.

masfenix

or say have an "update" programming running that updates a main ics file with ALL the events? I guess it would have to be one ics file unless I want my users syncing many ics files.

okay. cool.

user55340

I'm on mobile so rather terse

user55340

7:10 PM

Store the events in a db. Write a program to go from db to ics.

enderland

mobile SE chat? now THAT is intense

psr

@JimmyHoffa The key to YAGNI is to remember that it means You Aren't Going to Need It, OR You Are Going To Need It, depending on if you're going to need it.

user55340

masfenix

@MichaelT thanks! okay, so what SE network would you recommend me getting more information (before starting the actual programming?0

user55340

Depends on the problem. And you can always ask here first.

masfenix

7:14 PM

@MichaelT thankyou. actually, since you are being very helpful maybe I can you yet another one. So I have a DB of my events. A user comes in and wants to subscribe to only events created by a particular party. Now that's easy on my part using a SELECT WHERE statement. My question is that if the event changes in my DB (a time modification or even a new event), would icalendar be able to sync?

user55340

Yep. That's the "up to 8h" but on Google support page.

user55340

> Note: It may take up to 8 hours for changes in ICS feeds to reflect in your Google Calendar.

user55340

support.google.com/calendar/answer/37100?hl=en

masfenix

Hmm, that's weird though. How could it possibly know where the data originated from?

OHH I see, I am not gona let them download a file..

I am gonna publish it as a link..

on my server, which I can change as my db changes...

its like publishing an XML file when working with APIs.

user55340

Yep. The file exists when asked, but is generated dynamically

Duga

7:23 PM

programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/223313/… — bolov 1 min ago

masfenix

That is awesome, and almost feels like I can finish this project over a weekend (maybe 2 because I am learning node.js) and I feel like node.js is perfect for this.

user55340

6

A: Join N copies of a snippet to produce N^2 characters

Brainfuck, 17 16 bytes [>+>-..+<<-]-.>+ You can test it here. Just use the fact that n2+2n+1=(n+1)2.

user55340

I can't believe I'm seeing BF at a competitive level of bytes! — agweber 5 hours ago

user55340

@WorldEngineer bf even beat apl there.

Duga

7:57 PM

You may have better success posting your question on programmers.stackexchange.com, as this site is geared for specific technical questions. — levi 15 secs ago

I thought about this, but the problem is, when other programmers check out the project and compile, they will have to add the jar to their local repository; and they won't know to do so, so it won't compile. — ktm5124 24 secs ago

Duga

8:19 PM

@levi this would be closed downvoted and deleted on programmers in a hot second. Go learn the scope of the site before suggesting people post things there. Career and education advice is explicitly off topic on Programmers. — Jimmy Hoffa 33 secs ago

Jimmy Hoffa

8:37 PM

@masfenix beware, hammers can turn screws into nails, but you might want to try a screwdriver first just to be sure.