TeX, LaTeX and Friends

Stephan Lehmke

06:58

@davidcarlisle Another "feature" of longtable: \captionof doesn't work ;-)

longtable has its own definition of \caption which makes using \capttionof doubly difficult: Even if you circumvent the Misplaced \noalign, you'll notice that the floattype table is hardcoded... I don't know whether it's worth it to make a complete redefinition of longtables version of \caption. — Stephan Lehmke 1 min ago

kan

07:23

@JosephWright I am sending a TeX file which uses xfrac for cute fractions. So, is it OK if I just send in the l3packages.zip and ask that it be extracted to the working directory?

As in, is that enough?

Joseph Wright

@kan That zip doesn't have the extracted code in it

kan

@JosephWright Oops! So, what is the minimal thing I must send?

l3keys2e.sty, xparse.sty and xfrac.sty? @Joseph

Joseph Wright

@kan Depends on what is available at the 'far end'

kan

the minimal thing required for xfrac to work... given that tikz works without complaints... ?

Joseph Wright

@kan If the 'target' has a recent-ish TikZ then they probably have expl3 and xfrac already

If you want to be safe, send l3packages.tds.zip and l3kernel.tds.zip: installed locally that is an 'up to date' LaTeX3 set

kan

07:30

@JosephWright and they should simply be extracted to the present working directory?

Joseph Wright

@kan No, local TeX tree

kan

@JosephWright Huhu! Hi-fi stuff! Isn't there a simpler way out at all?

@JosephWright does xfrac depend on the stuff in l3kernel too?

OK, I now have come to the following .sty files to send:

xfrac

l3keys2e

xparse

expl3 ,l3names, l3bootstrap....

Is that OK?

and xtemplates too...

Joseph Wright

08:04

@kan Yes

@kan Yes: use the package manager!

@kan The reason we make 'ready to install' zip files available is that as this is a 'big' project it's not as simple as having one file to drop in

David Carlisle

08:30

@StephanLehmke Lt caption is just \mulicolumn{?}{c}{\originalcaption} so you could do \mulicolumn{?}{c}{\captionof...}

Stephan Lehmke

@DavidCarlisle Well \captionof calls \caption which is \LT@caption which contains \noalign...

Stephan Lehmke

08:58

... but of course I can save the original \caption and make \captionof call that. Answered.

David Carlisle

09:15

@StephanLehmke oh well you can't expect me to know my own code or to test my answers:-) (Also I was just closing down to get in the car and drive to work:-)

Stephan Lehmke

@DavidCarlisle :-)

Paulo Cereda

09:34

@egreg: Buongiorno! :) I'm reading a paper, and one of the authors is from the University of Verona; maybe your colleague? :)

David Carlisle

09:52

@PauloCereda is it about commenting out ends of lines?

egreg

@PauloCereda Quite probable.

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle :)

@egreg Davide Bresolin.

egreg

@PauloCereda He has been a student of mine.

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Really? How nice! :)

egreg

11:05

I didn't see this question at the time, but I believe it's off topic.

5

Q: Will XeTeX or LuaTeX support COLR table in OpenType fonts?

Announced at the Microsoft //build conference: A data structure, implemented as a new 'COLR' table in OpenType, breaks down the base glyph into a separate set of glyphs, each with its own z-order and single color reference. The color references are handled has palette indices, with a separate ta...

David Carlisle

@egreg why? I thought it was quite interesting (and on topic)

egreg

@DavidCarlisle Who can answer that?

David Carlisle

@egreg Khaled Hosny? It seems a reasonable question, if you install a font with any new OpenType table property to ask if the xetex font handling can read that property.

@egreg to get back to something more clearly on topic, bad news from Australia:

    Australia won the toss and decided to bat
    Australia 1st Innings 570 for 9 declared (158.0 overs)
    England 1st Innings 35 for 1 (21.0 overs)

hhh

How embed ASCII graphs to LaTex?

Joseph Wright

@hhh Don't?

hhh

11:19

Moved the question here, why not?

David Carlisle

@hhh verbatim enviornment

Joseph Wright

@hhh Because they look awful!

egreg

@DavidCarlisle Did you expect anything else? ;-)

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle Draw on the cards

hhh

@DavidCarlisle Verbatim broke the spacing

David Carlisle

11:20

@egreg well when we played them here in the summer we won:-)

hhh

egreg

@DavidCarlisle It's the advantage of not playing upside down.

David Carlisle

@hhh then you have tabs most likely. Tabs are evil, you could fix the file using expand or untabify in emacs or whatever, or use the verbatim package version of verbatim which has options to try to deal with tab

@hhh but as Joseph indicated it will look pretty poor anyway, LaTeX is a typesetter why not typeset that as a table or whatever using normal lining digits and real arrow symbols rather than a monospace font?

@egreg could be (or it could be that they are better than us, and we got lucky last time)

hhh

@DavidCarlisle because I am not qualified enough :)

And for a draft paper, verbatim is ok for the time being...

...wish there was some easy way to convert the ASCII then to something nicer :)

David Carlisle

@hhh the example in the question has spaces not tabs, so verbatim should just work, or has the site posting converted them?

hhh

11:27

Sure I got it running under verbatim but the next goal is to get ASCII to something nicer without much rewriting.

(I could connect the vertices with lines, the graph is a 2nd hypercube)

David Carlisle

@egreg Khaled could for example post the answer he gave on the xetex list tug.org/pipermail/xetex/2013-August/024681.html

Joseph Wright

13:53

0

Q: Community Promotion Ads - 2014

It's the time of the year again, namely it is December 2013, and so we shall now refresh our Community Promotion Ads for the new year. Huh, this is the only site where this opening is similar to last years... fancy that. What are Community Promotion Ads? Community Promotion Ads are community-ve...

discussion community-ads

That time of year

Paulo Cereda

4

:)

I probably missed a back in the last sentence. :P

topskip

wouldn't \topskip -34px help for the main site?

5

Paulo Cereda

@topskip As always, you are part of the solution. :)

topskip

Google had the black top bar as well, but apparently abandoned it. So there is still hope

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda I made some minor improvements:

3

Paulo Cereda

14:08

@DavidCarlisle LOL

topskip

Better: Bring back the old topbar!!!!!!!

(many exclamation marks)

Forkrul Assail

It needs an airplane.

Paulo Cereda

@topskip Bring back the old topbar!!!!!1!!11!!!ONE

<3

Forkrul Assail

and a house, they need to understand we have a militant wing

David Carlisle

@ForkrulAssail Unfortunately I did that with wordpad which lacks the power of latex picture mode.

topskip

14:09

and some WTF!!! inbetween

Paulo Cereda

@ForkrulAssail Either David's airplane or Jefferson's Airplane.

@David: we could add some WordArt too.

egreg

14:21

@DavidCarlisle You could add an overfull box.

Paulo Cereda

15:17

Yay @FrankMittelbach is here! :)

tohecz

15:56

Hi! Going from a party to a party today!

Ok, nobody here, and I gotta go, later!

Paulo Cereda

@tohecz TOOOOOOOOOM

:)

How was the test? :)

tohecz

@PauloCereda I think it went well. The point is that the tests are in general so long here that you can't finish it. So you never now if you made enough :)

Paulo Cereda

@tohecz :)

tohecz

@PauloCereda well, gotta go now really, catch you maybe tomorrow evening!

Paulo Cereda

@tohecz Have a nice day! :)

kan

16:35

Hey everyone! I am logged in from a Mac. :-)

So, I am stuck about how to setup TeX, Aquamacs, Sage (in that order)!

Paulo Cereda

@kan $ sw_vers in the terminal, please. :)

egreg

@PauloCereda By the way, there's Aquamacs 3 preview available

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Oh, that's nice!

egreg

@kan Install MacTeX. Install Aquamacs. Enjoy.

kan

ProductName: Mac OS X
ProductVersion: 10.9
BuildVersion: 13A2093

Paulo Cereda

16:39

@kan Cool, updated machine. :)

kan

@Paulo/ @egreg Can one of you give me a quick overview of this whole keyboard thing? Where is the delete button, for example? Sorry for this newbie questions. And, as I type this, I see the auto spell trying to interfere and I am, well, mildly sad about it.

egreg

@kan What do you mean by "delete button"? If you want to delete a file, drag it to the waste basket.

Paulo Cereda

Delete = function + backspace, I guess.

I do everything in the terminal. :)

egreg

@kan You can disable spelling corrections in Safari from the System Preferences, Keyboard pane, Text tab: uncheck "Correct spelling automatically"

Paulo Cereda

@egreg ooh this is very important. :)

egreg

16:44

@PauloCereda Command-backspace (on laptops there's also a "function" key, which is different)

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Oopsie. :)

kan

@PauloCereda oh, ok! that's right!

@egreg no, fn + bksp seems to work.

egreg

@kan That's "forward delete", yes.

kan

@egreg Hmm, yeah, I tried only on text.

Now, let me clean up the dock clutter.

egreg

@kan Only for text; I misunderstood what you were meaning.

Paulo Cereda

16:49

Live from the World Cup table thingy. :)

kan

help please! Where do I remove dock items? There is a Dock menu under the apple which does not let me express these preferences.

Paulo Cereda

Matthäus is on stage, woohoo!

Valcke has no idea of what he's saying. :P

Meanwhile, Fernanda Lima is on stage too. <3

A. Brazil...

B. Spain...

C. Colombia...

D. Uruguay...

E. Switzerland...

F. Argentina...

G. Germany...

H. Belgium...

Now let's see how things will be. :)

Uruguay, Italy!!!!!!

@egreg: ^^

Italy in group D!

Chile in group B.

Cameroon in group A.

Ecuador in group E.

Côte d'Ivoire in C.

Nigeria in F.

Ghana in G.

Algeria in H.

Let's go to the next round. :)

Mexico in A.

Australia in B.

Japan in C.

Costa Rica in D.

Honduras in E.

kan

17:08

On the Paulo's show tonight:

:-)

Paulo Cereda

Hey don't break the flow. :P

Iran in F.

Let's see now with the Europeans. :P

USA in G.

Korea in H.

Now, the Europeans!

Croatia in A.

First group complete.

Netherlands in B!

Second group complete.

Greece in C.

Third group complete.

Now, let's see this group. :)

HOLY COW!

England in D!

Death group for sure.

@egreg: ^^

Fourth group complete.

Three world champions in the same group.

egreg

@PauloCereda We'll teach @DavidCarlisle how football is played.

Paulo Cereda

@egreg LOL

France in E.

egreg

@PauloCereda I'm sorry for our friend @Leo

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Indeed. :)

Bosnia in F.

Argentina is very lucky. :)

egreg

17:15

@PauloCereda And, yes, England stole^H^H^H^H^H won the world cup once.

Paulo Cereda

@egreg LOL shhhhhh. :)

Portugal in G.

Another interesting group.

Russia in H.

And we are done. :)

Livestream done. :)

egreg

@PauloCereda Beware of Croatia.

Paulo Cereda

@egreg I remember Croatia in 98. :)

A great team.

kan

17:46

Aquamacs with Auctex done.

egreg

@kan Now dowload Skim and set it as the viewer for PDF skim-app.sourceforge.net

kan

@egreg happening... next is TeX.

egreg

@kan Do you have enough coffee? Long download. ;-)

@kan By the way, the radio has Handel's Hallelujah just now!

kan

@egreg nvm, I really need to get it done. :-)

@egreg how do I start the streaming? where is this radio?

egreg

@kan stream.srg-ssr.ch/m/rsc_it/mp3_128

kan

17:54

@egreg Merci Beaucoup.

Joseph Wright

Traffic to the site is rising after a lull earlier in the year :-)

Brent.Longborough

Interesting piece on the differences between publishing for Law and CS:

cs.columbia.edu/~smb/blog//2013-12/2013-12-06.html

kan

@egreg Would auctex installation be shoddy if I had no tex to begin with? or everything will be fine, as in if I try to do stuff after installing tex, things will work as expected?

Downloading MaCTeX and Skim won't open because Apple does not trust the developer.

Paulo Cereda

18:10

@kan You need to hold some key.

kan

@PauloCereda Cmd is then the right answer. :)

egreg

@kan AUCTeX is already in Aquamacs

Stephan Lehmke

@JosephWright Probably started in September ;-)

kan

@PauloCereda hmm, control.

egreg

@kan Override it without any doubt. When the message about unknown developer is issued, you can click a button in the Security pane of System Preferences, thus allowing installation.

kan

18:15

@egreg Hah, done now.

@egreg I wonder what that guy was doing when I told him: M-x package-install and then I keyed in auctex so that AUCTeX is installed.

egreg

@kan You probably installed AUCTeX again. Don't worry.

kan

@egreg Now, ergonomy. I am used to \ being the left pinky... let's see how to modify key maps.

egreg

@kan Do you have a French keyboard? ;-)

kan

@egreg no! I used an arabic keyboard on my dell and that had this nice feature.

egreg

For keyboard remapping, there's Ukelele: scripts.sil.org/cms/scripts/…

kan

18:22

@egreg however, is this sorta thing really advisable, I don't know, and I'd trust you on this but I am afraid my ignorance could be a deal spoiler!

egreg

@kan What keyboard layout do you have?

kan

@egreg U.S. English layout.

Paulo Cereda

Suddenly, in the main site: Zotero. Zotero everywhere.

egreg

@kan Oh, then the backslash is for the right pinky. Just the same, isn't it? ;-)

@PauloCereda Zorro?

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Antonio Banderas. :)

kan

18:31

@egreg :-)

leo

@egreg ha ha, indeed

egreg

@leo So Costa Rica has to teach England, too. ;-)

leo

@egreg well we have Gamboa who already defeated Man U. at their home :-)

egreg

@leo June 20: Italy vs. Costa Rica!

leo

@egreg yeah, never encountered in world cup2

and there's some revenge pending with Uruguay

kan

18:44

Macintosh can get viruses too, they say. :-(

leo

well

egreg

@kan I got the last one maybe 20+ years ago.

kan

@egreg Hmm, that was long long ago, so long ago, I-was-not-even-born-ago...

leo

I have little Dell Inspiron, with XP (more vulnerable than Mac) with no antivirus, and no virus :-)

and it work fast enough

Paulo Cereda

I have a virus and never got a PC. :)

egreg

18:52

@kan Here's the best antivirus ever; it was called Disinfectant

►

leo

:)

Paulo Cereda

I need advice from @JosephWright and @DavidCarlisle. :)

Joseph Wright

19:07

@PauloCereda Fire away

Paulo Cereda

@JosephWright I'm having my first contact with English tea. :) I see there some types out there (camomile, honey and vanilla, Prince of Wales (?!), mint, pure peppermint, white (?!)). What should I start?

Stephan Lehmke

@PauloCereda If it doesn't contain tea leaves, it's not tea. Especially not English tea.

I'm not sure about this question

14

Q: What are the standards of TeX/LaTeX coding in order to obtain robust packages?

I have posted several questions ultimately involving various aspects of robustness, that have arisen in the context of other questions in risk of clouding the main point of the question in each case. I thought it would be appropriate to have a centralised discussion here about what needs to be ta...

packages

Should the answers be community wiki?

Paulo Cereda

@StephanLehmke Oh the hardcore tea drinker. :)

Stephan Lehmke

@PauloCereda Otherwise it's called "herbal infusion" or something.

Joseph Wright

@PauloCereda @StephanLehmke is right: most of them are not really tea at all

Paulo Cereda

19:13

@StephanLehmke @JosephWright: got it. :)

kan

should I download mactex using torrents?

it's 1 holey moley?

Stephan Lehmke

@PauloCereda A false friend in German because we really say "Kamillentee". I once brought an Australian to fits of laughter by offering him "Hibiscustee".

Paulo Cereda

@StephanLehmke Oh. :)

Stephan Lehmke

19:25

@FrankMittelbach Welcome :-)

Paulo Cereda

So I already failed with my "English" "tea". :)

Still, my black tea + milk is tasty. :P

Stephan Lehmke

@PauloCereda Well the "Prince of Wales" (if it's not made from His Royal Socks or something) might actually be tea ;-)

Paulo Cereda

@StephanLehmke LOL I'll see if I can find it next time I go to the store. :)

I might invite @AlanMunn for a chimarrão or tereré. :)

Frank Mittelbach

not really here :-) only a couple of blue screens and the reboot kind of starts that room

Stephan Lehmke

@FrankMittelbach Nice to see your face anyway :-)

Frank Mittelbach

19:32

first one was this afternoon when @PauloCereda spotted me

Paulo Cereda

@FrankMittelbach :)

Stephan Lehmke

I'm on my way home; bye!

Paulo Cereda

@StephanLehmke Bye, Stephan! :)

Frank Mittelbach

19:53

Have you seen the info that the hardcover version of Don's books are currently on sale at the publisher? latex-project.org/site-news.html#2013-12-06

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda PG tips

Frank Mittelbach

at least for the TeX book that is a bargain

Johannes_B

Is this a question, or a novel?

@FrankMittelbach Yes, it really is.

kan

20:16

MacTeX on knsam update: 1.4 GB of 2.3 GB downloaded.

Johannes_B

Well, one has to at least give a link :-)
http://tex.stackexchange.com/q/148740/37907
Right now, i don't even get the question.

kan

20:35

@egreg vvvv

“While I was speaking about France it occurred to me to speak a few Words on their Language—it is perhaps the poorest one ever spoken since the jabbering in the Tower of Babel, and when you come to know that the real use and greatness of a Tongue is to be referred to its Literature—you will be astonished to find how very inferior it is to our native Speech.—I wish the Italian would supersede French in every school throughout the Country, for that is full of real Poetry and Romance of a kind more fitted for the Pleasure of Ladies than perhaps our own.—It seems that the only end to be gained …

Interesting remark, no?

Donut E. Knot

20:47

What edition is the newest TeXBook?

Canageek

21:33

@kan Aren't Italian and French rather closely related?

I dislike the theming and some features of the new bar, but like other ones (Rep change, showing awards and things)

kan

@Canageek These were Keats' observation and I had the feeling that Italian and French were closely related. That is why I expressed surprise.

Canageek

@kan Well, worst fights, best families and all that

@kan Personally I think we need to make an atonal, genderless, language with less then 30 characters.

@kan English is a good start. Add some consistency and reduce the number of letters a bit, and clean up the punctuation to fit better on a keyboard and I think they are on the right track.

kan

@Canageek Hmmm... reduce the number of letters a bit?

Canageek

@kan 26 is a pain to type, as you may have noticed. However, the more you reduce them, the longer words get. Someone should do a study on typing efficiency vs letter efficiency to determine the optimal number of characters.

kan

@Canageek and prove that 26 is optimal? :P

Note that decimal system is somewhat arbitrary too...

Canageek

21:42

@kan No, I suspect the optimal answer would probably be 30, including common punctuation. More if you add a second meta key.

@kan Make the two shift buttons asymmetric and 60 could turn out to be optimal. But I bet typing would be faster if newline was under a finger instead of having to travel, so that would take out one letter.

@kan Also caps lock of occupying some of the best real-estate. That is akeyboard issue, but you'd have to optomize that as well, Since most language is typed these days.

kan

updating tlmgr ... on my Mac.

Canageek

@kan Somewhat yes, but it seems to work the best of any mathematical system; a lot of things you have to do in a very difficult fashion in other systems naturally fall out of decimal. I have heard that Reverse Polish notation is far supriour to our way of writing equations though, as you don't need order of operations.

David Carlisle

@kan we could get rid of K and just use C :-)

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle youtube.com/watch?v=Yz2LaJOVAiA :)

(Watch @JosephWright appear) :)

Canageek

@DavidCarlisle Exactly. Also X. J and G are both useful, but they should have more defined sounds. Really, we should START by defining every sound the human mouth can easily use in language, then start designing the alphabet AFTER that.

kan

22:13

@DavidCarlisle so, what would kettle be? chettle? Then, what would charity be pronounced as?

David Carlisle

@kan cettle not ch as you need that for charity:-)

kan

Who is Caesar? Kaesar?

Celeron would be Keleron.

Oh, well.

Let me test my aquamacs.

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle: we could add some semantics to our new language, like this: 女 is woman, 姦 (which has three women) is noisy, wicked. :P

The wicked thing: this is actually true! :)

Canageek

@PauloCereda You know, implicit sexism is one of the things I'd like to remove. That is one of the few things English has going for it, is that it doesn't have sexism at its core, just the periphery

Paulo Cereda

@Canageek I have a sugestion, but you need to know a little about South Park. :)

Does the word marklar ring a bell? :)

►

Canageek

22:27

@PauloCereda Never watched South Park

Paulo Cereda

@Canageek Don't worry, I found the relevant link. :)

Canageek

@PauloCereda Don't think I can watch South Park at work

Paulo Cereda

@Canageek Sorry. :) The idea is to replace every noun with the word marklar. :)

Canageek

22:55

@PauloCereda That seems less then useful

Paulo Cereda

@Canageek to each their own.

egreg

@PauloCereda Another win. :) And next Tuesday we're at İstanbul.

Paulo Cereda

@egreg Good game. :)

Alan Munn

23:18

@PauloCereda You're just being polite. You don't drink chimarrão really, do you?

Paulo Cereda

@AlanMunn I actually do. :)

Alan Munn

@PauloCereda Is it very common in your part of the country?

Paulo Cereda

@AlanMunn Nope, people might've heard only the name. :)

Alan Munn

@PauloCereda Ok. That's what I thought. So how did you get into it? Do you walk around with cuia and thermos?

Paulo Cereda

@AlanMunn To be honest, I started with tereré. :) One of my friends used to drink a lot during our band shows (he played viola caipira), and I decided to give it a try. :) Later on, I was trying chimarrão. :) I'm usually quite shy when drinking either chimarrão/tereré mostly because it's something "weird" for my region. But I do have a traditional cuia and also one made of ox horn (?). :)

Alan Munn

23:45

So why did I get a downvote on this answer? tex.stackexchange.com/a/148637/2693

Transcript for

$TeX - LaTeX$ TeX, LaTeX and Friends